EK who is responsible

[JammedStab]

I read quite a few complaints on this forum about the working conditions at EK. I make no judgement on the validity of these statements which quite often seem to show unhappiness with the actions of the managers. Somebody called TCAS(whoever that is) or Ed in days gone by seem to get criticism, but I never hear a thing about Tim Clark, the man who gets all the accolades in the press as the guy who built this airline into what it is.

He is the president, doesn't the buck stop with him. Is he the man responsible for your working conditions or is he a good guy who tries his best for the employees but is over-ruled by others.

[Nikita81]

TC is a guy who doesn't even look at his employees while walking at the airport, let alone saying "hi" to them.

Also, he never approaches to check in counter to be checked in, VIP service does that for him. He may be a VIP but he is also a top manager. It is a matter of good organizational culture for manager to approach employees and meet them.

I believe he is arrogant and really doesn't care about anything or anyone but power (money he has). This is why the company reached its near bottom.

[Odins Raven]

Interesting question.

I once brought Sir TC from BHX to DXB. On entering the aircraft I expected him to at least introduce himself to the staff on duty in the first class cabin and the flight deck, but he just sealed himself off in the private suite for the flight.

Everyone has different leadership styles but I certainly expected something more motivating for the staff on the 'shop floor' such as getting a feel for the issues affecting the front line... I really can't imagine the CEO of Google or Apple walking across the factory floor ignoring people.

Guess that's just me as I'm used to needing to display good leadership as Captain to ensure the safe journey of a 450 seat airborne cruise ship.

So-called "Captain of Industry"...? I am afraid from my experience I would say NOT. Shame really
, has the power to make such a difference to the airline's failing reputation even in the face of Emiratisation of the upper echelons of EGHQ.

[Panther 88]

O.R.
The exact same happened on one of my flights. Can't even imagine Richard Branson or even that idiot that runs Delta to the same.

[notapilot15]

No one is responsible for this scheme. It is setup that way so on D-Day everyone will point finger at other but all top/mid-level management is Teflon coated.

Locals make sure there are no regulations and there is enough money.
Locals are also responsible to secure liberal bilateral agreements.
STC is responsible for productivity improvement (employees may use different term) ideas.

Run through any negative scenario, you cannot pin blame any one other than some low level employee.

God knows what they paid for the knighthood!
SilverSeated
That a good one. I thought they knighted him because he brings $4+ Billion/year to the kingdom thru EK.

[DCS99]

People skills lacking in a people business.
You could say hello to SMF reading the morning paper in HQ.

It costs nothing to smile and say hello.

[Talparc]

For what did he get his Sir?
For treating his staff like slaves? We should ask that question to the queen!
Any media interested to find out?

[Emma Royds]

For what did he get his Sir?

Maybe 11 380s and 7 Triples going to the UK each day, along with the immense amount of cash that has been injected into sport and tourism industry within the UK, may have something to do with it.

I have spoken to a couple of colleagues who have chatted to Sir TC whilst he was on board. On those occasions he was polite and and engaged in conversation with both flight deck and cabin crew but it is very rare!

Anyone for squeezing Lemons? :yuk:

[Nikita81]

On those occasions he was polite and and engaged in conversation with both flight deck and cabin crew but it is very rare!

Of course he was. You don't expect him to be rude, do you? Most of the people are polite in first encounters with other people. It means nothing in relation to the fact that he is the first among managers in EK.

That Sir title is only valid and only means something in UK. For the rest of us it can really say "Mute TC", what do we care for UK titles...

[notapilot15]

Talparc

Official statement is for his contribution to innovations in aviation or something like that.

But in reality he brings home lot of bacon

- Expats bring back lot of dough (other than FC/CCs most are not employable)
- Revenue to RR
- Revenue to Airbus UK A380 wings and others
- EK's most of PR fluff($2B) spent thru UK, like marketing agencies, media outlets, rating agencies, independent analysts, brand management, reputation management ...

So there is no question about his contribution to UK's economy.

Not so sure about his contribution to world aviation though.

[Emma Royds]

Of course he was. You don't expect him to be rude, do you?

Errr.... the general point that is being made here is that he is rude during most first encounters.

