US Reservist takes bullet for British Colonel

[ORAC]

Reservist took assassin's bullets for British colonel (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/defence/11039468/Reservist-took-assassins-bullets-for-British-colonel.html)

A British Army colonel's life was saved by a US soldier who jumped in front of an assassin's hail of bullets, it has been reported. The US Army reservist, who normally works for Apple, the Silicon Valley-based electronics company, was shot six times as an Afghan assailant opened fire on a group of high-ranking officers at a military training academy earlier this month, The Sunday Times said.

The reservist, who has not been named, used his body as a shield to literally "take a bullet" for the senior British officer, and was hit twice in the leg and once in the shoulder, with a further three rounds stopped by his bulletproof vest. Details of the act of heroism were revealed in an American casualty report, the newspaper said. It describes how the reservist returned fire with both his rifle and sidearm.

The attack by Mohammad Rafiqullah killed Major General Harold Greene, the deputy commanding general, Combined Security Transition Command-Afghanistan. Maj Gen Greene was the highest ranking US officer to be killed in hostilities since Lt Gen Timothy Joseph Maude was killed by a hijacked airliner that crashed into the Pentagon, on September 11, 2001. A similar ranking officer has not been killed overseas since the Vietnam War.

The attack took place during an outdoor briefing at the Marshal Fahim National Defence University, in Kabul, which also houses the British-run officer training academy known as "Sandhurst in the Sand". The Afghan ministry of defence described the attacker as “a terrorist wearing Afghan National Army uniform”.

Several other senior officers, including a German brigadier general and the Afghan commander of the training base, were among the 14 injured, which also included two Britons. Their injuries were said to be not life threatening.

The Ministry of Defence declined to comment.

[MPN11]

If validated, have an MoH I suspect.

But then that would highlight the deficiencies in the overall Security set-up, so make that a discreet Silver Star Medal (why do they call a star a medal?).

[pzu]

As he saved a 'British' life, should he be considered for a British Medal?

PZU - Out of Africa (Retired)

[NutLoose]

Or both....

[VH-UFO]

Is he eligible for the VC?

[Boudreaux Bob]

Right now I would settle for knowing this courageous fellow's name! Seems a small enough thing to do for a guy that is willing to die while protecting someone from a deadly close quarters attack!

[NutLoose]

There is a bit of a precedent for the silver star at least

Drum soldier who saved Polish officer tapped for Silver Star | Army Times | armytimes.com (http://www.armytimes.com/article/20130917/NEWS/309160041/Drum-soldier-who-saved-Polish-officer-tapped-Silver-Star)

[E L Whisty]

Soldiers who display such selfless valour still inspire me. It makes life worth living to know that there are such exemplary human beings.

As presented above, in the face of the enemy and, as I see it, satisfying all of the requirements, surely this is deserving of the highest military honour that our Sovereign lady might bestow.

Furthermore, getting off a few rounds at the bastard shows admirable skills!

VC, without a doubt in my book. MoH is up to our colonial cousins to decide:)

Politically, I cannot imagine any greater unifying scene than to see an American soldier awarded the highest British honour, For Valour.

(Spelling tests might have to be suspended!:E)

[barnstormer1968]

Conflict can bring such inspiring acts that seem almost incomprehensible to everyday people leading average lives.

Greater love hath no man...................

[glad rag]

I hope he makes a full recovery and has no lasting or debilitating effects from his wounds.

[West Coast]

IF said soldier is a US citizen, can he even be considered for the VC? A cursory search indicates no, but I stand to be corrected.

Now, if the soldier a Canadian who happened to enlist in the US army, possibly then?

[Wrathmonk]

The US unknown soldier from WW1 that lies at Arlington is a posthumous recepient of the Victoria Cross. That could class as precedence....

On 11 November 1921, the US unknown soldier was reciprocally awarded the Victoria Cross

Source: BBC News - The unknown soldier's journey from trench to tomb (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-11710660)

Not sure if the same was done with WW2/Korean unknowns.

[500N]

US soldiers have been awarded the VC before but when serving with Canadian forces. A long time ago though.

They can get the DFC as has occurred recently, so why not ?

[Boudreaux Bob]

Not that I trust Wiki...but it was quick and easy.



