Now thats some barn find - Bf109

[N.HEALD]

This interesting, lets hope some get to fly again


Platinum Fighter Sales | Warbird and Classic Aircraft For Sale (http://www.platinumfighters.com/#!ha-1112-m1l/c12zi)

[NutLoose]

They are all the Battle of Britain film aircraft purchased after the film and stored in the US by the owner, 5 Spanish airforce Buchons (Merlin powered 109's) a twin seat Buchon, and a Spitfire.

See

http://www.platinumfighters.com/#!inventory/c15ed

[CoffmanStarter]

I guess some of the 5 will be here in this pic ... RAF Manston during the filming of TBoB Film in the 60's :eek:

http://i788.photobucket.com/albums/yy162/Captainwindsock/ManstonBattle.jpg

Excellent post NH :ok:

[500N]

Is it an original Spitfire ?

[Evalu8ter]

Yep - the Spit and P51 are original.

The Buchons are original too, don't forget...it's only when labelled Me109s that issues get complicated....

The twin sticker, with that provenance, looks like a gem....

[NutLoose]

Yup, more or less but repainted..... About the only one totally original is in the Imperial War Museum.

[500N]

Thank you.

I have read about the Buchons / ME 109 arguments in the past.

[NutLoose]

You will find his story fascinating and how he acquired them.

Movie Stunt Pilot: Wilson ?Connie? Edwards? | tomahawkfilms.com/blog (http://tomahawkfilms.com/blog/?p=3463)

[ShotOne]

If you want such an argument500N, just call it an ME rather than Bf 109

[Brian Abraham]

just call it an ME rather than Bf 109

So which is it? Bf or Me 109? (http://109lair.hobbyvista.com/articles/bf-me/bf-me.htm)

[500N]

Very interesting, thanks for posting.

[TorqueOfTheDevil]

It makes me chuckle to think that, by the time the Spanish retired the Buchon from service, the Lightning and Phantom had both been in service for 5 years and the F-111 and TSR2 prototypes were flying...but then I suppose the B-2 first flew while we still operated the Shackleton...

[Brian Abraham]

ShotOne appears to take some exception to the link I posted. To clear the air, all extant airframes bear the official "Bf 109" designation on their identification plates, including the final K-4 models, with the notable exception of aircraft either initially built or re-fitted by Erla Maschinenwerk at Leipzig, which sometimes bear the erroneous Me 109 stamping.

From the very earliest of days though the aircraft was referred to as the Me 109 in the aviation media. Perhaps the ME prefix was used in recognition of the designer, and the fact that all his designs prior to the Bf 108 were designated M-(insert number).

http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1939/1939-1-%20-%201556.html
http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1940/1940%20-%203013.html
www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1939/1939-1- - 0931.html

Seems like the last link you need to copy and paste, else it comes up with a 404 error.

[chuks]

If you find yourself in Madrid with some time to spare, go to Cuatro Vientos Airport and visit the Museo del Aire there. It's not very well marked, and the opening hours seem to be a bit irregular, but it's definitely worth a visit. It's just down the street to your right as you face the civil terminal, in a couple of old hangars.

They keep a lot of the old aircraft in flyable condition, flying them sometimes on weekends.

The collection includes Spanish-built copies of the Bf109 or Me109, depending, and also both an original and a Spanish-built copy of the Heinkel 111.

There's a Polikarpov I-16 Mosca/Rata among a lot of very interesting aircraft. That was an aircraft that matched the Messerschmitt in a fight, each type having different strengths, but superior German tactics, fighting in pairs, meant that the fascists generally prevailed.

There was an American mercenary pilot, Frank Glasgow Tinker, who became an ace flying the Polikarpov for the Republicans, when he shot down two German fighters, either Bf109s or Me109s. He couldn't tell the difference and I don't think he much cared, being an American and all ....

[hunterboy]

The F.I.O at Cuatro Vientos flies on the first Sunday of the month except in August when everyone disappears to the coast. Well worth a trip if you are in the country.

[ShotOne]

"Shot One appears to take exception..." Eh? On the contrary, aren't such trivial debates exactly what this forum us for?

[Onceapilot]

The 109 is still generally referred to as the Me109 (pronounced sounds like "May ein-hundert-noyn") in Germany, mainly I think, because the German wartime propaganda pushed the Willy Messerschmitt angle. As previously covered in this thread, the Bf/Me title is no mystery.:)

OAP

[Brian Abraham]

ShotOne, sorry if I took your PM as being a little terse. You're right about being what the forum is for though. See the AWACs thread and -80/135/707.

[Innominate]

At the risk of prolonging the Bf/Me debate, my understanding is that the 109 was a product of the Bayerische Flugzeugwerke - hence Bf - and in July 1938 the company was renamed Messerschmitt AG.


The company's designs up to the 162 were designated Bf and from the 163 onwards Me. Design work on the Me 163 seems to have started in early 1939, making it the first product of the renamed company.


As mentioned in an earlier post, the Luftwaffe evidently adopted "Me 109" possibly because it was easier to pronounce "May" than "Bay-Eff"!

[500N]

Inno

Did you read the links posted by others above.

Answers a lot of the questions.

[Brian Abraham]

Thrown into the mix to confuse is the Me-209 which held the speed record (the first, not the second, a different aircraft by the same name produced later), not broken until August 16, 1969 by American Darryl G. Greenamyer in a Bearcat. For international PR and bragging rights the hierarchy (Goebbels?) named it the Me-109R, to give the impression it was a version of the fighter.

When the 109 first arrived on the scene it was also referred to as the B.F.W. Messerschmitt 109. Advertising by the factory in the press also referred to the 108 as the B.F.W. Messerschmitt Taifun. When the designer himself refers to the Bf-109 as the Me-109 who is going to argue.

[skydiver69]

More to the point can PPRuNE members have a whip round and buy one of the aeroplanes and fix it up :cool: