Latest NATO war games in the Baltic.

[Hangarshuffle]

Nato shows its teeth to Russia with elaborate Baltic training exercise | World news | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jun/17/nato-russia-elaborate-training-exercise-dangerous-signal)


Hope the link works, failed last time. Showing my former alma mater there nicely. Amazing to think Ocean was launched 20 years ago.
Always thought the Apache crews were/are very brave men (and women) to operate the helicopter over the water - they are pretty well death traps if they ditch IMHO. That narrow band of armoured glass always seemed too narrow to get through with the gear on. Has it been done before?
As for this exercise...God help us. I read a world war two veteran say recently the best thing ever would be for the worlds leaders to be made to attend compulsory peace studies....
I think conducting an invasion 100 miles from Russia could send the wrong signal-that we do indeed plan to attack their base in Kalingrad. Is this wise? Was this correct thinking on NATOs part?
Come on, answers and debate.
Glad the leftish wing Guardian reports these things as well as it can. Well done the Guardian and Ewen MacAskill. Other newspapers, where are you with this?

[rh200]

Yaaawwnn

The Russian military and pollys in the know will be laughing at it, and rubbing their hands with glee at the PR they can make from it.

Nobody of any consequence in Russia (same as during the cold war) will be under any illusion that the west will invade Russia. Hell we can't even arm the Ukrianians.

It will make a good properganda piece for the state media to promote the evil west line though.

[Martin the Martian]

WTR Apache ditching, as the dunker at Yeovilton has an Apache-style toy for bathtime, I guess that the crews all have to practice egress under the various conditions that it can allow for. I don't know how much they wear during the training, but I imagine it must be representative?

[Courtney Mil]

Hangarshuffle, for an ex-RN man you often seem very negative about Service (especially RN) matters.

My question is this, do you really think Moscow regards yet another NATO exercise as a public rehearsal for an invasion of Russia? Do you think, maybe, they compare this one with any exercise conducted 20 years ago and think that we've gone down hill a bit?

[FODPlod]

BALTOPS has been an annual feature of the NATO exercise calendar since 1971. Any cancellation might be viewed as an alarming departure from the norm.

http://cne-cna-c6f.dodlive.mil/6-things-you-need-to-know-about-baltops-2015/

[Hangarshuffle]

CM, time and distance is now making me look at all the services, and Britain even, in a differing light, that's all. I'm not unduly negative about them (I think) but I'm no longer the true saluting blue I was - that is very true. Being lied to and deliberately deceived when your volunteering head is potentially on the block, well it can do that. Being a civilian has made me look entirely in a different way at HM forces, what they do, with what and how.
The quotes today.What an earth does Fallon mean by saying " we" are standing tall? Against Russia? Is the man utterly mad? He needs to rapidly de-escalate, if he can.
More in the DM about today with a very good photo.
Moment RAF Typhoons intercepted Russian MiG planes heading for Nato exercise | Daily Mail Online (http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/news/article-3130175/Pictured-dramatic-moment-RAF-Typhoons-intercepted-Russian-MiG-fighters-spy-planes-bombers-heading-Nato-exercise.html)


Is it really a yawn? For whom? 4 powerful military combat aircraft were taking part in this photo, over Europe at high speed. These aircraft appear to be all armed. Mustering up an amphib. force in the Baltic -tactically mad and provocative to Russia to boot. We did the same thing back in 1985, those that were there will remember it -it simply provokes the Russians to respond in kind (which they did then and will so again and again).
I think this has the potential to spill over very quickly into combat via a misunderstanding, a misread. Both sides should broker a stand down-now.
Our politicians and their senior military officers (Britain's) keep on making horrible howler after howlers in their logic and decision making and in their strategy and thinking and in their operational reasoning and decision making - look at Iraq, Afghan, Libya, Syria, possibly now the Yemen, possibly recently in refugee pick-ups offshore Libya and how that would develop, probably with their cutting back of still credible UK defence forces - they keep getting it wrong time after time after time, within the last 15 years IMHO.
They need to get this one really very right.
Certainly the comments from the DM readers (and boy they normally are a true blue bunch) seem pretty nationally representative.


Martin I'm glad that is so, about the facility at Yeovilton. I wish them all well and did not wish to appear unduly negative or whatever. HS.


* Reading CMs question again...I don't know. I don't think the Russians really actually want a confrontation over anything, but of the Russians I've met and worked with, or the TV programmes and news I watch or have translated for me by others, I always get the impression that they never ever think as we do, they seem to think about life in an entirely differing way. Our humour doesn't translate to theirs, things we think as funny they can think of as humiliating or offensive and so on. Our logic doesn't follow theirs -that is why I believe we have to be very, very careful with our military forces and this ongoing situation (which has developed for months now) - we truly need the best of brains behind this and I'm afraid we simply haven't got that, at this present time. HS. Goodnight.