The Victoria Cross (VC) is the highest military decoration awarded for valour "in the face of the enemy" to members of the armed forces of various Commonwealth countries, and previous British Empire territories.[3]

I suppose when we broke the Lease with our Landlord back in the late 1700's we unknowingly frustrated any possibility of this Brave Soldier from receiving the VC.

The Law of Un-Intended Consequences strikes again!

[mikip]

This government has bent so many of its own laws and rules I don't why they can't bend another to give this very brave soldier the VC that is so well deserved

[Tankertrashnav]

Other than the many awards to Empire/Commonwealth recipients there has been a small number of instances of the Victoria Cross being awarded to foreign nationals. The one probably most familiar to the majority because of his depiction in the film Zulu is that awarded to Corporal F.C. Schiess of the Natal Native Contingent, a Swiss national, for his actions at Rorkes Drift in 1879. However Cpl Schiess was serving in a colonial unit of the British Army, as were the others I can trace.

I have not been able to trace any amendment to the original warrant which extends eligibilty for receipt of the award beyond members of British and Commonwealth (formerly Empire) armed forces, but this may have passed me by. I cannot find any reference to an amendment to the warrant which approved the award of the Victoria Cross to the US unknown soldier, but presumably a special case must have been made at the time.

This government has bent so many of its own laws and rules I don't why they can't bend another to give this very brave soldier the VC that is so well deserved

Understandable sentiment, but I dont think there is a case for "bending the rules". Far better to do it properly and amend the original warrant so as to include provision for the award to be given to foreign nationals serving in their own armed forces alongside those of the United Kingdom or the Commonwealth

[Thomas coupling]

This guy took 6 slugs: 2 in the leg, 1 in the hip and 3 into his bullet proof vest in the chest area!!!

More fuss should be made of this.

[TBM-Legend]

Crazy stuff really. A friend who was Australian FAC attached to USAF and seconded to an Army unit in Vietnam was written up for the Medal of Honor by his divisional sunray. This was passed to Australian HQ in Saigon for action and a recommendation for VC. He wound up with Silver Star and DFC .... Downgraded by both systems because he was a/ not a US serviceman and b/ he was not serving at the time with a Commonwealth service. The cracks are big I guess...

[Yellow Pen]

Given this took place within an Afghan army training facility would it be classified as an 'enemy' assault? Perhaps a George Cross might be forthcoming?

[Wrathmonk]

Perhaps a George Cross might be forthcoming?

For which there is solid precedent:

BBC News - Reis Leming: 1953 flood rescue airman gets Hunstanton honour (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-norfolk-21269277)

[Wander00]

WM - good "spot" I had forgotten that one - a very good precedent; but if that is OK why not VC as "in the face of the enemy.

[teeteringhead]

What about a QGC or MC???

VC might be a bit OTT......

[Tourist]

Yes VC would be a stretch.

What he did was merely astonishingly brave.

A quick read of VC citations would show that it requires total lunacy.

[Always a Sapper]

Whatever medal(s) are awarded and he most certainly deserves them, at the very least one would assume theres a barrel or two of the finest malt on the way to the lad courtesy of the Colonel.

[nutnurse]

As the BBC clip demonstrates, the GC is for valorous actions not in the face of the enemy. This soldier saved a British officer's life and should get the VC, regardless of foolishness about precedent. Simples!

[ORAC]

Authorised Foreign Military Decorations of the US Military

United Kingdom

Victoria Cross
Distinguished Service Order
Conspicuous Gallantry Cross
Distinguished Service Cross
Military Cross
Distinguished Flying Cross
Air Force Cross

[Tankertrashnav]

I disagree with nutnurse's statement. It is tempting to say - "Give him a VC", but The Victoria Cross is our highest award and is treated with the same reverence as is the Medal of Honor by the Americans. It has very stringent conditions for its award, and quite rightly so. If it were given out wholesale it would soon have no more cachet than the Iron Cross or the Croix de Guerre.

There are very good reasons why this very brave soldier should nevertheless not be awarded the VC. Although the assailant certainly had murderous intent, he probably could not be considered "the enemy" within the meaning of the original warrant. A good comparison is Northern Ireland, where Captain Nairac, who was murdered by the IRA, was awarded a posthumous George Cross, not the Victoria Cross, as the IRA were not considered "the enemy", strange as that may seem.

