Serviceman refused service in uniform

[ShotOne]

A soldier trying to buy cigarettes in St Helens, Lancs was refused service because the assistant "thought it was illegal to serve people in uniform". How on earth did we get to a stage where someone could think that??

..on the other hand, quite a lot of ppruners think it should be illegal for a family to eat a pub lunch, but still. Ps. The shop was called Alpha news if anyone wants to show how impressed we are!

[Herod]

My guess is that on the other side of the pond, a member of the armed forces would probably go to the head of the queue.

[OvertHawk]

Bearing in mind that a shop assistant in that part of the world is likely not to have English as their first language and that most shops have a clear rule of not serving cigarettes to children in SCHOOL uniform, is it possible to see how some confusion may have arisen?

Should not have happened, but lets try not to get too excited about it eh?

OH

[Pontius Navigator]

I recall many years ago a p****d off squaddie borrowed a 175mm SP gun. Only problem is he had no one to steer the barrel.

Maybe a few pongos should drive to some of these jobs worths, a Challenger would soon make the point.

[Trim Stab]

Why was a soldier in uniform trying to buy cigarettes in the first place? Service people should have pride in service and uniform. Smoking/buying cigarettes in public in uniform is akin to glue-sniffing in uniform, or being drunk in uniform - not illegal, but very definitely bad for the public image of the services. The only place that it should be acceptable to smoke in uniform is when out of public view - e.g. in the mess or, when off duty on overseas ops - though I would prefer that to be banned too.

If (god forbid) I ever had to work in an off-licence or tobacconist, I would refuse to serve anybody in a uniform representing a public service too (i.e. police, military), and I would give them a good earful too about representing their uniform.

[barry lloyd]

The so-called apology as per the photo says it all really...

http://i3.liverpoolecho.co.uk/incoming/article7988368.ece/alternates/s615b/shopb.png

Personnel spelt incorrectly - 16's scratched out and replaced by 18 -and these people are in business? Perhaps not for much longer though...

[mad_jock]

I can actually understand why and its nothing to do with being in the armed forces.

I suspect the shop is an off license.

There are a load of rules and laws about selling alcohol to a policeman in uniform or even in but with a civi jacket on. And they will have had a induction by the licensee telling them this fact.

I have been refused booze when some thick **** spotted my pilots uniform under my jacket getting a couple of bottles of wine on the way home. Using the uniform reason as well.

You pay peanuts and you get monkeys.

[Lynxman]

At least Royal Navy, Royal Marines and RAF personnel would have been OK.

[west lakes]

Or is this a case of sh1t stirring by an unidentified person, and did not actually happen in the first place?
Just as occurred regarding a pub somewhere and was a load of lies.

[Roadster280]

Well, that's it then.

Torch the place.

[Evanelpus]

Jeez TrimStab. You must get nose bleeds on your lofty moral high ground:D

[3engnever]

Trimstab,

Seriously, what a load of old tosh. Smoking is perfectly legal and so I see nothing wrong with this individual buying a packet of cigarettes in uniform. Are you saying that we should not be able to go into a shop on the way home from work and buy a bottle of wine for fear of presenting a negative view on the service. Lets be honest, most of the poor behaviour within the service in the past has been linked to alcohol consumption rather than going out for a quick smoke!!

[Fareastdriver]

Trim Stab. 10/10 for composition. Not many can write a story with so much punch as that one. You can relax now and have a fag.

[Tankertrashnav]

For anyone who has missed this outrage bus, the next one will be along in a day or two. Then the day after that. Then the day after...

What a load of fuss. Storms and teacups come to mind.

[Courtney Mil]

Why was a soldier in uniform trying to buy cigarettes in the first place? Service people should have pride in service and uniform. Smoking/buying cigarettes in public in uniform is akin to glue-sniffing in uniform, or being drunk in uniform - not illegal, but very definitely bad for the public image of the service

Sniffing glue? Have you been? Smoking in public I can just about get that you'd have a debatable beef. But going into a shop to buy something? Maybe he was buying them for his mother.

Get back on the medication, Bro.

[Out Of Trim]

If Trim Stab worked in an Off Licence..

He'd get beaten up about twice a week with his outspoken views; which, are none of his damned business!

:ugh:

[wg13_dummy]

Trim Stab, have you ever visited this planet? Or do you find that you get punched in the face for no reason a lot?


