Best way of becoming a pilot or test pilot in RAAF?

[Nighthawk56]

I was wondering what would be the best way of becoming a military pilot in Australia, i'm 18 and soon will be finishing the HSC probably with a not so great ATAR(probably around 50-70) and recently became attached to flying during the wrong time when I should be studying. I was wondering what quickest options I have left of getting to what my goal which is a pilot, but preferably a test pilot. I also do General maths 2, which may not help as all, but topped the class and also doing fine in physics, which may show you that i'm motivated for this goal and my english is not the best(just close to passing). Could anyone help me out here? Thanks.

[juliet]

I take it you've read the pages of advice in the thread dedicated to this topic at the top of the page?

And the pages of advice in the mil thread?

You've then taken all that advice, figured out whats applicable, and come up with a plan on how to become a mil pilot?

Or you're just expecting to be spoon fed?

[Ultralights]

if your near Sydney, there is a school at Bankstown run by ex RAAF pilots, and do a CRAM course, which is basically a RAAF pre selection course. worth talking to.

[triadic]

1) Join the RAAF as a pilot,
2) Dux your pilot course
Good luck

[pilotchute]

Nighthawk,

You will have to do an advanced mathematics course after you finish HSC. General maths just isn't good enough. Hundreds of people applying will have done the harder maths therefore knocking you out. Your ATAR also sounds pretty low. You must remember that you have to get above a certain score for each individual subject too.

[junior.VH-LFA]

Frankly with your results, you won't get selected, unless you do bridging courses or go to a civlian university.

As has been stated, two unit advanced maths is the bare minimum requirement, as well as band three's in physics and English. The minimum ATAR to enter the Academy now is 75.

Becoming a test pilot is something that will come much further down the track after being in an operational squadron, should you be deemed suitable by your CO. If that is a path you seriously wanted to take, four unit maths would be suitable, as well as university mathematics.

The fact that you're not aware of the general education requirements says to me that you aren't motivated at all.

Just being honest.

[pilotchute]

Junior,

As you know he doesn't have to be accepted to ADFA to be a pilot. As you have stated though his marks aren't up to scratch even for DE. Most of the military pilots I have met had ATARS in the 90's.

[50 50]

General maths knocks you out straight away. Did you check the minimum requirements?
Quickest and easiest thing for you to do is repeat year 12 and study for the marks you need. There really isn't much other option.

[junior.VH-LFA]

pilotchute, you're absolutley right mate, although as a general rule most people under the age of 21 who don't display exceptional potential are usually politely suggested to attend the Academy... one of my biggest regrets was falling for that.

[Squawk7700]

Does the RAAF actually have "test" pilots?

[truthinbeer]

Nighthawk, your location other than generic Australia could help the advice you are given.
If your marks are not up to scratch you could further your studies with a Pre Tertiary Studies Certificate to improve your ATAR. In NSW this link is https://www.tafensw.edu.au/howex/servlet/Course?Command=GetCourse&CourseNo=9048. Each state has it's own variation and some universities run their own pre-admission courses. Generally they are 2 years part time or 1 year full time.

Meanwhile you need to make some lifestyle choices and pull your socks up if this is your dream. You can do it if you really want to. Good luck.

[junior.VH-LFA]

S7700, yes they do. Almost every year a handful of pilots are sent to ETPS or one of the US Test Pilot Schools. Upon graduation most (if not all) are posted to ARDU in SA to test new procedures, equipment or a variety of other test items. It's extremley competitive and highly sought after.

[lilflyboy262...2]

Also, wouldn't talking to a recruiter be a good idea? They would be able to give you up-to-date info rather than hearsay that you read on an internet forum.
I know that one of the boys posting here is ex-mil but even then, things change!

[pilotchute]

Unfortunately talking to a recruiter can be difficult. All recruitment centres in Oz are civilian run and talking to uniformed staff that know anything of what your talking about can be near impossible.

Saying that the education requirements for pilot have changed little in 20 years. I suspect it's still pretty high.

[Nighthawk56]

I'm from Sydney, I already read the requirements and plan on doing bridging course for mathematics 2 unit and extension along with an engineering degree at some civilian university, would these help by any chance? . I could get in either by ADFA or Direct entry, but not sure which one would increase my chances of getting in.

[trashie]

In addition to getting your maths physics and english standards to an acceptable level you also need to get some indication as to whether you have the aptitude and co-ordination to pass the course. There is still a significant failure rate during the course as there is little tolerance if you fall behind or fail a test. You need to be totally focused and willing to do the hard yards.

I believe there are some tests available that can determine whether you may have the aptitude. I think Sim Jet in Brisbane has some tests that might give an idea before you commit to this course.

I once sat on a selection board where the Psych did not approve of a particular applicant as his high aptitude rating was not reflected in his average school results. I pointed out that the applicant had spent all his time as a cadet and had got his pilots licence while still at school. He obviously had the desire but his school results had suffered.

Naturally I recommended his recruitment and he passed his course.

[Nighthawk56]

I believe I can do very well for the eye co-ordination test as for the aptitude test do they test any mathematics 2 unit by any chance? And my results are around the B range.

[Judd]

It's extremley competitive and highly sought after.


If you want to use the RAAF as a cheap way of learning to fly at no expense to you, and in later years leave for an airline job then forget hoping to become test pilot. You will be lucky to get 25 hours a month and most of the time you will be sitting behind a desk drawing graphs and get so bored you will waste still more time reading Pprune. :E

[junior.VH-LFA]

I'd suggest if that's the only reason you're joining the RAAF, then you shouldn't join...