[Nikita81]

I am sorry for the misunderstanding, ER. :)

Anyway, I am more interested in the more often examples when he was not so polite.

[V1cutz]

Had him on a flight as well. Would of thought he would of at least said hello or goodbye. The man has no manners nor any respect for his staff.

[gl69]

Well if TC gets Knighted for 11 380s and 7 777s a day into the UK should the CEO of American Airlines get to be the next King of England because AA has 20 flights a day to LHR and numerous other flights to the secondary cities within the UK?

[fatbus]

Had him on a flt years ago , nothing! What a great waste of an opportunity on his part.
The good thing is, he gives us nothing he gets the same in return!

[Schnowzer]

Had him on a flight, went to see him in his seat. Perfectly civil chat.

[ruserious]

My experience with STC go's back to the days when we used to have a yearly meeting with him. He was highly intelligent, listened and responded to well though out arguments and complaints and acted on them. He did have minimal time for waffle and stupidity, but then so do I. Have met him a few times since and he has been nothing but polite. Could he do better like Richard Branson et al, yes of course, but not everyone has that skill set.
Just my experience, not intended to counter other peoples experience, just sayin.

[Gillegan]

I had a few dealings with him over the years and these are my observations; definitely not a people person- he could be polite but definitely didn't seek people out. He did have an impressive grasp of detail. Was at a managers meeting after a major change in regulations (I was a fly on the wall, not a manager) and he had a better grasp of the changes and the consequences than did the managers who should have been the experts. IMHO, he is the person most responsible for the things that EK have done well (marketing, fleet and route planning) and also the person most responsible for the mess we see now. Anyone who saw him during Flanagans time (remember the famous pilots meeting after the Gulf Air crash?) will not be the least bit surprised at how things have turned out. His management philosophy could best be described as "shut up and do what your told".

[halas]

Had STC on a flight to CDG years ago. On his way to Toulouse to sign something or other.
Left the flight deck for a slash, and he was there talking to the purser.
Said g'day and he looked up and then away without breaking conversation with purser.
After said slash came out again and introduced myself, and he all but ignored me and went back to his suite.
I am only the bloke in charge of his safety for the next few hours.
But to be honest, l didn't really want to meet him.

He is surrounded by staff who feed him nothing but good news and filter all other stuff out.
Everything is perfect in his world as along as those below do their job.
As such nothing will change until the system above changes.
And that is not going to happen for a while, as he likes it here.
I would too under those terms.

halas

[InnocentBystander]

I am only the bloke in charge of his safety for the next few hours.

Wrong. In his mind the new equipment bought from AB and Boeing with all the bells and whistles is what keeps everyone safe. You're just the bus driver supposed to not touch anything. If he had his way there would be automation from push back to block in.

That's how spreadsheet driven bean counters work; people don't matter. We're all just robots supposed to work as told.

Also, I don't think he cares for money or power anymore; he just loves to sit at aviation conferences and tell all the other airlines CEO's how crap they are at doing their job. That's what he lives for.

I pity the man.

[Dropp the Pilot]

Of course Sir is distant. Sir occupies a parallel universe where the A380 is efficient, reliable, and profitable.

Suits you Sir.

[fatbus]

Dropp, you need to talk to your mates that transferred to the 380. During the perf g/s I remember them saying," I had no idea it could do that" Also who really cares, it's just an plane , pay is the same.

[glofish]

Dropp, you need to talk to your mates that transferred to the 380. During the perf g/s I remember them saying," I had no idea it could do that" Also who really cares, it's just an plane , pay is the same.

Like landing on 3km of concrete?

But you're right, in the end it's just a plane .... but that borders blasphemy! ;)

[LLuCCiFeR]

Maybe 11 380s and 7 Triples going to the UK each day, along with the immense amount of cash that has been injected into sport and tourism industry within the UK, may have something to do with it.

I have spoken to a couple of colleagues who have chatted to Sir TC whilst he was on board. On those occasions he was polite and and engaged in conversation with both flight deck and cabin crew but it is very rare!

Anyone for squeezing Lemons? :yuk:Aren't you confusing ruthless business practices in order to gain market share with philanthropy and charity?

Do Brits like seeing their national airline and economy being undermined by slavery, and reward this predatory behavior with a fancy title?

