RNHF Sea Fury wheels up at Culdrose

[devonianflyer]

Reports are that the RNHF Sea Fury suffered an inflight loss of power and then during the subsequent forced landing ended up on its belly towards the end of the days flying display

Pilot walked away unharmed, no word on the airframe damage yet!

Hats off to the pilot for a job well done in making a good result from a bad situation! 👍

[NutLoose]

Glad he is ok and hopefully it's ok.

[Vitesse]

Pics on the news show him landing on the runway and the gear collapsing. Glad he's ok.

Edit. Forgot to mention engine was smoking.

[Wander00]

Sad for the airframe, but delighted pilot OK

[NutLoose]

UPDATE: witnesses describe "amazing flying" of pilot after a plane crashed near end of RNAS Culdrose Air Day | West Briton (http://www.westbriton.co.uk/BREAKING-NEWS-Plane-crashes-near-end-RNAS/story-22046371-detail/story.html)

Film here

Sea Fury Completes Emergency Landing at Air Show | Forces TV (http://forces.tv/95144845)

[The Flying Stool]

I'm quite surprised at how little coverage this is getting. If this had happened at Duxford etc we'd have several pages of posts by now. Does anybody know the status of VR930?

[ditchvisitor]

Saw it at Benson families day last week, awesome aircraft. I thought it had an issue then as the engine was mega smokey as it taxied in!

[MPN11]

I recall G-FURY making a mess of my approach at Waddo ... overheated motor after a long pre-departure hold at display location [Somewhere near Grimbsy] apparently, leading to a very large air brake at the front when it seized..

All crashes are bad, but 'classics' are worse.

Curiously, Spenser Flack and I were in adjacent wards at Nocton Hall [for unrelated issues] shortly afterwards. I chose not to mention the subject, or indeed my role in getting him onto a stretcher.

[Wander00]

Appears to have been brilliantly handled by the pilot, as one would expect, but whilst he avoided thousands of spectators, no mention of avoiding 2 primary schools a hospital and an old peoples' home. Press must be having an "off" day............... But so, so pleased pilot OK. Hope aircraft is repairable, again.

[SFCC]

The only important factor here is that the driver got out. Many of his ilk have not been so lucky with Sea Fury accidents (Charlie Hillard and Paul Morgan to mention but two fairly recent ones)

Well done Sir.

[rightbank]

BBC teletext is reporting a Sea Fury crash at the air day at Culdrose. The report fortunately says the pilot walked away unhurt. Any more info?

[BN2A]

BBC News - Aircraft crashes on to runway at Royal Navy Air Day (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-28594569)

:ok:

[DaveReidUK]

The RNHF hasn't had much luck with its Sea Furies ...

[Tankertrashnav]

but OAP homes abound. It is Cornwall after-all.

Including chez TTN, from where I had been watching the display through the binocs (£16, and a bloody long queue to get in? You must be joking ;)) I was in fact driving into Helston around 5pm and could see the Sea Fury doing its display as I drove in. Only heard about what had happened when I watched the BBC SW news at 6.30. Anyway the pilot is fine, which is the main thing, and in my totally inexpert opinion the aircraft looks repairable.

Bit of thread drift, but I enjoyed the show. Pleased that 558 made it again, but the best bit for me was the Canberra and the pair of Hunters - blue note distinctly audible even from a couple of miles away. Also enjoyed the Meteor and Vampire, and the B25 was a nice addition. Oh, and for once the notorious Culdrose Air Day weather actually stayed ok.

[Nige321]

watch?v=x_sf9OK8P6k

[NutLoose]

Blimey this is an eye opener, superbly done

RNHF Sea Fury T.20 Crash Landing - Culdrose Air Day 2014 - YouTube

[bakseetblatherer]

BZ to Chris, Fury was in trouble before landing, according to the announcer, and he got it safely on the deck sharpish.

[teeteringhead]

Superb bit of flying!!

Many of us would have been tempted to put the gear down earlier and (thanks to extra drag) missed the airfield. :eek:

An entirely appropriate BZ. :ok:

[treadigraph]

Video at this link (http://www.itv.com/news/westcountry/update/2014-07-31/sea-fury-makes-emergency-landing-at-culdrose/) shows the gear coming down earlier in the sequence, so presumably there was a problem there as well and he retracted then lowered it again. Neither leg appears to have locked down as in Nutty's link the left leg seems to swing inboard slightly just before touch down.

