US Licence based on old UK PPL

[essele]

Hi,

I have a US PPL that was issued based on my UK PPL when I did some training in the US many years ago. Since then I got a UK (JAR) CPL and just recently converted it to an EASA one (what a bargain!)

The US details (below) specifically reference my original UK PPL.

Physically I still have my UK (lifetime) PPL, although I have never been entirely sure of the validity of it once the CPL was issued ... and when converting to EASA it was pretty clear that you only converted the higher level license and not anything less privileged.

So my questions are...

1. Can I still fly on the US license if I carry my original UK (lifetime) PPL with me?
2. Should I change the US license to refer to my new EASA license, and if yes, how do I do that? (Assuming I'm not in the US anytime soon!)

Many thanks,

Lee.


Certificate Information:
Certificate: PRIVATE PILOT(FOREIGN BASED)
Date of Issue: 8/28/1995

Ratings:
PRIVATE PILOT (Foreign Based)
AIRPLANE SINGLE ENGINE LAND

Limits:
ISSUED ON BASIS OF AND VALID ONLY WHEN ACCOMPANIED BY UNITED KINGDOM PILOT LICENSE NUMBER(S) NOPP/xxxxxxA/A.
ALL LIMITATIONS AND RESTRICTIONS ON THE UNITED KINGDOM PILOT LICENSE APPLY.
NOT VALID FOR AGRICULTURAL AIRCRAFT OPERATIONS.

[MarkerInbound]

1. You need to find out if your UK license is still valid. If it is, you're good to go.

2. There is a way to "reset" the 61.75 certificate from a JAR license to EASA without coming to the US. But to get a 61.75 based on your EASA license you would have to go through the whole procedure again, including the trip to the FSDO.

[Tay Cough]

Also interested as I had a UK CAA PPL issued in the early nineties which has a cardboard 61.75 based upon it. Licence number was PP/xxxxxxx/A.

I now hold an EASA ATPL licence number GBR.FCL.AT.xxxxxxx.A, where x is the same. My address is different but the CAA have what they need to connect the two. I also hold a newly issued CAA ATPL...

Do I have to start again from scratch or can I just pitch up and get a swap done?

[sherburn2LA]

The paper licenses went out a while ago. Unrestricted US got a free change by post. 61.75 we had to get revalidated by the CAA to get a new plastic one. the FAA bit was still free but CAA charge 40 odd quid and you still have to pitch up at a FSDO.
So you could still do that for your UK license I think but it would not do you much good since it is no longer valid for non EASA aircraft. In any case it the same procedure to get a new 61.75 based on your EASA license with the extra proviso that they will 'generously' see you at Gatwick instead of a FSDO. I guess a non US DPE could probably do it also.
After all that you will still need a BFR.

[BillieBob]

it is no longer valid for non EASA aircraft.Haven't you got that the wrong way round? The curse of the double negative!

[nick14]

It's changed in the states, you don't need to go to the FSDO anymore, just find an examiner give him $50 and he will issue a temporary airmen certificate and the FAA will post your card within 120 days.

As far as I am aware if your licence number has changed (including the letters) then you need to get you FAA cert changed. This can now be done by the CAA for a fee I believe if you visit them.

[Mach Jump]

Hi Lee.

As already stated above, your old cardboard FAA 'Piggyback' (61.75) Certificate is no longer valid.

You will have to go to CAA at Gatwick and get it updated to the new plastic Certificate, and have the number changed to your new EASA Licence number.

Then, so long as you have at least a Class II Medical, a valid Type/Class rating, and have completed a BFR with an FAA Instructor, you are, as they say across the water, 'good to go'.

On a more general note:

My understanding is that all the old Licences are still ICAO compliant, and as such are still valid (with an appropriate Medical and Class/Type Rating) for flight on non-EASA registered 'EASA' aircraft outside of EASA.

It follows then, that, so long as you already have the new plastic FAA 61.75 Certificate, it should also still be valid (with a valid BFR) on US registered aircraft, outside of EASA.

I'd welcome any thoughts on that!


MJ:ok:

[Mark 1]

Your UK lifetime PPL should still be valid so its only a matter of replacing the paper Airman Certificate for a plastic one for a $2 charge (https://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/certificate_replacement/).

It may be more convenient however to have it based on your EASA licence in which case you will have to rescind the old one and pay for a CAA licence validation (£45?) and optionally use the facility to get it done in person at Gatwick CAA/Belgrano.

Edit: It looks like you have to get a CAA validation either way, so you may as well get one issued based on your EASA licence.

[essele]

Thanks for all the input ... it sounds like something I just need to save for the next time I'm at Gatwick.


Cheers,


Lee.

[BEagle]

essele wrote:
ALL LIMITATIONS AND RESTRICTIONS ON THE UNITED KINGDOM PILOT LICENSE APPLY.

This is an important point! Since Apr 2014, UK (non-JAR/EASA) PPLs have an added restriction in that they may only be used within LAPL privileges for 'EASA aircraft' - that is, aircraft for which an EASA licence would otherwise be required.

However, as the LAPL is a sub-ICAO licence, it has no validity outside EASA nations.