[Talparc]

LLuCCiFeR:
great comment!
That's exactly the question!

[SMT Member]

Would of thought he would of at least

Could someone please translate the above into English?

[Emma Royds]

Aren't you confusing ruthless business practices in order to gain market share with philanthropy and charity?

Do Brits like seeing their national airline and economy being undermined by slavery, and reward this predatory behavior with a fancy title?

The travelling public in any country have a choice and can choose who they wish to fly with. Cost and convenience will always come before ethics.

When you go into a clothes shop, do you check the label on a garment to see if it was made in a sweatshop in a third world country before you buy it and let that influence your decision to purchase it?

[LLuCCiFeR]

The travelling public in any country have a choice and can choose who they wish to fly with. Cost and convenience will always come before ethics.

When you go into a clothes shop, do you check the label on a garment to see if it was made in a sweatshop in a third world country before you buy it and let that influence your decision to purchase it?But does that clothes shop or clothes manufacturer who uses sweat shops to produce clothes get a medal for 'exemplary' and role model behavior?

Just because someone dumps hundreds of tons of clothes produced in a sweat shop onto the market, or lands x-amount of A380's and B777's at a certain airport, does it automatically make it a good thing? :rolleyes:

I can understand that the country in which the sweat shops are located gives the CEO a medal because obviously they don't care about worker's rights and safety, but why would a first world country with much higher (and more expensive!) worker rights and safety standards give a medal to the CEO who is actively undermining their entire social and economic structure?

It doesn't make any sense, except if the global elite don't really care about you and me and perhaps use this cost-war as a convenient excuse to squeeze more money out of the people who do the hard work whilst filling their own pockets with even bigger bonuses hidden away in tax free shell companies in far-away countries?

[RemoveB4Flght]

Would of thought he would of at least
Could someone please translate the above into English?

It's actually not correct English. He meant to say "Would have", which is commonly contracted to "Would've", which when spoken sounds like "Would of". Unfortunately some grammar challenged people think "Would of" is the proper way to write it.

[McNugget]

It's actually not correct English. He meant to say "Would have", which is commonly contracted to "Would've", which when spoken sounds like "Would of". Unfortunately some grammar challenged people think "Would of" is the proper way to write it.

That's your contribution to this thread, is it?

[Nikita81]

Since Human Resources Management (Bachelor degree) and Security Management (Master degree) are my profession, I've noticed one thing common to all departments in EK and I used to say when I was working there that "all the insecure people from planet Earth with the complex of superiority came to work for EK as bosses".

Working as a superior to someone is always a psychological trap for the superior and it can really be a measure and indicator of their inner insecurities and complexes, because it can bring out the worst in people coming from this lack of mental hygiene. Unfortunately, it happens a lot. 90% of people are immature and not ready enough to lead the team because they hide their own insecurities or/and incompetencies by being strict, unfair, wrong and, very often, childish.

This "bad boss working culture" has spread all over Emirates. All of them want to show and have power over human lives to the extent that it's accepted as normal and desirable. Sometimes it is a matter of the part of the world they are coming from. It's not racist, it's a fact.

TC may not be a people person but his behaviour influences other superiors who see his arrogant mask as a desirable model of behaviour. Same goes for the other top managers, who also have the need to prove something to themselves and others. I've heard that only head of HR Abdulaziz Al Ali is somewhat different and a good man, but his mistake is the fact that he doesn't bother with improving the organizational culture, which he has to do being an HR.

So, the first thing to deal with in EK would be that extremely sick way in which superiors grasp their role. And fire many middle managers who don't have any other role than to chase employees all over Emirates facilities and punish them for not wearing the right nailpolish color or for not wearing a hat inside HQ. Their roles are unnecessary and costly.

TC had to do something about it long time ago and he is quilty for not paying any attention whatsoever to the employee strategy.

[Talparc]

Nikita81:

very true. There is no leadership by example at all.

[jimmyg]

Thank you Nikita,

Spot on! this is one of my major grips.

If I get another management memo with "team" written 12 times, I think I am going to die.

Yes we do live in a bottom line kind of world. It is a real balancing act to reduce costs and maintain profitability.

I have always been of the school that you hire the best and brightest and reward those employees for their hard work and dedication. The word "team" nowadays just seems to be an over rot catch phrase for inept management.

