Ek: how many hours will you fly in February ?

[Desdihold]

Please state :
Aircraft
Seat
Ground school,
Leave ( how may days)
Days off ( how many)
Keep in mind that February is a short month so don't be fooled by being schedule for less hours than January.

Please keep the answers short.

[vfenext]

Pointless exercise :ugh:

[WhiteFly]

Aircraft : Fatbus
Seat : LHS
Days off : 11
Hours : 98

I was scheduled more hours than jan :}
Seems like they are tight on crew...
Anyone know whats the overtime threshold for 29 days?

[lospilotos]

Aircraft : Fatbus
Seat : LHS
Days off : 11
Hours : 98

I was scheduled more hours than jan :}
Seems like they are tight on crew...
Anyone know whats the overtime threshold for 29 days?

31 days: 88 hours. Subtract by 3 hours for each less day in the month.

[QCM]

Desdihold 109/LT are you gathering infos for industrial action? Did you meet union leaders already?:ugh:

[frankie777]

Aircraft: B777
Seat: LHS
Days off: 8 (+2 for Stars and stripes visa)
Hours: 93:30 (91 this month)

Overtime threshold is 86 in a 29 day month (ref: OMA)

Keep recovering.

[Buford]

I think the bouncy castle has decided it's cheaper to pay overtime than replace pilots...not good. That is, until the healthcare costs go up...

[145qrh]

LHS 380
92 Hrs
8 days leave
handling sim

Productivity kicks in at 82 hrs ..

[spanishfly69]

LHS 777
86 hrs (110hrs Jan)
14 days off (14 days off Jan)

[777-200LR]

It was fun the first month or two we did this, but what a waste of time this has become.

[lospilotos]

Aircraft: B777
Seat: LHS
Days off: 8 (+2 for Stars and stripes visa)
Hours: 93:30 (91 this month)

Overtime threshold is 86 in a 29 day month (ref: OMA)

Keep recovering.

OM-A does not seem to be updated to match the lowered threshold introduced in the latest salary review.

[Xiamen]

This amount of work does not give enough recovery time!
Not a pointless exercise - Its interesting to know that a lot of others are flying as much and this is true for both A380 and B777!!
Should be a warning to others thinking about joining, this job will affect your health and your quality of life! Don't expect to spend much time at home and when you are you will most probably be knackered!!

Oh, come on! You would all be properly rested if you could get some sleep instead of spending your free time here.
Norwegian long haul is coming to town. Why don't you swap your chaffeur driven transport, housing and school allowances with a package of nothing?
Get to fly the 787 and earn less money than anywhere?

[DuneMentat]

Rumours from the bouncy castle is that fleet planning didnt know how short of crew we are and would have delayed accepting new deliveries.. but I guess we can only dream of someone admitting they were wrong let alone doing anything about it :ugh::ugh:

777 RHS
90:25
9 days off

[frankie777]

Thanks Lospolitos. You are right I had missed that the overtime limits in the OMA had not been updated since the last pay review. It begs the question considering we are all now being FORCED in to accepting overtime as to why not?!? :ugh:

[White Knight]

FWIW:

LHS 380
96 Hrs
11 XX

[Sheikh Your Bootie]

777 LHS

14 hrs.15mins
RTGS, PPC.
6 days off (2 downroute)
14 days leave.

Bottom bid

SyB :zzz:

[nakbin330]

777.
LHS.
2 weeks annual leave, plus 6 XX after!!
21 hours, no gs or sim.

An astonishingly good roster, bottom bid too.

[Fratemate]

Busy time for me in Feb (just so you can compare the sandpit):

LHS 767
42:05
4 days off in Japan
14 days off at home

[Miche767]

LHS Classic Bus:

30 Hrs
No Leave
8 days off :}

[harry the cod]

Fratemate

I think the thread was asking for EK hours. The clue was in the title. Whilst EK is definitely pushing what is beyond acceptable, 42 hours is hardly reflective of the majority of airlines nowadays.

If you want to make a point and stir the pot, why not include your take home salary too? Then we can all decide how appealing Air Nirvana really is!

