Whats happening with Swissport at LGW?

[aergid]

Swissport getting it in the neck at LGW, anyone with local knowledge know whats going on?

[750XL]

On their knees at MAN too...

[Bigbluebroxi]

A disaster at both stations by all accounts after the merger/takeover.

[Bfs bloke]

Bfs is in a mess too after the takeover... Bring back Menzies :ugh:

[The96er]

Very little to do with Servisair takeover at LGW.

Actually due to internal changes, not related to Servisair at all.

Staff were not lost nor gained as result of Servisair.

Speculation seen on here is ridiculous sometimes


Care to elaborate ?

[TOWTEAMBASE]

The mess is at Swissport.......Servisair LGW are now aviator not Swissport, therefore the mess at LGW is not down to the Servisair buy out. They are just a shower of the brown stuff, end of. Think the guy who was steering the ship at LGW is now looking for employment elsewhere

[MaHell]

Swissport LGW a mess? It doesn´t come as a surprise for those who worked at ARN during the years Viking Airlines/Hellas, Hermes and other dogdy airlines operated LGW-ARN-Iraq (to, ISU or EBL), using ARN as transit station, due to restrictions UK-Iraq.
We never ever received telexes (LDM, PSM, PTM and above all - SOM) from LGW. Ringing LGW was always a farce "Really? OK, we vill send!". Usually nothing happened. Sometimes MVT, LDM, LDM, PTM - all of them with different pax figures arrived.
When flt arrived nobody O/B - F/D nor Cabin - had any idea how many pax was travelling to ARN or staying on to Iraq. "No, they didn´t tell us at LGW". Baggage to ARN was always mixed - sometimes behind - transit baggage to Iraq.
L/S LGW-ARN was always a joke. E.G it could show 500 kgs in a CPT and we could see about 100 bags.
Crew bags (Crew getting off at ARN) were stowed "anywhere". I once watched a F/O climbing over about 100 transit bags, desperately trying to find his Crew Bag behind transit bags to Iraq.
I wrote dozens of reports. Nothing ever happened.
Swissport LGW a mess? "Really?"

[MINIMUMGROUNDTIME]

no that wasn't the guy..

The man in question, came into Lgw last year to (in my opinion) attempt to change the business model to make it more profitable. But he failed, and unfortunately has managed to destroy not only our reputation, but also he is now damaging gatwicks reputation at the same time.

Bearing in mind everyone gatwick wants a second runway, the tales and wos of people waiting for their bags for two hours plus will not do gatwicks case any good for a second runway, and they will be anxious to ensure Swissport meet their obligations as a handling agent.

I believe now at least one contract has served 90 days notice, and I would imagine it won't stop there.

the men and women who work there on the frontline, do a fantastic job. Is it their fault the airlines demand as much as possible for as little money as possible?. My opinion is that unless you can adapt your business model, and stay In front then there's very little point in operating there in the first place. Profit margins are the talk of the day, service level agreements aren't.

Take a big airline for example, assuming they employ staff to over see the hagent, caterers, and cleaners etc, they will expect a high service. They will expect a decent clean, onetime bags, and catering regardless of the price. When one day the hagent delays a flight, the reps will be fighting hammer and tongs to defend their position, and to demand as to why the service is not being achieved. The pilots and crew may do the same thing, they will expect that all the bags will be loaded on the flight on time, they will expect a decent clean. When the third party suppliers fail, the pilots, crew, local airline staff are not happy. But go to the main office, speak to the accountant, talk to the procurement manager who is on commission for every £ he saves. The accountants are happy, the airline is making better margins... But crucially the SELF is happy as every year, the airlines have to compete with one another, and as a result keep their prices as low as possible.. Let's imagine it now, if you paid £100 one way for a flight to Malaga today, do you think they would be happy paying £200 next year? That's why the airlines can't put their prices up..

