Looking for Twins to hire....

[MagCheck]

I am trying to find any company or person who has a twin for hire. Ideally a Seneca 2 as the place I normally rent from have now stopped due to Sept11th. If anybody can suggest anything I would be grateful.

[Sensible]

You don't say where you are looking to go to fly the airplane, if you are near California, try Air Desert Pacific www.adp-flight.com (http://www.adp-flight.com)
they rent out Seneca's at $119/hr and 50hr block for $5500 that's USD's not UK quids!
Lots of nice interesting places to fly from there too!

[englishal]

Rainbow Air at Long Beach rent the Seneca II...think its around $170 per hour wet....

EA

[Hoodwink]

Hello

I had a quick look on the ADP site and noted that if you dont have 100hrs m/e they will provide you with a "safety pilot" until you reach the 100 hrs required for a solo rental. Does that mean the time can only be logged as Dual Received.
Are the aircraft in good nick?

Hoodwink

[englishal]

Never ever rent a Seneca I !

It has all the 'disadvantages' of a single coupled with Vmc.

Mind you I thought ADP had some Seminoles? I used to fly into Bracket when I was doing my IR,and the ADP aircraft looked pretty good...

[Sensible]

I understand that the 100 hr minimum hrs applies at ADP before taking away a Seneca solo without a free CFI as safety pilot (all the CFI's want to ride shotgun for free just to make up their own twin time!) the exception is when the renter has an ME Inst. + 25hrs. It's only the Seneca 1's that ADP rent out as takeaways I believe though. Not sure if anybody will rent out any twin to a low hours pilot!

[DesiPilot]

Englishal,

Whats wrong with Seneca I?

[MagCheck]

Thanks all for your posting. Apologies for not being specific enough, but I am looking in the UK. Ideally around the South/South West region. I currently have a ME IR and 30hrs.

I have found a company at Exeter willing to rent a Duchess, however I've never flown one. Anybody got any views on them??

[ 17 December 2001: Message edited by: MagCheck ]

[englishal]

Seneca I....

Normally aspirated lowish power engines, so if you lose an engine, especially at any sort of altitude or density altitude you will be unable to climb, and very unlikely to even maintain altitude. You have two engines, so your chance of engine failure (over a single) doubles, plus you have all the problems associated with Vmc. You're better of in a single, at least you have no Vmc to deal with, plus you don't get any choice when the engine quits....

Seneca II on the other hand is a great aircraft. Turbo Charged 200 HP per side, can climb on one engine if not loaded up to max, density altitude doesn't affect engine power (in fact power increases with alt), can operate up to 25,000' with two engines, and around 14,000' on one....

I wouldn't take a Seneca I into any sort of high altitude airport....

[Chuck Ellsworth]

englishal:

Are you serious that you would rather lose an engine in a single than in a Seneca 1?

Surely you are jesting? Is there not some way to stay above vmc?

.....................

:D The hardest thing about flying is knowing when to say no. :D

[Matthewjharvey]

Seneca I is not a great aircraft but I would still rather take my chances in it than a single. The problems come when inexperienced or poorly trained pilots fly these machines. If you do not get the correct engine feathered in a hurry you have problems. The Seneca I has a single engine service ceiling of 3650ft, hence flying over terrain higher than this you are effectively a glider if you lose an engine, but correctly handled at least your rate of descent will be significantly less than what it would be in the single and should give you sufficient range to find an adequate landing site. Vmc on the I is 69 knots, Vyse is 91 (sea level values). The lack of power actually helps minimise the risk of losing control and it is a very docile plain to fly on 1 engine. I should know i've had to land it like this occasionally.
If you are flying in lowland areas the Seneca I is a decent enough aircraft, but I would agree that I would not fly it in mountainous areas.
Oh and watch out for the collapsing gear.

[englishal]

Yea, ok, maybe its not as bad as a single, like The Greaser points out having two engines will give a lower rate of descent, and if an engine fails enroute, maybe you can save the aircraft. Trouble is engine failure will invariably happen at a crucial moment in flight (just as the gear goes up!) and if not handled correctly will put you in a world of sh*t. Same with all multi's of course though at least if the A/C can climb on one engine, all be it slowly, it is less likely the pilot will end up trying to gain altitude (stretching the glide) when it is clearly impossible, and then you start getting into the messy world of Vmc at low altitude with the only way to stay in control is pitch down / reduce power....might as well be in a single, its lighter and will stop quicker on the ground...this is just my view...

I wouldn't be too happy about flying a S1 in the Cable / Bracket area of California, there's a lot of high mountains to get over if you want to go anywhere......

Oh yea, and didn't the Stabilator used to fall off !

Cheers

EA

[MagCheck]

Rtning to the question, do I take it no one has any other suggestions??

I have never flown a Seneca 1 always 2 and will try to maintain at 2 or higher for what it's worth. But currently would STILL just like to find one to hire.

[sickBocks]

Flying Schools in S/SW of the UK with Twins:

Plymouth School of Flying 01752 773335 - PLH - Piper Twin Comanche

Bournemouth School of Flying 01202 578558 - BOH - Grumman Cougar

Carill Aviation Flying School 023 8064 3528 -SOU - Seneca III

Western Air 01264 773900 - Thruxton - Piper Aztec

Aeros - Seneca II- GLO - 01452 857419 - www.aeros.co.uk (http://www.aeros.co.uk)
some flying from Filton 0117 936 4495

Bristol Flying Centre 01275 474601 - www.b-f-c.co.uk (http://www.b-f-c.co.uk) - BRS - Seneca II

[MagCheck]

sickBocks - Thankyou!

I have to ask as the topic was taken this way... any preference: Seneca 1 or 2?

[hellcat]

Shoreham have a couple of Aztecs from two differents sources, one I know is vey good, i've flown it. The other I am told is good.
In my humble opinion Aztecs are better than Senneca's full stop (this is not up for debate I have flown both asymetric close to max wt).
Just to add a couple of quotes.
1.(from a very experienced FI) "I got my 'multi' in a Dutchess, the only single engined twin."
2. The second engine in small GA aircraft is only there to take you to the scene of the accident.

[ 18 December 2001: Message edited by: hellcat ]