RAF flying boot

[Pittsextra]

For no other reason than idle curiosity, what is the evolution of the RAF flying boot? Recently I have seen adverts from these guys:-


Haynes & Cann Boots - Airfield Equipment UK & Europe (http://www.airfieldequipment.co.uk/haynes-cann-boots/4583557117)


When did the 1965 variant get moved aside for the MK1 boot and is that still the current boot?

[Fox3WheresMyBanana]

I believe the heel profile was changed slightly after the crash of a Hawk at Valley in 1986, which I witnessed. It was found to be possible to inadvertently apply brake for certain boot sizes.

[Could be the last?]

H&C lost the contract to supply the MOD a few years ago. There were a number of reasons which included the unit cost at approx £250+ a pair, and the inability to produce a boot that could be used in various environs - my understanding was that they were given a number of opportunities to provide alternative boots but never produced the goods. The alternative solutions, although not perfect, met the requirements for a number of different flying zones, met the various DefStans and for the same price 3 pairs of Belleville could be procured!

[Guernsey Girl II]

Ah the Tan 65 Patt 'short" boots were the most prized bit of aircrew kit. Some kept wearing them till their toes poked through :cool:

[Sloppy Link]

Nah, we have boots made by YDS, seem OK but time will tell.

[HTB]

I thought this was going to be about a hybrid submarine/aircraft (das Boot)...

Here's what we used to wear in V-Force in the '70s, and I think we also wore this pattern boot during RN helo flying training in 1969/70 (along with Mk1/G cloth inner helmet combo. I don't recall when exactly we changed over to the streamlined versions (but some of the more...traditional, let's say...kept on wearing these ubtil they were forcibly taken from them).

http://rs867.pbsrc.com/albums/ab239/MisterB2/_351_zps9e5fde97.jpg~c200?t=1404887142

The upper portion could be cut off, leaving a shoe-like remnant, which would fool any Sov bloc citizens if you were attemting E & E...yeah, right...

Mister B

[Surplus]

HTB,

I got issued a set of those boots in 77, as they had none of my size left in the 'new' boots, the rest of the course got the the new ones and I was severely 'teased' about mine. The teasing stopped after Hagdyke and Moortrek, my feet remained dry and warm throughout, the rest - not so lucky, their feet looked like they had trenchfoot after a week.

[BEagle]

Didn't the boots, lightweight, tan come in with the Bulldog as the normal boots could get caught on the rudder pedal adjusters?

I was once in Cyprus waiting to fly the FunBus back to the UK, wearing the normal black boots which weren't ideal in the summer sun. Some staff officer asked me why I wasn't wearing the lightweight boots - and I told him the reason. Which was that our Sqn boss didn't like the colour, so we were ordered to wear black boots. Said staff chap got rather peeved "We don't spend time, money and effort developing clothing items only to have them rejected on some sartorial whim!", he told me. So I thought bugger it, I'll wear the comfier lightweight boots and pass on his comments to the Boss if he queries why I'm wearing them.

Which I did. There wasn't much you could say to that, was there Jim? :p

Didn't do much for my ACR, no doubt....:(

[CoffmanStarter]

1941 Irvin Boot :ok:

http://wing.chez-alice.fr/RAF/clothing/Flying_Boots_1941.jpg

I believe the straps were added when Ejector Seats appeared ... But I could be wrong :8

[Basil]

Wore the '65 pattern for walking (other than enforced) but the lack of grip was irritating. I liked the sewn in tongue which could keep water out - so long as you didn't step on thin ice with a water depth greater than boot height beneath it - right at the start of an exercise :{

[scorpion63]

"Ah the Tan 65 Patt 'short" boots were the most prized bit of aircrew kit. Some kept wearing them till their toes poked through"




Wore my light tan boots from late 70's to 2003 when they finally gave up the ghost and my toes poked through from grovelling around on concrete during turn rounds, most comfortable boots ever.

[India Four Two]

When I was in UBAS in the late 60s, our QFIs were the only ones with flying boots. The rest of us had to make do with standard black shoes, issued with our hairy blues.

A word of caution concerning the link to Airfield Equipment in the first post. Anyone tempted to buy from that site is advised to have a look at this post http://www.pprune.org/private-flying/476735-proviation-customer-care-problems-31.html#post8412319 and the 620 other posts on that thread, concerning the past history of the owner of Airfield Equipment!

[Wensleydale]

"our Sqn boss didn't like the colour"

A Stn Cdr at Waddington also stopped us wearing brown lightweight boots because of the colour. Stores were not too happy when we tried to hand back perfectly serviceable brown boots in exchange for black lightweight boots. He also insisted that AWACS rear crew wear the aircrew knife on flying suit - this after much work making the successful case not to wear one (they snagged on the seat and console table, damaged the seat cushions, and generally got in the way). Wonder if it was the same chap?

[Wensleydale]

"I believe the straps were added when Ejector Seats appeared ... But I could be wrong".


The straps were added before ejection seats. The boots had a tendency to fall off with parachute opening shock and the strap was fitted to counter this.

[Pontius Navigator]

1941 Irvin Boot :ok:

http://wing.chez-alice.fr/RAF/clothing/Flying_Boots_1941.jpg

I believe the straps were added when Ejector Seats appeared ... But I could be wrong :8
In 1961 some at ITS were issued with these. When they arrived at FTS they were replaced with the '51 pattern and the others were returned to South Cerney where they were 're-issued.

For some reason this was preferred rather than issuing a deficiency chit.

I sold my well used '65 pattern, 30 years old and my lightweights 40 years and hardly worn, on eBay.

