View Full Version : A320 - T/OFF SPEEDs on MCDU page (PERF)
My company uses FLYSMART to calculate of speeds. There aren't RTOW charts on board.
For example:
If iPads (CM1 & CM2) will be fail, which speeds to use?
Is FCOM consider raw data to calculate?
pezetaroi
4th Aug 2017, 13:38
I would do it, just back to basics... ;-)
FlyingStone
4th Aug 2017, 14:29
Where do you get the list of relevant obstacles from? Does FCOM even has enough data to calculate minimum obstacle clearance?
KingAir1978
4th Aug 2017, 15:30
Is this a serious question? The performance charts are runway specific. OBVIOUSLY you cannot use the FCOM. If your company issue you with tools to do the calculation and they fail, they'll also have to provide you with a back-up.
tubby linton
4th Aug 2017, 15:38
Call your fleet manager and get them to give you the data.
KingAir1978
4th Aug 2017, 15:54
And make sure you receive a copy of their input as well, in case somebody makes a :mad:
May it use - SPEEDS LIMITED BY VMCG/VMCA (PER-TOF-TOD-25-10)?
First.officer
4th Aug 2017, 17:13
Usually I would expect that a call back to base will allow for the reserve iPads that are maintained and updated within your Flight Operations department, to be utilised to supply the required performance figures as a temporary mitigation measure.....until you can have the new replacement iPads dispatched to you.
As for the likelihood of two iPads failing at the same time....that's got to be a highly unlikely scenario aside from a possible corrupted database issue, and then your in a 'no go' situation IMHO until such time as the relevant EFB administrator has resolved the issues internally.
I would expect this to be dealt with as a matter of urgency, so hence it should be resolved as soon as feasibly possible - much like any TECH/AOG issue, it can happen and is subject to similar contingency plans.
As for the likelihood of two iPads failing at the same time....
I'm in mind as for the possibility to calculate using FCOM or QRH.
tubby linton
4th Aug 2017, 20:48
As somebody has previously posted, you cannot use the Fcom data as it does not allow for the obstructions in the different segments of the take off. If you think that only using the runway data is acceptable then I don't want to fly with you.
No spare iPad on board? Thought that was a requirement, at least it seems to be in the case of the local european CAA that is responisble for my company. And a triple fault is quite remote, in that case i would play the lottery and go home.
As others have mentioned, generic data cannot be used as obstacle data will not be available, not to mention that flysmart also provides the EOSID.
First.officer
5th Aug 2017, 09:37
We only carry two iPads on-board - one each issued personally to the CM1 and CM2 positions respectively, all approved by our NAA. Over 3+ years operating, and has not proven to be an issue yet - although proving the case perhaps in itself, as Denti has alluded to, I would go play the lottery for lower odds in respect of device failure (even in the two iPad case!).
This is not that complicated is it? You just call you operations control who will have a version of Flysmart on one of their computers and they will give you the performance figures.
Surely there is a procedure for this in you OMA.
Denti, we only carry 2 tablets as well. Three seems overkill.
We used to carry only 2 when it was windows xp based tablet PCs (MIL spec ones). Which was good enough for the last 15 to 20 years or so of paperless operation. Now that we're in our second gen iPad ops we get a spare iPad on each aircraft (additional to the personal ones for each pilot) instead of the spare windows tablet we carry at the moment. Saves 4 kg of weight and quite a few issues with updating and power supply, not to mention training. Dunno if the eQRH is even available for windows XP at all.
FlyingStone
6th Aug 2017, 21:16
I think the vast majority of the operators carry only 2 EFB units, and there are contingency procedures in place if one or two of them fails.
Denti, sounds like you need to have a talk with your CAA and ask them to be more reasonable.
sierra_mike
6th Aug 2017, 21:57
pretty sure your MEL will have something against letting you go with all EFBs INOP if you don't have any alternate (paper)documentation on board
compressor stall
6th Aug 2017, 22:13
Three is being recommended by Airbus for eQRH operations as they are rolled out.
CaptainMongo
7th Aug 2017, 17:39
We used to carry only 2 when it was windows xp based tablet PCs (MIL spec ones). Which was good enough for the last 15 to 20 years or so of paperless operation. Now that we're in our second gen iPad ops we get a spare iPad on each aircraft (additional to the personal ones for each pilot) instead of the spare windows tablet we carry at the moment. Saves 4 kg of weight and quite a few issues with updating and power supply, not to mention training. Dunno if the eQRH is even available for windows XP at all.
How and where is the spare iPad secured? (When they put polar suits on our -777's, quite a few went missing...) Is the spare iPad plugged into maintain charge? Is part of your SOP to preflight the spare wrt charge, currency etc? Do you still have a paper QRH on the airplane?
Thanks for the info (I can see our company moving in the same direction - we have one pubs kit now per aircraft most likely to be none soon enough)
[question for extra credit: If a rogue regime detonated a nuke EMP, what would still work on our airplane? I don't know the answer just thinking out loud...- heard the Boeing military tanker project was running into issues with EMP protection]
safelife
7th Aug 2017, 17:58
In a box at the bottom of the wardrobe. Not maintained charged, but taken out by the crew every now and then. Update by 4G/LTE.
Paper QRH still, eQRH not yet accepted by our NAA.
How and where is the spare iPad secured? (When they put polar suits on our -777's, quite a few went missing...) Is the spare iPad plugged into maintain charge? Is part of your SOP to preflight the spare wrt charge, currency etc? Do you still have a paper QRH on the airplane?
Not on board yet, but apparently it will be in a sealed box in the wardrobe. And yes, the SOPs have been amended, charge and currency status have to be checked. Charge should not be a big problem, as the iPad will be switched off, not kept in flight mode. And update, well, that will require some work.
At the moment we don't officially use the eQRH yet, once we have approval for that, the paper QRH will vanish, however a few remaining lists will be kept in paper format: emergency evacuation (the iPad isn't crash tested), smoke/fumes/avionics smoke (the iPad is not certified for temperatures up to 55° C) and normal checklists as using the normal checklists on the iPad requires frequent switching between charts an eQRH.