Ryan Air can't find any pilots in Europe!

[Cruise Alt]

I thought my eyes were decieving me when I read he latest BALPA Employment News. Apparently MOL and Mr Dooney can't find any available pilots to fly their shiny new Boeings within the EU and have asked the Irish government for work permits for non-EU nationals. Maybe it is that the 1122 reported redundant pilots in the UK alone simply don't have the £50 application fee.

As for the Irish government if they believe this (with 150ish up comming redundancies at Aer Lingus alone)then the Irish deserve their reputation for being less than sharp. Well al those except MOL who makes Branson's business ruthlessness seem like a boy on a paper round.

Seriously - how can we as beginners with massive debts try to make a career in Flying if even our own governments sell us out?

[ 08 February 2002: Message edited by: Cruise Alt ]

[ 08 February 2002: Message edited by: Cruise Alt ]</p>

[Tosh McCaber]

Report the situation to your MP- not that it's likely to do any good!

[SkyCruiser]

RYANAIR is bang out of order. MOL is a total T++T.. .So many guys here are still looking for work, I will never apply to this outfit. <img src="mad.gif" border="0">

[FlyingV]

Well, maybe MOL reads PPRUNE.

With so many European pilots saying something along the lines of "I'll never work for that t**t", maybe he thought to himself "Fair enough, I'll go elsewhere".

Then as soon as he does that, its moan, moan moan - "That (insert your own derogatory comment) O'Leary should give me a job instead".

So maybe its the more experienced pilots who feel safe in their careers who are doing a dis-service to their more junior colleagues, and not MOL.

SkyCruisers post makes my point nicely.

Regards,. .V.

[Capt Wannabe]

ElNino. .Eamil me, and I may be able to help, although it doesn't really say a lot.

[foghorn]

Cruise Alt,

Idiotic decisions in immigration policy are not just confined to the Irish (if indeed the Irish government swallows MOL's line). You need look no further than HM's own loyal government for some howlers

Like for one the government is merrily issuing work permits to non-EU citizens with IT skills. This is despite some pretty major layoffs in IT over last six months: I know lots of good people struggling to find jobs. The government then justify this with IT job vacancy statistics from early 2000 - like there hadn't been a technology share crash and the shock of 11/9 in between.

The only way to stop this idiocy is to write to your MP and pressurise your union into contesting the application - especially if you live in the Republic. If you don't the vested interests will use the fact that politicians don't have a clue and senior civil servants don't live in the real world to crush the aspirations of the little people.

cheers!. .foggy.

[ 09 February 2002: Message edited by: foghorn ]</p>

[power lever]

FLYINGV

I think you should read Skycruisers post again, a fair post I feel.. .Another post on pprune at the moment states over 1100 type rated pilots have lost their job in the UK since 9/11, do you still think it is fair to approach other countries to find pilots?

I also will never apply to Ryanair for a pilot position. I take it you are flying for them! If so, never mind old boy!!!! <img src="confused.gif" border="0">

[Jetavia]

I think it is only to put pressure on the pilots so they won't demand higher salaries.. would be nice with a lot lower paid easteuropean pilots wouldn't it <img src="frown.gif" border="0">

[nightstopmonster]

What do you expect with Tony B Liar in charge?. Employment legislation in other countries would not allow such behaviour. Passing through a London based airport a few weeks ago made me sick seeing Ryan Airs foreign registered aircraft clogging up the stands taking ex UK flights when so many of our UK pilots are out of work. You suffer the CAA system and costs and claim the UK unemployment whilst others take our jobs. Nuff said. . .I am sure there are some Guardian readers out there that won't like this. Tough.

[Cruise Alt]

El Nino - sorry if you took offence at my comment - it was supposed to be ironic. I have some good Irish friends who are as it happens under threat at Aer Lingus and I in no way meant to insult. As for our own lovely government, having temporarily given up hope of getting work in aviation I am looking for anything that canhelp pay off my loans only to be told by the employment agencies that they are getting 100 CVs a day but lucky to find one vacancy a day. To add insult to injury there was some government MP on the radio on Thursday talking about immigration saying that they are giving work permits to non EU nationals because of a skills shortage. And they say that the house of Lords has no idea what is really happening out here! So my rant is simply at inept governments.

Enough of a rant. I think I will write to my MP. I have actually done this before and it was very effective. Problem is Ryan Air come undre the Irish Government. So is there anyone reading this there who could write to their MP?

[power lever]

FlyingV

Just out of interest, what line of work are you in?

Because if in your profession you had been given the boot, do you think it's fair to employ people from other countries before yourself?

Think about it, thats what is happening over here. <img src="mad.gif" border="0">

[FlyingV]

power lever,

I work in IT. Huge numbers of non-national/non-EU workers in the IT business here. I work with many of them and don't have a problem with it.

However, you seem to have missed my point. If, people object to Ryanair's terms of employment & refuse to work for the company, then why shouldn't they recruit from wherever they can find suitable staff ?

Regards,. .V.

[ElNino]

Cruise Alt. .Apology accepted! I shall be writing to my TD (MP) about the matter.

[HomerSimpson]

I thought there are laws set up in Europe for the freedom of trade and employment. How can Ryanair justify looking outside Europe for crews? There are plenty of type rated crews around but more than likely they dont want to pay them a good salary.

If Ryanair is looking for inexperience and people to pay for a type rating and then pay them less why not contact Capt PPRuNe as the are 178 people who are qualified for the Astraeus scheme???!!?!?!?

Regards,. .Homer <img src="mad.gif" border="0">

[liverbird]

Ryanair Who....oh them scabs....dont even go there....just stay away. let the public know whats going on...OK..... <img src="eek.gif" border="0">

[wysiwyg]

So how come this Irish outfit has it's main base in the UK flying aircraft on the Irish register and yet no one seems to have a problem with that?. .In my last airline I used to operate from Stansted on a regular basis and I used to find it very exhausting waiting in turn to get clearances on the delivery frequency while the east european (?) Ryanair flightcrew took an age to understand the english vernacular. A colleague of mine (an ATCO at Stansted) says he has exactly the same problems!. .C'mon Ryanair if you want to insult us by having a UK operation under a foreign flag at least pay us back by giving our pilots a fair crack.

incoming expected. .wysiwyg

[CamelPilot]

wysiwyg.

Being a member of the EU, as Ireland is, does give you certain privileges. Any EU airline can operate in any other EU country.

[eagerbeaver]

Here is the (relevant part) article,

"In the face of the reported number of Pilots who indicate that they have applied to Ryanair, who meet the laid down requiremenrs, it is difficult to understand why Ryanair has applied for work permits for non-EU nationals? XXXXX has submitted its opposition to all work permit applications, in theface of expirienced pilots being available, some of who do have the 737 on their licence. It is strange that a company who appears to want to recruit/expand its EU/Eire business base is putting in place the hurdles mentioned above."

Interesting comments, at the end of he day MOL is a business man wanting to make the biggest margins possible - he is employed to make money.. . Before you all batter me i am looking for a job too, so i am as annoyed as most of you.. . I seem to remember an american telling me thay have labour laws to prevent any non-US citizen taking a job from a US citizen regardless of a work permit or visa. . . Keep smiling

[ 11 February 2002: Message edited by: eagerbeaver ]</p>

[CargoOne]

East european crews typerated on 737 are getting more money in their home countries than Ryanair offering in Ireland. Also considering living cost in east europe is much cheaper I would be surprised if MOL will get a lot of non-EU applicants. May be you are talking about african guys?