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fireflybob
10th Aug 2014, 17:08
What do you teach with respect to having a hand on the throttle during flight operations?

mad_jock
10th Aug 2014, 17:40
Well SEP when you don't have anything better to do with and your hand and not at what ever cruise power you want.

At work MSA is as good a point as any for me personally. But first stage of flap is used by others.

foxmoth
10th Aug 2014, 17:45
Always on T.O. to a safe height - i.e. Flap retraction height of at least 200' AGL, then recommended to put hands back on during climb, hands on during approach unless needed for other things such as flap.

mad_jock
10th Aug 2014, 18:10
its the definition of what's counted as climb and what's counted as approach which causes the controversy.

MSA on the way up and on the way down works for IFR for me but I am not upset if people don't. And then mention it after the 1st stage of flap.

Its the ppl side of things which the big debates start some say as soon as they join the circuit, others its acceptable to not have it on the down wind etc etc.

Above The Clouds
10th Aug 2014, 18:14
Put your hand on it when you need to use it.

Level Attitude
10th Aug 2014, 18:25
Put your hand on it when you need to use it.True enough but, to ensure it is there without thought, delay or mistake at the more critical times, "Hand on Throttle" below 300' during Take Off and Landing for Students and below 200' for Licence Holders is a good Rule of Thumb.

mad_jock
10th Aug 2014, 19:32
why have a hand on your knee doing nothing when there is a primary control vacant to put it on?

If your that weak wristed that you need two on the stick to control the plane you should be up for assessment as a disabled pilot.

MarcK
10th Aug 2014, 20:41
My wife's flight instructor put his hand on her knee.

mad_jock
10th Aug 2014, 20:44
that makes a change in my experience its usually the female students that are doing the touching and not in a sexual way.

foxmoth
11th Aug 2014, 05:07
Put your hand on it when you need to use it.

A bit too general IMHO, that would be interpreted by many as, open the throttle for T.O. - hand can come off, how many pilots with a decent level of experience have not flown an aircraft where the throttle would vibrate closed if you did that?

Above The Clouds
11th Aug 2014, 13:55
MJ
why have a hand on your knee doing nothing when there is a primary control vacant to put it on?

If your that weak wristed that you need two on the stick to control the plane you should be up for assessment as a disabled pilot.


Who said anything about having your hand on your knee or using two hands on the stick ?

One hand to fly, the other to operate any other controls, levers, switches etc. as required.

mad_jock
11th Aug 2014, 14:03
That's obvious.

Its the spare hand doing sod all I am on about. When there is a primary control to have it on.

Even if you don't actually move the thing.

riverrock83
11th Aug 2014, 14:30
TO / climb / Approach - required as there have been a fair number of cases of throttle springs failing or friction nuts not being tight enough, so full power isn't maintained. I normally have my hand there at rest when it isn't doing anything else. Provides a good reference point for me to move my hand without looking to other controls (all controls are nicely ergonomically different in the 'dog).

dobbin1
11th Aug 2014, 20:39
Hand on throttle for takeoff and climb out, otherwise only when required.

With some students the problem is keeping them away from the throttle during the cruise.

Big Pistons Forever
12th Aug 2014, 03:02
Hand on throttle for takeoff and climb out, otherwise only when required.

With some students the problem is keeping them away from the throttle during the cruise.

I agree with dobbin on this one.

BigGrecian
12th Aug 2014, 12:33
Its the spare hand doing sod all I am on about. When there is a primary control to have it on.

What's wrong with two hands on the yoke if the throttle is set with friction and you are manoeuvring?

Genghis the Engineer
12th Aug 2014, 12:38
How many manoeuvres do you know that should never require any power adjustment?

I just tried to list them, started with shallow turns in the cruise, then ran out.

G

Above The Clouds
12th Aug 2014, 12:45
GTE
How many manoeuvres do you know that should never require any power adjustment?

I just tried to list them, started with shallow turns in the cruise, then ran out.


