New Wannabes Forums? What's All That About, Then?

[scroggs]

As £6 said in his announcement, the Wannabes forum has seen ever-greater use over the past few years, and we felt that the time was right to sub-divide Wannabes into categories that reflect some of its most popular subjects.

However, to get the best out of this new system, we need YOU to understand what it's about and how it works. First off, if you want to talk about getting a PPL, hours building, or the finer points of some piston single or other, you're in the wrong place; go to the Private Flying forum. If you're looking to do an FI rating, go to the Flying Instructors forum. If you wish to ask a general question of professional pilots, go to Questions.

Enough of what these forums aren't for; what do we want to see you using them for?

Pro Training EU/SA. This is the old Wannabes forum, and where you'll find threads from the past on all Wannabes topics. Essentially, it's exactly what it says on the tin: a forum to discuss professional (i.e. CPL and above) training to be carried out anywhere in the EU or South Africa. The bulk of posts will, as usual, be about training in UK, but there's a growing trend for UK (and other) students to train in SA, Spain and possibly the about-to-be-new EU countries from the old Eastern Bloc.

If you have a more general discussion point to do with professional training, this will remain the forum to post in.

Pro Training USA. For some years now, many UK and EU strudents have used the USA training schools to obtain some or all of their licences. This is likely to be an increasing trend, notwithstanding security and visa issues, so we've given you your own forum. Perhaps the various US schools will resist carping at each other from behind unlikely alter egos, but I doubt it. Gives us something to do and you something to laugh at. Where it gets out of hand, we will begin to expose the worst perpetrators..........:}

For those of you from other nations, please use your own regional forums, where they exist. For instance, HK Wannabes have their own forum within the Fragrant Harbour section, and our Antipodean friends have Dunnunda & Godzone (which may get its own Wannabes forum soon).

Sponsorship and Jobs. Pretty obvious, really, though we'd ask you to keep discussions about salaries and other terms of employment to the Terms and Endearments forum. Please remember that this is a forum for those trying to obtain their first professional flying job; experienced pilots looking to move are welcome to watch, but don't hijack the forum for your own purposes. Incidentally, this is the forum to discuss airliner Type Ratings, as TR courses are increasingly using similar selection techniques to sponsors and employers.

Groundschool. A no-brainer. OK, that's not an insult...! Please don't innundate the forum with endless 'feedback' four-choice questions; if you don't understand a subject by all means ask here, but you may want to go to your training provider or to Tech Log and pick their brains first.

Archives/FAQs. Not live yet, but if there's a thread from the past, or a new one crops up, that you think has extra and lasting value for new readers, let us know and we may incorporate it. I'll set up a sticky thread in Pro Training EU/SA for your nominations. The forum will go live when we have sufficient topics to make it worthwhile.

OK, there you go. Make the most of it.....:cool:

Scroggs

[FlyingForFun]

It's a shame this has happened - although I can't find the thread, I'm sure it was discussed, and the majority didn't want it.

From a personal point of view, I'm not sure I'll be reading all of the new forums. I've finished groundschool now, and although I have much useful information that I could pass onto others on this subject, I doubt I'll be a "regular" in the new Groundschool forum - whereas had they all remained combined into one I would have read and replied to any threads that caught my attention. I'll also miss the input on the USA forum from those who have been to the USA but put that part of their training behind them, who probably won't bother with that forum for the same reason as I won't bother with Groundschool.

Still, the decision has been made so we'll have to live with it and see how it works out.

FFF
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[no sponsor]

I agree with FFF. I think numerous forums will remove the personality of the Wannabes forum, its ad-hoc nature and the fact that topics often matured into decent discussions, based on many experienced and non-experienced people giving their two-penneth.

As someone who is hourbuilding - and doing training around the world, both in US and Oz (where you can now do JAA-FCL), then having one forum to peruse and give advice from was beneficial (having been surfing PPRUNE since 1998)

Like FFF, I shall wait and see. I don't want to be too radical in comments else I get banned by our moderators.

[Bodie]

I think this is a good move! It makes it easier for people to find the posts they are interested in.

However, I agree that the forums have now lost their character. I mean, come on "Pro Training EU/SA" what kind of name is that? Yes it does exactly what it says on the tin, but its dead boring.

HK forums have "Fragrant Harbour" = nice name
Oz gets "Dunnunda & Godzone" = lots of character

Can we have a nice name to replace "Wannabes" please?

Bodie

[PPRuNe Towers]

Bodie, we'll be sticking with wannabees.

It's the first dose of reality for those visiting here because long experience shows most don't make it beyond being mildly interested. Those with the guts and determination to make it as professional pilots will never be put off by a forum title. The same people will turn over any stone to get the information they need - might even raise the immense energy required to click on the change forums caption.........

Changing other stuff is the matter of seconds and we'll fine tune captions, titles and descriptions in the future. As to the sub forums: the Ozmates claimed it couldn't possibly work - take a look at what a disaster it is;) ;)

Rob

[FlyingForFun]

Rob,The same people will turn over any stone to get the information they need - might even raise the immense energy required to click on the change forums captionIt's not the people needing information who won't click on the Change Forums caption, it's the people who have that information to give...

FFF
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[Wee Weasley Welshman]

If it doesn't work we can always go back to the old ways.

At every major change to Wannabes and there have been several people have always had doubts and usually don't like the new version at first. With a bit of time perspectives change.

Input, as always, is welcome.

