THY question

[Murray_NN]

Ladies and Gents,

What is the best way to apply to Turkish Airlines? Direct through their website or through an EU agency?

Where can I find info about their recruitment process in Pprune? I did all the searches I could, but no info.

Thank you very much in advance.

[airport30]

Did you visit Turkish airlines english web site
You should I think you will find a answer of your question

Turkish Airlines - Announcements - turkishairlines.com (http://www.turkishairlines.com/en-tr/corporate/announcements/1)

[Vortex Thing]

So let me get this right. Even though in this very same Middle East forum group of threads there is more than one entire THY thread! Much less answers to questions. You also failed to spot the 8 page long Turkish Airlines thread!!! You claim to have done a search and that revealed nothing!

Notwithstanding what I am about to say below. If you cannot find the info on THY on this forum you probably deserve to go there rather than take a real job in an airline somewhere.

That thread will basically answer every single question that you could possibly have. From why you shouldn't go there unless you are unemployed and have no where else to go to how they will not pay you what they are meant to, when they are meant or fulfil the contract even close to how you were told it would pan out in your interview!

They Hate You ( Ottoman Airlines) is an interesting place to see the world and whilst I will admit the staff travel wasn't bad. Seeing your family for 3 days a month when you were promised 3 wks on 1 wk off isn't funny for a year. It isn't helped by being paid less than half of your contract rate for 5 months whilst they take you through the 2nd worst training in the world, tortuously slowly and badly and say that you receive full pay when your are fully qualified Turkish Airlines "Yabanci pilot" i.e foreign pilot.

I have a particularly fond memory of a 438 page powerpoint presentation on how they organise the Operations manuals into a newly Turkish invented system called OPS Manual A, B, C, and D and how they will lead the JAA by making these new fangled manuals available, wait for it......ONLINE!! Cue 36 fellow indoctrinees face palming.

That said if you are single and don't have young children or a wife/husband then you may see it as a better option than FR.

You do get decent route exposure over 3 continents on the short haul fleets. Do however prepare yourself for the fact that you may very often be in the cockpit with nothing other than the stale smell of cigarettes ( they smoke incessantly) from push back to chocks on regardless of rules and regs and you very often wonder how they will try and kill you next. Being an FI prior prepares you for this as you fly with child like local pilots who do not want you there, tell you so to your face and generally scare you in ways you didn't think possible.

Most of these flights start with "and another thing I learnt about the B737 when I was flying the F16 was........"

Enjoy, you will particularly enjoy the fact that you can work from SAW or IST a mere 3 hrs in traffic apart and have no time given post flight in your duty so report back the next day with 5 hrs rest for a 15 hr day to Africa. I also enjoyed the 15-18 days per month down route rest in hotels whilst I paid 2000 Euros a month for a 55 sq mtr apartment that I spent 6-8 nights a month in.

[Murray_NN]

VT,

Thank you for your thorough reply.

In fact I did search for THY thread but nothing came up, on my laptop I cannot access any other pages except the first one on a forum. But on my phone I got to see the posts you mentioned, so thank you.

May I ask you about yourself? Have you worked for THY before? FO/CAPT? how long? What position and company are you in now?

When you compare FR to THY, is FR that bad?

Thank you.

[Vortex Thing]

Murray,

I think it would be rather churlish of one to come on here and bemoan living in Istanbul and commenting on life in THY and the Ts & Cs if I hadn't been there and done it but for clarification yes for my sins I went there and did the THY pilot thing! (I'm not however sure how that wasn't clear!)

Moving on. Now you mention the comparison to FR and THY. The comparison I made was caveated by "if you are single" those 4 words are very very significant.
If you are single it doesn't matter if you only get 3 days back in UK/or wherever you call home per month. The assumption being that you would only go somewhere like Turkish as you cannot get a job elsewhere you are clearly going to go there to get the hours to move on to something like the Middle East et al.

With FR at least you would be somewhere in Europe so moving home was an easier thing and the option to move your family to live with you was also there. That was not really a possibility in Istanbul, you would be crazy to move your family there!

Is FR that bad? well it depends on if you think that you pay the airline more than the pax to be onboard is bad or not. Having already paid for your type rating, uniform, food, accommodation, security and ID cards for god's sake, the lanyard to put them on and have no contractual base and your choices for the day were with or without lubricant.

FR bases are mostly in Western Europe so I didn't have to contend with a massive cultural or climatic shock. Also everyone spoke English, as opposed to thinking that they could speak English which was a huge factor at THY where almost no one speaks English.

Though THY had many many bad things about it and the same for Istanbul there were of course good sides. The engineering was good, the flight support was excellent. You never had arguments with Ops has to how much fuel to take or not, whether to go or not go and basically as flight crew you were left to your professional judgement. If you said you weren't happy from an MEL perspective or any other then you didn't fly. That is not the case in the airlines I had flown in prior FR included. In those airlines the decision was made for you and you were told what to do or not do and if you didn't agree you got sacked, simple!

In sum though FR didn't treat the human capital very well, the training was thorough as were the procedures, it felt safe as a pilot to operate there and you may have been paid less than the local paperboy but you did not feel as if you were going to die from anything other than starvation. In THY you frequently would wonder if this was your last day on earth, scratch your head after yet another weekly TCAS or eGPWS aural call out and wonder who you had bothered in a previous life to end up having to work in a place like that. In fact it was often so scary being in THY that you yearned for the days where you went back to mosquito filled hotels working your way round the delights of Lagos, Sierra Leone, Dakar and other dream holiday locations which is what I had to do when I found myself looking for work a few years prior to that all.

Right now I'm FZ and expect to be so for the foreseeable. Do yourself a favour if you do not need to go to THY. Don't go, there are soo many other jobs now. It looked good from the outside but it wore thin pretty quickly. Granted you were more likely to get paid than being in Africa but not what you expect, or when you expect it. There is always some reason at THY why the pay is not quite as advertised. (Ah but you are training, ahhh but you LPC only on NG not on classic so you can only fly 66 of the fleet of 72 planes! So we will pay you less!!! ah but you have a degree but it is not certified by Turkish University so you will be paid as non graduate, etc etc)

There is enough info from myself and many of the chaps/chappesses I worked alongside in Thy to tell you the pros and cons but like I said if you are single then it is more of an option. If you have a family to support or need anything other than hours i.e paying etc then don't bother go somewhere else.

You have been warned!!

[Chocks Away]

YOU add content! :rolleyes:
Geez, the cheek you have demanding like that!
Add to the discussion instead of riding on other people's coat-tails. :cool:
THAT will get the topic back up to the top again!

[Vortex Thing]

Hey Rusty D,

Sadly there is no right way to leave THY early. How you actually go about doing it will depend on how long you have spent of your 365 day contract. If you are long haul fleet the process is slightly easier than if you are short haul as you are treated a little less like a child.

Suffice to say that if you need to go at lets say 6 months served as a yabanci pilot. Then my suggestion would be to get as much of your house in order as possible before you utter a word to THY. If you absolutely cannot make it to 3 months before the end of your year then you basically have to accept that you will end up owing them money or orchestrate a tactical withdrawal like below.

Assuming the contract hasn't changed too much if you take a look at paragraph 2.2.1 in your contract it basically says that if you leave for any reason at all before you first year is served you have to pay back the entire cost of your "training". I personally witnessed how some of my colleagues were treated in this instance. They basically charged them for all of their uniform, the initial 30-45 days in the hotel, their OCC (Conversion course), even their line check, joining flights and repatriation etc were all calculated and totalled up. They then cancelled their residents permit and took it back and did not even give them a repatriation flight. In sum they got stung for about 4 months salary. They stop your salary immediately, stop your ID cards working so you cannot get into ops of the Genel Mudurluk, had to pay a full fare flight home and had difficulty leaving the country as without a residents permit and no visitors visa (as you were not a visitor) immigration did not understand how you had legally entered the country!!

So personally I would decide when I was going, move out of the apartment there you live, pay of any credit cards from Crappy Kredi, and leave the account open with a zero balance. Then return everything i.e every single book, both sets of wings i.e to the last pair of socks into the THY issue roller suitcase. Then go over to the GHQ get a staff travel ticket issued.

Next pop over to a mates apartment in Yesilkoy, have a few goodbye beers, give them said suitcase. Get on the plane home and then make a phone call to your fleet manager.