Great work Sir and so very glad you are in one piece.


This video shows what can happen when a Sea Fury lands with one unsafe...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jEs5xKXgm6w

[BOAC]

http://www.pprune.org/military-aviation/544715-rnhf-sea-fury-wheels-up-culdrose.html

[Wander00]

absolutely brilliant flying: a humble "congratulations"

[LiveryMan]

Damn! I saw the sea fury performing at Farnborough this year. Beautiful bird, wonderful sound.
I hope the damage is not too severe and it can be restored to flight in short order.

[samfranklin]

Initial thoughts from yesterday are that he had an engine failure at altitude that lead to a drop in hydraulic pressure. As the lack of engine would mean his airspeed slowing, he did not want to create extra drag by dropping gear. When he does get near enough to drop gear, no hydraulic pressure means he has to gravity drop them. Left gear eventually locks, but right does not and then the rest you've seen in the video.

Some of the press have taken it a bit far with lines of 'avoiding thousands of spectators' (I don't think it was ever that close), but to get it down and avoid a fireball the pilot did well.

[Treble one]

If the RN do 'green endorsements' in their log books ( I don't know if they do or not), then I think the handling of this situation is worthy of one.

Top stuff sir.

[Evalu8ter]

From looking at it, the decision making behind this very successful forced landing is worthy of a Case Study in HF and flight safety courses. From the videos it looks like Chris traded energy for height, bought time, made the decision not to step overboard (lack height probably helped...) flew the aeroplane, thought about the gear, got her down and then, it seems, retracted the gear when he felt the RH leg go, mindful of the tendency to ground loop and nose over (hence JBs decision to jump years back with one leg stuck...). All with adrenaline running. Brilliant airmanship - BZ indeed!

[Valiantone]

MPN11

G-FURY displayed at Kirmington airport or Humberside as its still called, despite Humberside being abolished 20 odd years ago.

I wasn't there at the time but I lived up the road from it.

V1

[Wander00]

My guess it was one of a number of scenarios the pilot had thought through on the ground beforehand. If not, he must think blindingly quickly.

[WhiteOvies]

Glad to see Chris walk away from this after watching him display the Sea Fury at Yeovilton last weekend. He is one of the best pilots I have had the pleasure of serving with, BZ for dealing with an extremely difficult situation. Fingers crossed that the experienced maintainers at RNHF can put the Fury back in the air before too long.

[sharpend]

I remember many years ago a chum on my Sqn getting just a little too enthusiastic with dive bombing Filfla Rock (just off Malta) and both engines of this Canberra flamed out due to negative G. He glided back to Luqa airfield and had to hand pump the undercarriage down. The main wheels came down at about 10 feet and he held the nose up whilst still frantically pumping until the nose leg locked down. He got a good show for that and a b*llocking for flaming out the engines.

[Tankertrashnav]

A footnote to the Air Day itself. I commented earlier that Culdrose had been lucky with the weather, for once.

Surprise, surprise its been peeing down here since lunchtime, with vis down to a level that would have wiped out most of the flying display. Glad the luck went with them this time :ok:

[thing]

Superb flying, well done to the pilot.

[NutLoose]

I remember many years ago a chum on my Sqn getting just a little too enthusiastic with dive bombing Filfla Rock (just off Malta) and both engines of this Canberra flamed out due to negative G. He glided back to Luqa airfield and had to hand pump the undercarriage down. The main wheels came down at about 10 feet and he held the nose up whilst still frantically pumping until the nose leg locked down. He got a good show for that and a b*llocking for flaming out the engines.



Winkle Brown when flying the Gloster Jet out of the Farnborough had a flame out at altitude that wouldn't relight. He glided back to Farnborough, carried out a dead stick landing, rolled off the runway and back onto the parking slot he departed from... The Engineers seeing it arrive couldn't figure out why the engine was stone cold.