WWW

[scroggs]

People will naturally gravitate to whichever forums reflect their particular interests, whether as a seeker or giver of information. The old forum was getting unwieldy and unfocussed; the new set-up addresses that. There will be minor tweaks as we shake the new system down, and we'll welcome suggestions for more punchy titles that you may prefer - but to suit the format we now have.

Scroggs
[email protected]

[VFE]

I thought I'd give you guys some feedback so here goes....

First impressions are that it looks good and after a few weeks nobody will really give a toss about the old single forum format.

As for FFF's point, I say that anyone who has an ounce of respect for what wannabes is for (giving and taking info) will still find time to put fingertip to keyboard and help others from time to time. Hardly excersise of the century to click onto another forum and see what the deal is. If one has a will to help then one will still be game for helping out regardless of what page they go to.

One thing I did find strange was that someone said the wannabes forum had grown in traffic lately (or words to that effect). My view was that the forum had grown quiet in recent months (last 12 in particular) and that this must have something to do with the search function coming up trumps more, no?

VFE.

[Andy_R]

FFF

With all the respect in the world to you and your views, I cannot believe for one minute, that with the number of different parts of PPRuNe you post in, you will not find the time or motivation to use just a couple of more clicks.

I have never met you, but my impression of you is of someone who applies himself 100% to everything you do, and that includes helping others out. If you are prepared to make the HUGE effort that you always have done, in preparing generally well researched and informative postings, then that is not going to stop you now.

If I am truely wrong then feel free to correct me, but I don't think I am.

I, for one, look forward to reading your posts on everything, including Groundschool, for some time to come.

Cloud

[PPRuNe Towers]

For the last 11 months the search engine has been ten times faster than the previous version - but we still want your classic threads for the archive;) ;)

BTW - do you still think you can map read me around the London TMA at 300 plus knots??

Regards
Rob

[VFE]

Rob,

I'll give it a better shot next time for you! ;)

VFE.

[FlyingForFun]

Cloud,FFF... I cannot believe for one minute... you will not find the time or motivation to use just a couple of more clicks.:D :D :D :D :D

FFF
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[Anti Skid On]

I think the split is justified and the overview by Scroggs explains things. However, the split in terms of countries is a bit odd. Why Europe and SA? You may as well throw in NZ and Oz too, or instead have a southern hemisphere training forum - there has recently been a thread on hours building in Argentina. Also, would it be feasible/practical to have the forum existing in each of the appropriate fora - e.g. having the Southern hemisphere in the index for Wannabe's AND in the Dununda and Godzone?

[scroggs]

These forums are primarliy for UK/EU students who wish to study for JAA licences. The regional split reflects the places where those students go for their training, and that the US schools are as numourous as the rest put together. It also covers those places where foreign licence-holders may convert to JAA.

Those from other regions who wish to discuss training within their own locale and regulatory system can and do use their own regional forums. Hong Kong has its own Wannabes; Oz & NZ may get one, but they have a group of forums already and don't yet need a separate Wannabes.

The Argentinian hour-building post was sent to Private Flying, where it belonged.

Scroggs

[Elmer the Monk]

I recognise the need for further categorizing these forums; this website has become an impressive sprawl of wisdom for all aviation enthusiasts to enjoy. But I'm surprised at the move.

I always felt, perhaps wrongly, that the moderators were often frustrated at contributors unwillingness to find the correct forum for their posts. The number of moved posts remains high. This enlargement of choice is surely going to exacerbate their task and increase what is already doubtlessly a high workload. My respect to you all!

I hope it doesn't prove too mighty a task. Good luck!

Elmer.

[PPRuNe Towers]

I think we'll just have to live with the misplaced posts Elmer,

The over-riding concern as any part of the site grows past a certain size is, what we think of as the, 'signal to noise ratio.'

Forum picks up business, hits critical mass and goes beyond. Then suffers from too many subjects jumbled, constant repetition and (quietly) frustrated readers - 'it just isn't what it was'. Focus has been lost due to popularity.

We held off doing the sub forum bit here for a long time because of the uniquely high turnover of readers. Constant fresh blood arriving to reinvigorate the forum or, oh god, not another who can't keep their gob shut for the first three weeks while they absorb the collective experience, are the two extremes of reaction involved. It may drive many of the regulars demented and it certainly makes it near impossible to keep working professionals visiting and helping with their experiences and opinion. So it's long past time to really focus the old forum and make each sub forum as near essential, solid gold as possible.

Downside is the misplaced posts - we'll have to live with that. Others just don't like change - yeah, right. They don't buy books with chapters and headings to logically separate sections, concepts and chronology either. I'm afraid we'll have to trample the forum luddites down because we know best - otherwise this site would still comprise 4 pages of html text as it did in 1996 and there would be no wannabees forum. Signal to noise ratio - more focus - easier to find what you need at any stage in your progress to a professional licence.

Rob

[FlyingForFun]

Welcome, Capt Noodle!

I would guess that any issues which you think would apply to all Wannabes would belong in one of the main Wannabe forums, e.g. this forum for international CPL issues. Anything specifically Aussie, e.g. questions about Aussie schools, or peculiarities of the Aussie CPL, would go in the appropriate Dunnunda forum.

But the best thing to do is post wherever you think it belongs, and if you get it wrong don't worry because the moderators will move it somewhere more appropriate for you. Enjoy!

FFF
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[redsnail]

Capt Noodle,
Oz questions go in Dununda & Godzone "Questions" forum and you'll find GA stuff in "General Aviation".
Go and have fun. :D