ex-Luftwaffe F-4F arrives at Scampton

[Rhino power]

Well, HHA's non flying, spares christmas tree F-4F (37+89) has arrived at Scampton (an additional spares package to follow), the flyer (38+48) is expected to arrive later this year. Here's a few photos of 37+89 on it's way through the Netherlands (credit - Bas Velders) and at Scampton (credit - dukesdave).

https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t31.0-8/11539028_759879997462853_4152251011249683559_o.jpg

https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xta1/t31.0-8/11406459_759880077462845_5687480233920736857_o.jpg

http://i1106.photobucket.com/albums/h364/dukesdave/DSC_2598_zps6w5ihvfo.jpg

-RP

[Stu666]

Do you know what the plan is for this aircraft?

[Rhino power]

37+89 is for spares, 38+48 is for flight ops. I assume contract work for the MOD, maybe even BAES? Not a lot of (public) info around at the moment...

-RP

[HaveQuick2]

37+89 is for spares, 38+48 is for flight ops. I assume contract work for the MOD, maybe even BAES? Not a lot of (public) info around at the moment...

-RP



Well, 38+48 was put on the register months ago as ZK 848

[Roadster280]

Quick Q - why do non-MOD aircraft sometimes get UK military serial numbers?

[1.3VStall]

'Cos there's no feckin' way the CAA would give it approval to fly!

[WE Branch Fanatic]

'Cos there's no feckin' way the CAA would give it approval to fly!

How does it get past the MAA?

[Rhino power]

How does it get past the MAA?

I rather suspect it won't, and will have to meet any requirements needed to enable it to perform it's intended purpose...

HHA already operate/have operated Hunters on contract to the MOD, I don't see why operating a well maintained F-4F with an equally well documented maintenance and service history should prove to be a significant problem?

-RP

[dat581]

It's a shame no airworthy FG1 or FGR2's are around to do the job.

[Lynxman]

The MAA issues military serial numbers so the aircraft already has Approval in Principal.

[pulse1]

Its not this one is it?

Vulcan team has plan to bring another aircraft back to life (but they won't say which one...) (From Bournemouth Echo) (http://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/news/13891354.Vulcan_team_has_plan_to_bring_another_aircraft_back _to_life__but_they_won_t_say_which_one____/)

[Lima Juliet]

So the Chief Exec is looking for another project to line his pockets with now that the Tin Triangle 'money merry-go-round' has paid its last penny?

Serioulsy, I have been shocked at some of the wages drawn by the Vulcan to the Sky Trust people. As a Director of a charity organisation myself, that affects thousands of pilots in the UK, I draw no salary and only accept a free buffet lunch for my time - the dozen or so Directors are also the same. I also used to give up my weekends for free when flying for the BBMF.

Take a look at this graphic from 2009/10 - http://www.vulcantothesky.org/uploads/images/Financials.jpg

The annual wage bill for the Vulcan to the Sky trust was an 'eye watering' £750,000 - yes, three quarters of a MILLION quid. That was at 2010 prices so it is probably nearer to a whole MILLION now. That is why the 'begging bowl' went out to all of the enthusiasts pre-season each year!

Seriously unimpressed...

LJ :*

PS. staff list is here: http://www.vulcantothesky.org/faq-contact/operating-company.html. If the current wages has increased by inflation at a collective 15% over 5 years (that's about CPI) then it would be around £860k. Thee are 16 ground staff on the books and then there's the crews which is probably about 6 per year - that makes 22. Thus the average wage for all of them would be nearly £40k of each!

I wonder if anyone from the VttS trust would like to comment on my allegations?

[Rhino power]

Its not this one is it?

Vulcan team has plan to bring another aircraft back to life (but they won't say which one...) (From Bournemouth Echo) (http://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/news/13891354.Vulcan_team_has_plan_to_bring_another_aircraft_back _to_life__but_they_won_t_say_which_one____/)

No, try reading post#1 again...

-RP

[Stitchbitch]

LJ I thought BBMF got paid the same as everyone else in the airforce? I imagine there are lots of pilots who would fly the aircraft for free though, best workplace ever.

[Mechta]

So the Chief Exec is looking for another project to line his pockets with now that the Tin Triangle 'money merry-go-round' has paid its last penny?