I too was wondering whether the article was a bit of a **** stirring band wagoneering session. It wouldn't surprise me if it were true but in this day and age one never knows. Oh so simple to whip up the plebs in to a bit of a frenzy.


BTW, the RAF would never have an issue buying fags or booze in uniform cos most wouldn't associate it with a branch of the Armed Forces......:E

[airpolice]

Right then..........

I know it's from 2003, and I know it's a Cop not a soldier.

The version that I got, from a friend of the Cop involved, is that the cop in question had failed, in spectacular fashion, to embrace the concept of the "Village Bobby" being required to cultivate "Local Policing by Consent" as an alternative to a brute force and dictatorial style.

Such was the friction between this Cop, who liked to consider it very much as "His" patch, and some of the locals, that the shopkeeper found a lawful excuse, after some digging, for the staff to be able to stick it to him. The fact that they waited for him to get to the front of the queue before refusing with an audience, made it so much better. The speed and prominence with which it made the national press also suggests a bit of Malice Aforethought.

PC falls foul of law on sausage rolls | UK news | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2003/dec/31/martinwainwright)


I'm just wondering if the current story also has a bit more to it...........


Taken from the Lincolnshire Echo site:-

A Police officer today told of his embarrassment when staff at a village shop refused to serve him a sausage roll.

Counter staff at the Co-op store in Nettleham, near Lincoln, turned PC Dougie Brown away after he tried to buy the snack.

When he asked why, he was told in front of stunned customers that it would breach licensing laws.

Staff had been instructed to comply with section 178 of the Licensing Act 1964, which forbids the serving of "food or drink" to officers in uniform.

PC Brown said he understood why the staff had refused to serve him but was still shocked by the incident.

"Technically they were within the law and I accept they were quite entitled to do what they did," he said. "But what they did was embarrassing to me and unhelpful to my role in the community.

"It also goes against the spirit of this law, which was originally enacted to deal with drunken policemen 150 years ago - that's hardly relevant in today's society."

A spokesman for Lincolnshire Police said the incident had only occurred because the store where PC Brown attempted to buy the snack was a licensed premises.

"Lincolnshire Police respect the policy of the Lincoln Co-operative Society. However, we do encourage our officers to interact with their local communities," he said.

"One way of doing this is for our employees to take refreshments in the area where they work, visiting local shops and businesses in the process.

"Constable Brown was very embarrassed at finding himself in this situation at the head of quite a substantial queue in the shop. We have spoken to the local Co-operative Society and are working towards resolving the apparent conflict between their needs and ours, in an amicable way."

Lincoln Co-operative Society chief executive Kevin Cooke said he completely condoned the actions of his staff.

"The staff took the correct action - they have undergone a course of training in relation to the licensing act," he said.

But Mr Cooke said he had "every sympathy" with PC Brown and the society would work with the police to ensure the incident would not happen again.

"My understanding of the law is that we can serve food to an on-duty policeman if we have permission from a superior officer," he said.

"We hope to get such authority so that this kind of incident simply won't happen in future.

"The act is due for review and has become an anachronism. It is nonsensical that we cannot serve food to police officers."

Read more: Shop Staff Refuse to Serve Police Officer. - General - Visordown (http://www.visordown.com/forum/general/shop-staff-refuse-to-serve-police-officer/98682.html#ixzz3HCWoPwLz)

[Compass Call]

Trim Stab

Get a life.
It's people like you that make me ashamed to be British.
My father will be turning in his grave having fought in a war to give the likes of you freedom only to have you abuse it.

CC

[Willard Whyte]

Why was a soldier in uniform trying to buy cigarettes in the first place? Service people should have pride in service and uniform. Smoking/buying cigarettes in public in uniform is akin to glue-sniffing in uniform, or being drunk in uniform - not illegal, but very definitely bad for the public image of the services. The only place that it should be acceptable to smoke in uniform is when out of public view - e.g. in the mess or, when off duty on overseas ops - though I would prefer that to be banned too.

If (god forbid) I ever had to work in an off-licence or tobacconist, I would refuse to serve anybody in a uniform representing a public service too (i.e. police, military), and I would give them a good earful too about representing their uniform.

Tw@. Seriously, you are a tw@.

[Rhino power]

RE: Trim Stab's, erm, 'contribution'... DO NOT FEED THE TROLL!

-RP

[Trim Stab]

Can't believe you lot think it ok to smoke in public in uniform. I suppose you think chewing gum in uniform, hands in pockets in uniform etc are all acceptable?

