EK profit(share) 2016

[lospilotos]

So, 2.5 months of the financial year to go, TC is starting to downplay: http://m.arabianbusiness.com/us-dollar-eroding-emirates-profits-says-airline-chief-618543.html

[bogeydope]

Yeah, they can't use the excuse of " oil is at $120 dollars a barrel" anymore, so this is the next best excuse!!! WTF?????:uhoh::ugh:

[jack schidt]

Setting unreal targets is a sure way to keep the purse strings tightened and all profit to remain in house.

Remember, record profits never paid record profit shares, expect nothing and you won't be disappointed. It's the new norm sadly.

J

[harry the cod]

As he mentions, it's a 'double edged sword'. However, a strong dollar is not all bad. Fuel and wages normally make up the two highest costs for any airline. Fuel is now cheap, very cheap, down to around $40 a barrel compared to $110 a while back. Whilst all staff in Dubai are paid in local currency, outstations are not. Paying UK staff has now become cheaper as the dollar buys more pounds. Same for practically all other outstations around the network as is the same for costs incurred such as local advertising, fuel, lounges, landing charges, chauffeur drive, etc, etc. That must all add up to offsetting some of the lost currency revenue on tickets. And there's no ERP either. Another saving, especially with pilots and senior managers entitled to it.

Personally, I couldn't give a fudge about PS this year. What we need is a decent pay rise AND the increment. That's what makes the difference over time, not a one off payment so we don't miss the pay rise.....which we haven't had for 3 of the last 4 years by the way! Oh, and don't forget the leave! 42 days please. It's contractual.......

Harry

[Laker]

According to a well known manager at a recent new captains meeting 42 days is NOT contractual. He said we are only entitled to 30 days/year per UAE law but EK has the option to award us up to 42 days. That was a surprise to me.

[TangoUniform]

Laker, then they had better change all their recruiting adverts. 42 days....simple as that. Not eligible, not usually, just plain 42 days. But that's not a contract, I know. Pay raise? Sure. 42 days? LOL. "Back to the oars, minions".

[kingpost]

Whoa, EK pilots are contracted to 42 days leave a year, that's what they should be getting! 30 is the minimum according to the labour law, however they are contracted to more!

[Ghost_Rider737]

EK have lots of roadshows planned.
Are they "spewing drivel" at these roadshows ?? it's utter BS if they sell the idea of 42 days leave and Profit share etc.....

I hope future recruits are reading these forums. Go to EK expecting to be shafted.

I do know that regional pilots are most of the new recruits. Most of them are flying 80 hours + anyway.

[Kamelchaser]

Using the same argument, we should only be entitled to 1500AED a month salary as that's the minimum required to pay maids from certain countries under UAE law.

What a load of toss these people talk. "It doesn't matter what your contract says, we're only paying you or giving you the minimum under UAE law"

[777boyindubai]

And as been discussed many times on the forum, EK are a semi government company and hence not subject to UAE Labour Law. Go figure.

[Dropp the Pilot]

Actually, you work for two versions of a company that has Dissociative Identity Disorder, often changing character from month to month.

For example, you may take 10 days holidays in January and find that in the remaining 21 working days you will have 85 hours credit. In other words, your employer has blithely stolen from you and your family any opportunity to use your vacation to recover physically.

Now suppose you found that January's arrangement actually worked for you, so for March you ask for all your duties to be compressed into 21 days, leaving 10 days of freedom for yourself. D.I.D. kicks in and your employer claims they could never countenance such an arrangement, that would be a compressed roster and in their eyes it would be manifestly unsafe.

Unhinged and beyond parody.

[SOPS]

It's actually whatever works for the EK narrative at the time, never the other way around.

And if the latest stand is really that 42 days leave is "optional" at the companies discretion, that just proves it.

[Desert Camel]

My forecast: 2 weeks

Main battle is to go back to 80 hours a month, credit for leave and training, and full 42 days of leave. It is not that difficult, isn't it?

[Panther 88]

Never happen. Why should they? We're still here.

[cerbus]

Yes we are here for now. How many pilots are going to resign after the May "announcement"? Hopefully enough to make a difference.

