JetRanger fire extinguisher – A Con!

[Dick Smith]

I’ve just been told by my service organisation that I have to fly my JetRanger III VH-DOJ in for its 6 monthly fire extinguisher reweigh. Yes, that’s the small handheld fire extinguisher that is mounted in the JetRanger cockpit.

The JetRanger is located at my farm and means almost a $2,000 flight to get this fire extinguisher weighed every 6 months. I’m told that this is a requirement from the Bell Maintenance Schedule.

Can anyone advise me if it is a requirement in their country?

My JetRanger is simply a private aircraft and it seems to me that a lot of money is being completely wasted on this. Someone actually told me that you don’t even require a fire extinguisher for private ops, but if you decide to have one for safety reasons then you have to have the ridiculous cost of having it reweighed every 6 months by an approved maintenance organisation.

If I purchased one of those European Single-Engine Turbine Helicopters and decided I wanted the extra safety of an in-cockpit small fire extinguisher would I have to get it serviced i.e reweighed every 6 months under the Manufacturers Maintenance Schedule?

I look forward to some interesting comments of what happens in other countries.

[Hughes500]

Well in UK for public transport that is every 12 months at annual inspection.
Why don't you FedEx the extinguisher ?

[John Eacott]

Dick,

Of course you don't have to fly the extinguisher to be checked: drop it off when you're next in town! Have you checked AD Gen 65 (http://www.casa.gov.au/scripts/nc.dll?WCMS:OLDASSET::svPath=/airworth/airwd/ADfiles/airgen/gen/,svFileName=GEN-065.pdf)? As a private <2750kg helicopter you are not required to have an extinguisher anyway.

If you carry an extinguisher it should be AS1851:2005 compliant (for AS/NZS 1841 hand held fire extinguishers) which mandates a 6 month, 12 month and 5 yearly recurring inspection, hence the call for a 6 month re weigh.

All this is regardless of aircraft type: your A109E should be the same as well. I'm very surprised this hasn't arisen before in all the years of operation, was it only just noticed?

[airsail]

Here is the reason you need you cabin fire extinguisher re weighed
http://www.casa.gov.au/ADFiles/airgen/gen/GEN-065.pdf

And here is the reason it can be removed so the 6 month reweigh is no longer required
http://www.casa.gov.au/ADFiles/airgen/gen/GEN-065.pdf

Your aircraft is under 2750kg so not required to be installed IAW the above CASA AD, nice to have but at a cost. You could always have one in your flight bag which would not require a reweigh as it is not installed. Your AMO could have someone drive up and remove it, sign it off on the MR as removed, not required IAW the above AD.

[AnFI]

maybe you could arrange for the Maintenance Organisation to add you to their approval for the purpose of performing a one off maintenance task for which they are satisfied you are competent, and get you to weigh it and then you could just send them the number?

Alternatively: since you are not required to have a FE , then you could simply rename it and call it a Paper Weight for example , then you would be allowed to carry it without it needing to be re-weighed.

I do hope you havn't been flying up to now with an unweighed FireExtiguisher? Just imagine the risk.

[Dick Smith]

John I actually go everywhere by air - wy else would I have so many aircraft,

Surely you are not suggesting I drive from Gundaroo to Bankstown to get the extinguisher checked? Havn't made that drive for over 30 years - it's far to dangerous!

Why can't we do it every 12 months with the annual - like the UK?

Silly me - we in Aus know so much more!

Has anyone ever used one in a Jetranger to put out a fire? I reckon i would rarther land!

[Freewheel]

I don't know of a jet ranger but I do know a fellow who exited the cockpit of a squirrel with fire extinguisher in hand, only to find himself confronted with a blaze that left him with a feeling of impotence greater than when he turned 50. (His exact words:})


I wonder if there's a maintenance organisation much closer to your usual parking spot that may be able to assist for the purpose of saving you the death defying drive. Either that or fly the machine enough that you can cover the requirement when you have your 100hrly. ;)

[Tony Mabelis]

I had to use a Jet Ranger fire extinguisher in anger, only to find that the powder was compacted due to the helicopter vibration!!!
Absolutely B.....r all happened, and we had to resort to fire fighting with handfulls of earth (which worked)
Bit of a waste of time to weigh the extinguisher if the contents are solid!
Tony

[John Eacott]

Dick,

This isn't a CASA thing, it's compliance with AS1851 as linked earlier. You may well find a local approved fire extinguisher shop nearby, it's an easy inspection. In fact you may even find a mobile inspection operator who will call by on his rounds, and list you for a 6 monthly call along with checking all your other extinguishers around the farm!

A copy of the inspection certificate scanned and emailed to your maintenance operator will then suffice for their records.

ps I've just Googled and there are plenty of Fire Protection Equipment companies covering the Gundaroo area :)

[Dick Smith]

I bet the most likely fire in a Jetranger cockpit is an electrical one.

Most likely from a short circuit or a burning wire behind the panel.

Just how you put this out with a hand fire extinguisher I don't know

Better just to turn off the battery and generator switches and land quickly I would reckon!

And it's the 6 months that sounds crazy. Surely in 2014 someone can design an extinguisher that can last 12 months.

[fijdor]

Actually the heater (Janitrol) can give you a problem as well if not maintained properly. I did have to use the extinguisher in a 206 when the heater caught fire in flight, once on the ground I emptied it on or in the Hat-rack and then ran for my life. I guess it did the job ( I think), came back 1/2 hr later and everything minus the Hat-rack and part of the seat seemed ok.

JD

[krypton_john]

Cheaper to just buy a new fire extinguisher every six months trading in the "old" one?

[dubbleyew eight]

since the dry powder types settle and compact and become useless.
wouldn't you be better off with a gas extinguisher?

BCF would be my choice but they are banned as a greenhouse gas.
are CO2 extinguishers available that could be used?

squirting dry powder over the avionics seems to me to be a disaster in the making.
it would require an expensive strip down to clean it all off.

[Rotorgoat8]

Here in the U.S. I was required to install a fire extinguisher in a ex-military helicopter in the Experimental category. The military version had the extinguisher mounted outside the cabin on the frame. The FAA wanted it in the cabin and then gave me guff about not putting it within reach of the pilot. I told him it takes 2 hands and 2 feet to fly the thing--how am I supposed to operate it? He said they do it in a Jet Ranger--Guess I could never be that good! Why would you want to discharge one while flying anyway? To asphyxiate everyone in the cabin? Air Carriers are required to have O2 masks on prior to discharging one. The whole requirement for helicopters sounds like regulation run amok to me. Safety out the window-- when you should be looking for a safe place to put it down they want you to play with the FE. :ugh:

[419]

BCF would be my choice but they are banned as a greenhouse gas.
are CO2 extinguishers available that could be used?

BCF extinguishers are not totally banned. They can still be legally purchased provided that they are for use in one of the exempted categories of which aviation is one.

Aircraft Fire Extinguishers (Halon BCF) - Detailed item view - Leading Flight Equipment, Pilot Supplies, Aircraft Equipment, Aviation Headsets (http://proviationshop.co.uk/shop/article_A-BA23792%252F2HE.001/Aircraft-Fire-Extinguishers-(Halon-BCF).html?shop_param=cid%3D62%26aid%3DA-BA23792%252F2HE.001%26)

Aircraft BCF Fire Extinguisher 1.5kg BA51015 5 (http://www.transair.co.uk/sp+Aircraft-Fire-Extinguishers-Aircraft-BCF-Fire-Extinguisher-15kg-BA51015-5+BA510155)

I remember reading that BCF extinguishers are still legal for aviation use in Australia and NZ as well.