If you are wearing uniform in public, you represent the standards of the service, not your own grubby low-life personal standards, whatever they may be.

And yes, I do tell that to any service person I see smoking in public in uniform. And no, I don't get anybody trying to punch me - they just stub out their fag.

[Stanwell]

.
At the risk of feeding the troll...


Please just go away. Cret1n.

[dctyke]

I'm surprised it has not been mentioned that the army has relaxed it's rules on visible tattoo's. Due to low recruitment they will now take on recruits with tattoo's on their neck and hands, will look lovely outside Buck House :ugh:

[Laarbruch72]

Trim, nobody has suggested that the serviceman was smoking, he was buying cigarettes. Clearly not the same thing. I never smoked in uniform in public but I certainly bought cigarettes while in uniform, in fact I did so nearly every day of my 22.

As an aside, I was refused alcohol in one or two off licences when in uniform, for exactly the same reasons as this case, i.e. a misunderstanding of licensing law. It happens. I didn't go to the press, I went to another off licence.
People don't half get their knickers in a twist over nothing these days.

[Whenurhappy]

I'm surprised it has not been mentioned that the army has relaxed it's rules on visible tattoo's. Due to low recruitment they will now take on recruits with tattoo's on their neck and hands, will look lovely outside Buck House

No, the Army hasn't changed the rules. It was a suggestion from Capita to boost the number, but as far as I am aware, the Army hasn't accepted this suggestion.

[downsizer]

WUH

I'm pretty sure they have, almost 100% certain I read a din stating the standards had been changed and were now more liberal.

[Krystal n chips]

" If you are wearing uniform in public, you represent the standards of the service, not your own grubby low-life personal standards, whatever they may be

It's possibly just as well you, and your BP, never encountered those, in a different era I admit, wearing the M.U dress code....several options were available, non of which quite conformed with the expectations of those whose uniform was always immaculate.

You would, like those who were blissfully unaware, that when working on primary structure and bits of aircraft that rarely saw daylight once constructed, the perceived "grubby low life personal standards" of appearance had no relevance to the standards being imposed by the same low life in the course of their work.....been freely ignored.

You missed a golden opportunity however to " introduce yourself" about 8 months ago, on the M5 heading North just after Strensham services....a group of Para's broken down on the hard shoulder, several of whom were smoking.

Now that meeting would have been entertaining to watch, and listen to.

[Hydromet]

OK, settle down everyone. Smoke if you've got 'em.

[Typhoon93]

Why was a soldier in uniform trying to buy cigarettes in the first place? Service people should have pride in service and uniform. Smoking/buying cigarettes in public in uniform is akin to glue-sniffing in uniform, or being drunk in uniform - not illegal, but very definitely bad for the public image of the services. The only place that it should be acceptable to smoke in uniform is when out of public view - e.g. in the mess or, when off duty on overseas ops - though I would prefer that to be banned too.

If (god forbid) I ever had to work in an off-licence or tobacconist, I would refuse to serve anybody in a uniform representing a public service too (i.e. police, military), and I would give them a good earful too about representing their uniform.

The same people you preach to have more than likely been to war and been shot at just to protect your right to free speech. Remember that.

[ExRAFRadar]

Personally I thing anyone in any sort of uniform should not be served anything. Ever.

When out of uniform they should also be made to wear signs around their necks with the words "My other clothes are a uniform"

And then not served.

[Typhoon93]

not your own grubby low-life personal standards, whatever they may be.

FFS. How much more offensive can you possibly be?!

Why are smokers inferior to you? Or more to the point, what makes you so superior to a smoker?

If they were smoking a joint, then I could understand your point - drug abuse is not tolerated in any of the services. But it's a 'straight' cigarette!!! Get off that high horse, man. If somebody wants to poison their body with a legal substance, let them. It's not hurting you if they are outside.

[reds & greens]

At this point, I think the Troll must be sat back, happily counting the bites....

[Capetonian]

Storm in an ashtray. A small mistake was made by an employee of a shop, no real harm was done, and an apology, admittedly a pretty pathetic one was issued.

I believe, and I may be wrong as I've never needed to know, that it is illegal to serve alcohol to members of the armed forces in uniform. From there, it is only a small step to think that it may be illegal to serve them cigarettes, however irrational that may seem.

Much as I dislike smoking, people should be allowed to do so in their private space and time. I would not expect to see uniformed members of the services smoking in public, but if they do, I'm not going to let it worry me.

