SAR Walt?

[plans123]

I've just seen this over on e-goat.... Does anyone know him?

Brett Day (http://www.e-goat.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?47554-Brett-Day)

[Whenurhappy]

He sounds a bit of a Billy Bullsh!tter to me. He's clearly got the SAS Survival Manual (picked up at Sandbach Services for GBP4.99) memorised, but his account on TV was pretty amateurish.


And he hardly looks like Bear Ghrylls...mentioned he was a SAR Loadmaster...surely someone must know him?

[gr4techie]

Just goes to show the media will use anyone on television and not necessarily a legitimate "subject matter expert". Never let the truth get in the way of a good media story.

[RAFEngO74to09]

Googled this with a pic:

wildcrafts_bushcraft_instructors (http://www.wildcrafts.co.uk/wildcrafts_bushcraft_instructors.html)

Apparently, there is a need to learn bushcraft skills to survive in Essex !

[sycamore]

And you can see plenty of bushes around town on a Friday night...in all colours..

[TheWizard]

I've worked with cadets with more survival knowledge than that load of crap shown on Sky News. You can get a more comprehensive guide from Halfords!!

[Lima Juliet]

What is the breaking strain of a SAR winch cable? Also, it looks like you can eat well as a survival instructor!

That said, the first rule of survival is "the fat get thin and the thin die!".

LJ

PS. He's been in the media again Survival expert speaks about ferry jumpers (From Harwich and Manningtree Standard) (http://www.harwichandmanningtreestandard.co.uk/news/harwich_manningtree_news/11042404.Survival_expert_speaks_about_ferry_jumpers/?ref=nt)

[Lima Juliet]

There's a picture of him in this video wearing his NCA Sgt's Rank Tab...

Bushcraft Knife Sharpening basics - YouTube (http://youtu.be/M69nOtPYH7U)

I smell 'Walt' having read the E-Goat posts as well...

...the Chief Instructor doesn't come over very well either, in my humble opinion! I keep thinking 'David Brent from the Office does survival!'

LJ

[500N]

"Brett Day, a former RAF Search and Rescue winch man, said the men would have had between four and ten minutes at most to survive.

The senior instructor at Wildcrafts bushcraft and survival school in Essex said: "Once your body temperature, normally 36 to 37 degrees, reaches 27 to 30 degrees your muscles start to cramp and tense up."


That is IF the person gets over the shock of chest constrictions from the very cold water that can stop you being able to breath - at the same time as panicking and trying to tread waterer / swim. Then you might have 4 - 10 minutes.

[anotherthing]

Leon,

to be fais, Ray Mears isn't exactly svelte!

[airborne_artist]

I'm always entertained by Mr Grylls. He's never given the real reason for his leaving 21. ;)

[Whenurhappy]

Oh, gone on A-A, spill the beans....

[barnstormer1968]

No, Mr Mears is no lightweight, and having seen him in person recently he was just as big off TV as on :)

That said, I also was once employed as a bushcraft instructor (not a survival instructor) and I'm pretty rotund too, so I feel I'm in good company :)

Sadly in my case I'm overweight from being too successful as trapping wild haggis, bratwurst and chocolate !


Edit:
I have only just been able to view the linked videos.
It always irritates me when people say 'purify' water when referring to sterilising it. How would boiling or adding chemicals remove any foreign bodies or poisonous chemicals (or even small twigs etc). I always found it useful to inform people about the differences of filtering and sterilising.

I then viewed the knife sharpening vid. Apparently you need to have your knife sheathed (don't forget to leave your sheath inside your coat when stowing your knife so it is nice and close to your main organs) or pegged at all times unless you have been gutting something.........

But then it's also ok to leave it on a stump a minute later, or to stand up while holding it in front of you, to walk around with it in your hand etc etc.

It may also be a bit pedantic but that wasn't the best way to strop a blade either, but then I was still stuck on the idea of it being ok to put poisonous oil on a blade you may be using to skin and eat with!

[airborne_artist]

Check yr PMs Whenurhappy :E

[teeteringhead]

And you can see plenty of bushes around town on a Friday night...in all colours.. sycamore you surprise me.