[3Greens]

The problem is cerbus, everyone else hopes that everyone else leaves so that they (and a few select others) can reap the rewards. trouble is, no one wants to be the first, and perhaps, the only one to poke their heads over the parapet.
It's why Emirates don't have a union. Yes you may say they're illegal in the UAE, but there's not a lot they could do if you were errr, in Union and decided to act as one. Until that day beatings will continue until morale improves.

[dubaigong]

3Greens , you are spot on :ok:

That's exactly what is happening in most of the Airlines here , the majority of the pilots hope that enough pilots will resign to push the company to the point that they have to react and improve the terms and conditions or at least stop to degrade them
At the same time they try very hard to discourage any new pilot to join their company.

[Trader]

A few issues here. The first is that while they are very short they have been covering with pilots coming in on days off.

They have reduced the requirements for new hires and they are slowly starting to fill courses.

Anyone who has been here for more than about 4 or 5 years knows (or should know) that nothing will change. This is even more true now that Dubai and the UAE are being severely affected by the price of oil. EK is a cash cow and will be squeezed even harder.

I would hazard a guess and say that if they do make changes (pay or conditions) that they will change back as soon as they feel they are able to.

Soon there will be a VAT - likely 5%.

Parliament is discussing a remittance tax - to tax money being sent out of the country.

The biggest threat is that with oil prices where they are and the expectation that it will be low for several years there is a HUGE risk that they will depeg the dirham/dollar rate. IMO, this is our biggest risk as employees. (google it if you want more info--Saudi in the same boat).

[cf680c2b]

Does anyone know how early one can give their notice and still be eligible for the bonus payout (should there be one). I heard there was a cutoff date. So, if I submitt my resignation at the end of Jan and leave by the end of Apr, will they pay?

[fatbus]

Did anyone else hear about the signing bonus for new hires ?

[EKX]

I assume the new hire bonus was to DEC's or DEP's, because I have a number of friends who've joined the firm in other positions (Cabin Crew etc) who get nothing at EK upon signing.

[lospilotos]

Does anyone know how early one can give their notice and still be eligible for the bonus payout (should there be one). I heard there was a cutoff date. So, if I submitt my resignation at the end of Jan and leave by the end of Apr, will they pay?

This one has been done to death numerous times before....

You have to be on the payroll when it's paid out, which by the book is June salary, but historically has been done in May....

[harry the cod]

fatbus

Either you're extremely gullible or like giving a good wind up! Having literally just spoken with someone who's recently joined and is a very good friend of the family, that rumour can be discounted 100%. He's starting on the basic salary, without any 'bonus' and is in Meydan. That's it. He's one of 16 in his batch, 1 week behind another group of similar numbered students.

I guess the Company are starting to get their required 60-65 a month after all and from recent training feedback, the prop guys are pretty switched on. Most have flown jets, just not all their hours though.

Harry

[Wizofoz]

The prop guys will be fine.

The problem is, it's a fundamental change in what the airline is.

It's now a place for young guns to get their first jet experience, no doubt to then move on to better things.

Emirates used to BE the better thing experienced pilots came to.

[donpizmeov]

No, experienced guys came because their company went bust.

Then when hours were lowered, LCC guys came because it was less ****e than where they were. Even this seems debatable now it seems.

[Xiamen]

No, experienced guys came because their company went bust.

Then when hours were lowered, LCC guys came because it was less ****e than where they were. Even this seems debatable now it seems.

I think that is pretty accurate, at least for the western guys.
If there is a sign on bonus, maybe they should give it to the assessment team to stop them from failing DECs? What is the current failure rate, 99%?
Failing an assessment can put a dent in your record, and the screening should not be tainted by personal opinion on the DEC policy by the team.
As it is now, it is a complete waste of time to apply as a DEC.

[donpizmeov]

The failure rate of DEC candidates has nothing to do with either EK nor the assessment team.

[flyinthesky]

As someone with first hand knowledge of our recruitment and selection process, I can assure Xiamen that there is no prejudice from the team.

The quality of many candidates is quite simply, shocking. It opens my eyes a little further every time I do the assessments. And that holds true for both FO and Capt applicants.

[expat400]

flyinthesky

How do you judge the quality of a DEC? By 30 minutes in a SIM he's never flown? His ability to multiply fractions? Or by his experience and records?

[donpizmeov]

But how can you verify experience other than interviewing and observing a simulator? Most of the interview process looks at how you manage situations, and how well you play with the other kids.

Ek has hired DECs for decades. They have a good idea of what qualities they require. They will not let someone resign from a job to start training if there is any doubt they will get through the course.

[flyinthesky]

Exactly what Don said.

[Dropp the Pilot]

Haven't done any interviewing but I have done 2500 hours of LOSs/LOE/s and recurrent. I am going to guess my experience is the same as most: you can pretty much tell if the session is going to be successful or not even before the engines have been started.

Can't see why assessing a DEC should be not be an equally transparent exercise

[Xiamen]

As someone with first hand knowledge of our recruitment and selection process, I can assure Xiamen that there is no prejudice from the team.

The quality of many candidates is quite simply, shocking. It opens my eyes a little further every time I do the assessments. And that holds true for both FO and Capt applicants.

If the quality is so poor, you are not selecting the right candidates to begin with.
EK is very experienced in finding the right pilots, so this does not make sense.
If you are calling qualified pilots, the failure rate should not be 99%. The candidates can't all be retarded. An assessment is not rocket science, so the failure rate should be the roughly the same as for any other pilot assessment.
But it isn't. It is way higher.
The only conclusion can be this, the selection team is on a mission not to select DECs.
You mention DEP as well. The failure rate there is just as normal. Some bad, some good. As it should be.

Why?
Same reason EK pilots come here to paint a black picture of EK and everything related to EK and Dubai.
Parked aircraft due lack of pilots = possibilty of better T&C.

[uba737]

I have always liked conspiracy theorist, don't agree with them most of the time but they are entertaining!

[JAARule]

No, experienced guys came because their company went bust.

Then when hours were lowered, LCC guys came because it was less ****e than where they were. Even this seems debatable now it seems.
Absolutely spot on - on all three points.

They've always been lucky here with airlines folding just at the right time.

[Xiamen]

Conspiracy?
Try Occam's razor.

How they explain the failure rate to those higher up is a mystery to me, but stopping DECs is the most efficient way to stall reqruitment.
It has certainly stopped me from applying. I know my worth, and there is no way I am subjecting myself to a humiliating failure set up by the assessment team.

Good luck! You are the ones paying for this with 100 hrs/month.
Maybe, just maybe, it will work.
I have my doubt.

[olster]

There is no conspiracy with recruitment. The sim assessment team are as fair and transparent a bunch as you can meet. A good thing you can say about EK without bias is that the pilot standard from recruitment is very good. Not everyone is Chuck Yeager and there are some eye - watering stories with some pilot candidate performance. Subsequently they should not be surprised to not get the job, DEC or RHS.

Cheers

[alwayzinit]

The sim assessment is to display the ability to handle and prioritize a multi problem scenario, showing good SA throughout and assertiveness as required.
Its that simple.
Its generic as there is minimal manual flying, as long as you choose use the AP.
At least that was my experience when I did the DEC sim.

[Xiamen]

Apparently, DECs of today can't fly with or without autopilot.

Fair and transparent?
Nothing of the sort. 0 transparency, no way to question their decisions.
That is the same anywhere you go, but if the team abuse their position, nobody can do anything about it.

[thatwasclose]

you are just plane wrong. sorry. there is a set criteria for the selection process. this is what makes it transparent. the boxes must be ticked , the same for all. i know of several guys who have recently passed the DEC ride. what is true is that it is even easier than before, in that the standard has been lowered. it is simply not true that individuals in the selection progress have a grudge and are intentionally failing the DEC for no reason. it does not happen. there is a process and that process is followed. if you are that scared and paranoid about taking the assessment ... gonna guess you are not the quality of candidate we want. so good call in not applying. sorry if that harsh.

[Xiamen]

Thank you! Assessed and failed right here. Are you in the assessment team?

It's all up to the guys ticking the boxes. Or not.
The pass rate for DEC is?

[donpizmeov]

Seniority list shows new joining DECs on both 330 and 777 from multiple nationalities.

Xiamen you are full of cr@p.

[777boyindubai]

Xiamen. I am no defender of EK. But let me tell you for free that the recruitment and selection people have no axe to grind. They are highly professional and follow a transparent path. You do them a great disservice otherwise. In addition, I second Don's comments.