FEDEX the foreign pilots department every document your "JAA/EASA" validation, THY ID cards, residents permit, etc get your mate to hand in your suitcase with every item of issued clothing.

If you cannot bring yourself to exit in this manner then go to the chemist ask for a large tube of lubricant pop over to see the foreign pilots department and break them the news. They will basically stop all staff travel, cancel everything immediately roster you for every single remaining day in Ankara, cancel all remaining leave and not help you with anything at all. You will be lucky to even get a flight home. Your pay will be stopped immediately for the next 2-3 months until they calculate any "costs" and then they will tell you how much you owe them! Forget your last few months salary as you will never see it.

Or you could just finish out your year and perhaps get out 7 days early like I did! Just do not sign the renewal of contract and make sure you get your log book stamped and a letter of permission from your fleet manager to leave with good conduct before you say you are not renewing and you will get some money a few months of threatening legal action later.

Good luck with leaving early :O

[yanbancypilot]

Do like me ..take your bonus.. and go. THY does not deserve any correctness.

[Vortex Thing]

Bus Driver Man,

Try not to be so disingenuous to others experiences. Just because you were alright does not mean that every one was treated well.

I personally as explained left "correctly" and was fine. I also went and saw the fleet manager, the chief pilot and the foreign pilots department but I a served my entire year and therefore did not expect any problems.

On the other side of the house numerous colleagues were treated appallingly and had everything I said above happen to them.

To imply that we were welcome, treated equally and fairly and that there are no problems in THY is not representative of the issues to hand. When I was there there were just over 300 yabanci pilot and I knew at least 100 reasonably well. Some of those are still there, most are not and not one single pilot amongst them would agree that it was anything short of a nightmare joining, working or leaving THY. The only reason that those who are there remain is because it is more palatable than the alternative.

If you happen to be A430/B777 it is of course likely that you will see the world entirely differently as many of the problems experienced are by those on the short haul and B737 fleets specifically.

After witnessing numerous pilots try and leave correctly I personally handed over the ID cards and uniforms for many more of my colleagues who left before me who realised that it was a fairly pointless task.

So unless they genuinely have learnt from their experience and turned around how they now treat pilots lets not try and make out that THY is a bastion of fairness, equality and HR correctness.

VT

[Boeingrestricted]

Treat one as you would like to be treated. So I do not agree with yanbancypilot. Having said that, I do believe that you will experience hardship on your way out. Even if you have just marginally fullfilled your contract.:=

[DutchExpat]

Dont expect them to treat this fairly. Whatever you do make sure you give them everything back and than call according their OM A Unfit to fly from ABROAD and thats that. Than except no mail whatsover out of turkey on the address you have given them. This ofcourse is all just my humble opinion of a theoretical scenario.

[yanbancypilot]

And we are talking of the Best " European" Airline.. time for a petition to have them kicked out of the category. They don't belong geographically and culturally to Europe.With this expat gig they just managed to reveal their real nature , that is essentially abusive and non inclusive, and their lack of competence even more pathetic if seen in contrast with their fixation on higher education.It will be a huge boomerang and will hit them right on the head. The king is naked.

[Ottoforce]

Yabanci Porky,
It still seems from previous experience, now watching from afar,a degree in eggplant is better than airmanship, situational awareness, handling skills:mad: common sense or CRM and always will be.
The "degree" the airforce "pilots" get is totally bull...t as was then and it always will be.
IYI UCUSLAR
safe and pleasant flights:ugh::ugh::ugh:

[Expat737NG]

I could see that some of yoU HAS INSIDE INFO.

How is the B737 pilots roster?... how many overnights at home we can expect?

And the average Flying hours is nearly 90/month

[Expat737NG]

Tell me the good things to fly for THY...

Is it a job only for unemployed?

[yanbancypilot]

Its mainly a job for those that did not make it in real airline, furloughed,pensioner and desperados coming from ****** up outfits. Roster on 737 survivable only by locals with with big ego.. and no other options. As I hear no sign of improvement... enjoy!!

[Vortex Thing]

I did 27 nights on 3 nights off per month.

I would spend 15-18 nights per month downroute in a hotel i.e IST to Ankara to hotel to Frankfurt to Ankara to hotel to Paris to Ankara to hotel to Jeddah to two days off down route in Ankara or Antalya etc.

