PDA

View Full Version : Visa's in the US for flight training? Read this....


Cyclic Hotline
19th Oct 2001, 21:51
Hijack Suspect Reportedly Slipped Into U.S.

MIAMI (Reuters) - Mohamed Atta, thought to be a ringleader among the 19 hijackers who carried out the Sept. 11 airborne attacks on the United States, was questioned about his visa at Miami airport in January but got into the country anyway, two newspapers reported on Friday.

The Miami Herald and the weekly Miami New Times said Atta was almost denied entry into the United States on arrival at Miami International Airport on Jan. 10, because he stated he wanted to take flying lessons on a tourist visa, rather than a student visa.

Atta, who had flown in from Madrid, Spain, was ordered out of the regular immigration line so that a second immigration official could question him at length, a federal official familiar with the event told the Miami Herald.

But after a 57-minute delay, Atta was cleared for entry into the country as a tourist.

The New Times reported a similar sequence of events, basing its report on two INS sources.

Atta, a 33-year-old pilot who traveled on an Egyptian passport and lived in Florida for a time before the attack taking flying lessons, was aboard American Airlines Flight 11, the first plane to hit the World Trade Center in New York.

The Herald said the questioning over his visa was the fourth instance that had come to light involving a moment where Atta could have been stopped by U.S. authorities.

On Dec. 27 last year, a Federal Aviation Administration official threatened to investigate him and another hijacking suspect, Marwan al-Shehhi, after the pair abandoned their broken-down small plane on a taxiway at the airport, the paper said.

Also on Jan. 10, Immigration and Naturalization Service inspectors failed to notice that Atta had overstayed his visa by 32 days during a previous trip to the United States.

In May, police did not arrest him on a warrant issued after he missed a May 28 court hearing in Broward County on a traffic ticket for driving without a valid license. Such non-arrests are common given that thousands of people get traffic tickets and fail to appear for court hearings.

When he was questioned at the Miami airport on Jan. 10, the Herald said Atta told the INS inspector he had applied for a student visa but it had not yet come through.

If he had been deemed inadmissible by the second officer who questioned him, Atta could either have been sent to a nearby immigration detention center or deported to Europe.

His last entry into the United States was on July 19, when an INS inspector at Hartsfield International Airport in Atlanta gave him until Nov. 12 to stay, the Herald said.

The Herald quoted a former INS officer familiar with Miami airport inspections as saying the reason immigration officials missed Atta's overstay was that they were under pressure to clear tourists quickly.

"Supervisors want you not to delay those people unless their papers are not in order or they have no papers,'' former INS officer Patrick Pizarro said.

slim_slag
20th Oct 2001, 00:49
...Atta was almost denied entry into the United States on arrival at Miami International Airport on Jan. 10, because he stated he wanted to take flying lessons on a tourist visa, rather than a student visa.

But after a 57-minute delay, Atta was cleared for entry into the country as a tourist.

What does that tell you?

I bet it's all going to change of course. Visa Waiver holders will in the future almost certainly be required to have some visa to take flying lessons or even to time build, plus a nasty little extra too which nobody seems to have brought up.


Senate Bill S.1447 Aviation Security Act

(c) BACKGROUND CHECKS FOR ALIENS ENGAGED IN CERTAIN TRANSACTIONS REGARDING AIRCRAFT-

(1) REQUIREMENT- Notwithstanding any other provision of law and subject to paragraph (2), no person or entity may sell, lease, or charter any aircraft to an alien, or any other individual specified by the Secretary for purposes of this subsection, within the United States unless the Attorney General issues a certification of the completion of a background investigation of the alien, or other individual, as the case may be, that meets the requirements of section 44939(b) of title 49, United States Code, as added by section 111 of this title.

(2) EXPIRATION- The prohibition in paragraph (1) shall expire as follows:

(A) In the case of an aircraft having a maximum certified takeoff weight of more than 12,500 pounds, upon implementation of the program required by subsection (a).

(B) In the case of an aircraft having a maximum certified takeoff weight of 12,500 pounds or less, upon implementation of the program required by subsection (b).

(3) ALIEN DEFINED- In this subsection, the term `alien' has the meaning given that term in section 44939(f) of title 49, United States Code, as so added.


What's this title 49, section 44939(f) all about then?

Its added in Section 111 of this Act

(f) ALIEN DEFINED- In this section, the term `alien' has the meaning given the term in section 101(a)(3) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (8 U.S.C. 1101(a)(3)).'.


So finding what this is all about...

Title 8 U.S.C. § 1101(a)(3) defines an alien as "any person not a citizen or national of the United States. " In turn, 8 U.S.C. § 1101 (a)(22) defines a "national of the United States" as "(A) a citizen of the United States, or (B) a person who, though not a citizen of the United States, owes permanent allegiance to the United States."

Case law has held (very recently in California, the US ninth circuit court of appeals) that a green card holder is neither.

So it looks like the US authorities are seriously considering making non-US citizens have a Federal backgound check before they can rent a plane. Its in the Senate right now. That's a bit of a bummer I'd say.

inverted flatspin
20th Oct 2001, 04:20
Back when I got my greencard, A background check was required. It really is not that hard all I had to do was go to my local Garda station (Irish Police) and ask for a certificate of character. About a week later after they had checked out my criminal background they sent me a letter saying that I had never been convicted of a crime. They also forwarded a copy to the embassy. A Scottish friend of mine tells the exact same story so the same thing happens in the UK. I also seem to remember in some of my dealings with the INS+FBI and from going through Background checks in the U.S.(so that I could get into a nuclear power plant and lawrence livermore labs) that they maintain a list of "FRIENDLY" countries where the Background checks required are less stringent. If it comes to it all it will involve is some paperwork unless of course you have got a criminal record.

slim_slag
20th Oct 2001, 23:46
Flat Spin

If it comes to it all it will involve is some paperwork unless of course you have got a criminal record.

Oh sure, it's not a terribly big deal but it's still a pain. I would imagine that it would be something the home country embassy would process at the same time as they process your visa.

As you say, the embassies are used to doing this for immigrant and non-immigrant visa already.

It's going to be an extra cost of course, and will probably deter those borderline wannabes from getting involved in flying, which is a bad thing. I suppose it might have a positive side to it for UK flying schools.

If you read the Act in full, the background check provision only lasts until the FAA comes up with some permanent security scheme for airports/flying schools. They have 12 months to do this. Security is quite frankly ridiculous, it's been simple to walk onto a ramp and steal a plane for ever.

I once managed to rent a plane three years ago in a small town in Tennessee without showing any ID or a pilots licence. I also paid in cash. If you think that's nuts, the person who checked me out (5 touch and goes was all it took) was the local deputy sheriff!!!!!

Absolutely Nuts