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View Full Version : 3 WeeK PPL - HOW??


ariel
20th Nov 2001, 17:42
Hi

Virtually finished my PPL, BUT need to do the Xcountry and skills test. I'm lucky in that I work one week on and one week off, but even with all this time to go flying, I'm STILL waiting for the right weather to do my cross country. Feels like I'll never get there... lost count of the number of times we thought it was OK, did the nav calculations, then had it cancelled again.

How do UK flying schools get people through these three week PPLs with our weather, (especially around this time of year?) I'm curious to know!

ariel

126.825
20th Nov 2001, 23:07
:D

well it's like this:

most schools will boast that they have finished courses within 3 weeks. it can be done but you need all the ingredients - brilliant weather - a student that can come in literally every day and a student that has the ability of a student of TOPGUN (oops and obviously the wedge to go with it!).

most of the 3 week courses take place in the states where they are near enough guaranteed of the weather.

on a personal note i normally do not recommend crammer courses for the simple reason that normally if you cram for something after you have passed you normally dump the knowledge.

any more questions - let me know.

regards

an old ops man :) :D :)

WX Man
20th Nov 2001, 23:50
Not true. You 'dump' the knowledge that you don't use. It's also got quite a lot to do with stuff being in our long term memory and short term memory (WWW will be able to expand on this one, he knows about this sort of stuff).

The proof: ask a 54 year old airline captain something that was in the ATPL syllabus in 1965 (such as Astral Navigation?) and he/she probably won't be able to tell you very much about it. However ask him/her what Vso is of the aircraft that they fly day in, day out and they will be able to say without hesitation. It's all about repetition.

Whirlybird
21st Nov 2001, 15:43
You are both right. The problem comes when people do a three-week flying course, get their PPL, then take a break. This often happens - they go back to work, earn more money to fly, or whatever. And the knowledge goes. Whereas if you've been learning to fly gradually, the stuff's already been incorporated into your long term memory over several months, and is more likely to be retained even if you do take a break.

Julian
21st Nov 2001, 16:14
Yep Crewman is right, its 3 wks if all goes to plan and I would say that you are turning up having the all the writtens under your belt already.

If you are thinking of going to the US for your course then look carefully at where you go as regards to weather as well - despite popular opinion in the UK the US is not all bright sunny days!!

Julian.

ariel
21st Nov 2001, 16:40
Thanks for the replies:

It is also my personal opinion that 3 week PPLs are not such a good idea because of the likelihood that crammed knowledge may not be properly retained.

As I say, I've virtually finished now, and will 'soldier on' until I get the weather to complete - I'm not interested in the USA at this stage.

What I am REALLY interested in is what PERCENTAGE of UK flying schools manage to actually get (some) of their students through in the 3 week frame, given our horrible & unpredictable weather!!

(and what happens to the students confidence in the school if they cannot deliver their promise)

ariel

Charlie Foxtrot India
21st Nov 2001, 17:59
Anyone who "guarantees" a PPL in as short a time as three weeks should be regarded with some suspicion. I knew of a mob that did that, and the only way they could jam the students through was to do some very dodgy paperwork fiddling.
The quickest one we have done was three weeks and two days, and he had all the theory squared away before he started.
On the other hand we had one chap came to us who had done a three week PPL in the states, and the only way he had got through was by big chunks of the syllabus being missed out, including the IF. And because of the lack of any kind of consolidation time for things to "sink in" his confidence in his flying wasn't the best, because he knew he'd forgotten much of what little he had done.
IMHO it's better to take your time and allow at least five weeks for a full time course, you need to have some rest.

Whirlybird
21st Nov 2001, 19:00
I learned to fly over a nine month period at Welshpool, my local airfield, which specialises in three week courses. I well remember the long faces of people who'd come for three weeks and spent much if not most of it grounded due to the weather. I also remember the stressed out looks of others who'd done most of it, but were staying up nights studying for the ground exams, and were so overworked they'd stopped enjoying the course at all. There were a few who finished in the three weeks, others who got the bulk of it done and came back later, and quite a lot who either had bad weather or needed much more than the minimum number of hours, who came back, or went elsewhere, or gave up. It can be done, but not often, isn't usually enjoyable, and probably isn't a good idea for most people.

126.825
21st Nov 2001, 20:03
the percentage i would say is less than 1% that finish in 3 weeks.

what they do if they don't- well after spending the sort of money - they carry on with it until done.

obviously more difficult for someone training in the states!!.