I.e you often get days off down route (ie every month often!)

You spend 8-10 nights in your own apartment with shorter multiple sectors and then you will get guaranteed 3 days off to go back to your family.

In the entire year from when I had everything signed off and was online. I spent 3 days a month with my family.

I would fly to UK first thing in the morning arrive home by 17:00hrs see the kids before bed, get the whole next day with the children if it wasn't a school day. Then one whole evening with the wife then next day up at the crack of dawn to get the flight back to operated early the next morning.

Expect comments such as, "It doesn't feel like were married anymore", "its like living as a single parent", " they don't like that/watch that/ eat that anymore!! Its like you don't even know your own children!"

It's basically pretty depressing and if you look through my posts you will get the feeling that I don't really do depressing I am about as happy a pilot as you get out here so what do you think the difference may be!

Agree wholeheartedly with below you go there if you are unemployed, unemployable or escaping previous misdeeds and should consider it the military equivalent to joining the French Foreign Legion!

[porkflyer]

Your fleet is not a fleet is a squadron!! I have never seen sorriest and more basic individuals in this business as local pilots. No life, no interests, nothing but money, car, whisky, raki, East European ladies ,and a couple of weeks in their summer house..that will be your benchmark..enjoy !! There is no civil aviation in Turkey.

[Scott_T]

Could someone who has recently joined THY please contact me via PM I would greatly appreciate it.

[Expat737NG]

Mr Scott,
I' appreciate if you can share some info here or via PM.
I waiting for my work permit to be processed.


I have many doubts about 737 roster/ life on THY.

tnk u

[TypeIV]

Keep in mind that there is no such thing as subpart. Since Europe went to EASA and Turkey is kept outside, general rules for Turkey:

1000hrs annually
14hrs duty per day before extension
8hr is minimum rest
No such thing as local nights. 3 consecutive night flights are common, after the last night of 5 flight hours, you might get 8hrs of rest and then another 2 legs domestic after lunch the same day.
Minimum 7 days off per month (the actual target off, of the company, except for the few extra off days scattered over the year to meet the annual minimum OFF)
Standby is not considered duty time. Expect 12hrs of standby on a day and then get called up for a three day sling.
Being sick puts you on the sh'tlist and you need to go to the emergency among heart attack, knife wounded and stroke patients in the middle of the night for your report in order not to get a noshow :8

[Expat737NG]

Many thks

We can see that there is no reason to wear THY's Uniform

[Sag73]

Hi everyone, I'm an expat just joined THY and I need some info on 2 issues please:
First: how should I get my university degree approved by the Yök? & what are the documents needed?
Second: I was thinking buying a car from abroad, is there any privilege being a THY on this issue (I heard you can keep it the whole year and you won't have get it out of turkey every 6 months or something like this) is that true?
Or is it better to just buy a blue plate car from Istanbul? & also what are the documents needed.
I appreciate any help, also feel free to PM me. Thanks

[yanbancypilot]

So you know about blue plates but you did not do your homework and due diligence on THY :D:D:D You seem perfect for the job.
If you are a captain seeking the few extra TL on salary... just forget about it.
The process is endless and requires multiple trips to Ankara not worth it. If you are an FO looking for an upgrade forget about it even more.It will never happen regardless. Enough Turks around.. you are just a seat filler and will be disposed off as no longer needed. Too late ??
Sure you have many privileges. A free Mercedes SLK is ready for you just choose the color you like and 40 virgin await for you in the afterlife.. just convert to Islam

[de facto]

Sure you have many privileges. A free Mercedes SLK is ready for you just choose the color you like and 40 virgin await for you in the afterlife.. just convert to Islam

Your stupidity is endless,you are a disgrace to our profession.

[flydive1]

Yanbancypilot, how come you only have 9 posts now?
I'm sure I've been reading your rants for month.

[Sag73]

What a negative energy you're sending!!
You can see I'm a new comer & exited about joining and need some help, so If you don't wanna help no problem but at least don't Frustrate me..
And by the way; is the SLK the best car you know ? Hahhaaa
If anyone else wanna help please PM me. Thanks

[tongo-sierra]

I know many pilots from all fleets , they are all happy with some exeptions . The major problem of the guys is the commuting in the narrow fleet . But yabanci you talk about culture and religion , you have a problem with that other pilots are more open minded and dont see a problem to deal with other cultures and religions .
My question to you is , when are you confronted with religion when you fly for THY ?