From what I understand at Lgw,Swissport we're attempting to be the biggest handling agent at gatwick in terms of market share. They were hoping, that by taking on lots of work over the last three years, they could see off competition. Then once gone slowly increase their prices. But due to the robustness of the business models of Menzies and to some extent servis air they failed. The only option was to buy out servis air, which backfired at gatwick, as they had to sell off servis air straight away.

As a dispatcher, (or now a flight supervisor) With over ten years experience at the airport,it's now fair to say anyone can do my job. So when companies do huge recruitment drives through agencies, prior experience is no longer needed. I'm just glad that when a captain asks me what his zfw is, or asks me a CG related question I can at least answer it without looking like a idiot. I feel sorry for those who are coming in, who just don't have the basic foundations that we all once had.

[JB007]

Swissport LGW not popular! (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-28508587)

Good weekend for overtime!

[STN Ramp Rat]

I don't see it getting better until the end of the season

[DespairingTraveller]

Out of interest (I'm holidaying out of LGW shortly), would I be right in thinking that this mess is also affecting outbound travellers with baggage missing flights?


It would seem remarkable if the "resourcing issues" were only on inbound traffic, but, of course, outbound problems won't feature in the UK media. Most of which hasn't picked the problem up anyway.

[Blue-Shamrock 89]

I'm sure BA will address this with their chosen handler.

I thought ground handlers are judged on their baggage delivery times?

At least when travelling with Easy Jet you get ground handling by Menzies

[Out Of Trim]

BA did address the situation by making their own staff redundant and employing a handling agent that couldn't cope with the extra work in the first place!

You pay your money and get what you deserve!

[DespairingTraveller]

That's what I was afraid of.


As a paying passenger, I don't want the problem "addressed", I want it solved...


Sound like I'll have paid my money and won't get what I paid for... Or my bags!

[Exascot]

Hand baggage only is the solution. As tour operators we can't belive the size of our client's suitcases for two weeks in a sunny climate. Come on, what do you really need apart from your passport and credit card? Good idea to put clothes on for tbe flight though.

[T250]

Hand baggage only is not a solution.

Unfortunately most people require at least some things to be packed into hold luggage, not least because of the ridiculous security rules around liquids that prohibit holidaymakers from taking suncream etc in hand luggage. It is not cheap to buy this locally, if at all in most European charter destinations.

No doubt those travelling on flights with airlines such as BA may also be going for extended trips etc so need a lot more than 1 rucksack of clothes.

[Exascot]

T250 I take your point we have the advantage of having two homes which are equipped with everything we need. Did have to post the leatherman to Greece this year though. If it wasn't for the laptop I could commute in what I stand up in. Think however customs may get out the rubber gloves :eek:

[DespairingTraveller]

@Exascot
Yes, but why am I (who is paying for the service) having to work round the failures and general incompetence of those who are paid to provide it?

And whereas I understand your point, and had already decided that's what we'll do for the sake of a quiet life, it isn't actually a proper solution, because:

a) there are various categories of items that are not allowed in carry-on baggage. And others, which are allowed (like small knifes and scissors) but which can and do fall foul of different rules in other countries, and to the general "rules is what I says they is" attitude of security staff. I don't go on holiday with the inclination or intent of spending my time going round shopping for everyday items that have been stolen off me by officialdom.

b) we now have to waste our time and money buying sizes of products we don't want, simply to meet the bizarre restrictions on liquids, etc., when we could simply have thrown our existing supplies of our products of choice into checked baggage.

c) using up my cabin baggage allowance for clothing, etc., means I can't use it for other items I wanted to take - e.g. as I'm an amateur astronomer and my wife's a birdwatcher, we were considering taking a small portable telescope with us. They are our hobbies and interests, why shouldn't we enjoy them on holiday? We have previously. But that idea's now dead. Not everybody wants to just lie on the beach or gawp at churches, castles and megafauna.

In essence, I am tired of air travel. Certainly for leisure purposes. Navigating your way through a Byzantine web of luggage sizes, security restrictions, etc., that change from week to week, journey to journey, carrier to carrier, airport to airport, country to country, just to "enjoy yourself" is bad enough to start with, and is ceasing to be something I'm prepared to do, without throwing in the likely failure of suppliers to deliver the service they contracted for!

[Bigbluebroxi]

Its not just as easy as snapping your fingers and it being fixed like folk seem to think. It takes about 3 months to get just a basic baggage handler ready to go with all the training thats required and all the hassles involved with getting an airside pass.

Extensive training is then required for opertaing the machinery, getting driving permits etc etc.

There is also the issue of the wages being low, in an area where (correct me if im wrong) jobs arent exactly thin on the ground, so getting staff to comit to this for what may only be a temporary problem will prove difficult.

Obviously somebody has made a total cock up, theres no way "planing" would have been done so badly.

Hopefully the situation improves over the winter. Just hope the situation in LGW and MAN doesnt lead to a loss of work at other stations who are doing a good job.

[STN Ramp Rat]

Monarch to terminate Swissport Gatwick contract - www.travelweekly.co.uk (http://www.travelweekly.co.uk/Articles/2014/07/31/48845/monarch+to+terminate+swissport+gatwick+contract.html)


Monarch to terminate Swissport Gatwick contract
By Lee Hayhurst | 31 July 2014 at 08.51 GMT

Monarch Airlines is understood to have told baggage-handler Swissport that it is terminating its contract at Gatwick amid continuing problems at the airport.


Monarch has already moved to use alternative provider Menzies at Luton and Birmingham airports, and has put Swissport on 120 days' notice at Gatwick and Manchester.
Aviation industry sources told Travel Weekly about the move by Monarch following a series of baggage handling delays in recent weeks caused by staffing problems.
Both Monarch and Swissport refused to comment on contractual arrangements. However, it is understood Monarch has already started looking for a new contractor at Gatwick.
The Times has reported that other airlines may follow Monarch's lead and predicts further chaos this weekend as the big summer getaway continues.
It quoted unnamed airlines as saying the situation could be wore this weekend than during previous pinch points, particularly at peak travel times.
The latest problems at Gatwick occurred last weekend when passengers experienced severe delays late on Saturday night and into Sunday morning.
This followed problems earlier this month, when customers had to wait up to 90 minutes for their bags, and in June.
Swissport issued an apology saying the latest problems came after “a sustained period of consistent baggage handling throughout the busiest day of the year”.
It conceded service levels fell in the early hours of Sunday morning but blamed the volume of delayed arrivals. In a statement it said: “Despite having already increased our resources to support the off‑schedule activity we were still unable to fully accommodate the handling of off-schedule arriving aircraft during this period.”
A Gatwick spokesman told The Times: "Gatwick is working closely with its airlines to improve the performance of Swissport in line with the airport's own high standards of passenger service."

[Mr Angry from Purley]

Not going to be fixed overnight even if they threw resource at it, getting I.D. would take forever. Have to have some sympathy for the handling agents these days, airlines want it dirt cheap so out source to the lowest price. You pay for what you get. If you want to control it, use your own Staff, buy your own de-ice rigs. Who does that these days???. They should look at what Express package Companies do.

[DespairingTraveller]

Have to have some sympathy for the handling agents these days, airlines want it dirt cheap so out source to the lowest price. You pay for what you get.I'm sorry, I have absolutely no sympathy whatsoever for Swissport. Nobody is forced to accept a contract that can't be delivered for the price. They should have walked away and invested their business' funds elsewhere, in a profitable activity. Running a whelk stall, possibly. Having signed the contract, they should deliver on it, even if they don't make the profit they wanted. That's business.

I also have very little sympathy for either the airlines or for Gatwick, who are the ones who will principally suffer the public reputational damage. What sort of apologies for procurement and contract management processes are these companies running that have led them to allow a key part of the customer experience to be run by a company that has apparently failed to deliver to target on a persistent basis, and without the contract remedies in place either to enforce delivery or allow timely cessation?

