Obtaining a US Airman's Certificate

[stolport]

Hi

Has anyone obtained a temporary airman's certificate for hour building since September?

I would like to go to Florida in February or March but wan't to make certain that I can obtain a certificate relatively easy.

I see from the Orlando FSDO website that they are still by appointment only but are now open Monday-Friday's.

Thank's in advance :)

[Naples Air Center, Inc.]

stolport,

It is still a straight forward process getting your JAA Licence converted to FAA. The procedure we have been using is calling ahead to notify the FAA that were will be flying over and the rest works the same as prior to Sept. 11.

Happy Flying,

Capt. Richard J. Gentil, Pres.
Naples Air Center, Inc.

[johnnypick]

I got my temporary airmen cert 6 weeks ago, all you have to do is make an appointment at the FSDO. If you just turn up, they'll get pissed off and probably have you arrested. :)

[nickos37]

HI STOLPORT,I'M GONNA BE IN FLORIDA AROUND MARCH AND I'M THINKING TO DO SOME HOUR BUILDING TOO.IF YOU'RE INTERESTED OF SHARING SOME BLOCK-TIME LET ME KNOW,WE COULD FLY TOGETHER AND LOG TIME BOTH OF US.
MY E-MAIL IS [email protected]

[spitfire747]

Hi

I was at NAC last month. I had to make an appointment with the FSDO and then just turn up with my licence and medical.

YOU NEED an appointment or you will not even get in the building, but apart from that it is all straight forward, just fill in the form and smile nicely

Spitfire747

[FlyingForFun]

I got a temporary airman certificate in Arizona two days ago, with no advance notice, no problems at all. Just show them your license, medical and photo id, and fill in a form.

A related question:

The certificate states that "all limitations and restrictions of the UK pilot license apply". This means that if you don't have a night rating on your UK license, you can't fly at night in the US, for example.

I have a basic PPL. I'd like to fly at night in the US (after appropriate training, of course). I'd also like to fly a complex aircraft (retractable, fixed-pitch). My US license won't allow this unless my UK license does. So, the question is, can a US (FAA-certified) flight instructor endorse me to fly at night, or to fly complex aircraft, on my UK JAA license? If the answer is No, it seems that the only other way I can do this is to take the FAA written test and PPL skills test, to get an FAA license which is not based on my JAA license - is this correct?

Thanks

FFF
-------

[FAAJAA]

If you wanted to fly at Night or Complex on a UK license in the US it IS possible...but rather difficult. You would have to get a US medical and student pilot certificate, and get an instructor to endorse you based on training received from him/her. The problem is, not many FBOs int he US will let you go meandering off solo in a retract without at least 10 hours of dual in the aircraft...and finding an instrcutor to sign you off for solo night flight may be an issue. For example, when I was actively instructing, I never once gave out a night solo endorsement. Not out of malice, it just open you up to liability, which the ambulance chasing lawyers in the US love.

[twinkletoes]

This is more a question than answer. After visiting several FBO's in the US I have got the feeling that having at least 10hrs dual for a complex endorsement is more an insurance issue than a FAR. I have also found that you would be very lucky to find an FBO who will let you lose with low time and 10 hrs in a complex aircraft.
Night privalages would (I presume) become very complicated.
I have however found FSDO's to be more accomadating than the CAA and the answer to all questions lies with them.
Best of luck, I am sure others will be interested in the final outcome.

[Julian]

I have never had any problems getting endoresed on aircraft in California, once you have shown you are competent in handling the aircraft and completed a short written test on the aircraft, the instructors have been quite happy to sign the paperwork and cut you loose.

I have flown night solo under both VFR and IFR conditions.

Julian.

[englishal]

You can of course get a complex endorsement on you "FAA licence issued on the basis of blah blah". There is no minimum time requirement, once the instructor is happy with you he'll endorse your logbook. I rent an Arrow from Rainbow in LGB. They require 5 hrs dual.Same with a twin....if you have about 100hrs twin time they'll let you take their aircraft, otherwise you need 25 hrs dual with one of their instructors...oh yea, you need the FAA ME rating as well, again no minimum time, though normally takes around 10 hrs.....

I have no night rating, but got my FAA IR and ME (IR). The instructor is happy to endorse me as a 'student' to fly at night :)

[FlyingForFun]

englishal,

I think you're wrong about being able to get the complex endorsement on the "FAA license issued on the basis of...." because this license states (direct quote from the license): "all limitations and restrictions of the UK pilot license apply". Since my UK pilot license won't allow me to fly a complex aircraft, my understanding is that there is no way to get the complex endorsement on the FAA license. However, if I got my JAA license endorsed, this would automatically carry over onto the FAA license.

Thanks for the replies, guys. It seems that there are two ways of doing this:

1) Get a student pilots license, and get an instructor to sign you out for solo flight. This is an option I hadn't thought of - I can see problems with doing this for the complex aircraft (how many people fly complex aircraft on a student pilots license?) but it should be possible for night flying, so long as you can find a willing instructor!

2) Do the FAA skills test and get an FAA license not based on the JAA one.

Either way, you obviously also have to get the school or club you are renting from to agree that you've got the experience and skill to fly the aircraft.

Thanks! (And good luck to everyone else who's trying to fight their way through red tape, too!)

FFF
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[Julian]

Flyingforfun, yes you are able to get one issued on the basis of your licence. It seems the restricitons quoted are aimed mainly at night rating which are part of the FAA course but not the JAA therefore as a basic PPL holder you should be night flying in the US unless you hold a licence. I did my NR in Feb so I could, I recently completed the FAA IR course and now file full airways in the US, UK it gives you the IMC rating.