[yanbancypilot]

Dear Payscale friend the real disgrace of this profession is THY and its average sub par professional level, slavery like terms and conditions ( 100 hors 7 days off) calling it self " Best European" (but not having to abide to EASA FTL) heavily subsidized by an arrogant Islamist Government coming to Europe to steal passengers and paradoxically subjugating expat pilot often from EU, hired through shady agencies and lies, to its retrograde and discriminating "company culture"
SAG73. you are "exited" but you "exitment" will not last long...trust me.Still I can see your English skills fits perfectly in the system.
Tango Sierra I'm long gone but still have friends and hey are all about to leave or looking for alternatives. Of my class of 16 only two are still there so that is a more or less 94 % attrition in three years..not bad for a place where everybody is happy :ok:
State and religion are not separated in Turkey. Islam is wittingly or unwittingly influencing everything and everyone and you have to be blind not to see it. Mine was just a joke but humor has no place down there. Ok ..the virgins are actually 72.

[GF4RCE]

yanbanc"y"pilot

Your character is not only insulting and down right racist your post are directly geared at an ethnic community or religion and what de facto says about you being a disgrace to our profession and industry couldn't be more true...... i am quite happy to put up with your objective (though biased) facts but your endless and unsubstantiated rant on about THY religion and the people employed by THY or the neo ottoman-ism slander is in down right disgraceful and offensive... your previous nickname was barred (judging from you post count) but a few changes in the characters of your nick hasn't stopped you from your tirade of profanity which serve only to insult rather to inform... the actions or words you serve here is nothing short of defamation
..
Maybe you had a bad experience ( i doubt this or your credibility about the information you give) but no one put a sharp object to your throat a put a weapon against your skull (be it empty judging from your pathetic replies) to sign the dotted line... YOU KNEW exactly what the condition were going to be like.. signing a full time contract and then expecting commuting condition is like buying potatoes but expecting caviar .. get real... if you really have any expat experience you will know the difficulties not only working conditions in which you work in... but the cultural factors aswell which you so ignorantly ignore with you imperialistic and divinely superior knowledge:ugh::ugh::ugh:...

now lets look at your misinformed comments objectively:

calling it self " Best European" (but not having to abide to EASA FTL) heavily subsidized by an arrogant Islamist Government coming to Europe to steal passengers and paradoxically subjugating expat pilot often from EU, hired through shady agencies and lies, to its retrograde and discriminating "company culture"
if you understand skytrax if you had even o atomic gram of intelligence ... its a award for service & quality of a product .. transportation of passengers and goods from one point to another ....which is voted by the general public and selected delegates within the industry... its working conditions terms and agreements though indirectly play a role .....ITS is the OUTPUT such as customer satisfaction, time performance, catering, cleanliness , entertainment transfer amenities etc ...this is all in the SURVEY that you VOTE on if you bothered to have a blo0dy look before you start your utter garbage tirade... here is a hint for you racist mind click here (http://www.worldairlineawards.com/index.htm) and hint look at the categories :mad: and here to look at the performance indicators (http://www.worldairlineawards.com/main/mthds.htm#KPI) ...
secondly you rant on about turkey not being in EUROPE .. yeh may be politically but last time i checked the maps Turkey had 23,764 km2 or land mass located on the European continent which is 23,764 km2 more then Uk or Cyprus... besides the point who cares if its Europe or Aisa or deep in the pacific .. the fact is Skytrax have flick all to do with my job , working conditions or my career...
if your going to argue some point BE bl@@dy objective...

contrary to what your saying
heavily subsidized by an arrogant Islamist Government
its actually THY that's subsidizing the foreign policy ..i.e some of the more interesting locations we fly to .. all the investments and acquisition of equipment (i.e aircraft) are done without any federal or political subsidies or guarantees..

