the flare

[deanofs]

HI all

Im in the circuit and seem to be stumbling a bit either flarring too high or too flat, but only right on a few occassions, any advice on how to perfect this, different instrucotrs seem to have different views !! Im getting my 70kts OK and flaps etc and approaches are judged to be very good, that is until Im about to flare !!

I guess its been covered umpteen times before, if so where is the thread ?

Thanks

[AerBabe]

Here (http://pprune.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=74587)
Here (http://pprune.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=68421)
And here (http://pprune.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=65921)

Just search under 'flare'... or 'landing' etc etc.

[Evo]

One of my old threads (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=42671)

[AerBabe]

Awwww...... :)
Errr, you have got the hang of them now, right? :bored:

[Fly Stimulator]

AB,

Why do you think we're all going for IMC ratings?

We'll just keep orbiting until the clouds come down and nobody can see us land! ;)

[Evo]

Errr, you have got the hang of them now, right?


Well, they're kind of :ooh: :oh: :uhoh: :ugh: :* :O :{

(I got a 'very good' from Wycombe, but I think they got me confused with someone else ;) )

[BlueRobin]

Keep her close to the ground and deny her from landing by pulling back until the wings run out of steam... ;)

Do this and you'll make a good tailwheel pilot.

Visual clues are looking forward, down and off to the side. Practive makes perfect. Every stumbles through circuits and solo consolidation is one of the big brick wall in the PPL you have to overcome because it's not fun when things go wrong. Now, I love circuits and pulling off a good greaser. Sad or what! :ok:

[iainpoll]

Feel the ground effect....feel it...when you feel it for the first time, you will know.

PS what aircraft is it you fly? Warrior? In the Warrior I was always taught 60-65 Kts threshold speed, else you float and float and float and float...and then go around:ugh:

[buzzc152]

Here's a tip I find useful sometimes...... as you approach the flare you switch you're attention to the far end of the runway...... just as the end of the end of the runway dissapears from sight (or even better the end markers if on a hard runway) start your flare..... obviously you'll still use periphral vision clues too. This method has limitations on sloping runways but it works for me !!

[ratsarrse]

The last few feet are trickiest, aren't they? I practice looking for the visual clues on the motorway (in my car, obviously - I think people might get upset if I tried to land the Warrior on the M1). Not sure whether it helps too much, but so far my landings have been alright - they are still using the plane. I had my first bouncy experience today, mind. After a really nice stable approach (earlier approaches had been a bit crappy, but I'm blaming windshear and I'm sticking to that story), I was expecting a good landing to follow. Who said a good landing always follows a good approach? It's still very early days for me and I can't really work out whether I've just been lucky or whether I am indeed getting the hang of it. I'm always suspicious when things go too well - it usually means a dark mass of lurking crapness waiting to land on my head somewhere in the future...

[Tinstaafl]

No matter how much experience you get you'll never guarantee a perfect landing.

All that happens is the bad ones occur less often, and they tend not to be so bad when they happen. :O

[Aussie Andy]

ratsarsseWho said a good landing always follows a good approach?I think its more like a good approach always precedes a good landing, not necessarily the other way around! :p

[Chuck Ellsworth]

Some things never change:

Once again, if you look at the far end of the runway to judge flare height and then "feel" the correct landing height you will never learn to flare or land correctly.

But hey, there is a plus to this lack of understanding of a simple thing like judging the flare and landing...... just keep using the old look at the far end of the runway thing and you can become an instructor.:D :D

Chuck E..

[FlyingForFun]

Chuck,

As I read your post I had a sense of deja vue. So I did some reading. And I found this thread (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=74587) (which is in fact one of those which AerBabe referenced earlier on) where, about 15-20 posts in, you and I have had a very similar conversation before!

The last time we had this discussion, we came to the conclusion that the error which people were making was in not explicitly breaking the process of landing, after the approach, into two parts which are either called "roundout" and "flare", or "flare" and "hold off" depending on who taught you. Thus, when someone talks about the "flare" it is not clear exactly which phase of the landing we're talking about.

Once we resolved that issue, I think we agreed that in the "hold off" (after the flare) or the "flare" (after the roundout), depending on your terminology, looking into the distance ("the far end of the runway" being a good approximation of where to look) is correct.

Deanofs, have a very good read of this thread. Because once you get past all the terminology problems, Chuck and others give an excellent description of how to land.

FFF
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[iainpoll]

I've just re-read my post, I appear to be talking about the hold off, when the question referred to the flare........I better get me coat:suspect: :suspect:

[Rood]

One thing I found was that before you even get off the ground is to make sure the seat position and height are adjusted correctly and are consistant every flight.

It goes a long way to helping me have the correct aspect on approaches and flares.

[CPilotUK]

One thing I found was that before you even get off the ground is to make sure the seat position and height are adjusted correctly and are consistant every flight.

I totally agree.

I used to ask permission and then go and sit in an aircraft so that I could get a visual clue on when to start the flare.

[FlyingForFun]

Seat height is certainly relevant once you start flying more than one aircraft. I remember the embarassing time when I flared a PA28, absolutely perfectly, at Europa height. Since my eye-line is around 4 feet lower in the Europa, the landing was a little on the heavy side!!!

FFF
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