The FAA has already refused to issue a 61.75 to a LAPL holder, so advice for anyone still holding a 61.75 based on a non-JAR/EASA PPL is that it is probably only valid for flying non-EASA aircraft (irrespective of the registration) in the US.

However, trying to get a straight answer out of the FAA is, even for the UK CAA, proving to be rather difficult.....

[chopperchappie]

Hi

I'm going to US for a week in Dec and would like to fly a few hours but don't want to (don't have time to) spend the next 2 months running around getting an FAA medical/license

Is there a quick way to get a FAA ticket based on my JAR PPL(H) / EASA Medical combo ?

Alternatively can I get a G-Reg R44 in Florida and fly that on my current ticket?

CC

[Whopity]

(non-JAR/EASA) PPLs have an added restriction in that they may only be used within LAPL privileges for 'EASA aircraft' - Surely that is an "Added Privilege" since the licence is not accepted by EASA within EASA States but, may now be used for a limited period with additional LAPL privileges!

How can EASA impose a limitation on a licence that falls outside their regulation, in an area where they have no influence and which complies fully with ICAO recomendations?

Is there a quick way to get a FAA ticket based on my JAR PPL(H) / EASA Medical combo ?
No, but if you complete SRG2110 (http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/SRG2110Issue01Final.pdf) and get your UK licence verified, you can probably get an FAA Restricted licence by December.
Alternatively can I get a G-Reg R44 in Florida and fly that on my current ticket?Not very likely.

[chopperchappie]

Hi Whopity

Thanks appreciate a positive response about what can be done!

Sorry for being thick but renumbered from what?

Does this apply to me if my license was issued initially prior to 2012? Or after 2012 (e.g. Does it not matter?)

My licence is JAR-FCL in the format UK/PP/34xxxxX/H

Is there somewhere that concisely explains how to get a FAA Restricted?
I did search the forums but just got loads of results.

CC

[Whopity]

Sorry for being thick but renumbered from what?
Your JAR licence is now an EASA licence. When you get to the 5 year reissue point, or have any licensing action carried out by the CAA, it will be reissued as a EASA licence with a slightly different number. This has resulted in pilots with FAA Restriucted Certificates having to have them changed. In your case you do not have a Restricted Certificate yet, but if you are going to get one, it would make sense to do so on the basis of a new EASA number rather that the existing JAA number! In either case you need the CAA to verify your licence so that the FAA can process your application at a FISDO in the USA. I should have referred you to form SRG 1160 (http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/SRG1160FFenabled1.pdf) not 2110. Either way, its raised the renumbering issue which could mean you have to repeat the process in the near future if you don't obtain an EASA licence before you make the application.

[chopperchappie]

I just did my LPC and they got me to fill in the EASA licence request so I'll wait until that comes through and apply then to FAA

Thanks for the explanation

CC

[chopperchappie]

Hi

I was reading through the process documents and it seems when all the paperwork is done you get a 120 day temporary certificate.

What happens after 120 days - I assume you get something more permanent in the post?

I just want to check I understand... That's JUST a validation of the JAA/EASA license right? It allows you to use the privilege of the EU license on a N-reg globally but doesn't act as a stand alone chit that can be used if the EU chit is not valid?

I also understand you can add a rating to the FAA (like a night rating) part but if you return to uk that's dubious if you can use that as the EU license doesn't have that rating.

Appreciate any pointers

CC

[chopperchappie]

For anyone that is interested...

Back in December/January (sorry it's been busy) I did get to the US and having filled in my various forms with the CAA and they sent my verified details to the FAA I got the letter from the FAA that they sent my letter of authenticity to the Orlando FAA FSDO office - all good.
At this point the wheels came off slightly.

When i tried to make an appointment to go into the Orlando FSDO they basicalally said they didn't do that anymore and provided me with a list of FAA Examiners to which they had "delegated" the task.
This confused me a bit, I didn't really know what "delegated" meant and some other cloudy questions (like do I need to find one examiner that does helis or can any examiner do)!!

Anyway I started sending emails and calling people and go no reply answerphones etc. - eventually got hold of a guy that told me to log into an online system and apply then met me at a shared office (like Regus) and checked my paperwork, then issued a "Temporary Airman Certificate" / permit on the spot.

When I showed this to the flight school that I took an R44 out with, they thought (but didn't verify with FAA) with such a permit I could just do about 5ish hours training and get my full US license (without first getting my fingerprints and US medical etc.) as I was legally entitled to fly an N reg in US.

Appreciate if anyone else has any experience of that route?

PS I'll try and remember to find the form numbers and site I had to log into etc. for anyone else that needs to do the same.

PPS when I got back I did get a plastic version through the post - I'll also check the validity etc, but from memory it was not 6m or 12m more like 5 years - best I check though !

CC

[chrisbl]

For the initial issue of a FAA certificate like an unrestricted private one you will need to go through the TSA approval process. You may not need a visa due to the small number of hours.

The same applies for a multi rating, I have an EASA MEP and still needed the TSA approval as well on top of my FAA Commercial and IR

[nick14]

That certainly is the way it is done now and potentially more flexible for the user.