I mean, the excuses that are coming out are risible: "Aircraft didn't land on schedule! It was the busiest weekend of the summer! It takes a long time to train people!" No sh*t, Sherlock! Nobody in the airline business could have seen those things coming, could they?

As for "you pay for what you get", what about the poor customer who isn't getting what he/she paid for? And is having their holiday ruined or business trip disrupted into the bargain?

[cjhants]

Now, I`m no great lover of Swissport after the way they shafted their staff and suppliers at LHR 11 years ago. Nor do I consider zero hours contracts appropriate in a supposedly grown up economy, and nobody should be surprised if staff on these contracts decide to go home rather than unload late-arriving flights.

But, Swissport management cannot be that stupid in not foreseeing staffing problems in peak summer periods, when flights are normally delayed. I remember waiting for several hours a couple of summers ago when 3 or 4 EZY delayed flights all arrived within a few minutes of each other. Menzies did their best, but there were lengthy delays in getting bags, and GAL were not slow in letting everybody know which handler was at fault.

I am sure much of the problem relates to the delays in getting CRCs returned. Until you have the CRC you cannot even book in an appointment to get a pass. You would normally expect them turned around in 10 days or so, and so the recruitment of summer staff would be based on that sort of timescale.
It appears that disclosure Scotland are not turning the CRCs round for many weeks, and I can see this would cause huge problems in recruitment and training.

When I got my first pass nearly 30 yers ago, you just turned up on a Monday morning, got a polaroid taken, got your laminated pass and off you went. You were given on the job training with an old hand, and that was about it, you were semi-productive in a few hours. With the current inflexible dft rules, it can take months to fill a basic airside vacancy, so if staff leave with little or no notice, you are :mad:

[Mr Angry from Purley]

you pay for what you get", what about the poor customer who isn't getting what he/she paid for

Yep cant but agree, its the same with Hotels, taxi Companies etc etc. Airlines have gone to results only behaviours and apply smoke and mirrors with "service level agreements" blah de blah.
As a punter i'd avoid any big airport like the plague anyway.

CjHants yeah in the good old days if the Handlers went on strike (who remembers Gatwick Handling), the Office Staff got some overtime, drove a baggage trolley without any training or any idea how to get to the aircraft, no elf and safety and the only thing that needed to be avoided was the BCAL flight to Lagos as the bags weighed a tonne :\

[GRIZZLERS RETURN]

When Swissport took Thomsonfly and First Chioce off Servisair 2009/10 ish they turned a 25 minuet offload into 1 and a half hours on a good night...some times they had no steps 20 minuets after the plane pulled on stand...so there is no NO CHANGE THERE THEN...like I said 4 years ago while working for Servisair...YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR......Swissport....cheap and nasty.

It's good to be back.

[BHXvine]

Glad I left Swissport BHX 5 years ago when the cracks began to appear. Baggage problems, lack of departure and arrivals staff, aircraft on the ground waiting an eternity for steps etc etc etc. Not apportioning any blame whatsoever to ex-colleagues who I still remember fondly, but mismanagement at the highest levels.

[avturboy]

Talk about a fight to the bottom, anyone who works on 'a ramp' in the UK knows this has been on the cards for a long time. For the problem to get so large that the consequences are now national new headline is a dreadful indictment of all that is wrong in the relentless pursuit of low cost operation.

This debacle may well do wonders for the UK's own holiday industry, letting customers down on their much looked forward to summer holiday will leave a very bad taste in the mouthes of many thousands of customers who will think very seriously about their next holiday purchase decision.

The actions of a few people who have brought about this problem could have a long term and far reaching effect on all of us who's living depends on the successful operation of UK airports.

[Onthetarmac]

Airlines are just as guilty they gave the likes of Swissport the contracts knowing that the service isn't going to be of the standard required.

Swissport not only a mess in LGW but BFS as well.

Apparently staff balloted for strike action with over 95% for action.