[BEagle]

So why didn't you return them to clothing stores when you retired, PN?

To be honest, I'm astonished that any ex-RAF officer would admit to selling a pair of 30 year old boots on eBay - is there anything you won't sell? You'll be telling us you flogged off your long johns :yuk: next.....

[ACW418]

BEagle,

I suspect PN is a sort of Northener. Where there's muck there's brass tha knows.

ACW

[500N]

Better to go to someone who wants than land fill.

And heaps of people want good, old military gear, re-enactment societies.

Is it because they are boots ?

Should I throw out my 1940 - 60's British Para Smock
which doesn't fit ?

[beardy]

Are the long johns still for sale?

[Gemini Twin]

Lots of development in the early days leading up to and during WW I but Supermarine really got going with great advances between the wars... Oh I'm sorry your discussing the evolution of boots, RAF flying boots.

[P6 Driver]

In the late 70's a senior AAC chap decided that puttees were to be worn over the '65 pattern boot. The "Flying Puttee Regiment" was born at Detmold.

[Pittsextra]

Wow that seems incredible that the 65 boot lasted until circa '86 and changed to suit the Hawk and that boot lasted for another 20+ years before someone looked at the invoices and thought £250+ was a lot to be paying for a boot that was unchanged for two decades....


Then change to a generic US Belleville boot that is off the peg and presumably has none of the design features (Hawk heel profile) of the out going model.

[rolling20]

Beagle, my short sourjorn on the Bulldog saw us students wearing the tan desert boots for the use of. Being a fashion conscious 18 yr old, I knew that the black ones were far more trendy and fashionable. To boot, they would also look rather good with a pair of jeans at half mast for a trip to the local football stadium. Along with a service haircut one could really look the part on the North Bank. Alas my dreams were dashed, when the stores chappy told me all they had was tan. "Not so!" I cried ,"all our instructors wear black boots!" "Well they didn't get them here sonny,next!" Tan it was , I envied the Bosses boots from then on. Although the black service shoes did come in handy one evening for a bit of Town v Gown action. I still had those shoes up until about 2000, built to last.

[Basil]

Are the long johns still for sale?
The acrylan pile suits made great pyjamas but Heaven help you if you were unwise enough to keep them on for a bit of cross-country, even in cold weather.*

* Not Arctic - haven't done that yet ;)

[BEagle]

rolling20, any of my students who claimed to be ...a fashion conscious 18 yr old... would have been out on their ear toot sweet!

Students who were interested in beer, sports cars / bikes and fast women, well fine - those were the students we wanted. But not some mincing 'fashion conscious' kid keen on poncing about like some gay bar loiterer!

[Fox3WheresMyBanana]

You are forgetting, dear BEags, that Gay Bar loiterers are positively encouraged to join these days.

[blimey]

I believe the RAF boot attained a preeminence with the addition of a flap :}

[BEagle]

blimey wrote: I believe the RAF boot attained a pre-eminence with the addition of a flap.

This modification came about for Harrier pilots only. After a number of such 'bona mates' lost their boots whilst ejecting from their jets, it was found that this was caused by the boot laces having rotted.

The cause of the rotting was soon identified. As is well-known, all Harrier pilots have very small willies and as a result would often widdle over their boot laces, due to dimensional limitations.

So a flap was provided to protect the laces henceforth and the problem was resolved....:p

[rolling20]

Beagle,
ah yes we did laugh at the flares, roll neck sweaters and natty check jackets of the instructors. Not to mention dubious facial hair. That was after of course we had raced up and down the runway for a car to car transfer, taken a few star struck floozies back to the OMQ that we used as a base and drunk the bar dry. I was once complimented on my smart attire by a Boozed up Flt Lt @ Lossie, who promptly fell off his stool!

[oldmansquipper]

Yep..the p*ss flap story by BEagle is all true!!! Trust me.

As is the tale of the `Bona` who insisted on wearing his Special Trial Fit Gortex extreme cold weather boots in summer. For lesser mortals, it is of note that these trial boots had a Gortex `sock like` insert fitted and a nice `Gucci` Gortex label on the side....So you could distinguish the Bonas from the common erd, I guess.

Anyway, this chap then initiated an Air Incident because his feet were too hot (in summer):ugh: - F760 raised at vast expense..but then took matters in to his own hands and cut the insert out :rolleyes:

Oh, how we laughed

My `65s` are still going strong after about 30 years, fitted the old USAF zip system whilst on Flag - fantastic. :D

and finally..I relished the look on the `Bona Mates` faces when, during the SCSR sea drills, we started pre-employment training for Typhie jocks going to Warton.. Typhoon pilots have inflatable boots, with a visible inflation tube, as part of the full cover anti G system - which set them apart, of course, from mere mortals with p*ss flaps....;);)

[blimey]

oldmansquipper

Did a bonamate once shag your sister/wife? :cool:

[Stitchbitch]

Probably :8

Aircrew boot saga:
1965-Use on all aircraft ages ago-not in use now.
Various Gortex pro boots,etc - Use on all aircraft ages ago.
MK.1-Use on all aircraft-in use untill they fall apart.
Belleville -Use on all aircraft bar Hawk (poss Tucano)
YDS Hawk - Hawk only (can hurt TP feet)
YDS - Use on all aircraft bar Hawk

Strange but true - the Aussies on the last ETPS course had flying boots which were also issued to the rest of the Aus Def Force as combat boots. Why can't we do that (yes I know they have to survive an ejection, parachute landing,etc,but at the end of the day they are only a pairt of boots!!). :ugh: