Nuclear war-games call: great idea

[ShotOne]

The UK Defence secretary has called upon NATO nations to conduct co-ordinated military exercises with our nuclear deterrent. What a great idea! Flash-points all round...so let's do some nuclear willy waving. Who comes up with this stuff? Couldn't Mr Fallon just have himself pictured riding a horse bare-chested?

[NutLoose]

That's old hat, it's ice Hockey these days

[JointShiteFighter]

I'm quite unsure how this will be beneficial to anybody?
Damaging the environment further just to flex ones muscles to Commies...... no!

[Rhino power]

Damaging the environment further just to flex ones muscles to Commies...... no!

How on earth would conducting exercises cause (further) damage to the environment???

-RP

[ORAC]

How on earth would conducting exercises cause (further) damage to the environment???

Exercise Able Archer 1983.......

How a Nato war game took the world to brink of nuclear disaster | UK news | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2013/nov/02/nato-war-game-nuclear-disaster)

[PAXfips]

Not only a call.. actually happening next week in Germany.:sad:
It's a yearly drill with different NATO members called "Steadfast Noon".

German source: Aktuelles: Heimliches Atom-Manöver in der Eifel ? BI gegen Fluglärm, Bodenlärm und Umweltverschmutzung (http://fluglaerm-kl.de/aktuelles_einzeln.php?artikel=201510102039)

[JointShiteFighter]

Rhino power, one would presume that weapons will be released (in a remote area) during these exercises. That's how it would damage the environment.

Also, what ORAC said!

[Rhino power]

Rhino power, one would presume that weapons will be released (in a remote area) during these exercises. That's how it would damage the environment.

I'm assuming you actually think that live nuclear weapons will be released and detonated for the purpose of a training exercise?! :eek:

I'm also familiar with ORAC's linked story, but despite the souring of east/west relations in recent years, we're not at the height of the Cold War anymore...

-RP

[minigundiplomat]

To paraphrase Churchill, appeasement is feeding the crocodile hoping he eats you last.

Putin is an opportunist and is taking full advantage of weak and dysfunctional leadership in the West to either expand or embarrass adversaries. The only way to put the brakes on this is for the West to show some backbone and that's not going to happen with the Obama - Cameron - Merkl - Hollande dream team at the helm; neither is moving 125 UK troops to the Baltic States.

[salad-dodger]

JSF
Rhino power, one would presume that weapons will be released (in a remote area) during these exercises. That's how it would damage the environment.
You clearly do not have a clue do you JSF? You think that weapons are going to be launched in any such exercise :ugh::ugh::ugh:

It was suggested to me via PM that you are Typhoon93 reborn. I wasn't sure at first, but believe it now, call you out and claim my £5.

S-D

[dragartist]

S-D you beat me too it!
What became of Hanoi Jane?

[Pontius Navigator]

HJ was genuine, talked with him a lot.

As for nuclear war games, I was never aware that this was the case.

Warning messages, release requests, etc but within moments of first use, ENDEX.

[Chris Kebab]

Come on JSF you really are Typhoon93 aren't you?!

If not maybe you could briefly comment on your involvement with Military Aircrew - operator, maintainer, back-room boy/girl, spotter, walt, whatever.

Or we could have a thread discussing specifically what compelled you to adopt the PPrune handle you have.

[dctyke]

Nuclear willy waving? Even if it's done these days it's the navy and very deep, nothing to see here.

[Finningley Boy]

Nuclear willy waving? Even if it's done these days it's the navy and very deep, nothing to see here.

Well exactly sir, this is why we should have retained the V-Force, far more spectacular way of heading toward Armageddon!:ooh:

FB:)

[ShotOne]

Er, so mgdiplomat you feel that not pretending to launch nuclear missiles counts as appeasement?

[ORAC]

Many, many years ago, during a TACEVAL, I was the MC when we had a Vulcan simulating a Bear B with 2 buckets of sunshine onboard requesting to defect (standard input to see if we followed the appropriate intervention techniques and diversion to land.)

"Take him to Leeds-Bradford", say's I.

"Why Leeds-Bradford?", asks Gp Capt umpire with clipboard.

"Because we can afford to lose Leeds and Bradford", says I.

"I come from Leeds", he opined.

"Unlucky", say's I.......

[Cazalet33]

NATO "co-ordinated" joint exercises for Britain's "independent" nuclear deterrent.