[TOWTEAMBASE]

Ah grizzler.......welcome home. All we now is sat2 and we have the full compliment :). I'm hearing your welsh ex shift mucker has made a return to STN.......maybe he heard that FR now only carry 30 bags instead of the 300 they used to load. You'll be back next :)

[sat1]

welcome back o grizzly one!!!
With the cost of reuniting bags with pax being so high,why not simply offer proper overtime? The result would be:service levels met,negative publicity removed and no more expensive taxis reuniting bags.Simples,and maybe swissport may keep hold of contracts.Spend a little to gain a lot.

[GRIZZLERS RETURN]

Maybe SAT1 If I got myself a van you could put a few bags my way..I could reunite them with there owners...then again maybe I would need a forty footer.....Its nice to know its S.S.D.D...It's like I have not been away.

[STN Ramp Rat]

To be fair to the current Swissport management,when Swissport and Servisair merged they had to dispose of Servisair Gatwick so the Swissport operation at Gatwick is exactly the same Swissport operation that was planned earlier in the year by the old swissport management.


When the merger happened Swissport were reversed into Servisair and the Servisair management took over they were obviously working on the integration and did not see the issues at Gatwick on the horizon. About June it became apparent that all was not well and a management "restructure" took place at Gatwick and Manchester on the same day, they have been playing catch up since then. I would imagine the available workforce around Gatwick that have a simple and therefore easily checkable work history are already working at the airport or don't want to work at the airport. This leaves Swissport having to ride the wave. They cant bring in staff from other airports like they used to as the current pass restrictions mean that you can have full access at Stansted or Heathrow for instance but that does not grant you access for Gatwick.


What Swissport are guilty of is running a very poor PR response to the issue, I have not seen response from Swissport. It seems that GAL are managing the PR response on their behalf and obviously doing that to put GAL into the best light. I don't believe the current management are culpable in this, beyond not checking what the old management had planned, but they are doing a very poor job of explaining why they cant recover the situation as quickly as they want and I believe others are to blame for that.


this will have a massively negative impact on Swissports reputation that will last just as long as it takes for the other handlers to raise their prices ........ or am I being cynical

[backtrack_32]

It look as though swissport MAN has been struggling again this evening. Pax waiting over an hour for bags!

[TOWTEAMBASE]

MAN and LGW have been asking other stations to bail them out, but it's summer season, anyone who has spare heads to hire out must me overstaffed I'd say. And you can't blame Servisair management.....it was the Swissport manager that was escorted off site, and surely someone would have seen this coming ex Servisair manage my or not.

Grizzler......this app has missed your FFS too, welcome back :)

[Bigbluebroxi]

A screw up over voluntary redundancy led to 150(roughly) people leaving at the same time, from what i have heard.

There is staff from Swissport stations all over the world at LGW helping out.

Maybe monarch leaving will be a blessing and efforts can be focused on providing better service to the remaining customers.

[GRIZZLERS RETURN]

Strange that things have not changed...I left Servisair STN in 2011...I had been with them since 1982...when I started with Servisair STN we where the only handlers there.....if a plane landed it was yours...it was a good job back in the day....then came Gatwick Handling...the slippery slope had started.

But Swissport has not changed...they where bad when I left in 2011 and it would seem that things have not changed...they are still bad....glad I got out when I did...but do miss the blokes and the airport...most of my working life has been at STN...to me it seems to have gone backwards there....ramble ramble...the good old days and all that..Grizzle Grizzle the end.

[aergid]

To be fair to the current Swissport management,when Swissport and Servisair merged they had to dispose of Servisair Gatwick so the Swissport operation at Gatwick is exactly the same Swissport operation that was planned earlier in the year by the old swissport management.


When the merger happened Swissport were reversed into Servisair and the Servisair management took over they were obviously working on the integration and did not see the issues at Gatwick on the horizon. About June it became apparent that all was not well and a management "restructure" took place at Gatwick and Manchester on the same day, they have been playing catch up since then. I would imagine the available workforce around Gatwick that have a simple and therefore easily checkable work history are already working at the airport or don't want to work at the airport. This leaves Swissport having to ride the wave. They cant bring in staff from other airports like they used to as the current pass restrictions mean that you can have full access at Stansted or Heathrow for instance but that does not grant you access for Gatwick.