Harry

[Fratemate]

I know it was for EK but, as you say, I was just stirring the pot :) I know you're the EK Kool Aid guy, so pointing out the huge hours disparity probably doesn't sit well with you. I'm sure the guys that have come to us from EK are really, really concerned that the majority of airlines don't have such low hours nowadays.

With the bonus and pension removed from my salary it normally runs at $15400/month or $17400 if I back-to-back my days off and only use one commuting flight in two months. That includes my accommodation allowance for when I'm in Nippon and just under $1000 per diem.

No schooling (but my kids have left school anyway) and no free housing when I'm at home....with the emphasis being on home.

Air Nirvana doesn't exist but I won't be submitting my EK DEC application any time soon :E

[harry the cod]

No, not a 'Kool Aid' kinda guy whatsoever, just realistic to the industry as a whole and what's available. 42 hours in a 'busy' month is not the norm in this industry and you know it. Which is probably why you and other EK pilots are there and not here. However, I agree with you that the duty hours we work each month does not sit well with me, neither does it to the other 3950 EK pilots hence the thread I guess.

You had the decency to reveal your employer and the salary. Whilst it wouldn't work for me, it may well do for others. There are some contracts worth considering, despite the 20-30% pay cut that it may entail but money is no longer the main issue. I genuinely hope more people leave for a better lifestyle to Companies such as yours but it shouldn't have to come to that. With the current plan to double in size within 9 years from now, the only way forward for this Company is to stop burying it's head in the sand and, once and for all, accept it has a problem and do something about it.

It's pointless how many likes it gets on instagram or how many followers it has or how it's the most popular 'brand' in Dubai. Emirates is an airline. Its business is flying people from A to B and it needs sufficient and more importantly, motivated crew to do that. Not only pilots, but cabin crew and engineers too. Without highly qualified and well trained front line staff, it isn't going anywhere.

The backslapping and PR rhetoric from sycophants and senior management from within this Company is at times unbelievable. If some of these people spent as half as much time smelling the coffee as they do drinking it, we wouldn't be in this mess!

Harry

[nolimitholdem]

hahaha! Oh harry...how did we KNOW you'd be out in a millisecond, guns a-blazin', reminding us all of How Much Money Emirates Pilots Make and How Great Life Is for Harry The Cod.

Sorry, but Fratemate easily passes the threshold of "Enough" money, and then his roster kicks yours in the balls and laughs...change is hard, but it's time to accept that EK just plain isn't anywhere near the best game in town anymore.

If it ever was. It IS in Dubai, after all.

[harry the cod]

nolimitholdem

Obviously no limit to your ignorance either. Need to re read my post again my friend, hardly support of the Company policy is it.....? :ugh:

Anyway, thought you'd left.....or was about to?

Harry

[BYMONEK]

Mmm.....I think Fratemate's roster might kick everyone's rosters in the balls. Including the likes of BA, Air France and the US legacy carriers. Where do I sign up! :p

Oh, and for the record.

LHS 777
97 hrs (4 trips, 5 turns (3 of which night)
12 days off

Bottom bid, but more surprisingly, not feeling too bad as the end of the month approaches!

[The Outlaw]

Careful Harry...its been said enough...EK just ain't cutting it for the post schooling crowd. I suppose if one is fascinated by malls and beaches then EK has lots to offer...other wise i'm not so sure.

[The Zohan]

LHS 380
96:20 (2 ULR + 3 Europes)
11 days off
1 AD
1 NPA:ugh:

tz

[fatbus]

Instead of bitching or bragging about Feb hours . Braggers have avoided. What changes have guys seen in their rosters over the last 12 months?

[maimax]

90 Hrs (US,EUR,Asia and Australia)
+RTGS+2 Sims
8 days off

[B-757]

EK pilots,


Your schedules are very, very rough..I admire the fact that you can work this hard, a month after another, and still keep going..My hat goes off for you..


..As you probably already know, there are several good commuting contracts available (mostly in the Asian market)..They are hiring.. Less flying, good money, and more time at home..And not to forget, you and your family can live anywhere in the world..


These jobs are not for everybody, but most people are happy with them..Including myself..


Fly safe !!

[Cloud Bunny]

RHS 777
8 Days Off
93:30hrs
No ULR trips and nothing I bid for (but that's another thread!):\

[White Sausage]

LHS 777
9 days off
96:30
On top of 4 layovers they had to throw in 4 turnarounds :mad:
Nowhere in the world this would be legal :ugh:
FWIW in December I did more than 110 hours :ugh::ugh::ugh:

[Desert Busdriver]

What goes around comes around. For years us 330/340 drivers have had very tough rosters. Night flights, low flying hours and crappy destinations. We still do these flights but the accelerator has eased off quite a bit. Feb roster includes sim, a week of reserve, 8 days off, night and day turns and total of 30 hrs flying. Can't complain.

[BigGeordie]

Desert Busdriver, I think the difference is the 330/340 guys have always known that the crappy rosters are temporary. Eventually you were always going to fly less as the fleet was run down and then move across to the 380.

Anybody on the 777 now is looking at what their rosters are going to be like for the foreseeable future- and by that I mean decades, not years. In fact they will probably get worse as the 380 takes more layovers from the Boeing.

[uba737]

What goes around, comes around??? Man I don't understand us some times, why is the misery of others good for you? What a bitter bunch we are!

[Chesty Morgan]

LHS 738
February
18 hrs (4 sectors)
16 days off, no leave
1 sim, therefore, 1 night away from home

January
8.5 hrs (2 sectors)
17 days off, no leave
Every night at home

Harry, you want to compare salaries but I'd rather compare fatigue and lifestyle;)

[Emma Royds]

Fratemate

Apparently one of your colleagues has applied to EK as a DEC. :eek:

[crazy_bird]

just out of curiosity ,

How much do you get paid (in AED) per hour as productivity pay?

[my salami]

Dear Chesty...
Kindly note the Thread name starts with EK..
Not very interested on how cool are you top 50 guys in FD:ugh::ugh:

MS

[Chesty Morgan]

Yes, I can see that. It's worth the comparison though don't you think.

Where's FD out of interest?

[BigGeordie]

I think Chesty is based in the UK with a Northern LCC. That is why he doesn't want to compare salaries. He has us well beaten on lifestyle though. You take the money (literally) and make your choice.

[Chesty Morgan]

On the contrary I'm quite happy to compare salaries. Pretty irrelevant competition though considering it's all public knowledge.

How knackered you are at the end of your 100+ hour months is something else.

[The Dominican]

Fratemate

Apparently one of your colleagues has applied to EK as a DEC.

Not that surprising is it? Everyone is different in terms of what they want from their career/gig....., A couple of AJX captains have gone to the ME and other gigs in the US, Korea, looking to fly something a bit more advanced than the venerable 76..., I don't think that the 78 will ever happen here.

In the other hand..., we have a few former EK pilots here, even one T7 captain that came as an F/O, you might think his choice is senseless but it doesn't matter what you think, if he and his family feel better about their lifestyle, that is all that matters.

If someone's tired of doing the same old thing of freighter Okinawa turns, they move on...., that is the nature of this business, there is no greener pastures, they are all different shades of brown:ugh:

[Fratemate]

Apparently one of your colleagues has applied to EK as a DEC.

I may have been talking to the very man a couple of days ago. I didn't pry too much as there were others around but I got the impression that he probably won't make the move if he's successful but I've been wrong plenty of times before :bored:

As Dom said, we've got (had) a few EK refugees and they seem pretty happy here and prefer the lifestyle to EK. Actually, we've got two 777 captains but I've got my suspicions about one of them...the other is a top bloke. It's a shame that our network is so restricted, especially when compared to the likes of EK and it would be nice to fly something with nicer gadgets and TVs than the 767 but, at the end of the day, lifestyle is the No.1 factor and I think ours is not too bad. It could be improved upon and is certainly not perfect, so if PARC & CREW are reading this, get your act together!

I'm going for different shades of grey, rather than Dom's brown.....apparently it's more fun :)

[Versace]

B777 RHS
92 HOURS
9 DAYS OFF

[fliion]

Frate

(Now that hijack successful)

On average how many days CONSECUTIVELY are you away from home on average per month?