[Agaricus bisporus]

The tinwork and such is easily repairable given enough money but putting a Centaurus back together after whatever it was that broke plus the shock loading of the arrival is a massive task. Maybe the RN have spare engine(s)?
Bear in mind the Centaurus is a fabulously complex sleeve-valve requiring the most minute tolerances not a simple agricultural american style radial. Few people around with the skills to do that sort of work too I imagine.

Still, coulda been worse.

[India Four Two]

Bear in mind the Centaurus is a fabulously complex sleeve-valve requiring the most minute tolerances not a simple agricultural american style radial.

Then if necessary, put American radial in it, like they do at Reno ;)

[Tourist]

That would be a crime against humanity.

[Bengo]

It would also be an airworthiness nightmare.

N

[sp6]

I thought the Hercules/Centarus sleeve valve radials in de-tuned transport applications were very reliable, with 3000hr TBO. There must be specialist engineering support and that the sleeve valve system is a known quantity.

A large part of the Sea Fury appeal is the superb noise, and that the original, reliable engine is key.

[nimbev]

I thought the Hercules/Centarus sleeve valve radials in de-tuned transport applications were very reliable, with 3000hr TBO.With respect sp6, you obviously were never on Beverleys! Although to be fair I dont think they were de-tuned... that was probably the problem!

[aw ditor]

ISTR the Hercules 264 was derated in the Varsity Pilot Training role in that they knocked 100 rpm off the max. permissable. The engine was reliable in this role but the single engine' rate of climb at high weights on hot days was somewhat sixpence/half crown' if it was for real!

[BEagle]

Good to read that Chris' skilful handling has avoided major damage to the 'Fury and that it should be repairable:

Exemplary Airmanship Saves Sea Fury (http://www.fnht.co.uk/exemplary-airmanship-saves-sea-fury.html)

[sp6]

As a bit of a plane spotter geek, I took a look at the Sea Fury pilots notes and the emergency procedure for the undercarriage looks horribly complicated and not exactly what you want to be faffing with while maintaining 130kts and judging your approach.

Looking at the RPM control lever, it has an auto setting with a manual over-ride for high rpm. It doesn't mention any actions to do with the rpm with an engine failure, so I would imagine the prop goes high rpm with no options to manually select low to extend the glide. Any ideas? Now that we are allowed to play with the wobbly props on Tutors during a PFL, it does make a difference. Surely it would also make a huge difference to the glide of a big piston too?

[Tourist]

That's not a bad quote to put in your cv from winkle..

[FODPlod]

Speaking of Winkle:

Aviation legend 'Winkle' Brown delivers his own history (http://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/news-and-latest-activity/news/2014/august/04/140804-winkle-brown)

The Fleet Air Arm's most decorated Pilot delivered a lecture on Highlights of a life in Aviation at the Fleet Air Arm (FAA) Museum at Royal Naval Air Station (RNAS) Yeovilton.

Captain Eric Melrose ‘Winkle’ Brown CBE, DSC, AFC, KCVSA, PhD Hon FRAeS, RN at the age of 94 is a former test pilot who has flown in 487 different types of aircraft, more than anyone else in history and a record unlikely ever to be broken! Winkle Browns second world record is for the most aircraft carrier landings performed, 2407 in total!

On the night of 29 July over 400 people gathered beneath the Wings of Concord in the Museum to listen to who can only be described as a living legend in the world of aviation. Silence fell as Winkle Brown took to the podium next to a commissioned portrait of himself on loan to be hanged at RNAS Yeovilton...

[cornish-stormrider]

BZ to Chris,
A superbly handled emergency,
Ah well, it'll buff out.

[Wander00]

Wondered if there was any news yet on whether the aircraft is repairable and, if so, in what timescale?

[Madbob]

My thoughts too W00. Would RNHF ac be covered by hull insurance as the ac are all on the G register? (I appreciate that the Crown/MoD self-insure mil ac but am curious to know what the situation is here.)

Just glad that CG is not hurt and no spectators were injured.

MB

[Tyres O'Flaherty]

In answer to W00

''An investigation is currently underway to establish the cause of the incident and the Trust is working closely with the Royal Navy and military investigators to piece together what happened and get her repaired and flying again as soon as possible.