Depends on aircraft type, but they are likely outside the scope of this thread.

sapperkenno
12th Aug 2014, 13:22
I know a few FAA manoeuvres where you don't alter the power setting, but we don't teach such things under EASA, as flying a rectangular pattern (adjusting for wind to maintain a rectangular track), turning around a point (maintaining an even radius and adjusting for wind) and flying S-turns along a road, aren't seen as necessary lessons and a good skill base to develop in pilots.

Much better sticking to the dated 1940s RAF Air Exercises, and giving students a headache learning a massive pre-landing checklist that includes checking for items not even fitted to their airframe as they pootle downwind.

TheOddOne
12th Aug 2014, 17:41
What's wrong with two hands on the yoke if the throttle is set with friction and you are manoeuvring?

Just about everything!

If I had my way I'd take a hacksaw to the inner halves of the yoke on PA28s and 100 series Cessnas. If you need both hands to flare the a/c then you're not able to control the a/c properly as you should have one hand on the throttle. (Arrow 4's excepted, I suppose, yuk!)

TOO

TheOddOne
12th Aug 2014, 17:52
and flying S-turns along a road, aren't seen as necessary lessons and a good skill base to develop in pilots.

Sounds like super-whizzo fun!

After exercise 15 from the 'dated' syllabus, I like to choose a day with plenty of small Cu about and get Bloggs to 'play' around them. Topping entertainment, oodles of confidence-building, nobody ever pranged a kite colliding with the sky, then back for Tiffin.

Toodle pip

TOO

sapperkenno
12th Aug 2014, 18:46
Also a fan of cloud surfing. Quite hard to judge 1500m horizontally and 1000' vertically at times though. ;-)

ctrl
13th Aug 2014, 12:25
Is it not "clear of clouds" below 3000 feet where you fly?

hwatson
13th Aug 2014, 14:16
In my experience if left hand not otherwise occupied trim wheel is a good other place to put it to enable minor adjustments

BigGrecian
13th Aug 2014, 15:38
In my experience if left hand not otherwise occupied trim wheel is a good other place to put it to enable minor adjustments

Are you serious?

Cows getting bigger
13th Aug 2014, 16:15
Wot I was taught:

At all times when at full power or idle.
At all times on the ground unless brakes applied.
During final approach.


I'm sure there are other times but......

sapperkenno
13th Aug 2014, 18:20
Not many fluffy clouds around below 3000' this time of year.
Wot he sed ^^^ seems like a good answer.

downwind24
16th Aug 2014, 18:22
I always teach hand on the throttle below 1000'. Generally take off and landing. Had a student from another school that needed me to pull the power on him, on final and on take off, 8 or 9 times to make him put his hand on the throttle lever.

He had been taught, at a previous school, to never touch the throttle unless he was moving it !! He also pulled the mixture twice on me downwind, in my opinion because his hand wasn't familiar with the controls.

glendalegoon
17th Aug 2014, 01:56
simply put, if you will need to use the throttle to adjust something soon, keep your hand upon it.

on takeoff until you reach V1 (transports).

on takeoff to make sure the throttle does not creep back in a light plane and there is no doubt you will continue the takeoff. (no need to abort/reject).


holding your hand on the throttle in really rough air on takeoff MIGHT make you grab something and pull it the wrong way, so use caution.

on landing approach, your hand really needs to be on the throttle at all times, esp in rough air (see above for caution though) as you may need to add power in a big hurry.


You should always be able to fly the plane with one hand on the wheel one on the throttle, except in extreme circumstance.

condor17
24th Aug 2014, 21:44
Glendalegoon , teach the studes to PUSH the throt[s] forward on t/o . On our bumpy grass , or any turb from our hills or trees ; holding with the G force will close the throt[s]..... get them to imagine pushing 4 throtts..
On the approach our trees and hills soon get their '' hand on throt , hand on stick '' especially when they need full power 2 seconds ago .

TheOddOne ... love your idea of sawing off inner part of yoke ... spamcans into instant stick and rudder machines ......... even better in these days... what a wonderful way of getting the cheapest way to train Airbus pilots !

atb condor.