[Sheikh Your Bootie]

5 DECs so far Don, the programme is a complete success :ugh::ugh:Not.

SyB :zzz:

[donpizmeov]

You can only work with what you are given SyB. The fact is if you make the cut you are offered the job. There is no conspiracy.

With the package offered experienced fellas are not applying. Far better deals elsewhere.

[Sheikh Your Bootie]

True indeed Don.

SyB :zzz:

[fatbus]

320 Capt comes for (DEC) interview and crashes twice ! You want him flying your family ? Not mine.

[delorean79]

but is he trainable? :eek:

[The Outlaw]

Delorean,


Of COURSE he is because the CPA said so. Perhaps, what he doesn't realize is that there will be a flood of legal testimony to the contrary from endless pilots when the big impact occurs.

The CPA is a muppet and a planted figurehead....and will pay the price in due time....just watch how fast the company sends him down the **** creek with no paddle despite his nationality,


Tick Tock...Tick Tock...

[Xiamen]

Seniority list shows new joining DECs on both 330 and 777 from multiple nationalities.

Xiamen you are full of cr@p.

Thank you for your kind words, don.
Do you know that outside the little EK bubble you guys are in, the way you treat other pilots asking questions are commonly referred to as bullying?
5 pilots since they started DEC, one? year ago?

I'm not saying this is what happened with the 320 pilot, but it is really easy to make a pilot crash in the simulator. He will not even know why he crashed.
If it is true, that is.

Last time I sent an application, I had to include my three last simulator reports.
If EK calls pilots who genuinly can't fly, the team is not doing the right back ground checks.

[Tankengine]

Don is correct re who are NOT applying. :hmm:
A few F/Os from my company are there now, from what I hear from them and on here there is no way I would apply as a DEC with EK.:ugh:

Experience wise, 1500+ on 737 and 3000+ A330 in command so I would expect qualified.:p

[lospilotos]

If EK calls pilots who genuinly can't fly, the team is not doing the right back ground checks.

Ok, so you have a beef with the EK pilot selection team. You have made your point and no one seems to agree with you. Time to move on perhaps?

[Laker]

Xiamen,

Why not consider it a blessing and move on? Sometimes things work out exactly as they should. There are some great contracts out there. You do realise that pilots are leaving EK en masse, in unprecedented numbers (FO's and CA's)? If you are determined to move to the ME there's an airline down the road which seems to offer a higher quality of life.

[fatbus]

I guess this is a rumour network and not a fact network. no need to say anything else.

[fliion]

Xiamen

We are flattered by your obsession

☺️

[Aluminium shuffler]

Wasn't this discussion about bonuses/profit share? I don't see what DECs and selection failures has to do with it.:confused:

[delorean79]

Does anyone remember which was the profit target for 2014?

1st half 2014 profit was 2.2 and 5.5 for the full year.

1st half 2015 profit was 3.4. If the fuel price stays this low, we may be looking to a full year profit higher to the 7.7 target.

If we do, then we may see profit share. It's that simple.

If everything goes well, and we haven't been hit by the ruble depreciation (haha), we could see a total profit from 8.0 to 9.0.

Then we just need a rule of thumb with the margin between the profit target and the actual profit from 2014 to start talking about weeks, days, hours or minutes of basic salaries!

We are looking forward for the highest profit in the history of Emirates and we may see NADA, NOTHING, NIL, RIEN, NICHTS as profit share. Let's keep our fingers crossed, for them to decide on investing part of that profit in package improvements, salary increase, steps, allowances.....

[BANANASBANANAS]

I think it is impossible to call.

I guess it depends on whether they really want to acknowledge, and professionally address, the retention issue or not.

Expecting nothing, hoping for something, deserving of more, making sure I have options ready to go.

[delorean79]

Found the 2014 target.

My rule of thumb: 2014 Target=3.7 Actual profit=5.5 Margin=1.8 Weeks=9

We need a 8.6 Total profit to get about 4 weeks. That means a 5.2 profit only on the second half... :eek:

I wish I could be that positive...

Let's crush some numbers. 2014 first half profit 2.2. / 2015 first half profit 3.4. That's 54% more.
2014 2nd half profit 3.3..... plus 54% more? 5.1.... mmmmm

I was right back in May, but I had the real profit results to play with...
May 2015 pprune post (http://www.pprune.org/8967243-post148.html)

Anyone with time to adjust my rule of thumb with a comparison in fuel prices during 1st and 2nd half of 2014 and 1st and 2nd half of 2015? LOL

[Desert Busdriver]

Bananasx2 is spot on. FYI, don't go out and put that deposit on the 458 Italia just yet.

[JAYTO]

we will get somewhere in the range of nothing to very little.....


There is no problem with recruitment.... this is the leading factor that will dictate what they throw our way.
The decision to accelerate the fleet restructure. (Edited due to Fatbus comments), large retirements of aircraft.
Quite a few Malaysian pilots heading this way.
With the lowering of the requirements the company now has thousands of applications from turbo prop guys.
There is no more problems....

AAR thinks he is the smartest man on the planet. He gave us nothing in the way of a payrise last year and all his problems have once again been solved, even though we all know its just smoke and mirrors.

You think he is not going to have another go at it this year???

J

[fatbus]

Sudden restructuring ? This fleet retirement plan is not sudden. 4 years ago at standards meeting a slide was presented . The plan you see now is almost no different ie 343 still here and now only 1 345.but all gone by mar /April 2017 including the first 777300 er.

[bia botal]

Profit share is a thing of the past lads imho! I reacon we only got it last year because the runway closure went way better than anyone could have imagined, hence the reason it's been set so high this year, can you imagine with oil prices as low as they are at the moment and short of a invasion of Iran destined to stay low for a few years at least what the target will be next year!
I'm sure we all noticed the half full cabins for October and November!
Profit share this year,,,,, ZIP!

[White Knight]

The thing is Bia Total - the cabins are always only half full for most of October and November; low season...

[Wizofoz]

I have no idea if we will get a profit share this year, but I love it when someone says they are a "Thing of the past".

I first read here how they were a "Thing of the past" in 2008, and pretty much every year since, even the one we got 14 weeks in.....

[lospilotos]

Found the 2014 target.

My rule of thumb: 2014 Target=3.7 Actual profit=5.5 Margin=1.8 Weeks=9

We need a 8.6 Total profit to get about 4 weeks.

Don't forget that we "only" need to make the target, then it's an automatic 2 weeks. 25% of the profit exceeding the target is then paid out as profit share on top of the 2 weeks. Of course the company can massage the figures to their liking and in the end of the day, they will pay out as many weeks as they see fit....

[Saltaire]

I believe they will make the target. Airlines that don't make massive profits with fuel prices this low, likely never will.

Now will the accounting reflect the true profits?

My guess is 2-4 weeks.

Far rather see a reduction in hours, increase in basic, overtime rates and hourly pay. Who am I kidding.

[highlight]

Whatever... I heard from my best friend's maid who heard it from her cousin; we're getting 14 weeks. I already placed an order for a BMW 745i - silver color in case you're wondering. I'll drive it in the left lane on SZR at the speed limit to piss off the local boys. :E

[lospilotos]

All sources indicate a ~40% drop in jet fuel prices compared to last year, averaged over the year. From the 2014-15 annual report the fuel bill was 28,7 billion AED, that (should) equate into a 14,35 billion saving on fuel alone.

If one looks at the fuel price for the first six months of the financial year the price drop was approx 33%, with the second half to date shows approx 47% drop, compared to the full 2014-15 year.

So, if the half year result was barely on track, the second half should show a substantial improvement, at least if all other factors stay the same....

If there is not a record profit with record profit share, there is something seriously wrong...

[Saltaire]

Agreed. If airlines don't make massive profits now, they never will. I think they will smash the target. Unfortunately, what they actually reveal and post is another story. The gov't needs money in a big way. I think we'll still get a decent pay out of about 4-6 weeks is my guess. That said, we need a pay raise!

[LHR Rain]

It will be at least 10'weeks this year.

[VIFF]

A Pay rise is essential to help cap the attrition rate.
A juicy bonus is always welcome, but with the ever increasing cost of living in Dubai, an increase in salary is a must to bring the package into line with others on offer.
No pay rise = more people leave = less leave/more work = more people leave......etc, etc.
I do hope that we haven't reached the point of no return yet!