An early assessment of the damage by the specialists at Weald Aviation who maintain the Sea Fury T20 is that she is eminently repairable. “We have the specialists and the spares to rebuild her and get her back in the air again as soon as possible” said Tim Manna. “The offers of help from Fly Navy Heritage Ambassadors and Supporters have been incredible. A beautiful historic aircraft like the Sea Fury needs to be flying - and as soon as the investigation is complete we will be devoting all resources to repairing and restoring her to full serviceability again.”

[overstress]

Good to read that Chris' skilful handling has avoided major damage

He was taught well... :O

[Madbob]

Tyres O'F

Any news on how the investigation is proceeding? Have repairs begun and how long will they take?

MB

[oldgrubber]

Madbob,
I don't know about the repairs but it was loaded on a lorry outside 814 today. On its way home for some TLC I expect.

Cheers

[Tankertrashnav]

Passed my house this morning, on its way to somewhere in Essex, where Weald Aviation live, apparently. Be an eyecatcher on the M5, M4 and M25 throughout the day, I should think!

[FODPlod]

RN website: Outstanding support for Sea Fury recovery (http://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/news-and-latest-activity/news/2014/september/24/140924-sea-fury-recovery)

http://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/~/media/royal%20navy%20responsive/images/news/where%20we%20are/air%20stations/culdrose/140924%20sea%20fury%20recovery/sea%20fury%201.jpg?mh=447&mw=980&thn=0

[Hangarshuffle]

For future generations to enjoy. The RN are relatively pants at looking after these aircraft for flying purposes compared to the RAF. And there are reasons why that is so.
Just call it a day.

[Evalu8ter]

HS,
That's just a little harsh. The RNHF do not appear to have the same financial muscle as the BBMF, but are by no means alone in having incidents/accidents with Historic aircraft. BBMF effectively burnt out a Hurri at Wittering, TFC have had some misfortune over the years and the poor old Blenheim has been crashed twice...

The Firefly crash was tragic, and the report sad to read, but those lessons have been learnt. The Centaurus and Pegasus are rare beasts compared to Merlins and Griffons, with knowledge and spares in short supply. To argue that the T.20 should be in a museum is a little unkind; it has no real historical value as such, and the FAAM already has a FB11 in the collection. Ergo, for as long as possible, I think it's important that this aircraft is seen and heard in its natural environment and act as a valuable aid to converting the next generation of historic pilots to high performance tail-draggers.

[Valiantone]

Evalu8ter

The first Blenheim that crashed was not rebuilt to fly, it lingers at Duxford somewhere. The second one has been rebuilt after its landing accident.

It was due to fly earlier this month but hasn't yet.

And it now has a Blenheim Mk1 nose instead of the MkIV nose

V1

[Evalu8ter]

VOne apologies for the generalisation; I was at Dux when the first one came back on the lowloader and flew a formation sortie with the second. My point was that operating vintage aircraft is not without risk - regardless of the professionalism of the air and ground crew. Same could be said about certain front line aircraft at times over the past couple of decades....

BTW, I look forward to seeing the Mk1 in the air - soon I hear/hope?

[CharlieOneSix]

The episode of the BBC documentary series Close Calls on Camera featuring the emergency landing of the Sea Fury at RNAS Culdrose on 31 July will be transmitted on BBC One on Wednesday 29 October 2014 at 1145.

[Sloppy Link]

BBMF = Public funding
RNHF = RN + Trust funding
Army HAF = AAC/self funded

Shuffle......off and show some respect fort those that put a lot of time and effort to keep historic aircraft flying for the public to enjoy, your comments are plain rude.

[Lima Juliet]

Just to put the record straight...

BBMF are not fully funded by public monies. I, and many others, used to give time for FREE when Not Required for Duty (NRD). Also, we had a bit of sponsorship from various companies who would get their names on the back of the brochure. It is nothing like the Reds in public funding terms.

I do hope that Hangarshuffle was joshing - I have a lot of respect for the RNHF.

LJ :ok:

[Pheasant]

Leon,

AFAIK the BBMF is funded in the same was as HMS VICTORY and the National Army Museum. Each Service is permitted to fund one unit from public monies.

I am not sure your time was "free". Service personnel are funded 24hrs per day 7 days a week; Not Required for Duty is a bit different to not being paid. This is not to take away from the fact that you volunteered your time on a very worthwhile cause.

RNHF gets/got a small grant from the RN of about £240K pa, but this may have stopped. The CO of the unit is also now a serving aircrew officer.

[Just This Once...]

Service personnel are funded 24hrs per day 7 days a week; Not Required for Duty is a bit different to not being paid.

A flashback to days past?

Service personnel are no longer on a daily rate paid 7 days a week. We fell in line with UK and EU law quite some time ago and now receive an annual wage with part of our leave 'entitlement' established as a 'right'. Part of our pay comparator is against typical hours worked and, for the lower ranks, this is also compared against the minimum wage to ensure compliance.

I do remember the days when your statement held true, but we have moved on since then.

[mmitch]

The Lincolnshire Lancaster Association has contributed a fair sum to the BBMF over the years too.
mmitch.

[Pheasant]

JTO,

My statement still holds true (unless different for the RAF?). The way it is defined may have changed but I am not aware that Servicemen are paid an additional amount i.e. overtime. If my staff work more than their conditioned week, 40 hrs say, they get overtime. This overtime is double or triple at weekends. If my son does a weekend duty on his ship he doesn't get overtime or TOIL, nor does he when he deploys for 7 months.

[Lima Juliet]

Pheasnt

The military have been doing TOIL (Time Off In Lieu) for years. If you work late into the evening (say 2030hrs) then you won't be expected to pitch in for 0730hrs met brief. Likewise if you work a Saturday or Sunday, you may well be told not to report for duty on a Monday. Yes, they could order you to work 7 days a week - but if this happened week in, week out, without a very good reason we would not have much of a military left!!!

My BBMF time was a secondary duty (and a bloody good one as well!); it was commented on in my annual report just like the Mess Sec, OIC Underwater Basket Weaving and the Wednesday afternoon Station Golf Team players. I was not required for duty when I flew - ie. I was not sat in the QRA shed or instructing some poor sod in a Tornado. The only full-time aircrew on the BBMF at that time was the OC and a FTRS OpsO - the rest of us all gave our time for free. I was not paid for flying on the BBMF, I was not posted onto their strength and I was being paid for my primary duty as a Tornado instructor. The ground crew were full time (some Regular some Reserve). I seem to remember that we cost ~10-20% of the cost of the Reds and flew about 200% more air displays (this may be different now). :ok:

Anyway, back to the thread. It was a great shame about the Sea Fury - even with hindsight it was really bad luck and the pilot did a good job of putting her down as gently as he could on unlocked gear. I absolutely refute the previous poster's comments about the professionalism of the RNHF. I hope that the Fury is back up before too long (I did meet the CAA surveying team and they thought she was repairable - happy days! :ok:).

LJ

[mabmac]

Quote: Lt Cdr Christopher Gotke was awarded the Air Force Cross for his “extraordinary and instinctive flying skills” landing a historic Sea Fury T20 plane during a display after its engine failed.

BZ

[rvusa]

I am not decrying the skilful handling of this incident but wonder whether the AFC is the appropriate reward. There appeared to be no option other than to carry out a forced landing due to time/height constraints. The Wiki. definition is :- "an act or acts of valour, courage or devotion to duty whilst flying, though not in active operations against the enemy"
If not the AFC, then what?

[Wander00]

Congratulations - IMHO well deserved, and also recognition of those who keep the historic aircraft flying

[Madbob]

Well deserved.


Next question, have the insurers decided to cough up, and if so, when will the Sea Fury (and CG) be back on the display circuit?


MB

[flynavysomerset]

BZ Goatie, couldn't think of a more deserving recipient for a superb and skillful piece of flying.

FNS

[Jumping_Jack]

but wonder whether the AFC is the appropriate reward

Green Endorsement and a firm handshake? ;)

[son of brommers]

An observation from the un-initiated if I may and in no way am I questioning either pilot skill or the concept of an award:

Does the Airforce Cross cover all miltary aviation across all the services in the UK or is there an equivalent award in the Navy or Army for that matter?

BZ either way.

[Union Jack]

Green Endorsement and a firm handshake? - JJ

A big BZ indeed, but hopefully no big hug from First Sea Lord....:)

Does the Airforce Cross cover all miltary aviation across all the services in the UK or is there an equivalent award in the Navy or Army for that matter? - SOB

Yes, although I once heard that there was a move in the 1970s to have the award renamed the Air Service Cross to cover the point you raise but, unsurprisingly, it did not come to much.

