ATPL ground exams vs CPL ground exams

[RAK67]

Hello All,

I'm 46 and tinkering with the idea of gaining my FI rating. I have to stress gaining this qualification is the limit of my professional aspirations and designed to keep me on my learning toes!

Bearing the above in mind, can you help me with the following questions:

1. In terms of academic content, how much greater material does the ATPL syllabus have over the CPL one?

2. CPL ground school locations (specialising in distance learning) look comparatively thin on the ground. Do people here have company names I should consider?

3. My other concern is (coming from a training company specialising in education/training under the watchful eye of dear old Ofsted) how do you work out the good from the bad??

Many thanks in advance!

[RichardH]

Hi RAK67

Funnily enough I had this very conversation about 3 weeks ago, when I was phoned for some advice. My first question to you is have you got your class 1 medical?

According to CAA Document 31 the following schools do CPL theory:- (Apologies if any missed)

Atlantic Flight Training - Coventry
Caledonian Advanced Pilot Training - Littlehampton
Cranfield Aviation Training School (CATS) - Luton
Ground Training Services - Bournemouth
ProPilot - Coventry

Do not select on cost basis only.

As most students would have only been at one school it is hard to get a subjective view on what they are like - but search the threads here. Have a look at a their websites then VISIT them and see what the facilities are like and get to chat to some of their students.

For somebody with your goals the CPL is all you need and should do. Though I think there are only 1 or 2 less exams the amount of material is significantly less. Eg in Met no climatology, Gen Nav no Polar charts or inertial nav, Flt Plan & Perf no MJRT/LRJT (jet) & fewer Jeppesen charts. Please note though CPL is less demanding than ATPL it will still require time, motivation, dedication & some ability.

All the best with your aspirations. Please PM for further advice if needed.

[paco]

The ATPL requires 650 hours of training and has about 40% more material than the CPL, which requires only 250, but Richard is quite right, you still need dedication!

For instructing you just need the knowledge, which means only passing the exams. You don't need the CPL licence.

[Genghis the Engineer]

I did CPL TK with CATS several years ago.

In theory there's a significant difference between the two, in reality they're pretty similar. We mostly practiced using ATPL practice papers, and the CAA papers I took at Gatwick weren't much difference to what I'd practiced on.

There are areas of the ATPL syllabus where they gave us the notes (and I still have them on the shelf - CATS notes were excellent then, and presumably are no less good now) but told us not to worry about it. It was maybe 10% of the total.

The biggest advantage was having to do a few less exams because of subjects being combined in CPL that were separate at ATPL.

A rather daft flaw in the whole system is that as I only did CPL, I didn't have to do IFR comms. But, holding a CPL, I was then exempt the TK exam for my IMCR [IR(R)]. Needless to say, like anybody else with any sense, I made sure I understood the material anyhow !


My appraisal of CATS (and I'm also a professional educator - specifically a qualified university lecturer, still in occasional practice) - superb notes, you're very much trusted however to sort your own study strategy, lots of helpful practice papers - although it's worth also subscribing to another commercial question bank: it's easy to get trapped into question spotting but they do try to get you to learn the material properly before going through lots of example questions. They are however extremely shambolic when it comes to organisation of the classroom periods, and everybody gets frustrated about that - although the actual teachers are generally pretty good with a lot of relevant professional experience. I'd be quite happy to recommend them again, with cautions.

[dn88]

My appraisal of CATS (and I'm also a professional educator - specifically a qualified university lecturer, still in occasional practice) - superb notes, you're very much trusted however to sort your own study strategy, lots of helpful practice papers - although it's worth also subscribing to another commercial question bank: it's easy to get trapped into question spotting but they do try to get you to learn the material properly before going through lots of example questions. They are however extremely shambolic when it comes to organisation of the classroom periods, and everybody gets frustrated about that - although the actual teachers are generally pretty good with a lot of relevant professional experience. I'd be quite happy to recommend them again, with cautions.

I think Genghis has hit the nail on the head. CATS will get you the "tick in the box" and their online notes in general are pretty good. I'm fairly sure that you'll also find them the cheapest and with enough time and dedication you'll easily pass the exams no matter which school you choose.

However, the classroom "brush up" weeks are a shambles. It's a shame as they've moved in to quite a nice modern facility near Luton airport, with on-site parking and cafe and quick access to the A505.

Also bear in mind that the "brush up" weeks are compulsory, and so if you're in a full-time job you may have to consider a chunk of annual leave one year to get them finished.

[RAK67]

A big thank you for all your responses.

Reference Class 1, I have just renewed my Class 2 and had a good chat with the Doc on what is involved getting it and feel comfortable i would. Obviously, I shan't invest @£2k in books, etc, until I hold it in my log book - just in case !

As to which exams to sit, clearly 40% more work for ATPL exams I shall never use makes their choice redundant. Sometimes there are upsides to getting older!

The company I end up choosing could be more difficult. i will definitely closely investigate the options. Like so many other areas of adult learning, it always amazes me how so many training companies are outside being benchmarked because they don't receive any form of funding.

I am not saying for a moment Oftsed is perfect but as a reference point in making an informed decision, they aren't normally that wide of the mark.

I certainly welcome feedback from any person who has used the above companies.

[lasseb]

Just a quick note
With the new easa rules you do not need cpl to gain an FI rating. But you will be limited to teach only for the LAPL and not for PPL.
The enterpitation of the rules by the local CAA where I live is that if you then take the CPL theory and exam you will automatically get rights to teach for the PPL also.

[RAK67]

I feel the LAPL will be as popular as the NPPL....