With the singing of record first half profits and Fuel prices this low, even with a high target, a profit share of anything less than last year (9 weeks) would be an insult.:=

[The Outlaw]

Slash is right...there are DEC positions available on the A380 right now and in order to attract the very best, they have quietly offered up to 350,000 allowance and starting at a basic of 55,000 per month. There are some other benefits like 60 days leave and free DEWA etc.

I heard one guy negotiated a car as a signing bonus...

He'd be crazy NOT to come.

WHEN or IF you do decide to apply, be sure to TELL THEM WHAT YOU WANT...otherwise you'll just get Meydan and a few shekels per month.

The Outlaw

[k grind]

Hey Outlaw, was just wondering, did 'that guy' negotiate for the Mercedes G63 or the G65? Man, if he settled for the twin turbo V8 when he could've gotten the V12, he's just contributing to the race to the bottom. What a sell out...

[Rotating Bacon]

in my exit interview they offered me the V12 if I would stay, told them I would stay for the Aston Martin from spector, they said that will go to a 380 DEC from south america, it shows again seniority doesn't count here, I am so pissed off

[ExpatBrat]

I met with the Mondial financial guy a few weeks ago. He told me Emirates is the only thing Dubai has that is currently making money and that it's being milked for all it's worth to service other debt. Maybe it's a bit of a jump to go from that statement to "no profit sharing" but I'm not expecting very much.


just FWIW

[jatqual]

They won't know what hit them once the dodgy report times, non credited augmenting times, illegal reduced layover times, non credited training duties and fatigue take their toll

[halas]

There are two sides to the massive drop in oil prices.
One is the reduced costs for the operating airline.
The second is the massive drop in personnel traveling that belong to the oil industry.

halas

[lospilotos]

There are two sides to the massive drop in oil prices.
One is the reduced costs for the operating airline.
The second is the massive drop in personnel traveling that belong to the oil industry.

halas

Which could be offset by the majority of the travelling public, which does not belong to the oil industry, that benefit from the low oil price for oil based consumer products and perhaps are able to travel more than before?

[fatbus]

How much revenue has the UAE lost because of the drop in oil prices. Canadian Oil Provence of Albeta, Calgary alone lost 6500 oil related jobs so far .

[Dropp the Pilot]

There have been quite a few folks who resigned in the last ten days or so with an eye on being eligible for profit share if there is any. That will work if the company continues in their kindness of paying it out in May (as they always have) when the rules actually state the share is paid out in June. Those folks won't see the cash if the rule is strictly applied.

Any bets that this is the first year in history when the rule is strictly applied?

[pumpkin]

"Think they've got themselves into another tangle!
EK generally do pay rises for everyone i.e. not for a specific group so if they up flight crew pay they'll have to do it for everyone, but they don't necessarily want to increase everyones pay!
They could increase flying pay but that doesn't help as we want to fly less. Increasing flying pay doesn't really help the package much as only an increase in basic pay affects company provident fund payments.
So how do they increase our package financially without annoying everyone else!".

Seriously do you think they give a rat's a** what everyone thinks? The bottom line is there are thousands, if not millions of people out there that could qualify to be a gate agent, cabin crew etc etc but a very limited pool worldwide of pilots that are qualified. Their only hope now is to SIGNIFICANTLY increase the package for new AND EXISTING pilots- as there are better options out there right now. They have no obligation to do the same for everyone else. When a company recruits a CEO, they have to find the person with the years of experience and qualifications that are fully capable to handle the job ; they have to pay the right cash to attract and retain them. They do not have to do this with their admin and support staff as they are a dime a dozen. Their admin staff does not get a raise every time the CEO has a pay rise.
Experienced pilots are a commodity, most of the other staff , while they may be amazing at their job, are not coming with a highly specialized background,and can be easily replaced. If the pay is high enough, people will come here, numbers will go up and we can all get some rest. Just even a little. Otherwise, it's going to be a non stop exodus. Personally , I don't give a sh*t about the "bonus"- it is just a way to shut everyone up for a while- what we need is a very big pay increase, and more pilots (so again, a very big pay rise).

[BigGeordie]

Seaman, I have no doubt they are in another tangle. They rarely aren't. However, they are very much set up for giving pilots a pay rise without having to reward the rest of the company (or vice-versa if they feel so inclined). That is why we have "FD" job grades instead of the standard "EK" grades in the rest of the company. In a rare piece of foresight, no repeated since, the realised long ago that pilots may need to be rewarded separately.