again misinformed yabanc"y" but no... that should inhibit your slander regardless if its full of bul$%it

coming to Europe to steal passengers and paradoxically subjugating expat pilot often from EU, hired through shady agencies and lies, to its retrograde and discriminating "company culture"
what so basically if A has an inferior product than B and A is not from your country or "geographic culture" then B is stealing ??? wtf ...what kinda narcotics or acid are you on for Christ sake? its a business regardless even if they 2 are from the same geographic location the point is to be competitive and capture market share.... mate your more than welcome to go to communist nation if your looking for equality in business:D:D:D
BTW those "shady agencies" you imply are mostly located in Europe .....
you are "exited" but you "excitement" will not last long...trust me

Tango Sierra I'm long gone but still have friends and hey are all about to leave or looking for alternatives. Of my class of 16 only two are still there so that is a more or less 94 % attrition in three years..not bad for a place where everybody is happy

Be real will ya for one microsecond in your life ...firstly ever since i noticed your threads .. oo let me see 2009-10ish your always taking about the "big exidous".. still waiting after what 4 years ... the fact is you will NEVER have a completely happy workforce nor will you ever have a completely happy employee that's a FACT (more so as an expat)... im sure even in you Utopian organisation there are a few loud whingers there too... things are not perfect here but to say you will brushed aside as soon as the locals have enough number .. yeh may be in 15-20 years time .. have you sat down and crunched the numbers .. they are expecting over 200 air frames till 2023.. 20 737 alone next years plus the narrow and wide buses and the 777... then you got the 3rd airport under construction as we speak that will handle 150mil pax per annum.... there is no way in the near future the locals will be able to fulfill the number... period!!! ... so may i suggest to stop procrastinating from your rear bowls and start putting objective numbers rather than scare mongering...

State and religion are not separated in Turkey. Islam is wittingly or unwittingly influencing everything and everyone and you have to be blind not to see it. Mine was just a joke but humor has no place down there. Ok ..the virgins are actually 72.
really pathetic attempt at humor... i dont care nor do most of the expats here (with a professional expat mindset other than you idealistic or imperialistic vision) at how things are run in the country .. there are way more worse places to work than in Istanbul but then again you vision only goes as far as your nose with blinkers on....


SEXTUP:
I heard this story about sick leave. If you don't go to specific hospital no pay. Friend of mine went with 39 fever and vomiting.. Isn't this a clear violation of most basic rights??? Europe..EASA..with their attitude looks more probable they will join the ISIL CAA...

not true at all ... you are free to goto what ever hospital you please however is the hospital clinic or department (usually private hospitals) does not have a agreement with the social security (SGK) institution then the medical report must be validated by a governmental clinic or hospital. its got nothing to do with THY but rather to do with you social security payments and privilege set by the SGK. Not a big issue done that a few times my self the private medical cover THY give is usually accepted by 99% private hospitals in ISt, the medical clinic or "saglik ocak" they call it within the originating hospital districts just stamps and confirms the prognosis and thats ittt.. it takes 20-30 min .. and just email the document to the flight medical dept ...once the rest is finished you go to the flight ops medical dept and get a check up hand in the original then start flying....

flydive1:
Yaban"y" has 9 post because his previous nick and post were most likely banned or censored because of the utter garbage, insensitive and disgraceful content it had..... he like to see himself as the messiah of aviation but in reality his just a chap swimming in his own bull###

Sag73: 2 visits to the YOK in person (1 to give application the other to pic up the document if you dont want it delivered) depending on where you education was done could take 1 month to 6 months... govt institutions :) ... but you will need to have transcripts as well (makes copies as they takes the originals (transcripts that is).....very important!!!

[flydive1]

flydive1:
Yaban"y" has 9 post because his previous nick and post were most likely banned or censored because of the utter garbage, insensitive and disgraceful content it had..... he like to see himself as the messiah of aviation but in reality his just a chap swimming in his one bull###

I did not notice the slight change in his nickname.
I thought he did something like Stexup, deleting all his post to regain some kind of virginity.

