JAR PPL in Africa??

[centre]

I am in England and am wanting to do my PPL and perhaps continue further to ATPL. I have heard that SA is a good place to go because of the obvious cheap sunlight. But I want a JAR approval so that I can fly back here. Have heard that some schools advertise JAR but don't actually have it. Can anyone tell me if there any good flying schools in South Africa that have JAR approval??

[Dakota Queen]

Dude

There was a school, in Midrand Airport but as fas as I know it closed down so theres nowhere you'll get JAR cert. But as you pointed out, SA is both cheap and the weather is perfect. the conversion to a JAA PPL when you get home involves some exams and a flight test. They only recognise the hours.

I'm planning on going their end of next year. Expense wise between £2-3K incl accomadation is all you will pay.

Ciao:D :D :D :D

[Irv]

>> centre "Have heard that some schools advertise JAR but don't actually have it"

You often see schools outside the JAA states advertising using terms like initial or preparatory JAA CPL module - for that you can read "do some cheap fast hours building here".
There are basically two ways to get a JAA CPL/IR or frozen ATPL/IR - pay a 5 figure (pounds) sum and effectively go to college at an airfield for over a year, or the other way is the modular route. The latter is at your own pace, and the CPL course normally wants 150 hours to start. It doesn't really matter what ICAO licence you have before that, or where you built the hours. You could have an SA-PPL and hours built in SA, or an SA-PPL and hours built in the UK, or even started on an SA PPL and converted earlier to JAA PPL.
I think the SA schools which are not JAA approved but use certain JAA phraseology in the adverts are just getting you to the point where you could then start a JAA CPL course (with some other school). However, as long as you understand what they are really offering and what they are not, they can get you to the start of CPL quickly (due to weather) and cheaply (due to exchange rates) - relative term there! :) - the problem comes if there is any masking of what they are really offering on first contact with you.

>>DQ "There was a school, in Midrand Airport but as fas as I know it closed down"
I hadn't heard the JAA school in SA had packed up though. The following comment is NOT aimed specifically at that one, but note with ANY JAA approved school outside the JAA states, potential students must establish the numbers of JAA approved instructors / examiners there. Since March 2002 the instructors at these schools either have to be 'real' JAA instructors, or have been previously teachig JAR before the cutoff date in March 2002. Obviously over time, the numbers of such JAR instructors (and examiners) at any school outside the JAA states could diminish to a point which was a problem for the numbers of students on courses, unless the school addresses the problem. It's just another thing to raise with them and what would happen if they could not meet plans.

[perceval]

hi ,
If I were you , I would check carefully with your home CAA who is approved where , especially regarding the flight tests .I believe that some schools are using a JAR syllabus at the same time than their local requirements but do not have the rights to issue licences , so you might well still have a local licence to convert to your JAR one .This is not necessarily Awful though because most licences issued in Normal african countries (I mean the ones not having a civil war) are ICAO recognized so that you will have a minimal conversion with a few advantages :1-you can do it quicker coz weather is better .
2-It is fabulous to fly in Africa and you will have a dual experience having done both licences .
3-You will be able to also increase your human experience at the same time than your flying experience .
Don't hope to save money though , even if the advertised prices are cheaper than in the EU , think that you will have accomodation , ticket there ...on top .
If you decide to go to SA , ask around about which schools to go to .There has been a certain number of bad stories from there , it might be turning into a smaller US thingy .Shop around carefully .
Other places to consider are Kenya , Tanzania ,Botswana ...
Only local licences but great flying .
cheerio

[George Tower]

Hi there

On SA PPL you can fly UK registered Aircraft. To convert an SA PPL to a JAR licence you need (I think) 100 hours Total time and then a flight test in a JAA state e.g. the UK. I think also you need to write to additional exams - Human Performance (which isn't on the SA PPL syllabus and Air Law.

With regards to going further towards a JAR frozen ATPL I don't think there is any school in Africa that can offer the whole thing. FTC at Grand Central have some tie up with a JAA approved school in the UK and from memory were offering a full time ground school for the ATP theory as well as hour building. As far as I am aware you still need to do the CPL flight prep and the IR in the UK or a JAA state.

I hear from various people I have spoken to that 43 in Port Alfred will be offering something in the future for JAR student. At present they offer a so called structred hour building course, but to be honest nothing beats exploring this beautiful country on your own.

As you may be aware the JAR Instrument Rating consists of a 55 hour course and this can set you back more than £13,000, but holders of an ICAO IR have the course reduced to 15 hours 10 of which can be in a sim. So it may well be worth getting an SA CPL IR and then doing this new conversion not only will it be cheaper but you'll also get more experience.

It may mean writing more exams and doing more flight tests but that can only stand you in good stead and also gives you a greater chance of passing the JAR stuff first time round - it's expensive enough without having to do re-tests etc.

Finally as for SA's reputation. I think if you dig hard enough you will always find dirt. I could post it here but whats the point. Most main towns in SA have good flight schools and I'm sure a quick searchon Pprune would give you all the info you need.

[Irv]

GT:
The 100 hours was necessary when JAR first came in - now you can convert if you want with under the 100 if you do ALL the ground exams and the flight test (and medical) - if you have 100+, you only do 2 ground exams, (law and human performance), the flight test (and medical). Many still wait for the 100. Oh yes, and the SA licence must be fully valid at conversion time.

I'll send you a link 'offline' which covers a few JAR things.