[lospilotos]

Emirates considers Houston A380 downgrade as oil slump hits business, but profits to rise | The National (http://m.thenational.ae/business/aviation/emirates-considers-houston-downgrade-as-oil-slump-hits-business)

Sir TC: "[He] said the carrier expected to report “significantly higher" profit this fiscal year."

[pilotguy1222]

And the Houston flight has never had much load anyway, so no surprise there.

I am all on board for the pay raise, and it needs to be significant. A bonus would be great as well.

Cathay showed passenger traffic up 6-7% from last year, but profits were up 90% on fuel cost savings. (per the news I read this morning)

[PPRuNeUser0215]

Don't know about CX profit but closer to home....
Flydubai annual profit drops 60% to Dh100.7 million in 2015 | The National (http://www.thenational.ae/business/aviation/flydubai-annual-profit-drops-60-to-dh1007-million-in-2015)

[Macrohard]

No profit share. Step increase only, if you're lucky!
If you don't like it, you can leave ...

[MR8]

As mentioned so many times before, the basic salary is not the main issue. Yes, a pay rise is long overdue, especially since we haven't had a correction in line with inflation in DXB for years now. But the main issue is QOL: there's only a few people who like to earn the big bucks if they don't have the time to enjoy it, being constantly tired and looking at no family life etc. etc. You get the picture.

So I hear a lot of people say that we need to reduce the overtime threshold, get paid for ground duties, reserve, credit for annual leave... I'm all for that, but it won't accomplish a single thing without the real deal breaker: a SERIOUS increase in overtime payment.

Why?

Lets consider a 10 year seniority captain. Without having access to the exact numbers... (ballpark figures will do since these numbers are good enough to get the idea - if someone has time on their hands for a detailed 'study': feel free! )

Basic pay, flying pay, housing, medical, training, schooling, A fund, ... is easily above 88000 Dhs per month.

So that basically means that 1 hour at work costs the company AT LEAST 1000 DHS.
Now, our overtime is 600 Dhs/hr.
So basically, every hour of overtime you work, you are saving the company at least 400 DHS compared to what you would have if you were working max 88 hours. If they would have to hire a new captain to cover that work, it would cost them a lot more!

It is clear that the company is SAVING money by working us overtime, so they have absolutely no incentive hiring more pilots, as long as they have enough to cover the flight whilst remaining legal to fly.

The only way our lives will get back to sort of normal is by an increase in overtime payments to at least 1500 Dhs/hr region. As long as we don't achieve that, the company is making money by working us in overtime, and any reduction in threshold or whatever they do is just a small pay rise, but has nothing to do with actually taking down the monthly hours.

Conclusion: The only way the company can prove they are willing to increase our QOL is by dramatically increasing the overtime pay.

[fatbus]

Problem is they don't care about your QOL, you are here to work plain and simple . Why ? Greed! They will pay the absolute min to keep the operation going. Key point " keep the operation going" . They will only increase TCs to accomplish that one goal. Sinking ship, look out for a mass scramble . China , in the short term, will not be short of applications.

[donpizmeov]

We still have people volunteering to work on days off. They won't change a thing.

[CaptainChipotle]

We still have people volunteering to work on days off. They won't change a thing.

This is true Don, I've heard from a few people lately that people are still working on their days off. makes me want to bang my head against the wall.

I know of a Capt that didn't allow the FO controlled rest because the FO was working in a day off and had volunteered. :=

[Aluminium shuffler]

I hope that is just an apocryphal tale - deliberately causing fatigue to an operating pilot because you disagree with a political issue is a flagrant breach of safety, let alone decency. If true, that Captain should lose his licence. Whatever one may feel about people doing favours, there is a line that should not be crossed.

[single chime]

the line was crossed when the FO went to work not properly rested.

[scrambledegg]

How do you know he wasn't rested properly? Whoops I had controlled rest twice last week, so did the the bloke next to me. And the time before that and that and so on. I must have crossed the line many times then. Anyway, back to profit share...

[fatbus]

If anything the FO should email his CP Have the Capt justify his actions. If in fact it's true. This is PPrune.