:) :D :)

QUERY
22nd Nov 2001, 00:48
The question was:
'How do UK flying schools get people through these three week PPLs with our weather, (especially around this time of year?) I'm curious to know!'

The unsurprising answer is not often. In the unlikely event of favourable weather for three weeks (AND if it happens to co-incide with your course dates!), you may encounter other typical UK problems such as limited opening times, examiner on holiday, lack of aircraft availability, instructor busy etc.
So, with everything and everybody in your favour, 3 weeks is just possible in the UK but I agree that the probability is very low

Whatever the location or subject, there are obviously advantages and disadvantages in any quick course and, in any case, not everyone is allowed 3 weeks off work, or their relationship! But it shouldn't be a problem to take your PPL course in more than 3 weeks, as you would probably only have to pay for the extra accommodation.

Some digress, and more now go, to the US, where the probability of completing a PPL course in 3 weeks at one of the British owned JAA schools must be very high. Although it is true that the weather is not always suitable for students, even in Florida or California, the key factor is that it is rarely adverse all day, or for days on end. Also, the bigger established schools are obviously 'geared-up' for 3 week JAA PPL courses, with plenty of aircraft, instructors and opening time. Another advantage at such schools is that students stay there so, if you become behind schedule, you're on standby to fly immediately the opportunity presents itself.

Because flying is very much cheaper in the US and most agree it is a pleasanter place for private pilots, not only do more train in the US but many people now do most, or all, of their flying there.

pilotwolf
22nd Nov 2001, 00:58
Hi all. I chose the USA for all the reasons you state it can't be done - weather, cost, etc.

Managed to get my FAA PPL (H) in just over 3 weeks in California, BUT...

I had done a lot of studying prior to leaving the UK for the written exam and you need to fly a lot of hours per day to do it. I took the checkride, (and passed) on the Saturday morning and flew home Saturday afternoon.

It took a lot of work on my part and my instructors. I ve never looked back - my bank manager has - several times sincce I got hooked..... :rolleyes:

BEagle
22nd Nov 2001, 01:23
Well - it used to be possible when the UK PPL only required 35 hours of training. From my logbook:

25 Mar - First trip
29 Mar - First solo
12 Apr - Qualifying Cross-country
19 Apr - PPL Test

That was at Cranfield - some years ago, I might add! Pretty well impossible nowadays with the JAR/FCL PPL - but perhaps it might be possible next year with the NPPL??

Julian
22nd Nov 2001, 12:53
Pilotwolfs says the crux of it all really , go over prepared and then you only have the flying to concentrate on. My PPL when I did it took 4 wks in California, I passed the day before I left so my advice would be to build in abuffer in case you need a retest or you will be arranging one back home. A couple of people found themselves doing this for various reasons (and subsequently passed I am pleased to say :D )

One thing I did find is that if you are over on an intensive course the instructors over there will basically become your full time personal tutor! You dont have to chase them round or wonder if they are booked up - even got taken out by them when we fancied a day off!!! Likewise we arrived to find that they had block booked the plane already for us so getting an aircraft was not a problem.
If you ask instructors if you can fly somewhere and stay away for the night as part of the training then they are more than eager as well as US students just turn up for the odd hour, do a couple of circuits and go home again. You can generally come to some sort of deal with them so neither of you are really out of pocket as regards hotel costs, etc.

What would I moan about in the US? To be honest, apart from the odd cock up and days grounded there wasnt really a lot to moan about.

I guess I will sign off and say again, if you are going over there go with all your writtens done. I was out with a few others exploring Long Beach whilst others were sweating over exams in their rooms. And to be honest it makes the experince oflearning to fly if you have seen a bit more than the inside of a hotel room!

Julian.

whydontugetalife
24th Nov 2001, 00:14
I did my PPL , UK one in the USA at a Florida school, completed it along with 3 others at the time in a C150 , including all ground exams, 50 hrs of flying in 2 weeks and 13 days including .

Dont listen to all the negative stuff about the USA, just do it, all schools have good things and bad things, how often do we go into Tescos and get peeved at the service. We dont complain on a forum about it though, so why should people getting away with talking about flight schools in the Uk or out of it in the same way...if you listened to all the whingers on pprune you would never leave the ground. I think that pprune is full of bitter and twisted people who have either A) never passed their tests and exams B) have paid all the money only to find their personality kills their chances of getting a pilot position, or C) people that fit into both these categories!!