Bristow Tiger question

[heli1]

Did the AS332L Bristow Tiger version have blade folding ...and if so do they use blade supports?

[countertorque]

Memory fades for it was while ago now but I remember the mains folded but the supports issue eludes me.

[Non-Driver]

No and I'm not aware of any civil 332's with blade folding.

[heli1]

Illustrations from Aerospatiale definitely show blades folded on the AS332L1....but the AS332L and specifically the Bristow aircraft??h

[Bravo73]

Reading between the lines a bit here but... does this mean that Bristow have donated a Tiger to the museum???

[AS332L1]

Oman Royal flight had two AS332C's and one L1 with blade fold they were civilian registered.

[as365n4]

Some Norwegian 332 had Blade folding as well together with the kneeling option to fit into the very small Hangar, as they had some Oil & Gas Rescue Helicopters permanently stationed on an Oil Rig. Can't remeber but could have been on the Ekofisk Installation.

[heli1]

Bravo 73...No...Bristow has not donated a Tiger to anyone so far as I know.
However still keen to know if the early AS332L blades could be folded as per the later L1.

[ericferret]

The engineers technical training notes (1984) deal with the blade fold system.

The 4 blades when folded locate on poles attached to the tailboom.

Alternatively it could be folded with one blade over the nose one over the tail and with two blades folded.

Looking at the Bristow Tiger photos on G-INFO I cant identify the locating points for the poles on the tailbooms. So maybe they were not specified for the Tiger.

[Bravo73]

Bravo 73...No...Bristow has not donated a Tiger to anyone so far as I know.

That's a shame. :(

[Variable Load]

However still keen to know

Why? It's almost ancient history!

[Fareastdriver]

Lot's of mounting points disappeared off the Tigers as years went by. The ladder mounting keys on the fuselage and pylon and the slots for mounting the blade folding gear. I haven't seen a 332 with its blades folded but the 330 looked a right Horlicks when it was done to them. One of our Chinese 332Ls had the pole slots in.

The ultimate with blade folding was when they built a self-propelled undercarriage. This consisted of two miniature tank type treads on each leg plus a double ski arrangement on the nose wheel. The object was that the aircraft would land, shut down, blades folded for/aft and then the port engine would be started in accessory drive which would bring ALT1 and HYD1 on line. The hydraulic power would then drive the aircraft into cover with the skis enabling the nose wheel to traverse soft ground.

They never flew an operational undercarriage, just the assembly, which meant that the undercarriage was fixed down. There was a rig that would clatter around Marignane occasionally. It would always end with a bang and a cloud of smoke in the distance.

In the hanger offices there would be the rustle of money as they sorted out who had won the sweep betting on the time taken,

[Ian Corrigible]

Veering wildly off topic, but here's the track-equipped Puma in all its glory:

http://i.imgur.com/EpW3MRt.jpg

I/C

[pedroalpha]

The most ridiculous mod for the RAF Puma HC1 was to fit skis for operations in Norway during the winter NATO exercise season. We were quite happy landing on sloping snow with the standard undercarriage because the wheels acted like anchors and the aircraft settled in up to its belly. One year we had skis fitted and that really was fun as we careered around the slopes whilst attempting to land. Skis removed and it was back to normal again accepting whatever slope there was at the LS and holding the aircraft on the collective if it seemed excessive. The HC1 had blade folding of course together with kneeling undercarriage to allow it to fit in a C130.

[Fareastdriver]

The observant will notice that the above picture is of a 330A with the UH1 type nose. The very first Makila engined 'Super Puma' was also of that batch of six but had a single wheel undercarriage and plug in the aft section of the fuselage.

Accessory drive can be identified in the 332's cockpit on the overhead power levers box. On the extreme left will be seen the stamping marks in preparation for a cutout, two slots, similar to the rotor brake and safety lever on the other side. The lever would withdraw a sleeve in the gearbox that would disconnect the drive from the input shaft to the rotor drive pinion whilst still leaving it connected to the alternator and hydraulic pump. There was a safety lever because, as was once found out, the sleeve would migrate and reengage the drive quite noisily. The Puma Mk2 has the blanks but not the facility.

[Oldlae]

I have it on good authority that the Bristow Tiger did not have blade folding, it was not required, Mr Bristow wanted a clean head to obtain maximum airspeed.

Even so, the blade spindles were not up to the job and the max speed was reduced after a severe vibration caused a Tiger to shut down just before take-off, a blade spindle was found to have had a failure.

[Brother]

Correct Oldlae, the Tiger did not have blade folding.

But I thought that the severe vibration was caused by a frequency adaptor that let go and that the pilot was Peter Hall?

That was the initial pitch / speed reduction to 16 degrees instead of 16.5 as it had been previously. It happened in summer 1982.

[Phil Kemp]

Hi Brother. The information posted by oldlae is absolutely correct.

G-TIGC suffered a fracture at the 12 o'clock position on a Main Rotor spindle on take-off from the Balder Crane barge in the summer of 1982, whilst working on the construction phase of the NW Hutton. Fortunately the pilots (Chris Hudson and Neil Anderson) who were just about to rotate when this occurred, dumped her back on the helipad and everyone walked away to fly another day.

I was based out there with a 212 and when we found the source of the problem, we were pretty horrified to say the least. Pushed it to the side of the helipad and flew in an S61 with a new head and then ferried her back out to Aberdeen two days later. It was an incredibly close call, and disaster was only averted by the quick thinking and action of those two pilots. The spindle had opened up a full inch after it failed!

There were frequency adapter issues amongst other problems that year, but that was certainly the most dramatic failure that had occurred to date.

[Thridle Op Des]

I seem to recollect that the transmission had some effect on the pitch being reduced from 17.5 to 16.5 (and therefore the speed), My log book has a note that our transmission that threw a chip inbound to ABZ and was changed as a result was the 52nd one to do so. Again the story was Neil had actually initiate forward cyclic input when a blade popped seriously out of track, Chris hauled it back onto the deck. Perhaps the gentlemen concerned will come up and give the definitive story!

TOD

[Phil Kemp]

TOD, your account is correct. Split second decision that would have seen them flying a disintegrating helicopter if they had proceeded. The machine had just arrived direct from Aberdeen for a rotors-running refuel and return to Aberdeen - consider the infinitesimal odds of that failure occurring when it did?

[Brother]

TOD

I think Cruise Pitch was 16.5 degrees then reduced to 15.5 with 16 in certain lower torque situations? I remember Laurence Bristow marketing the Tiger at 145 knots direct to the ESB with 19 pax, which it did for a few months until the above event. I was at ND doing my IR when it happened.

[Thridle Op Des]

I hate advancing age! Yes, Brother you are correct.

TOD