Heads up: BBC2 22:00 11/3/15 [Archive]

Old-Duffer

11th Mar 2015, 21:54

I'm waiting for somebody to post that the programme should have been made two years ago but there was a backlog in the training system.

Old Duffer

PS If the guy had been taught to fly a wokka wokka it would have been well worth watching.

ExAscoteer

11th Mar 2015, 22:23

Am I the only one who is ABSOLUTELY ******* DISGUSTED that he was allowed to wear 'Wings'?

Arfur Dent

11th Mar 2015, 22:32

Yes - you're the only one!:ok:

ExAscoteer

11th Mar 2015, 22:37

Ah, you don't think that QR(RAF)J727 applies then?

I on
the other hand do.

I worked ******* hard to get my 'Wings' and I am damned if some comedian is allowed to wear them just for some poor piece of TV.

You on the other hand may feel different.

ACW418

11th Mar 2015, 22:49

ExAscoteer,

No you are not the only one.

ACW

Tankertrashnav

11th Mar 2015, 23:53

Felt sorry for the guys at Valley having to work with such a dick! Thought they were very patient with his totally inane chat.

Mogwi

12th Mar 2015, 08:39

I agree that he should never have been allowed to wear wings. I worked effin hard for both my sets, as have many thousands of fine chasps in the past. What was Valley thinking of?

Tashengurt

12th Mar 2015, 09:50

Felt sorry for the guys at Valley having to work with such a dick! Thought they were very patient with his totally inane chat.

You have to remember that we were seeing him in his 'comedy character' which is that of a permanently bemused fish out of water individual.
I've never met him but I'd hazard a guess that between takes he isn't such a buffoon.

thunderbird7

12th Mar 2015, 10:55

Lighten up chaps! I thought he did a good job of showing how difficult the job is and the blokes looking after him were a credit to the RAF. Great program without any heads up pompous arses for a change! :D

Martin the Martian

12th Mar 2015, 10:58

On the other hand, it was a good piece of PR for the RAF in general and fast jet flying in particular. His concluding piece about the difference between himself and the people he was flying with was very good, and the programme itself showed that it's not a job that just anyone can do.

ahwalk01

12th Mar 2015, 11:32

A great program, one of my favourites, shows you what it's like to fly fast jets.

Whatever badges he was wearing is less important, he got to do it for a day.

P6 Driver

12th Mar 2015, 12:33

We've had comments about wearing a set of wings. We've had the "one-upmanship" comment about qualifying for two sets of wings. Anyone with three sets or more?

Martin the Martian

12th Mar 2015, 12:42

The Red Baron?

rarelyathome

12th Mar 2015, 13:37

The Red Baron?

^^^^^^
:D:D:D

KiloB

12th Mar 2015, 14:15

Surely he had four?!?!
KB

HugoFirst

12th Mar 2015, 15:21

Presumably someone within the RAF hierarchy sanctioned this? I can't imagine for a moment that Gilbert turned up with his own set of wings and demanded to wear them... :rolleyes:

salad-dodger

12th Mar 2015, 16:09

wub, thnaks for the heads up. It has been on before, but it's a good programme.

Ignore the usual crown of whingers and moaners. They're the same ones about who bang on about their beautifully bound log books and how great thy look in a 1940s greatcoat.

As someone else said, great PR for the RAF, not something you hear very often!

Flying - if it was that difficult, the engineers would be doing it instead of pilots!

S-D

BEagle

12th Mar 2015, 17:22

I've just watched the programme on BBCiPlayer. How on earth did they manage such fantastic weather at Valley?

A very good programme to cover so much in a mere 30 minutes. The RAF came over very well and it was fascinating to see the new Hawk T2 training infrastructure.

Rhod did well, I thought.

The only jarring point was that he was handed a pilot's flying badge, aka 'Wings'. Those have to be earned the hard way, just as an all-arms badge, green beret, dolphins badge or parachutist badge has to be earned. It was emphatically wrong that he was allowed to wear the flying badge; a pity as it detracted from an otherwise excellent programme.

Danny42C

12th Mar 2015, 18:24

No, you are not !

You could make an exception for Churchill, perhaps, for at least he had done some aviating, and recalled once: "Stalling between two fools", (sounds like a possible CaPCom suggestion !)

But not this character (whatever his fame in other directions). :=

D.

Danny42C

13th Mar 2015, 01:01

Very interesting ! How Valley has changed from '50/'51 when I was there ! But I suppose the weather is much the same.

But the shots of the Hawk 2 simulator brought home to me that I'm from a bygone age. I only hope that all those touch screens work better than the one I've got (goes AWOL regularly, close/wait/reopen laptop usually fixes it), but these Star Wars cockpits are not for this child !

D.

magicmick

13th Mar 2015, 10:43

There's a Red Arrows programme on BBC2 this Sunday evening. I hear Rob Brydon and Rhod Gilbert are the synchro pair.........what could possibly go wrong!!!!!!!!