An RN F-35 that actually flies? :}

[Dr Jekyll]

Serioulsy, I have been shocked at some of the wages drawn by the Vulcan to the Sky Trust people. As a Director of a charity organisation myself, that affects thousands of pilots in the UK, I draw no salary and only accept a free buffet lunch for my time - the dozen or so Directors are also the same. I also used to give up my weekends for free when flying for the BBMF.

Take a look at this graphic from 2009/10 - http://www.vulcantothesky.org/upload...Financials.jpg

The annual wage bill for the Vulcan to the Sky trust was an 'eye watering' £750,000 - yes, three quarters of a MILLION quid. That was at 2010 prices so it is probably nearer to a whole MILLION now. That is why the 'begging bowl' went out to all of the enthusiasts pre-season each year!


As of 2014 there were actually about 32 employees with a combined wage bill of £760,000.

So an average of less than £24K, doesn't sound shocking or eye watering to me.

[airpolice]

Vulcan.


Dr. Jekyll, if only an average was appropriate. One man accounts for about 10% of the wage bill.


Vulcan to the Sky accounts to October 2014



Wages and salaries £767,529
Social security costs £62,986
Other pension costs £4,764

Total for the year £825,279

Bank Charges £29,048
Computer costs £39,594
Legal & Professional fees £15,594


Robert Pleming is the only member of staff who earned more than £60,000 His salary was between £70,000 & £80,000

Expenses have been claimed by Andrew Edmondson, director of Vulcan to the Sky Enterprises Limited, amounting to £5,312 (2013 £5,072)

Expenses have been claimed by Robert Pleming, Chief Executive of Vulcan to the Sky Trust, amounting to £16,276 (2013: £15,256)




So, the head man at the charity is getting through about £1,800 a week. That's not really how a charity is supposed to work, is it?

£600 a week in bank charges?

£800 a week in Computer costs?

As at the end of 2014, XH558 had flown for approximately 272 hours on a total of 192 sorties since her return to flight in 2007.

I wish I had the time to calculate an hourly rate for that flying.


View accounts (http://apps.charitycommission.gov.uk/Showcharity/RegisterOfCharities/DocumentList.aspx?RegisteredCharityNumber=1101948&SubsidiaryNumber=0&DocType=AccountList)

[Lima Juliet]

Stitchbitch - BBMF is a voluntary duty for most and you're right it is a total honour to give one's time up, at weekends and BHs, for free to do it and bring such joy to so many people. That is why paying people to fly the Vulcan, to me, seems so wrong.

Airpolice - thanks for confirming my allegations, I am still shocked by this and would not donate one penny to a future project that RP had anything to do with; regardless of how much I wanted to see it fly...

LJ

[SWBKCB]

That's not really how a charity is supposed to work, is it?

Surely that depends on the size and complexity of the job?

Difference in scale, but see link below - not saying it's right but hardly unique

Charity pay study: Who are the highest earners? | Third Sector (http://www.thirdsector.co.uk/charity-pay-study-highest-earners/management/article/1335060)

[dagenham]

Big projects or charities require professionalism.......Professional people cost money..

Just compare Vulcan to the sky and the sitatuion with black Mike where the guy collected umpteen thousand beer token and did a bunk or the guy collecting for help for heroes with the scout and was using the money to fund his military vehicle collection. Like or loathe rp, he has professionally raised significant money over a number of years and run a safe flight organisation ( silica bags not withstanding) so I do take my hat off to him for that.

If anyone here does fancy being responsible for raising a couple of million a year, employing 70 people and running a old complex aircraft to fly safely with every mistake scritnised and criticised....and do it for free.... You should go for it.

Pay peanuts get monkeys....

[Rhino power]

Any chance of the thread returning to the original topic instead of irrelevant waffle about the bloody Vulcan and charities?!!!

-RP

[newt]

Well said Rp:ok:

[Hastings]

Doesn't seem so long ago I heard you were asking about the chances of joining. Forgive me if this is mistaken identity.

[Rhino power]

Mr Blue Sky?

Who he? And what relevance to this topic?

-RP

[Stitchbitch]

LJ, agreed although the rest after LLA was always nice.

Back on topic, what complications does operating the Phantom bring? HHA also have a Buc and SU22, both of which haven't shown at Scampton yet, I presume there's is a call for a big supersonic target out there?