What Swissport are guilty of is running a very poor PR response to the issue, I have not seen response from Swissport. It seems that GAL are managing the PR response on their behalf and obviously doing that to put GAL into the best light. I don't believe the current management are culpable in this, beyond not checking what the old management had planned, but they are doing a very poor job of explaining why they cant recover the situation as quickly as they want and I believe others are to blame for that.


this will have a massively negative impact on Swissports reputation that will last just as long as it takes for the other handlers to raise their prices ........ or am I being cynical

and


A screw up over voluntary redundancy led to 150(roughly) people leaving at the same time, from what i have heard.

There is staff from Swissport stations all over the world at LGW helping out.

Maybe monarch leaving will be a blessing and efforts can be focused on providing better service to the remaining customers.

Both spot on...

Good to see some peeps on here with something between their ears apart from steam and pink mist....

Next few weeks it will be Menzies or DNATA or ASIS getting it in the neck, swings and roundabouts... that's the business we are in...

'Working at an Airport would be great, if it wasn't for Aircraft & Passengers'

:rolleyes:

[TOWTEAMBASE]

Any truth in the rumour that the MON move from "pisspoor" to Airlines services at LGW has gone sour due to lack of ground handling licence ?

[sat1]

I think there are more pressing issues within MON

[OnTheRamp]

BFS seems to be sorting itself out. Menzies BFS was a holiday camp with poor structure and discipline, most issues since TUPE have involved poor timekeeping and attendance, lack of interest in other airlines other than EZY and a core of mixers on old aviance contracts stirring up trouble to get redundancy.
Most staff have seen the disruptive minority for what they are and are working towards hitting all targets

[TOWTEAMBASE]

Why's that sat1 ?

[MontyP]

BFS seems to be sorting itself out. Menzies BFS was a holiday camp with poor structure and discipline, most issues since TUPE have involved poor timekeeping and attendance, lack of interest in other airlines other than EZY and a core of mixers on old aviance contracts stirring up trouble to get redundancy.
Most staff have seen the disruptive minority for what they are and are working towards hitting all targets

Is that so?

Strike at Belfast International Airport - UTV Live News (http://www.u.tv/News/Strike-at-Belfast-International-Airport/eb1e681f-0017-4f40-8797-880ab6d5d272)

[yotty]

So you find aircraft damage amusing? :hmm:

[Habana2118]

Who's Virgin and Germania going to?

[cjhants]

Virgin to dnata from what I hear.

[T250]

Virgin to Dnata and Germania to Airline Services.

Sign of how bad things are is that Virgin had its own dedicated team of loaders, gate staff and pushback etc from Swissport but still wasn't good enough :hmm::rolleyes:

Swissport only handling agent at LGW to continue to lose airlines, everyone else Menzies, Aviator, Airline Services and now Dnata are gaining at Swissport's loss!

[Habana2118]

And I wonder how long it will be until Emirates go to Dnata! Can see them becoming a big player in the UK

[cjhants]

Emirates already sorted!

[neilgeddes]

T250: Can you say when dnata will be taking on the Virgin contract? I have some friends working there with Swissport. Thanks.

[tony2574]

All stations are different, handling companies excel at one airport and not at another, all down to internal management setup. I blame airlines trying to drive down the cost of handling, making companies secure contracts at silly prices, only to provide a poor service to airline passengers. Its all about making money and not about performance, most baggage times at most airports in the UK are made to look better than they really are. Over the past few years there have been a rise in accidents at stations across the UK, jobs being under staffed, workers being over worked and in some cases not getting a suitable wage, baggage handlers wage has actually decreased over the past 15 years, it used to be a very good job with a good wage, but now every airline is subcontracting their handling just because it is a lot cheaper, hence more PROFITS !

WHEN WILL IT ALL STOP !!!