Class 1 referral because of fit HELP

[Paul2289]

I had my initial Class 1 in July and was referred to a Neurologist after having a single instance of a fainting fit on my medical records when i was 17 (i am now 37 and only ever had one in my life).
The consultant i was referred to by the ame examined me and stated in his letter:

"He had a vasovagal syncope at the time and brief jerks are frequently seen and of no concern. From a neurological perspective, there is no contradiction to a class 1 CAA medical certificate"

Despite this (and chasing the AME every day for a week to get them to review the letter from the specialist) they have now referred me to the CAA!

Throughout the whole process I have found the AME disinterested in me as a customer and never (apart from when i demanded to speak to the practice manager) rang me back when they said they would or generally cared about my case.

I have a coupe, of questions.

1. Is this normal to be referred to the CAA for a single event 20 years ago even after having an EEG at the time which was clear and being examined by a AME referred consultant?
2. What is the general turn around time for matters such as this by the CAA (The AME refused to give me ANY indication of time scales).

I am now having to cancel lessons for my PPL as i am ready to go solo and cannot progress without my Class 1 (i wish i just went Class 2 and worried about my class 1 latter).

Any advice would be gratefully received!

[Fire and brimstone]

It appears to be a sad reflection on our industry / aviation in general that there is any need to see posts like this.

However, they appear with a certain regularity. Why is this when there is aeromedical assistance supposedly on tap - even at a price?

1) Don't give up.

2) Remain positive and focused on what you need to do and the end goal.

3) If you can't get the advice from a certain AME, then find one who will help. They do exist.

4) Keep trying to get the guidance you need (and deserve). If you are not told what you need to do, how can you do it?? It is fair and reasonable for you to be told how to proceed, but this can take time and patience.

5) Keep a record of all correspondence, make sure you get proof of posting of essential correspondence. If you don't get replies, don't hesitate to go higher up the organisation.

6) If you are part of any association, get them to help you.

You are not alone, and there are numerous others in precisely the same position as you are.

Also, reflect on this in The Telegraph 28 August .............

ONE IN SIX NHS PATIENTS 'MISDIAGNOSED'

This is in the NHS and GP surgery's (not specifically AME / CAA), however, AME's are GP's.

Doctors are making mistakes in up to 15% of cases, because:-

- they are too quick to judge;

- they are reluctant to ask more senior colleagues for help.

In addition to this, Prof. Graham Neale states the real situation is almost certainly worse than this, as many people are reluctant to report mistakes by Doctors.

Best of luck with it.

[Radgirl]

Wow dont stop there F and B. Tell us what you really think of the medical profession..... Bit of realism needed here I think!

I suspect the situation has arisen because the clonic jerks were disclosed, as indeed they should have been. The AME could not then issue a medical certificate as it was a fit and properly obtained a neurological opinion. The same would have applied for a class 2 IMHO

That opinion was that there was nothing to worry about. This was a simple faint

The AME may however now have to pass this by the CAA and indeed has done so. So far everyone has behaved properly.

The issue is that the CAA isnt very quick and the AME knows that winging at them rarely helps. He is busy, and indeed may be less than animated. His receptionists tend to shield him from, presumably, an impossible NHS general practice where he sees 50 patients a day etc etc. The Telegraph is telling him he is C@@@ because he is too quick to judge, and has a full 7.5 minutes for each patient, and needs to refer more patients to consultants who after all after just twiddling their thumbs. No wonder the poor GP /AME is disillusioned

Paul2289 I appreciate this is frustrating. A telephone call to the CAA may be your best bet here. I suspect you will get your medical but it takes time

Good luck

[AyrTC]

You may find trying to get in touch with the CAA by phone impossible. Use the email address and attach any relevant documents, remember to use your CAA Ref no.
I believe the CAA are very short staffed/ busy and they are trying to make all contact with them via an AME.

I am sure if you send them an email they will get back to you. My recent experience was a reply within two weeks, however I may have been lucky.

I'm afraid once the CAA gets involved it could take several months.

[Paul2289]

Hi Radgirl I know its very hard to comment on individual cases but I feel having read the guidance that I have been inaccurately refereed to the CAA. The single episode i had 20 years ago was investigated. I had a full EEG and no sign of epilepsy and the report stated that it was a direct result of fainting and nothing to worry about.
i provided copies of this report from 20 years ago to the AME and to be safe he said he wanted to refer me to a neurologist. As stated in my post the neurologists agreed with the diagnosis from 20 years ago (he even said he was very surprised they bothered with an EEG).

Now i am in a situation where the CAA are unlikely to talk directly to me and the AME seem disinterested in helping or giving me any meaningful updates which considering i paid £550 + £600 in extra investigations is disgusting.
At the very least they could compile a "So you have been refereed to the CAA hat next?" help sheet rather than leaving me guessing.

I must admit i am very worried to hear it can take months. I may as well give up on my PPL now! What do professional pilots do where this could suspend them from duty?

[Paul2289]

I emailed the CAA and got the following on their automated response:
"Medical reports for aeromedical decisions submitted to the CAA are normally actioned and a response despatched within 10 working days. We aim to prioritise assessments for professional pilots and ATCOs returning to duty"

does the 10 working days apply to new applications as well?

[Radgirl]

Sorry Paul2289 I appreciate your frustration but the AME is not a specialist he is there to effectively screen pilots. A neurologist may well have been content with the 20 year old report but it is not surprising the AME wanted effectively an update. And I suspect because you had jerks he had to refer to the CAA. He had no alternative

Sadly both the AME and the CAA are under massive pressure. This is due to the government not them. GPs are in crisis and the CAA medical branch has been seriously cut back. This does not resolve your issues but those who work in the NHS will appreciate how difficult it is to be under such pressure and then to be criticised.

[Paul2289]

Understood which is why i was referred to a Neurologist last month by the AME who cleared me for my Class 1. I then call the AME a week after they received the letter from the Neurologist to be told i have been referred.
If the AME appointed "Expert" says i am fine to fly why has he referred it to the CAA? Further more why was i not told this would be the case when he send me to the Neurologist in the first place, at least I would have had my expectations set and could have planned my training properly.

To be honest the customer service from the AME has been terrible and funding is not an excuse because i am paying for it! Ultimately I dont feel like they care about me as an individual beyond the £550 I paid them for 2 hours of examinations.

[Bad medicine]

OK, I think we are going around in circles here.