[teeteringhead]

Trim, nobody has suggested that the serviceman was smoking, he was buying cigarettes. Clearly not the same thing. At the risk of Troll-feeding.....

........ so - according to TrimStab - if buying ciggies is equivalent to smoking them in public, jolly lucky he wasn't buying condoms!!:eek::eek::eek:

[Tankertrashnav]

I'm surprised it has not been mentioned that the army has relaxed it's rules on visible tattoo's. Due to low recruitment they will now take on recruits with tattoo's on their neck and hands, will look lovely outside Buck House

Maybe so, dctyke. PPRuNe, however, has not relaxed its rules on the correct use of apostrophes. :=

(TTN, resident pedant ;))

[MPN11]

What a joyous thread to read on a Sunday morning. :cool:

My thanks to all those contributors who have put a big smile on my face :ok:

[Mechta]

Perhaps servicemen should ask for 'tipped singles' (individual cigarettes), as this works for schoolchildren when in uniform. :E

[Finningley Boy]

Can't believe you lot think it ok to smoke in public in uniform. I suppose you think chewing gum in uniform, hands in pockets in uniform etc are all acceptable?

If you are wearing uniform in public, you represent the standards of the service, not your own grubby low-life personal standards, whatever they may be.

And yes, I do tell that to any service person I see smoking in public in uniform. And no, I don't get anybody trying to punch me - they just stub out their fag.

Ok Trim Stab, old plum,

I happen to have good reason to believe that smoking and drinking in uniform, as well as out, are part and parcel of what being in the Forces is about. Every time I look at photos of Soldiers fighting in Normandy, every other one, it seems, has a fag hanging out of his mouth (cigarette that is!) so if it was good if enough for them in the heat of Battle its good enough for today's Government sponsored warriors!;)

FB:)

[spekesoftly]

http://www.authentichistory.com/1939-1945/1-war/1-39-41/Winston_Churchill_In_Uniform.jpg

[Finningley Boy]

Spekesoftly,

That chap in your photo is smoking, and in uniform too, disgraceful! Where on earth did you find such an image, the airman in it should be on a charge!:=

FB:)

[goudie]

'Sergeant, take that man's name!'

Snap FB

[spekesoftly]

Sgt Wilson's reply: "I don't need to take his name Sir, I know it" ;)

[Finningley Boy]

Really Wilson, when I ask you to take a man's I expect you to write it down so you know you've taken it.:)

[Stanwell]

I also wonder what Pte Fraser would make of all this.

[Stanwell]

.
On the subject of name taking, (pardon the thread-drift), in a former life as a Parks & Wildlife ranger, I was counselling a miscreant who was inclined to be a bit difficult.

A Senior Ranger, who happened to be passing by (an ex-Bobby, BTW) rushed up and said to him...
"I'll have you know, sir, I'm empowered to take your name!"

I'm still laughing about that one.
.

[Out Of Trim]

Trim stab sounds like a park ranger.. Dressed in a Gestapo coat and Jack Boots.

Keep Off The Grass! Or you vill be shot..

No Smoking in Uniform! It is verboten.. And I vill tell you off..

Pick up your dog's mess! You grubby little man..


Jeez, first rate plonker. :=

[nimbev]

In my day one was discouraged from going off base in uniform due to the IRA threat so not much chance of the general public seeing chaps in uniform smoking.

Mind you, one was positively encouraged to go to the scruffs bar at any time of day or night after a 9 hour sortie plus 4 hours brief/debrief, have a round ie 4 or 5 pints and then drive home. And as there were only 5 married quarters on base, we all jollied off onto the public roads. Double standards? Different culture in those days I know.

[Vendee]

I've got embarrassing memories of going into a shop to buy some fags in Ripley, Derbyshire while manning a Green Goddess during the 1977 Fireman's strike. I was in my RAF uniform complete with yellow painted tin hat.

Everyone turned round, looked at me, started clapping and parted to let me get to the front of the queue. Quite a humbling moment.

p.s. trim stab..... get a life. :ugh:

[barnstormer1968]

I am now ashamed to be on the side than won WW2 !
I've seen far too many photos and film clips of dying aircrew being given a cigarette by medics as they are carried away from their battle damaged Bomber on a stretcher after landing.

What a disgrace to our country and no wonder no one wanted to give these men and their filthy habits a memorial for several decades !

:)

[gr4techie]

My guess is that on the other side of the pond, a member of the armed forces would probably go to the head of the queue.