RigPig

13th Mar 2015, 20:13

People are unhappy about wings being handed out without being earned, and Comic Relief is (unfortunately) on the tv I seem to remember that years ago a Hercules being fitted with a red nose and flying Lenny Henry somewhere. At one end or the other he was saluted as he got on or off the aircraft. That riled me as I am sure he doesn't hold the Queens Commission. My memory works in funny ways.

Baa humbug etc.

Bob Viking

13th Mar 2015, 20:22

In my opinion anything that gets the armed forces back into the public eye and paints it in a positive light as we approach a general election in the post (!) Afghanistan era is a good thing. I watched this programme a few months ago and thought it was a job well done. The guys who took him round the sim and jet did a great job and were well chosen.

The RAF comes out of it smelling of roses and everyone thinks FJ pilots are awesome as a result (only confirming what we already know!). Why get all bent out of shape about the wings thing?

I was on the fringes of a previous programe about Valley from 2002/3 (I think it was called Combat Pilot or something and I was in the background for a few seconds hurriedly getting out of shot) and TV producers/directors have their own ideas about what makes a good programme. The presenting of wings would have been their idea almost certainly and in the context of the programme with Rhod Gilbert did no real harm.

Maybe it would be a good idea to lighten up and just take it for what it was. Light-hearted TV with a side dish of prime time, main channel, positive PR for the RAF.

BV:rolleyes:

BEagle

13th Mar 2015, 22:33

BV wrote:

The presenting of wings would have been their idea almost certainly and in the context of the programme with Rhod Gilbert did no real harm.

If it was the producers idea, then the IV Sqn folk should have refused to agree. Giving Rhod the RAF pilot's badge to wear was unacceptable.

salad-dodger

13th Mar 2015, 22:43

If it was the producers idea, then the IV Sqn folk should have refused to agree. Giving Rhod the RAF pilot's badge to wear was unacceptable.
Oh for goodness sake, get over yourselves. What a precious bunch. BV has it spot on. The PR gains far outweigh your pathetic precious sensibilities. People watching this don't for one moment think that Rhod has earned his wings. Did you watch it all the way through and see the high praise he heaped on the RAF?

S-D

Bratman91

13th Mar 2015, 23:42

Comment for rigpig concerning Lenny Henry being saluted although he doesn't hold a Commission; I can recall being told at OCTU that officers saluted ladies as a courtesy and I have it in the back of my mind that one or two other categories of civilian were also saluted as a courtesy (maybe bishops or heads of a foreign state?). Are ladies still offered this courtesy or am I just showing my age? Just a thought, but what about senior officers who have retired but still hold a permanent commission? I am probably very old-fashioned but, although I am past the recall age, I hold my commission to be exactly that - permanent.

BEagle

14th Mar 2015, 08:22

salad-dodger, as non-aircrew you probably won't have a real understanding of the resentment felt by those who've worked hard for their 'wings', when they see them being handed over like that to someone unentitled.

Hardly 'pathetic precious sensibilities'.

Yes, it was a good programme as I've already said. The 'wings' aspect was the only jarring element.

Training Risky

14th Mar 2015, 09:58

I am on exchange with the RN at the moment and they never fail to comment on how slick our spin machine is!

So you see chaps...in the context of post-Afghan, SDSR... spin has a quality all of its own.

Ref the wings debate, I can see both sides. I am proud of my wings and I hold our traditions/habits in high regard...but is this so different to Jim'll Fixit arranging for some 12 yr old to train with the Marines and wear a green lid?:E

Bob Viking

14th Mar 2015, 13:18

BEagle.
It obvious to me that we shall have to agree to disagree.
Anyone could ring up Terrane and order a wings badge with their name on it. Hell, you can probably buy them at surplus stores along with green berets and medals.
I'm a pilot and I worked hard for my wings but it doesn't bother me one bit that Rhod was given a pair. Why? Because there is no inference whatsoever that he earned them properly. If it was, let's say, a six week programme where there was a period of training to teach him to fly and he were to claim at the end of it that he were a qualified pilot then I might feel differently. What he had was an air experience flight and he quite clearly put across the idea that he was woefully under qualified to do the job himself.
There's a difference between claiming to have earned them (which he has not) and wearing, what is basically, just an ornate piece of cloth.
Anyway as I said above we are unlikely to agree but that's my two penn'orth anyway.
BV

BEagle

14th Mar 2015, 13:46

BV, did you have 'Op' badges on your FJ squadrons? When I was on 56, you could wear the 'informal' badge once you'd joined, but you didn't wear the proper squadron badge until you'd gained Op status.

So how would you have felt if the Op badge was just handed to any Tom, Dick, or Rhod to wear on a flying suit?

Anyone can indeed become a Walt and wear something to which they're not entitled. If you think that's OK, then we will indeed have to disagree.