You need to create a corporate culture of an inner sense of excellence, with a desire to serve. This of course is much easier said than done in today's what is in it for me work environment.

One of the most successful models for a company has been Southwest Airlines. Herb Kelleher had shown what can be done for an employee group with outstanding leadership skills. " NUTS! South West Airlines Recipe for Business and Personnel Success " should be mandatory reading for all those who wish to manage.

"If the employees come first, then they're happy, ... A motivated employee treats the customer well. The customer is happy so they keep coming back, which pleases the shareholders. It's not one of the enduring Green mysteries of all time, it is just the way it works"

[Nikita81]

TC may be competent but a top manager on his position is actually a leader and he has to have it ALL. Including people skills.

[buswind]

How is the atmosphere in Saudia and the training? Not sure if I should join , hired with Ruh based assigned.

[exekcabincrew]

I just have to contribute to this thread.. Had TC on my flight to BHX. Never left his suite, never bothered to say hi to the crew or talk to anyone. In any company everything starts at the top. With the CEO and top-management, then it flows down to all other departments. In EK leadership is a title - "I have an ID card that says CC6, therefore I am superior to you, since you hold a CC2 ID." EK leadership culture is all about fearing your seniors, not respecting them.

I agree 100% with Nikita when Nikita sais that most leaders in EK are not fit for their job. Many of them come from certain cultural environments where the social structure is based in casts, opression, titles and surnames and not on respect for human dignity. Other "leaders" come from Western cultures, however its seems that they are happy to embrace the opression culture endoresed by the management the very first moment they earn their Bla-bla-10th-level EK ID. Most seniors are not psichologically ready to lead a team and they only use their canned authority to express power over somebodie's life in order to feed their low self-esteem and lack of decision-making power they probably experienced during their childhood, teens and adulthood.

This corporate culture is the perfect environment for many negative behavioral patterns to flourish, such as backstabbing, snitching, lack of trust in everyone around you, lack of feeling of belonging to the company.

How many of you feel that you are\were part of Emirates Group? How many of you identify yourself with Emirates and feel proud of working for it? Personally I never felt I belong to EK, there always was my job and Emirates was the HQ building full of so-called managers that don't give a crap about me. The "company" is your enemy, it's not an organization you can rely on. That was Emirates in my perception anyways..

To finish, I'd like to share a TED talk on leadership. Please watch it, it's 12 min long and you will have a good laugh (a sad one probably) on how the leadership in EK contrasts with what the speaker, Simon Sinek, has to say. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmyZMtPVodo

[donpizmeov]

SA post of the year.

[nakbin330]

How is the atmosphere in Saudia and the training? Not sure if I should join , hired with Ruh based assigned.

John Cleese will answer, standby.

[nakbin330]

It's simple enough ... MF laid the foundations and STC threw money at it. QED.

[SilverSeated]

SilverSeated
That a good one. I thought they knighted him because he brings $4+ Billion/year to the kingdom thru EK.
Notapilot15

I'm sorry but that's a load of tosh, TC is hardly the biggest expat contributor to the UK economy non of whom have been knighted for their endeavours. Should Queenie just Knight all CEO's who bring in relatively marginal income for her purse...

[jimmyg]

Thank you Exekcabincrew,

Nice illustrational video of what real leadership is all about :ok:

[notapilot15]

SilverSeated

He is definitely one of the biggest contributor to UK's economy. Who will hire all these managerial tosh without he at the helm of EK.

Who will pay all these retired Oxford/Cambridge professors to fabricate meaning analysis showing EK is god's gift to world of aviation.

[fatbus]

Well at least the 65k a month in the bank acct is not fabricated !

[Evanelpus]

just have to contribute to this thread.. Had TC on my flight to BHX. Never left his suite, never bothered to say hi to the crew or talk to anyone. In any company everything starts at the top. With the CEO and top-management, then it flows down to all other departments. In EK leadership is a title - "I have an ID card that says CC6, therefore I am superior to you, since you hold a CC2 ID." EK leadership culture is all about fearing your seniors, not respecting them.