Thanks

[The Dominican]

Frate

(Now that hijack successful)

On average how many days CONSECUTIVELY are you away from home on average per month?

Thanks

How on earth did this become about AJX:rolleyes:

It depends on what option of days off/commuting you choose...., this is exclusively a commuting contract and the company will NOT sponsor residency in Japan but some guys do live there (married to Japanese ladies, other residency means etc.) then it is two to four days at a time.

If you commute, then it depends if you take your vacation days every month or you do back to back days off...., the good thing here is that you have a lot of freedom to choose your days off.

I use my vacation days every month and stretch the block of days off to 14 in a row, then I bid days off back to back once a year to take my vacation with 28 days in a row....., some guys work back to back duty days and do a work rotation of 34 days and then get 28 off etc.

It all depends on what pattern of days off you choose.

[fliion]

Much obliged

[ekwhistleblower]

Just read the TransAsia crash report, blames the pilots but also included this:

"The report advised TransAsia to hire more pilots to reduce workload and ......"

Sound familiar?

http://http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-35438567 (http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-35438567)

[Ophion]

In 30 days between mid December and mid January I did 117 hours block.
3 ULRs and 2 Euros
LHS 777

[updown]

Question: Are you paid the 117 hours block? Or just the "flying hours" ?

[White Knight]

Paid........

[TangoUniform]

117 hours? That is just insane. Might be manageable in a two or three time zone wide operation, but with 3 ULRs......ridiculous. But you'll get a month of leave afterwards, right?:*

[Check Airman]

In 30 days between mid December and mid January I did 117 hours block.
3 ULRs and 2 Euros
LHS 777

That's insane.

How are your rest rules defined? Is it xx hrs per calendar month, or per 30 days etc?

Here in the US, under the new rules, we're limited to 100hrs of flying in 672hrs (28 days).

I ask, because as oddly as our rule is written, it helps in a situation like yours where (I presume) DEC was back loaded, and JAN was front loaded.

[Kapitanleutnant]

Chk Airman...

At EK, they don't get any credit for the month for all bunk time doing these ULR's they talk about. They get paid but no credit. So, while a max month might be say 100 hours, they only credit for say 85 meaning the company can (and absolutely does) roster them for more flying.

117 hours in the jet - credited for only 90 - paid for 117.

Kap
PS... no credit either for:

Vacation days...
Sim training....
Ground school

[fliion]

Chk Airman

It's 100 hours in a rolling 28 days.

So you can start a 17 hour 1 leg sector on the 28th day if your look back 28 days was 99.9 hours.

If it's 100.1 you can't do the flight.

[V1cutz]

Best roster I have had at EK in 7 years.
0 hours
29 days off

Left two weeks ago. :cool:

[TangoUniform]

^^^^^^^^^:D:D:D:D:D:D^^^^^^^^

[Check Airman]

Thanks Kap,

fliion,

Chk Airman

It's 100 hours in a rolling 28 days.

So you can start a 17 hour 1 leg sector on the 28th day if your look back 28 days was 99.9 hours.

If it's 100.1 you can't do the flight.

That seems a lot like the old part 121 rule of "legal to start, legal to finish"

On the west coast of the Atlantic, at no point in time should you be able to look back and count 100hrs of flight time.

In your example, our software starts at the END of the flight, and looks back 672hrs to ensure that you don't exceed the limit. That way, you could never legally start that 17hr leg.

I hope that important regulatory distinction makes it into your rulebooks. 100 hrs with 10 days off every month cannot be safe!

[120feet]

I would highly suggest when and if you have to file an ASR due to level bust etc. IF Fatigue may have played a role, it needs to be mentioned in your report. Either long or short term fatigue. You guys appear to working way past anything that could be deemed safe, and are certainly paying the price with your long term health. Cannon fodder comes to mind.

[Praise Jebus]

So you can start a 17 hour 1 leg sector on the 28th day if your look back 28 days was 99.9 hou

Crazy that the 16.9 hrs that took you to the scene of the accident don't count. ...