IR before CPL ??

[jmp1n]

Question

Can anybody advise me on whether it makes any difference if I take my IR before CPL. I believe this route works out slightly cheaper, however will it make it harder for me to pass first time ??

My only experience is on simple aircraft such as C172...

Thanks

[Tinstaafl]

More experience, especially complex experience, will make any new learning task easier. That applies if you get a CPL then an IR, or an IR then a CPL. The awkward part is working out which is the better learning curve.

It will vary from jurisdiction to jurisdicdtion since the tasks to be learned & the allied complexity changes. What country/aviation authority governs you?

If JAR I'd tend towards CPL then IR, if Oz probably CPL 1st but not so strongly, If USA then maybe the reverse: IR then CPL.

No great conviction on my USA thoughts but an IR is very commonly added to a PPL.

[redsnail]

I did the IR before the CPL (actually during..) in Oz. I wouldn't do it again. The CPL demands visual navigating skill, the IR requires you to be on "the clocks". 2 different skills that you don't want to be mixing up. CPL nav is an extension of what you learnt during the PPL. (and a bit more of course).

[airshowpilot]

I agree with redsnail. They are two different skills. You would be as well to go for the CPL first in my view, especially if you have recently been flying visually single-engine/hours building etc.

The JAA CPL has some instrument elements to it but I would suggest that you are better off, if not financially (and there are marginal amounts involved usually given the total outlay), progressing through to the CPL. That way you have a CPL stand-alone licence and could decide at a future date to gain your multi-engine rating and your IR i.e. if, for example, you felt that it was worth going straight on to a flight instructors rating after completing your CPL.

Some advice though, if you are flying in the UK, try and get your CPL done when the weather is better. I did mine during the winter and it proved very frustrating and expensive as I kept losing momentum due to bad weather. Even though there were many days that I saw the IR students flying in conditions that I could not go up in, I do not regret getting my CPL first.

Good luck!

[mad_jock]

I did my IR before the CPL.

This was forced on me by the ****e wx in the Vale of York, which by all accounts hasn't improved since my CPL test last year.

Great I can't even see eccup after TO. 5K my arse.

Don't mix and match the courses it does your head in.

If your doing IR stick to it. CPL and FI can be combined.

It does work out cheaper, I was told the only reason why i got away with it was because I hadn't done a IMC first. No bad habits to kick out of me. And everything was on the twin.

If you already have done the IR in a twin don't mince about in a single doing the CPL. The CPL test after the IR in a twin isn't an issue. After 55hrs wacking round the skys in a twin a couple of go arounds with engine failures are bread and butter to you.

Having to get your eye in for glide to land and PFL I should imagine is a pain in the butt. You will proberly be flying the same machine that you did for your IR so the IMC part will be pish, unusual attitudes, stalling etc again bread and butter for a IR pish again.
So the only thing you need to brush up on is VFR nav.

I also sensed a change in attitude of the examiner when the IR pass slip came out my training folder.

Don't get me wrong the IR was bloody hard work, how much more hard work than if I had done the CPL first i shall never know.
But it worked for me.

I started the IR with 150hrs and 5 hours MEP in a seminole. You have to have done the MEP training before hand and have passed the skills test (but not issued) before you can do the IR test

The other advantage is that when you pass the CPL skills test in a twin your MEP resets at that point so its valid 1 year from your CPL test.

MJ

[FougaMagister]

Had this "opportunity" meself, and (wisely) turned it down. The IR would have been way too hard a learning curve straight after PPL (and ATPLs). Plus, it's easy to hone your skills at VFR DR nav while doing hour-building. Let's face it: the CPL is nothing but a much glorified PPL with smaller margins of error... The IR is a completely different kettle of fish!

Cheers