It does make me feel ashamed when people I've worked with try to pull this stunt, thinking they deserve better treatment or a reduction in price from a family owned small business. Despite the fact they've stayed in the UK working behind a desk.

There's plenty of other occupations who contribute just as much to society, who we could not do without. Yet they don't walk around in uniform just to get special treatment.

I never ask for discount because I don't think I've done anything special. I'd feel embarrassed to cash-in on the bravery of others.

[Shack37]

It does make me feel ashamed when people I've worked with try to pull this stunt, thinking they deserve better treatment or a reduction in price from a family owned small business. Despite the fact they've stayed in the UK working behind a desk.
There's plenty of other occupations who contribute just
as much to society, who we could not do without. Yet they don't walk around in uniform just to get special treatment.
I never ask for discount because
I don't think I've done anything special. I'd feel embarrassed to cash-in on the bravery of others.


Ah, come on techie, he only wanted to buy a packet of cigarettes.;)

[Tankertrashnav]

Shack, I'm guessing your ;) indicates you know what techie is on about, and I'd like to back him up.

What he's talking about is the habit that is creeping over from across the pond. The American public, racked with guilt for the despicable way they treated their guys returning from Vietnam have swung the other way, so that now every clerk in the Pentagon who's never set foot out of the US gets a round of applause and thanked for his or her service.

I've said this on here before, and got roundly condemned for it, but I am right behind gr4techie on this one. Serving in this country's armed forces should not make you feel entitled to any special treatment -I except of course those returning from Afghanistan, etc, minus bits of themselves, who are entitled to all the respect and practical help we can give them. But as for the rest of us expecting to be applauded and expecting discounts for just having done our jobs and been reasonably well paid for it - well count me out.

[Kitbag]

TTN, hear, hear. Absolutely right

[Dundiggin']

You are talking a crock of sh@t. What makes you think he was going to smoke in uniform with his hat on and outside the confines of a building or vehicle?? You are a first class prat....What has.... 'where he was going to smoke the cigarettes' got to do with you? Mind your own f@cking business and wind your measly neck in you supercilious git! :E:E:E:E:E:E

[ACW418]

DD,

No say it as it really is - don't dress it up in diplomatic language!

I totally agree with you.

ACW

[Herod]

It does make me feel ashamed when people I've worked with try to pull this stunt, thinking they deserve better treatment or a reduction in price from a family owned small business. Despite the fact they've stayed in the UK working behind a desk.

There's plenty of other occupations who contribute just as much to society, who we could not do without. Yet they don't walk around in uniform just to get special treatment.

I never ask for discount because I don't think I've done anything special. I'd feel embarrassed to cash-in on the bravery of others.

Since you've taken my original post and turned it to your own ends, I'll make it clearer. The serviceman concerned was not trying to get to the head of the line, nor was he asking for a discount. He was trying to BUY a packet of cigarettes, which is perfectly legal. My point was that in some other countries not only would he have been served, but probably served with a smile. I'm not saying we should give preferential treatment to every serviceman, nor treat them as gods; just be normally courteous. OK, the young lady made a mistake; not the end of the world.

[PingDit]

Trim Stab
Location: Heart of Darkness


Says it all really.

[Finningley Boy]

What he's talking about is the habit that is creeping over from across the pond. The American public, racked with guilt for the despicable way they treated their guys returning from Vietnam have swung the other way, so that now every clerk in the Pentagon who's never set foot out of the US gets a round of applause and thanked for his or her service.

Bang on Target Tankertrash,

I was stationed at Ramstein in the early eighties and the mawkish uber apologetic sentiment was embarrassingly cringe making. Broadcast on AFN, actors and so on were recruited to make a farrago of "feel proud of yourselves after all" type ads. And you're spot on, it contrasted acutely so with the scenes and sentiment reflected whenever the Vietnam era was the subject.