I am going to doing my ME next time I go out, which will be issued on the FAA rather than the JAA licence.

Julian.

[englishal]

Yep you can get a complex endorsement, even if your FAA licence is issued on the basis of your UK PPL. I have a UK PPL, no NR, nada, but have FAA Licence issued on basis of my JAA PPL, FAA IR(A), FAA ME (IR) and a complex endorsement. As the complex endorsment is simply an endorsement in your logbook by an FAA CFI, then once endorsed, this limitation no longer applies. With the IR and ME your airmans certificate is maked with "US test passed"....

You can do the FAA skill test if you want, but you'd be wasting your money...

[FlyingForFun]

Julian/englishal,

That's very good news! Two questions:

Do you know if the same applies to night flying, i.e. can I get a "night rating" on my US license after undergoing appropriate training?

I don't suppose you have any references for this - I mentioned it at the school I'm flying at, and found one instructor who agrees that it's possible, and one who thought it wasn't! Fortunately, the one who says it is possible is more senior, so I will be able to fly complex aircraft once I'm checked out - but if I could get references it would make it a lot easier, politically!


Cheers!

FFF
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[englishal]

FFF,

Its not possible to get a NR without either getting an unrestricted FAA PPL, or CPL or getting a NR on your JAA licence. The only way is to get signed off as a student and fly solo at night. This is becasue for the FAA PPL / CPL night training is a requirement for the issue of the licence....which makes sense to me, maybe JAA should do the same and abolish the night 'qualification'. After all flying at night is no different to flying in the day really, except smoother...

As far as Complex endorsement goes....because your basic JAA PPL is for the SEL, and a complex aircraft like the Arrow is a SEL class aircraft, it is not a limitation in the sense that your JAA PPL forbids your to fly a complex A/C. FAR 61.31 (e) states that for a person to be able to operate a Complex aircraft they must have received ground and flight training with an authorised instructor (unless already operated one prior to Aug 4 1997....then they are exempt), and have a one time endorsement in their logbook. Once this is done, then you're good to fly complex N reg A/C.

The other way to do it is to get an FAA ME rating, as this superceeds the complex endorsement as ME A/C are complex....but it costs more !


Hope this helps !

EA

[Squealing Pig]

Ok, so its Licence, Medical cert, Photo ID, Do I need my log ?

[DesiPilot]

Yes, current JAA/CAA PPL, class 2 medical, your passport and yourself.
Although you need an appointment to go to FSDO, there are FAA designated examiners who would convert your licence for a small fee. Usually between $25 to $40. If you have to travel lond distance to visit the FSDO, this might be an option. The designated examiner here charges $25 and he is available on short notice. You can call your local FSDO and ask them if there is a DE in your area who is authorised to do the conversion. I hope this helps :)

[FlyingForFun]

I didn't need my log book, but I can't see it does any harm to take it with in case. The flight school you're hiring from will certainly want to see it, anyway, even if the FSDO doesn't.

As for making appointments, seeing designated examiners at home, etc. this seems to vary from state to state. In Arizona, the only way of getting the license is to see a designated examiner at home. If you go to the FSDO in Scottsdale, all they'll do is give you a list of phone numbers. Speak to your flying school, or the FSDO, to find out.

Thanks to everyone who's answered my quesions, either here or by e-mail. I'm still getting contradictory advice from different people, but the general consencus seems to be that the night restriction can be removed, and that complex endorsements can be added. And the school I'm renting from now agrees with this, too, which is a bonus! However, because I am still getting some advice to the contrary (e.g. englishal who says that night restrictions can not be lifted) I will check in the FAA AIM as soon as I get the chance, for the definitive answer, and will post references!

FFF
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[Julian]

FFF, if you hold a JAA Night rating then you are able to fly at night on your FAA licence.

Julian.

[englishal]

I had a chat to an FAA examiner about the Night thing, and he agreed with me. In fact, I busted my IR check ride, even before getting to the oral, because I had not (officially!) flown at night. To undertake a US rating like the IR you need to have met the FAA PPL minimum requirements which include 3.5 hrs of dual night before you can take the test. When questioned about flying at night, he agreed that the only way was for me to either: get signed off as astudent to fly at night solo, get a JAA NR on my JAA licence, take the FAA PPL tests or get an FAA CPL, (which is what I'm going to do anyway). For the CPL you need various night cross-countries etc, so in the end I got signed off as a student pilot to fly at night...

EA

[FlyingForFun]

Hmm, interesting. Julian, I don't have the night rating, that's the problem. Englishal, most of the people I've spoken to, including someone from the FAA, say that if I do the FAA PPL minimum night requirements, I'll be able to fly at night on my FAA license. Haven't got round to actually checking with the FARs tho. Does seem very strange if this isn't the case, but it certainly doesn't seem 100% clear, that's for sure. I'm not planning on doing FAA ratings, though, so no danger of the issue you had! Just the danger of flying solo at night, believing that I'm all signed off and ready to go, but actually being illegal.

Why can't things ever be easy???

Ah well, these things are sent to try us.

FFF
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[englishal]

FFF,

Here's an extract from the FAA website, which should clarify things:

Also, any limitations that appear on the foreign pilot certificate are limitations that apply to the U.S. certificate that is obtained under FAR 61.75. For example, some foreign aviation authorities do not allow night flying. That means a U.S. certificate issued on the basis of that certificate could not be used at night in the U.S.

Can read the full version at http://www.awp.faa.gov/fsdo/foreign.htm

Cheers

EA