Very similar rants the two of them;)

[yanbancypilot]

Wow..G4Force have you ever thought of writing a novel? But please change format you citations are becomin more and more annoying to say the least. I did not change any frikking nickname and I was never " banned" for your info. Truth hurts this is the fact.
I again really don't see any attack on Islam in saying that you get 72 virgin when you go to paradise because that is what the Quran says. And if you want to tell me that the Turkish Government has no Islamist agenda ..ask the Turkish people what they think about it. I really cannot see how this statement can be defined as slender in a democratic and free speech environment. Turkish people I admit are not really acquainted to this unfortunately. . Many of the practices in place in THY would not be legal in the EU and are quite right stupid .The tax break granted by the Government of which THY is arm and marketing instrument for example. .Let's compete my friend but starting with same rules. Just for you info the EU parliament is discussing this issue in this very moments.
Let's see where THY ends up having to abide to EU rule.
The attrition rate. speaks for it self. The treatment reserved to foreign pilot has been poor and you get what you ask for. Sag 73 I feel for you. You can try and got trough the process but it will be useless. Long ago a British FO with an engineering degree got it s degree refused as many coming with aviation degrees based on ATPL .Turksih education is very demanding ( multiple answer tests ) German, British, French, Italian and so on ...institution cannot compete :ugh:Beside this degree story is just plain bull**** and again in In Europe would be illegal.
I read on this very forum how many discovered about it after joining as it was kept hidden with the complicity of the Irish recruiter, Add the story seem to repeat as it would appear recently non type rated candidates where asked to pay form their own pocket on the last day of screening. This indicates an attitude.I trust not everybody writing on this forum is " islamophobic " and "slanderous" like me therefore I suggest, as I think you are an FO righteously looking for a career path, to you to search ( you should have done this before) also for posts on seniority that I cannot find at the moment but if I remember well from one day to the other foreign FO where sent , degree or not degree to the last positions of it.
The reason for all this is the innate hyper nationalistic attitude of Turkey and the fact that the Government is looking for internal consensus. Any job given to foreigners is one less vote this is why you can consider your self , notwithstanding the propaganda a temporary fix until new Turk national will be ready to take your place. Over 100 pilots left in my group in few weeks seen the stubborn attitude of THY. Don't hope they will ever change.
Flydive1...you are in all forums, discussing of FAA license on one, ATR42 job on the other..and so on.Instead of snooping others accounts come on find an hobby or talk to a psychiatrist.

[flydive1]

Flydive1...you are in all forums, discussing of FAA license on one, ATR42 job on the other..and so on.Instead of snooping others accounts come on find an hobby or talk to a psychiatrist.

Yes, I try to help where I can, or sometimes just express my opinion, without ranting about and insulting other countries or users of the forum.
But I see you read the Italian forum too, just like your friend Stexup.

No need to snoop others accounts, your posts counter is just below your username. Nice cleanup by the way.;)

Now waiting for a new PM with threats and insults from stexup and maybe from you, for change.

[yanbancypilot]

Flydive I'm not fluent but I can understand enough if needed. But your 893 posts on such heterogeneous topics such as Canadian licenses, formula 1 broadcasting ,FAA license conversion, Aerolineas Argentinas German and Austrian aviation scene and so on... are enough to prove that your are just a sciolist with a lot of time to waist ,minding things that are not of his competence and showing psychological issues in an obsession to investigate other posters identity. You are not working and never worked for THY and you are not even a pilot most probably. This leaves open the question: what is that you want? I don't have to justify myself. Still I'm not insulting anyone even less a country or religion. Fact is that is culturally difficult there to accept criticism and irony and that the "levantine" attitude is what has kept them out of Europe for 45 years..not religion as they like to believe to justify their "levantine" attitude. Turkish Airlines is just the proof that Turkey is not ready to embrace the values of inclusion and mutual respect needed. That is my point. I don't know stexup at all but sure I understand his frustrations if he is or was involved with THY in any way.

[LeGu]

Ok yabancy, we all appreciate your posts...thank you very very very much. You warned us

Now, step aside kid and let real pilots discuss about this topic.

[yanbancypilot]

Why bother replying to idiots? He is just a wannabe ..look to his posts. I could be your father..ass.Sure he seem macho enough...poor thing....👌

[QCM]

The purpose of any forum should be to give hints,share experience,with facts to help decision making...so if this thread can come back to its initial purpose I would try a question....
Anyone can inform me,here if possible or via PM if preferred,about the lifestyle as B777 direct entry Captain?
Rosters,salary,commuting,or possible to keep family in Istanbul?
Any other suggestion?
By advance many thanks...

[lowstandard]

I agree with QCM. I understand if some people have had a bad experience, its good to share as part of a decision making process.