As I outlined above for the VC, the George Cross is restricted to UK nationals and those of commonwealth countries (previously colonies). You would therefore have to amend the warrant before you could award a George Cross to a foreign national, although of course that may be a good thing.

Certainly he otherwise seems to qualify under the terms of the warrant which state:

"It is ordained that the Cross shall be awarded for acts of the greatest heroism ... in circumstances of extreme danger..."

Not much doubt there, I would have thought!

[NutLoose]

Read my post 7 , that US soldier stepped in front off a Polish Officer and took the blast of a suicide bomber, he got the Silver Star.

The other one in NI was Michael Willetts who won the GC

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Willetts

TTN, see post 20 re a GC awarded to a US citizen.

[Tankertrashnav]

Good point Nutloose- then I assume that there must have been an amendment to the warrant which allowed for this award, something I dont have a record of. In that case I think there is a strong case for a recommendation for the George Cross, but not the Victoria Cross

[PhilipG]

If one country gives this serviceman one of its highest honours, what a precedent that sets for the other countries that had officers there?

[500N]

Depends on what the others did.

This guy not only got shot multiple times, he managed to return fire with both his rifle and his service pistol.
Sounds like a well rounded individual.

[Wander00]

Now if it had been a general he had protected..............................hat coat


(Seriously though, the guy done good, VERY good, and deserves something)

[Buster Hyman]

With respect, arguing over what medal he should get belittles what he's done to some extent. Someone as selfless as that wouldn't even enter the discussion.

(Sorry, I'll put the soap box away now)

[Wrathmonk]

Someone as selfless as that wouldn't even enter the discussion

I would hope you could say that about every single person who has been awarded a medal for gallantry - an individual who enters a discussion about what level medal they feel they personally deserve (or moans that they should have got a higher award than the one made) doesn't deserve one in the first place IMHO (regardless of what they did)!

But to suggest that arguing over what medal this particular individual deserves belittles what he is done is wrong (again, IMHO). Sometimes gallantry such as this needs a bit of a 'nudge' in the right direction to get the reward they justly deserve (and perhaps alert those journalists who peruse this site who have column inches to fill...) - I haven't read back through the thread on the campaign to knight Simon Weston (that I believe ended up in Jet Blast) to see if you made similar comments there...

What is really belittling, however, is that with the football season underway again here in UK the words hero and bravery will soon become so overused as to make them meaningless.....:ugh:

[Buster Hyman]

I'll save you the search time WM, I made no comments there because I haven't read that thread.

Anyway, to each their own I guess. Maybe I'll move on once we've sorted out where to hold the ceremony & what music the band will play... ;)

Having said that, your last point...well, don't get me started! :ok:

[Typhoon93]

I have no knowledge of medals and how they are awarded other than the Operational medals such as the Afghan medal or the Iraq medal for example, but this guy is definitely a hero.

[nutnurse]

Reis Leming was awarded a GM at Hunstanton not a GC. The point is to reward this reservist quickly or risk bringing the whole system into disrepute. The GC isn't on the US list of approved decorations. One lot of bureaucrats (e.g. UK MoD) nit-picking would lead to unacceptable delay. Two lots (i.e. including US DoD and/or DoA) would be a geometric progression towards infinity with nothing actually happening. I take the point about the VC. Surely, there can be no argument and should be no delay about awarding him the DSO? (And I don't consider it relevant whether or not the US or any other country awards him a decoration - in part, I suggest it's a matter of gratitude.) :D

[Boudreaux Bob]

This poor Lad came up a bit short for the VC.

He only took on 30 of the Taliban.


Hero Gurkha handed bravery medal by Queen said: 'I thought I was going to die... so I tried to kill as many as I could' | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1393355/Hero-Gurkha-handed-bravery-medal-Queen-said-I-thought-I-going-die--I-tried-kill-I-could.html)

[MPN11]

A fine distinction, perhaps, in Cpl Pun's case ... he did not deliberately place himself in danger. He had little choice but to fight, with everything he had at his disposal - which he did, heroically and with determination and skill.

[nutnurse]

Right then, the CGC it should be.