Jack

[just another jocky]

@Madbob - at this weeks pre-display season symposium at Shrivenham, they said it wont fly this year.

Congratulations to the pilot concrened too - I heard his description of the accident at last years post-season symposium and it took a lot of skill to recover the a/c safely and with minimal damage.

[BEagle]

I'm looking forward to congratulating Chris at this year's FNHT supporters' day!

[Onceapilot]

JAJ,

Did he say why (apart from trying to save any damage) he chose to try to put the gear down at the last moment, rather than force-land wheels-up? Also, you can see the inboard gear doors are open during the approach.

OAP

[just another jocky]

OAP - sorry, I can't recall exactly what he said and wouldn't want to guess. I have the Bouchon Me109 engine failure description running round in my head atm and can't recall exactly the sequence of events.

[Onceapilot]

JAJ,

Do you mean the one in Denmark 18 months or so ago? There was some very good handling there, didn't try the low energy turn onto the runway and took the wheels up deadstick into the field with relatively little damage.:D

OAP

[Sleeve Wing]

>>>>There appeared to be no option other than to carry out a forced landing due to time/height constraints. The Wiki. definition is :- "an act or acts of valour, courage or devotion to duty whilst flying, though not in active operations against the enemy"<<<<

rvusa
If he'd decided just to save his skin when it was all going to worms, he probably had just enough time to bale out.
However, being a thoroughly briefed warbird pilot, he realised that there was a realistic possibility of saving a valuable aircraft that he obviously enjoyed, and was very competent, flying……..Take your choice from "valour" and "courage".

When the situation was falling into place and he recognised there was even a chance of getting back to CU, up came the gear and prop into Coarse, and set it up. Perhaps we could include "devotion to duty" now.

Closer in, he now realised there was even a possibility of pulling off a glide landing. Hence reselection of the gear when he was on short final.
The fact that, now, too late, the gear was only partially down made the latter part of the landing difficult. The enquiry will determine whether it was Low Hyd. P or, in fact, with the inner doors still down, an unexpected sequencing snag. Suffice it to say it had to be selected up, again, on landing, knowing that the Fury with one leg down is a killer.
Yes, I know, a lot of supposition but realistic.

But, yes, that definitely warrants an AFC in my book. A nearly textbook FLWOP from a
brave Officer. Congratulations, Chris.

[EyesFront]

I'm looking forward to congratulating Chris at this year's FNHT supporters' day!


He gave a fascinating and detailed account of the incident at last year's FNHT supporters' day. I'm sure there's a write-up somewhere but from what I remember he initially felt a vibration so initiated a precautionary landing but had no way of knowing that the aircraft was leaving smoke - though obvious to viewers on the ground. When the engine refused to provide power he considered baling out but took the option of retracting the gear to stretch the glide to the runway, popping the gear out at the last minute. He was only a couple of seconds away from the u/c locking down - so was unlucky - or very lucky, depending on your point of view!

[mmitch]

I think this gentleman's endorsement says it all.
Navy?s greatest aviator praises Sea Fury pilot for Culdrose emergency landing (http://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/news-and-latest-activity/news/2014/august/05/140805-culdrose-air-day-landing)
mmitch.

[Madbob]

Here is a link to the AAIB investigation. Does anyone have an update as to how the repairs are going?




https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCEQFjAAahUKEwj4iu-X7eHGAhUEaxQKHWKWCw4&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.gov.uk%2Faaib-reports%2Faaib-investigation-to-hawker-sea-fury-t-mk-20-g-rnhf&ei=9sqoVfi3LoTWUeKsrnA&usg=AFQjCNFgAf05t7CWpkVUijhPlu0mZc6g4A&bvm=bv.98197061,bs.1,d.ZGU




Is there a spare engine available?


MB

[Mick Strigg]

Madbob, repairs are going well, but there was no "spare" engine. The Fly Navy Heritage Trust has had to buy one in kit form from the USA at the huge cost of £200,000! So please donate through www.fnht.co.uk (http://www.fnht.co.uk) to get this aircraft back in the air next year.