I agree 100% with Nikita when Nikita sais that most leaders in EK are not fit for their job. Many of them come from certain cultural environments where the social structure is based in casts, opression, titles and surnames and not on respect for human dignity. Other "leaders" come from Western cultures, however its seems that they are happy to embrace the opression culture endoresed by the management the very first moment they earn their Bla-bla-10th-level EK ID. Most seniors are not psichologically ready to lead a team and they only use their canned authority to express power over somebodie's life in order to feed their low self-esteem and lack of decision-making power they probably experienced during their childhood, teens and adulthood.

This corporate culture is the perfect environment for many negative behavioral patterns to flourish, such as backstabbing, snitching, lack of trust in everyone around you, lack of feeling of belonging to the company.

How many of you feel that you are\were part of Emirates Group? How many of you identify yourself with Emirates and feel proud of working for it? Personally I never felt I belong to EK, there always was my job and Emirates was the HQ building full of so-called managers that don't give a crap about me. The "company" is your enemy, it's not an organization you can rely on. That was Emirates in my perception anyways..

To finish, I'd like to share a TED talk on leadership. Please watch it, it's 12 min long and you will have a good laugh (a sad one probably) on how the leadership in EK contrasts with what the speaker, Simon Sinek, has to say. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmyZMtPVodo
exekcabincrew is offline Report Post

Quite powerful for your first post:rolleyes: I call troll on this one:ok:

[GoreTex]

I agree, since I started here in the 90s I never felt like I belonged to the group either, I always felt I had to watch my back because somebody will try to stab me or report me and I was right about it, it wasn't paranoia.

[jack schidt]

STC and the Boss travel economy "often"! From the Knights mouth.....

Emirates Airline boss: 'My sheikh has often travelled in economy'
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/36085203

J

[fatbus]

Once as a promotion and it was empty

[Nikita81]

The journalist is my man.

[buggerall]

When the whale was new he once walked through economy on launch day on the ground. That's what he meant

[notapilot15]

I thought the agreement between US and UAE prohibits TC from giving any interviews, or may be he is not allowed to talk tosh about subsidies.

[fatbus]

What agreement ?

[SOPS]

There is agreement to stop TC doing interviews? I think that is a stretch to far.
Unless you can provide links

[notapilot15]

Some time in August 2015 in response to US DoT/DoS docket, Emirates(UAE government) filed (ie., agreed) Emirates (Dubai) built exclusive terminal for Emirates (airline) and along with other subsidies.

Emirates Confirms Billions in Government Subsidy for Airport Terminal (http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/emirates-confirms-billions-in-government-subsidy-for-airport-terminal-300134208.html)

If you notice Sir who was using sledge hammer until then stopped talking about subsidies since.

My take US Government will look the other way on subsidies as long as TC doesn't speak bad about US3. Only interview after that was with CNBC in November 2015 where he said "no one believes him even though he is repeating same thing again and again".

CNBC Transcript: Interview with Tim Clark, President of Emirates Airline (http://www.cnbc.com/2015/11/09/cnbc-transcript-interview-with-tim-clark-president-of-emirates-airline.html)

Well I think we have almost exhausted ourselves in explaining why, we Emirates are not subsidized. I don't think we could have been more clear, more transparent, evidenced in any number of ways to show that this company is not subsidized in any way shape or form by the Dubai government. We've made that clear with evidence, we've shown it in multiple figures, submissions etc. Now for someone to keep banging on that particular drum is for me a complete waste of time.

Compare that his earlier weekly press conferences/interviews/white papers/analysis, someone told him to cut down the media coverage on this topic.

Not a written agreement, but you see the results.

[Nikita81]

Oh no, now I have to put up with the flood of trolls and PRs answering every post of mine...

[Anilv]

Can you imagine what topics would arise is he were to have a conversation with the staff?

Bonus? Flying hours? fatigue? company housing?

Emirates is a very tightly run ship, maybe too tight but that's how the owners wants it. He is doing his job and the progress of EK is witness to that. Can it be sustained? Maybe not..there may need to be a correction but it will have to get much worse before you see any changes.

To sum it up... I'm not at all surprised that he avoids discussions with the workforce whenever he can.

Anil

[fatbus]

Anil you are very correct. Anyone who the nose there is going to be the " big" change I think they are sadly mistaken . Too bad , once a good job, now it's not! Which bucket will fill first?