[50 50]

I would think that now RAAF fighter assets are being deployed in a combat role for the first time in living memory (don't shout me down it's just a generalisation) that competition for entry will be extremely fierce.

That said the RAAF can afford to be even more selective. It's recommended that a student begin preparing for RAAF selection in year 10 in order to meet requirements upon finishing high school. An enormous ask for a child, but they are the ones that are ultimately successful.

[Hempy]

Educational requirements for selection..in fact selection itself..is the easy part!!

[Nighthawk56]

If I just want to become a Test Pilot in the RAAF are there any alternative ways? e.g Direct entry or try going through ADFA method(Bsci cut off was 72)

And no, i'm not using RAAF as a cheap way of flying, I have money. It's just I want be involved more with the military than commercial airlines.

[gerry111]

Now come on, Jack! At least it wasn't in 'textise'... :(

[Centaurus]

and do a CRAM course, which is basically a RAAF pre selection course. worth talking to.

How things have changed and got more complicated:ugh: I designed my own RAAF pre-selection course by turning up at the interview in a new suit and log book evidence of 8 hours dual in a Tiger Moth at Bankstown. In those days only needed Fourth Year education (Intermediate certificate) Even then 800 applied and 90 got in and 37 graduated 15 months later.

[Inspired]

There is no way you are going to get selected at your education standards i know people who did 4 unit maths and got 90+ atar that got selected. The selection process is so tough these days that if you are allergic to wheat you will be cut (had a friend cut for that because the ration packs they give you are made of wheat).

[Nighthawk56]

I believe I have no medical condition at all (never broke a bone) and I think my eye co-ordination should be superb, just should focus on my studies. Are there any pilots that never got an ATAR of 90+ and still made it somehow because they were persistent?

[Username here]

Me mate...

I barely passed high school...

If it's what you want never give up.

Ever.

Junior LFA are you a pilot in Defence?

[Ascend Charlie]

Wanna be a test pilot, eh? Seen those movies where the heroic pilot wrestles with the controls of a new-fangled machine that has already killed 3 test pilots, and then miraculously discovers what is inherently wrong with the design, falls in love with the designer and marries him.

There are a couple of types of test flying - maintenance test, where you take a machine after maintenance and run it through its paces to make sure they got everything done right, or spend hours on tracking and balancing a blade, or doing compass swings. Boring as b@t5h1t.

Then there is developmental test flying, either on a new type of airframe, or working on an older type but adding things to it. This one requires you to have already done at least one flying tour on a type of aircraft, then be selected for the course (maybe 2 per year are selected) and spend a year in US Navy Test Pilot School, survive that (up to 2 die on this course each year) and then come back to ARDU or whatever it is called now.

A long career path. No direct entry to test flying - they need pilots with experience and skill before going on the course.

Hate to prick your bubble, but my brother is one of the very few to get through USNTPS without holding a degree.

[Traffic_Is_Er_Was]

As an admitted failed applicant from many years ago, do you really need such high educational results once in the everyday RAAF? Back when I had a go you just needed pretty good passes in the math sciences to be in the running. Now it seems you need BSc after your name on the application form. The equipment in the inventory hasn't changed that much over the time. I realise it is one way of sorting the wheat from the chaff, but is the guy with a Masters any better a fighter pilot than the guy who is just naturally good at it? There's a lot of guys poling 737's and 330's around in civvy street who's educational results would have ruled them out of the chance of flying the same gear in the RAAF.

[Username here]

Pilots course is a brutal affair, especially with the "gate" at BFTS now

How on earth do you know if, like you say below, that you have only passed flight screening?

managed to get myself on to flight screening and got the nod.

I hate scare-mongering about pilots course...Especially from the those yet to walk the path.... :ugh:

[junior.VH-LFA]

I would never profess I know it all, only ever what I've seen so far.

Education requirements are what they are, which is what I thougt the main point of discussion was...

Regardless, as I have obviously offended some of you, I'll withdraw my observations on my experience on pilots course so far. My apologies.

[Lookleft]

Don't let them get to you junior. There will always be someone disagreeing with your point of view. The civilised posters will just present an alternative, the more disagreeable will attack you personally. My advise is when they play the man and not the ball, don't apologise and don't hold back. Remember the rules of Fight Club (and of course the Pprune rules).:ok:

[pilotchute]

There has to be a cut off with regards to education. All airlines have minimums to reduce the amount of applicants. Some are negotiable and some aren't. RAAF education requirements are not negotiable. No amount of "eagerness" will change them.

You either meet the mins or you don't. Many applicants greatly exceed the mins.

You have to be realistic these days.

[Tiger35]

I suggest that you read Matt Hall's book - The Sky is Not the Limit, to get a really good idea about how hard to work at school, during pilot's course and after grad training.
Dedication and aptitude will get you the results at school and your best shot at RAAF Pilot Training and then a shot at elite jobs thereafter.

[Runaway Gun]

Put simply - if you cannot achieve at least the minimum marks in school subjects, then you have no chance of passing 2FTS. Regardless of whether you are a 'natural' or 'enthusiastic' pilot. There's a lot to be said for study techniques, as well as English, Physics, and Math, and the ability to learn under pressure. Put on a flying helmet and wind over that PT6A, and your brain reverts to mush pretty quickly.