FB:)

[HTB]

FB

I spent 4 years at Ramstein and recollect that the majority of those AFN radio vignettes were about Fraud, Waste and Abuse of public (US Govt) money and facilities (amd invariably the military police were made to look foolish); the other recurring theme was advice from the US (Army or Air Force?) Master Fitness Trainer - Maj Hank Schwader - about drinking water during and after taking physical eaxercise:ok:

Mister B

[chevvron]

The guy was only buying fags; what proof is there they were for him and not his girlfriend/wife etc?
I'm reminded of an occurrence in nearby Woking a few years ago.
Serviceman goes to check in to a pre-booked room in the Holiday Inn (yes I'm naming it, nasty aren't I) and is refused a room by the new Asian owners as he was in military uniform.
Didn't get too many headlines at the time (during a Labour government) I wonder why?
PS. I knew a guy (over 65) who worked there a couple of days per week for a bit of extra money to supplement his pension. He said the new owners wanted to charge him and his workmates £8 per day to park his car there whilst at work and this was a substantial portion of the wages they gave him.
Another guy I knew was a bus driver operating one man buses out of Uxbridge. If anyone in uniform got on his bus, whether regular forces or cadets, he would refuse to take a fare off them saying 'your money's no good on this bus mate, now go and sit down'. I even encountered this when I was an ATC Cadet, the conductress saying she had no change for a pound note for a 20p fare.

[Finningley Boy]

HTB,

I do recall a rather more straight forward ad for re-enlisting, the 3 Rs;
Revaluate
Reconsider
Re-enlist!

Then there was a particularly public groveller with various, largely middle-class looking people, back home stateside dancing down/up the steps of what appeared to be a City Hall. I can't replicate the musical manuscript notes here, but I can the lyrics.

To a real hand clappy tune, the ditty went;

We'd just like to thank you for co-mi-ng through(thru) you're do-ing us a world of good, and so on. I can also remember close ups punctuating the song to various every day folk giving a thumbs up to camera delivering a more personal thanks to the United States Military.

That's what has stayed with me since 1983, but there was more, and yes, if there was a queue at the PX/BX or Commissary, regardless of length if somebody in uniform joined the distant far end or immediately behind the next person to be served who simply wasn't in uniform (your's truly and a chum in the R.A.O.C. on one specific occasion) then they got propelled to the till ahead of all! They weren't rushing off to risk life and limb or nuttin, just doing a bit of shopping before, after their shift or during the lunch break.

FB:)

[Load Toad]

These 'stories' crop up about once every 6 months and are sent viral by Britain First on FB & such and often include a Muslim for good measure - or at least a reference to Islam.

[P6 Driver]

Cracking wind-up from "Trim Stab"! Took a few good bites there.

(I'd rather think that than the fact that she might be serious...)

[Shaft109]

Just flicking through a booklet about the proposed Bomber Command memorial in Lincolnshire - every other pic all the lads have a fag on, Just strange how times change.

[The Oberon]

Shaft, just thinking the same myself but later. For the first couple of terms at Locking,1961, we could only go off camp in No.1s, even when going on leave. No problems then in having a beer, coffee and lighting up in a pub or café. Not a good idea on the street though.

[Tankertrashnav]

Not a good idea on the street though.

And that's the point. On the street was a no-no, but there was never anything wrong with smoking in uniform indoors, but now that is illegal it presents a problem to smokers.

A few years back I saw a naval Lt Cdr in uniform standing hatless on the street outside a pub in Oxford smoking. I know the law meant he had to go outside for a fag but it just looked wrong. He was wearing a sword (I think he'd been to a wedding in one of the colleges) which made it look worse for some reason.

[airborne_artist]

33 1/3 years ago I was doing post-Selection training on the live ranges at Brecon.

We came to a mid-morning break, and the DS said "15 minutes break lads, you may smoke".

There were about 30 of us. No-one lit up. The times they were a-changing.

[teeteringhead]

For the first couple of terms at Locking,1961, we could only go off camp in No.1s, even when going on leave. No problems then in having a beer, coffee and lighting up in a pub or café. Reminds me of an incident many years ago, when young Teeters was training at Ternhill.

A number of us - well a car load - had ventured as far south as Shrewsbury on a Saturday, for some lunchtime drinking - as you do.

One of our number was a re-roling sqn ldr, a suitable bad influence on young lads comme moi.

As we were in the pub, a couple of (Cosford?) apprentices in uniform appeared, and were drinking adjacent to a couple of (very) hairy rockers and their young ladies (sic). Said rockers gave apprentices a hard time - particularly over their shorn locks, and it looked at one stage as if it might all get physical.

Whereupon, our sqn ldr mentor commented:

"If we were a decent regiment, we'd join those lads and all get stuck in!" :eek:

Fortunately not necessary, and in fact the rockers soon departed - sans young ladies - who eventually left with the apprentices - looking as if their afternoon entertainment would be more than just playing Scrabble :E - result!