MCC required when applying?

[Sentenza]

Hi All,

I was originally hoping to do the MCC as part of a type rating, if and when the time comes, with my employer then hopefully paying for it.

Do airlines expect you to have the MCC already when applying? Does it depend on the airline? I'm asking this with particular regard to RyanAir. Their online app form doesn't specifically ask whether you've done the MCC course, so would I have a chance applying there w/o the course?

Any info greatly appreciated,

so long for now,

Mike

[Point&Power]

I am in the same position. Have asked around the flying school etc. No one seems to know. (I know Easy have it listed as one of their requirements for their type-rating scheme). Would appreciate a response from anyone who has information on this, before shelling out (another) £2000+!!

Also has anyone reading this been to the Atlantic or Multiflight MCC recently? (If so what did you think?) Any other suggestions for MCC (other than oxford/cabair).

[benhurr]

I did the MCC at Multiflight in January.

Probably learnt more about myself on that course than on any other course I have attended in my life.

The mix of instructors were great - different emphasis on different things really added to the experience. I would thoroughly recommend it.

The MCC is not a "tick in a box" course, even though you cannot fail it.

Although I know people recommend doing the course on a 737 or something, I found the jump to a King Air more than adequate to demonstrate the crucial CRM elements.

Price is reasonable too!

If you go, ask Alan about the 747 he "met" in a Kingair...

ben

[moggie]

You can only do your MCC as part of your type rating if the type-training organisation is approved to do it. I don't know who, if anyone, is approved as it does require quite a stringent approval/renewal process that may not be cost effective for a TTO/Airline.

Otherwise, you will have to go to one of those approved MCC suppliers - of which there are many.

Do you have something lined up with a potential employer? If so, ask them. However, I have not heard of any airline which does it's own MCC (anyone care to correct me?) so suggest you budget to DIY.

[FougaMagister]

Sentenza - I won't get into the "where do you do your MCC?" debate; there is another recent thread on this subject (with conflicting opinions on whether one should go for a "full-motion" jet sim or not).

All I'll say is that more and more (though not all) airlines are considering MCC one of their minimum requirements. Clearly you don't want to end up restricting yourself to airlines which don't ask for MCC.

Also, remember that most airline selections WILL include a sim assessment (or "check ride"), on a 727-200, BAC 1-11, DC-9, 737 etc. If you have been through MCC, you'll be much more confident then (even if your MCC wasn't on the same sim).

Last, but not least: remember that there are LOTS of unemployed low-hrs. pilots out there (I should know), so the waiting list (or the stack of CVs on airlines' desks) is BIG; you don't want to suffer from a "comparative disadvantage" at that point...

Cheers.

(Does your nickname have anything to do with the character played by Lee Van Cleef "The Good, the Bad and the Ugly - my preferred movie?)

[Sentenza]

Hi All,

thanks everyone for your replies;

FM - thanks for yours as well. I was specifically trying to avoid the "where to do it" debate, as I've already decided where to do it if it comes to that (which it looks like it will).

The Good, the Bad and the Ugly - now there's a cool movie... :cool:

Thanks again,

Mike

[Point&Power]

moggie
Off the top of my head Channel Express do their own MCC, among others.

The CAA website provides a list of approved FTOs in the flight crew licensing section (about 1.5mb .pdf download), Section 3 contains a list of organisations approved to carry out type ratings and MCC ratings*. If you look through that you will find that quite a few airlines have approval to carry out MCC training (Air 2000, Air Malta(sorry probably not helpful), Britannia, British Midland, etc)**. It does seem fairly logical to include it as part of a type rating and I think that the main reason for including it as a 'requirement' is to aid the binning/non-binning of CVs***.

Which (finally!) brings me back to the original question

Do airlines [REALLY] expect you to have the MCC already when applying?
We know that many ASK for it. More speculation is welcome but an answer (from someone who knows) would be appreciated.



Note(s):
* Don't know why I forgot to mention this in my original post.

** Not taken from the up to date list (which I've mislaid somewhere on my hard drive).

***More speculation.

[moggie]

Interesting to see Air Malta and Britannia on the list - especially as we do the MCC for their sponsored cadets (and some DEPs in the case of Britannia)!

[PPRuNeUser0215]

w.r.t Britannia's MCC, it is definitely part of the Initial Type Rating. I know because I am right in there. As for the DEPs who did an MCC at Jerez, I think you will find that it took place in 2001 as a trial with a pair of guys.
It was, I believe a JOC course which so far hasn't been reconducted for reasons I am not aware of. Perhaps future training courses will do it, perhaps they won't but what's certain is that no one did in 2003 (and we are far from being all type rated on the 75).

On more general terms, after 911, I did an MCC at Multiflight with the great Alan Calder thinking this would help me get a job.
Well, mixed feeling here really.
Next job I landed in December 01, no MCC was required (Beech 1900, two crew Ops).
Following one, Air Taxi single pilot.... No MCC required.
Interview and Sim ride with BA Citiexpress... MCC required.
Interview and Sim ride with BMI Regional..... No MCC required.
and finally a job with BAL.... No MCC required.

Did I waste my money ? Well I could do with less debts today but at the time, it appeared to be the best option available whilst waiting for the Afghan War to take place, Major Airlines to go bust and god knows what what else we all feared could/would happen.

As usual in this industry, there is no clear cut answer. Might help some then again it might not make the slightest difference for others.

As said in a previous post though, if you do it, do it not just for the tick in the box but also for what you might learn from it.

Cheers