You just can't make it up.

[Pontius Navigator]

Caz, our independent nuclear deterrent is a weapon of last resort as is, I believe, France's. Any tactical nukes assigned to NATO are US controlled.

Now, without coordination you could have UK considering launch of our strategic missiles (unlikely I know) when NATO tactical deterrence may prevail.

Alternatively our SSBN needs to be ready should NATOs tactical use lead to general release. I commend you read Henessesy' s Secret State.

[minigundiplomat]

Shot,

If he doesn't think you'd pull the trigger for real, I can't see why he'd give two hoots either way on firing blanks during an exercise.

My post was more of an observation on the general geo-political situation rather than whether NATO should hide in a HAS for a few days and project tabletop power which in all likelihood will never be matched by political will or decision.

[ORAC]

XyJh3qKjSMk

[ExRAFRadar]

The UK Defence secretary has called upon NATO nations to conduct co-ordinated military exercises with our nuclear deterrent

Just out of interest how does one perform 'co-ordinated military exercises with our nuclear deterrent' ?

I thought the boomers stay hidden at very deep level, at very secret locations,their sole purpose to receive a launch message, get to firing depth and unleash retribution.

Nearly all the exercises I went through ended with 'ESCALATION TO GLOBAL EXCHANGE'. Well some of them did. Think it was the planners way of saying Game Over.

Is it true one of the reasons to fire the buckets was if Radio 4 was off the air? Hope they pay their license fee.

[MAINJAFAD]

Is it true one of the reasons to fire the buckets was if Radio 4 was off the air?

Yes, though it was just one of the things that had to be checked that initiated the Captain of the boat to open the letter of last resort from the Prime Minister on what He / She wished to be done if the UK was destroyed by a nuclear strike.

Most of the historic and current operation of the UK nuclear firing chain was covered in a very good Radio 4 programme made in 2004 which is linked below.

hc1L6dCjhwQ

[Lonewolf_50]

Rhino power, one would presume that weapons will be released (in a remote area) during these exercises.
Uh, nope. :ugh:
Any tactical nukes assigned to NATO are US controlled.
GHW Bush, aka Bush 41, pulled the tactical nukes back the early 90's. However, as I am not a ground pounder, someone may still have some in storage in Europe ... all of the nuke stuff I worked on was maritime in NATO, and we haven't had tactical nukes on US ships for almost two decades. (Granted, we still know how to use them ... )

Just out of interest how does one perform 'co-ordinated military exercises with
our nuclear deterrent' ? Based on the last one I had to play in, it's mostly a comms and coordination exercise against a time line. Craploads of work on the staff side. Not as much on the "down in the weeds" side.

[Pontius Navigator]

Lonewolf, assigned does not mean positioned or deployed.

[Lonewolf_50]

Lonewolf, assigned does not mean positioned or deployed. Got it, NATO allocations, force offerings by nations, etc. :ok:

[ExRAFRadar]

Good documentary MAINJAFAD thanks.

Great quote "I signed for my first Nuclear Weapon at age 23" by the V Force chap.

[ExRAFRadar]

Re the above that the Trident Skippers would open.

If retaliation is a national policy why on Earth would we give a potential enemy the thought that we might not retaliate?

I mean if we allow a single person to decide if we launch or not does that give an enemy the ability to guess/analyse what that person has written long before any conflict starts?

Surely that might make a Nuclear Attack more likely?

Take it to its extreme. Corbyn has already said he would not retaliate. So when he writes he's letter the whole world knows what it says.

Might as well dry dock the Tridents while he is in power if he gets in.

Jeremy Corbyn: I would never use nuclear weapons if I were PM | Politics | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/sep/30/corbyn-i-would-never-use-nuclear-weapons-if-i-was-pm)

[skippedonce]

Originally Posted by Pontius Navigator http://www.pprune.org/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.pprune.org/military-aviation/568931-nuclear-war-games-call-great-idea-2.html#post9146387)
Caz, our independent nuclear deterrent is a weapon of last resort as is, I believe, France's. Any tactical nukes assigned to NATO are US controlled.

Now, without coordination you could have UK considering launch of our strategic missiles (unlikely I know) when NATO tactical deterrence may prevail.Not quite: the UK and USA participate in NATO's Nuclear Planning Group (NPG) along with 25 other allies who do not own their own nukes. France does not participate in the NPG and retains a truly independent nuclear deterrent.