A bit of advice, please folks.

[Dorr]

A bit of advice, please folks. I’m a military controller (!) who has been trying for a while to make the move across into the civil Air Traffic side. I’ve written to a number of units, offering to pay towards my “conversion to the other side.” I’m not after a freebee! Unfortunately, so far I received a totally negative response, (I thought there was meant to be a growing shortage of controllers)!
First off, any suggestions, (clean ones please), from my civi ATC colleagues, on how I might accomplish my goal.
Secondly, I’ve just had an offer from SERCO Canada, to take up employment on the other side of the pond, earning myself an ICAO licence, (how come they recognise my experience, but my own country doesn’t, I’d rather work here!?) Whilst I believe that I can’t use the ICAO licence in this country, I believe that I could use it in Europe? Does anyone know if there are any plans to recognise its use in the UK?

[AlanM]

Go to Canada!!

I think that the reason why they will recognise your military experience, and don't take this personally, is because they are desperately sort of ATCO's.

Have you tried NATS - there have been, and are continuing to be lots of ex-RAF people coming through.

Speak to the College of ATC, Bournemouth, direct.

[Chilli Monster]

Yes - there is a shortage, more so in the future, but at the moment training is limited and quite expensive. Despite your military experience you are still an 'unknown entity' and as such, especially in the current financial climate (approx £50K including accomodation, if you can get a course place outside NATS), you're too much of a risk. (not all military controllers have managed to cross over succesfully, and that's a known fact which they will no doubt be considering). Lots of places prefer to train their own assistants and nurture from within the organisation

If you really wanted to get a UK licence then the only option may be to pay for your own ADC course and then throw yourself at the market - a huge risk and with no guarantee of a job at the end of it. At least then you'll have shown willing and you might get sponsorship for APP and APR (but beware - APP is where a few military controllers have problems, having not done similar in the military).

As to the ICAO licence. No, it's not recognised here and probably won't be for the forseeable future. For a start some of the ICAO procedural separation standards are different to the UK. That's just one difference, there are others. Licenses are being harmonised throughout Europe but only in terms of the ratings and endorsements meaning the same. What it will do though is give you the chance to work in areas such as the middle east (if you ever wanted to - there's an expat community there), or Europe, or may even get you across into NavCanada should you fulfill the residency requirements after a stint in coldest Labrador (I take it that's where the job would be :cool: )

Sorry to be doom and despondency - but it's a harsh world out there where ATC, although necessary, is seen more and more as a drain on finances without producing anything visible. (We know we do - safety - but try telling airport management that :rolleyes: )

[WetFeet]

Unfortunately many countries are like the UK. Last time I checked US, Australia and New Zealand would require you to undergo training and examination to get their licence, albeit sometimes a shortened course. Plus, you would have to satisfy immigration/residency requirements first. It might be one thing having a recognised licence but it is worthless if you can't get in to the country.

I would also be wary about who is offering the job. How many places does Serco operate at in Canada? Don't NavCanada do most of the ATC? Same in the States. FAA do most whereas the private operators just do level 1 towers, although I believe that might have been changing to allow slightly higher rated towers.

I may be wrong but I get the impression that national authorities that recognise overseas, or even ICAO, licences, are places that most would be wary of living in, or it is for posts at units where the locals don't want to work! There will of course be some exceptions but most would give priority to their own folk.

The UK isn't alone!

[FWA NATCA]

In the US the FAA has a vacancy announcement that is aimed at recruiting current military controllers who are approaching military retirement. The FAA also gives preference to military controllers who are getting out / or are out of the miltary prior to reaching retirement age. Just a reminder you have to be a US citizen to work for the FAA.

At my facility we have 4 former military controllers (all uder age 30), one was so sharp in the training program (military approach control experience), we had to reduce the minimum hours required so that we could certify him early, and he has already moved onto a busier facility. Another cetified in the normal amount of time, and the other two are still plugging away. All four arrived at the facility the same day. As you can see having approach control experience was a huge asset for the one individual.

Mike
NATCA FWA

[Canoehead]

Before considering Serco Canada, do your homework. As far as I know, Serco operates in only one location....Goose Bay Tower. Where is that? Haven't a clue! :p You may as well move to the moon. And the mosquitos! And the blackflies! And if you're lucky, you may actually see an airplane now and then.

[almost professional]

CM
not everyone works for an organisation or airport where the job they do is undervalued-we have a management that is very pro ATC and who are fully aware of the talents and benefits that the controllers they employ bring to the firm. (but then I dont work for the great god NATS)

[Scott Voigt]

Mike;

Don't give the lad the wrong impression. You have to be a US citizen to get a job with the FAA...

regards

Scott

[FWA NATCA]

Scott,

The third sentence states that you have to be a US citizen.

Maybe some day in the future our friends from the UK will be able to cross the pond and work as an FAA controller, heck if we can fight wars side by side, why not.

Mike
NATCA FWA

[blondie118]

Have you tried applying to NATS?

I know of a number of military controllers who have passed throught the college. They have had to start their training from scratch and taken a drop in pay.

It may not be the best option but it's an idea at least.

All the best.:D :D