Bob Viking

14th Mar 2015, 14:36

On the Jag we had the giant triangular arm shield and the CR badge. The former could be worn by anyone who had flown the Jag solo. The latter was awarded once you were CR.
If either were presented to a celebrity in he manner being discussed it wouldn't bother me one bit.
I will concede though that if some random 'erbert turned up in a bar in a flying suit wearing them I'd be slightly miffed. Indeed if I were drunk I'd probably make a huge song and dance about it!
I see a distinct difference in the two situations though.
BV

windytoo

14th Mar 2015, 14:45

Broughy was a stand up comedian before he joined the Air Force and many would say he stayed one on the Squadron. Maybe that's why they asked him to give Rhod a few tips!

wub

14th Mar 2015, 15:48

No one here has complained about Larry Olivier, Richard Todd, Michael Caine and Christopher Plummer wearing wings in films. They were playing parts of course but to some extent, so was Rhod Gilbert.

BEagle

14th Mar 2015, 16:29

wub, hardly the same thing at all.

charliegolf

14th Mar 2015, 16:47

To me, the award of a flying badge means success at a very difficult endeavour. It is earned against an objective set of success criteria. Does ANYONE (Rhod Gilbert included) think that ANYONE will think that he has earned the wings?

The wings in this instance represent a cross between a keepsake and and a little 'dramatic licence'.

Gilbert was a vet for a couple of days- is anyone convinced? Is he?

CG

PS C'mon Scotland!

charliegolf

14th Mar 2015, 17:29

Just watched it on iPlayer. He was very self-deprecating throughout, I thought, and sincere at the end.

Line of the programme: "Last time I saw this many knobs was at the Tory Party Conference." Classic!

CG

Danny42C

14th Mar 2015, 19:31

Bob Viking (your #33) I agree - we must agree to disagree.

Don't blame Rhod. He had to do as he was told by the BBC producer without question (unlike some in the news !). I blame the pusillanimous RAF incumbents at Valley. What were they thinking of?

We all had to work hard for our wings, no problem with that. But, still in living memory, in Bomber Command alone, there must have been roughly 8,000 sets of double wings that ended in the wearer's agony, probably in flame and soaked in blood. Is there no respect any more?

It is sadly true, every fighting Service needs a major war every generation - just to remember what they came into the shop for in the first place. The bottom line is still "Kill or be killed". This is not a game (and never was, and never will be).

The "Plays, Films and TV fiction" argument is a red herring. This was a documentary. Rhod's wings were pure window-dressing, it would have been just as interesting and educative without them.

Danny42C.

charliegolf

14th Mar 2015, 19:53

This was a documentary.

Piffle! It's a light entertainment series. It's a vehicle for a comedian to make cracks about himself in an alien (for him) setting. Watch the other episodes. Sheesh.

CG

BEagle

14th Mar 2015, 20:35

Bob Viking

14th Mar 2015, 22:56

Danny.
I have the utmost respect for you and your generation but we don't have to agree about everything.
I'm not saying you're wrong I'm just saying I feel differently about the matter. Maybe it's a generational thing. I personally don't feel it is disrespectful to those who have earned them.
Now if he'd pinned a VC on his chest I'd feel very differently.
I feel like I'm starting to repeat myself now so I shall cease and desist.
BV

longer ron

14th Mar 2015, 23:09

No one here has complained about Larry Olivier wearing wings in films

Well he was an FAA pilot during part of WW2 :)

longer ron

14th Mar 2015, 23:13

http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv316/volvosmoker/LO%20pilot_zpsvd9m6hbn.jpg

Pic courtesy of - you know who :)

Danny42C

14th Mar 2015, 23:58

longer ron,

Never knew Sir Laurence Olivier was in the RNVR as a FAA Lieutenant during WWII, but apparently it is so.

Can anyone identify the aircraft? (my guess: Albacore?)

Danny.

ShyTorque

15th Mar 2015, 00:11

charliegolf, this isn't Jet Blast and even Welsh schoolteachers should show some respect to WW2 veterans - your exclamation of 'Bollocks' was as rude as it was inappropriate.

Please edit your post and get one of the kids to give you six of the best - you'd probably enjoy that...:rolleyes:

Don't be silly. CG is someone who previously earned his own flying badge. Having flown with him, I can vouch for his professionalism.

I objected to civilian flying instructors being given the same flying badge as regulars, when this was proposed two decades ago, but this was different - Gilbert won't be wearing his "wings" every day.

hoodie

15th Mar 2015, 00:22

Can anyone identify the aircraft? (my guess: Albacore?)

K8931 was a Blackburn Shark (http://www.aviationarchive.org.uk/Gpages/html/G3633.html), and as it happens that airframe was the penultimate one of the type to be retired (in July 1944).

http://www.transportarchive.org.uk/aimages/G3633.jpg