If any one has an honest and objective viewpoint of a DEC position at THY, please let us know. I think as most of us on this forum are expats, we understand the pitfalls of moving abroad. It would be nice to hear just the facts sir or ma'am..

[Boeingrestricted]

It's a captain's airline trying to change this in many and various ways. Both pros. and neg.
money to the company is everything, unexplainable unless you are part of it . now this is a one way traffic for you..(neg.)
Expect deductions, see above, for example due to genuine sick leave.
Some of the managerial actions understandable to locals will stay a mystery to expats.(this will be a neg. experience to you and sadly a revolving door on several aspects.)
Many more aspects, too many to address.

[porkflyer]

For anyone with a minimum of professional pride and integrity a no go. You will eat you liver from the frustration. For those thinking of leaving the sandpit and finding paradise..think twice. Do you really think the proud Turkish masters of the sky will leave a 777 seat to you for one day longer than strictly necessary ? Beside THY HR managers ( and not only ) live in an imaginary world where Istanbul is the best place on hearth. Reality? An overpopulated nil English speaking mess . This gig is only good for EU legacy retired guys looking for a short term boat paying years in a "forgiving" environment. Bringing your family to Istanbul? Impossible if you have kids in school...it will cost you a fortune.. up to 15000 USD x kid .forget about it. Beside any small problem you will have to be dealt with in the local idiom with zero help or cooperation form the company For FOs a a big NO NO NO !!. Just heard from some guy still in Turkistan some are about to sue PARC and THY for fraud...

[QCM]

Quoting Porkflyer..."An overpopulated nil English speaking mess"...I know a place like this called Karama!
Annual school fees 7,000$ in my collegues french secondary school in Istanbul...
But that's nice from you guys to take time for feedback,appreciated.:ok:

[Fluke]

QRM

"Anyone can inform me,here if possible or via PM if preferred,about the lifestyle as B777 direct entry Captain?
Rosters,salary,commuting,or possible to keep family in Istanbul "

This is what I do not understand about you guys. Why would you make it good to keep your family in Istanbul if its a commuting contract ?

Fair enough plenty of summer visits but it seems to me just madness to bring a young school age family here!

[QCM]

In this case this would not be commuting,but living there with family and standard rosters...just a plan B,an escapre route,just in case...

[bob777]

Living in Istanbul with your family may prove much worse than living in Dubai especially if you have kids in school. Turkey is not ( yet) a multicultural country and Istanbul not as much as you would expect. As the swine says this is a good option if your are out of job , out of alternatives or at the end of your career. EASA license highly recommended.. its a matter of time.

[QCM]

Thanks for infos...

[Expat737NG]

Any THY pilot here can tell us how many weeks last the ground training for TR or NTR ex
and how long take to do the first flight? Because I wondering about when may I expect to receive the first full salary.

Tnk u

[B777200LR]

Anyone can inform me via PM if possible ,about the lifestyle as THY B777 direct entry Captain with commuting contract?
Rosters,salary.....

Any info really appreciated

[Flap2]

The ground training itself doesnt take long. Up to 3 weeks.
But you gonna be waiting about 2 month for your apron card and validation of your licence.
Make sure you always try to push the guys in the office about your documents. Otherwise you might be ending up waiting a endless time.....

[Boeingrestricted]

Any flight related activity e.g. SIM or Flight will result in a full pay. This is called on your pay slip as Flight allowance (=tax free) this comprises roughly 50% + of the basic salary. Because things can take up to 3-4 months this was being 'taken care' of by a random observer SIM session for which you would not even have to attend, but just to check-inn and go back home in idle months. As Bus Driver Man was referring to. You could request such a SIM session at the end of idle months so you would end up with a full salary. However, since 10 months or so this has changed! During ground training and roughly 1 to 2 additional months, if unlucky you might end up with 3500$ or so. There will be no more such SIM's available for salary purposes. Hope this answers the question.

[Flap2]

Pretty much true what is writtin here so far. But with some few exemptions.

They will not schedule you for a observer SIM anymore. So your first salary will only be the ground part of the total salary, which equals about 40%.
If you are some sort unlucky, and I know a lot of cases, you might be waiting a long time for the documents needed for flying to be issued. Again the same scenario: Only ground pay...

[Flap2]

Porkflyer summed it up correctly. Not more, not less.