Jaguars

[WH904]

I'm seeking some help with a project I'm tackling on the Jaguar. Does anyone know of any former Jaguar people and where I might be able to reach them? I'd really like to get some information on operations, handling, things like that.

Also, I'm on the hunt for photographs from the earlier days in the Jaguar's career, especially the prototypes, early production aircraft and export machines.

If anyone has any pointers I'd be very grateful! :)

[Courtney Mil]

I have some old buddies. I'll see if I can get in touch.

[MAINJAFAD]

Alber Ratman is your man. He has been researching the development of the aircraft from the National archives at Kew and has been up to Warton to look at their archives. He is also an admin for the SEPECAT Jaguar Appreciation Society page on Facebook which has a large number of Jaguar aircrew and Ground crew on it.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/174883289270119/

[1.3VStall]

BH - Ouch!

[NutLoose]

BomberH newt can tell you what it's like to eject from an almost serviceable Jaguar!!


Well at least he got some sensation of speed in the end.

[Bob Viking]

WH904.
I flew the beast, but at the end of its life rather than the beginning. Alber Ratman is definitely your man from an engineering standpoint.
BV

[MAINJAFAD]

Bob

Alber has dug up the development and trials reports which highlight some of the problems with the jet all the way up to its first ten years of service (there are documents at Kew that cover up to 1983/4). Paints the very good reasons why the French canned the Jaguar M.

[Bob Viking]

Only two years before the UK though!
BV

[Rhino power]

Bob, MAINJAFAD is referring to the Jaguar M, the naval version. Only one prototype was built. I'm guessing you're thinking of the last French AF versions which were retired in 2005?

-RP

[MAINJAFAD]

Of course there is a well known ex jag pilot on here in the shape of Mike Rondot

[Bob Viking]

My bad. RTFQ!
BV

[Typhoon93]

Wasn't ACM Jock Stirrup a Jag pilot in its early days?

[chevvron]

We had an OC Flying at Farnborough who, when posted to Boscombe Down, very soon became the first to do a 'Martin Baker' from a Jaguar.

[TyroPicard]

ISTR that newt is also the expert on wing strength in the context of architectural reorganisation...

[Alber Ratman]

Ian Hall's "Jaguar Boys" book has done the Ops side to death. Martin W Bowman's "Jaguar Tactical/strike/Everything" has done very similar. What is the project you are doing. I do have virtually every photo going from BAES heritage, Warton. If you are doing a book mind, you will have to get their permission to use them. I have scans of most of national archive files that are interesting including a lot of the JMC meeting notes (not the treasury ones mind, too much maths figures to be very interesting). Was looking at a Haynes technical book, but they have binned doing them. Too busy nowadays rebuilding a Jaguar. PM me.

[Alber Ratman]

Yes chevron, the OC flying who decided that the T Bird needed more high alpha testing with stores at altitude. As mentioned in Gp Capt Hall's book by a contributor who was on the JCU instructors conversion course, that goes on about the fact that at the time the aircraft wasn't cleared to drop anything at low level (which is backed by JMC notes around that time). Have only browsed that book in Jarrods, BV, as the publisher was going to send me a copy and hasn't yet. Coggers has the last chapter and mentions the 40Kg landing after the dropper feed failure. Sure the tanks were blown off that time, vague memories that it was RCS, but could be wrong?

[WH904]

Thanks very much for the helpful replies. I will PM accordingly in order to spare readers the details!:)

[Nige321]

Was looking at a Haynes technical book, but they have binned doing them

Ehh... They still seem to be doing lots of them?
They can't be selling many car manuals these days...:8
http://www.haynes.co.uk/wcsstore/HaynesPublishing/images/Bookjackets/150scans/H5287.jpg

[Bob Viking]

Alber.
It was a Kiwi but older than RCS. Much more pale if you know what I mean! And yes he did land without the drops. One of them washed up in Kent I think it was a few months later. Or maybe Lowestoft.
BV

[sharpend]

I flew Jaguars for 9 years!

[teeteringhead]

Wasn't ACM Jock Stirrup a Jag pilot in its early days? Indeed he was T93. Got his AFC after a nasty birdstrike whilst instructing on the OCU. Incapacitated stude in front seat IIRC, so couldn't jump out - landed safely.

Later commanded 2 Sqn (Jags) at Laarbruch.

Oh - and he's MRAF now - we haven't had one of those for a while ....

[WH904]

Was looking at a Haynes technical book, but they have binned doing them

Can't say I'm surprised. Aviation books just don't sell. They never did all that well, but when a print run of maybe a couple of thousand or so is now seen as normal, you can see why it's no longer a viable proposition for the big companies. That good ol' internet has been pretty poisonous in some ways.

[NutLoose]

sharpend

I flew Jaguars for 9 years!



Lossie to Colt? :E

[X767]

Please Nutloose - give it a rest !

[NutLoose]

??? I was wondering about his postings, neither of which I would have relished for that long.

[Nige321]

Was looking at a Haynes technical book, but they have binned doing them

Well considering that the technical books and particularly the aircraft ones are one of Haynes big sellers I doubt they're binning them yet. Just looked at the Haynes site and there's many new ones coming... Swordfish, Lysander, Tornado...

[Alber Ratman]

Ian Blacks "Tornado" book has been out for ages. They had a cut back last year that was well reported with the business going back towards mainstream car manuals. The aviation editor was busy with half his department being made redundant at the time. I didn't progress any work on it afterwards as what was drafted at the time didn't fit any other style. I also didn't bother pushing again either. Busy doing other things at the moment anyway that take my time.. Like rebuilding a SEPECAT Jaguar GR1A. WH904 is right, not many authors make money out of aviation books. For the time it takes to research such and write, large profits don't exist.

[Alber Ratman]

Thanks BV


Think he was more scared of my drive back to Norwich from BZN after the return from Carpet 06. Remember the conversations with the Auth of the problem as I was on the other side of the hatch, then droppers were gone..

[Typhoon93]

Indeed he was T93. Got his AFC after a nasty birdstrike whilst instructing on the OCU. Incapacitated stude in front seat IIRC, so couldn't jump out - landed safely.

Later commanded 2 Sqn (Jags) at Laarbruch.

Oh - and he's MRAF now - we haven't had one of those for a while ....

I have a lot of respect for Jock. I respect anybody with power who does something good with it, and his actions as CDS made a difference for the guys on the ground in Afghan.

Has he retired now? I wasn't aware of his promotion to MRAF.

[Old-Duffer]

Not retired - he's a 'Marshal' and so (or should be) on half pay. BTW, he's also a Lord.


O-D