One would have thought an affiliation to a Portuguese-speaking South American country to have been more likely thereabouts...... :E

[cornish-stormrider]

Ray Mears is a bit on the porky side as he eats extremely well when in t bush

I refer you all to case A, he is in the Alaskan back country and has caught a large salmon

He proceeds to flake it and smoke it Indian style
To quote the yoof of today OMFG, I was scraping my way thru the television

He then proceeds to say you have to be careful as bears can smell cooking fish from twenty miles away

He then does a line about how he'd have to fight the bear for his salmon, I'll have twenty on the judo guy over a bear

Oh and I suggest you reads his biography for more .

If the apocalypse happens I will be heading for the woods

[AR1]

Brett Day | LinkedIn (http://www.linkedin.com/in/brettdaysp)

wildcrafts_bushcraft_instructors (http://www.wildcrafts.co.uk/wildcrafts_bushcraft_instructors.html)

Brett is a former Loadmaster who served in the RAF Search and Rescue for 4 years, during which time he completed the aircrew survival cadre and later assisted in teaching it.

He has an active interest in the outdoors and has taken part in events such as the Munro challenge and The 3 Peaks challenge.

Brett enjoys passing on the skills he's learnt, in his spare time he enjoys mountain biking and is a keen photographer.
Brett is also the Qualified First Aider for Wildcrafts, combined with his experience in Search and Rescue you cab be assured of being in good hands.

[Bladdered]

Instructor and H&S Advisor (Part Time). at Wildcrafts. The Essex bushcraft and survial school

What is a survial school?

Its all elf and safety to me! That speaks volumes :=

[Whenurhappy]

...he completed the aircrew survival cadre and later assisted in teaching it.


Not the same thing as teaching it, is it?

[NutLoose]

Get's around

Health and Safety for Beginners ? View topic - People always in a rush... (http://www.healthandsafetytips.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=36351&p=283305&hilit=brett+day#p283305)

I had the chance to do the Police Class 1 driver training (Blues and Twos) at Hendon

[SilsoeSid]

I was surprised watching that Sky interview vid at @40 seconds he said "In any survival situation the big priorities are Water, Food, Protection, Shelter and Fire ; Mmm, on my seperate Arctic, Desert and Jungle Survival courses we were told; Protection, Location, Water, Food.

Perhaps I need to readjust all that teaching and attend one of Bretts Wildcrafts bushcraft and survival school courses :rolleyes:

I will especially look forward to the very dynamic personality of chief instructor Les during the knife safety and sharpening class :ooh:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/dd/David_Brent_111.jpg

[Tiger_mate]

Get with it Siloe

These days it is:

Protection
Concealment
Water
Food

..because the bad guys nowadays cannot read the Geneve Convention and are a bit handy with their machetes and video cameras. That said I agree with your sentiment :ok:


....and I also believe that any aircrew member who has undertaken any form of Survival training would default to the same order. I am interested in finding the outcome to this thread as there are dangers with ill informed persons being permitted to teach anybody never mind Cadets who will lock onto every word.

[JTIDS]

Anyone else having a flash back to the Army Major Doctor who held on 22 at Valley but actually turned out to be a TA (non-doctor) private?

[NutLoose]

When you look at his linkedin, it shows his education history which includes his school, but seems to miss the RAF out totally which is curious

[charliegolf]

What is the 'aircrew survival cadre'? I did the CSRO course, and taught survival at fod free Finn. But I haven't a scooby what said cadre is. Post '87 p'raps?

CG

[TheWizard]

WALT KLAXON
From his LinkedIn profile-
Interests: Airsoft skirmishing

[Whenurhappy]

Oh dear, not looking good for him.

From my winter survival training (albeit 1987):

You will only survive:



3 hours without shelter
3 days without water
3 weeks without food

Or about 30 minutes if you fib on TV or the internet.

[Lima Juliet]

Seeing as we're into The Office here's a quote that these two jokers could definately use "I could catch a monkey. If I was starving I could. I'd make poison darts out of the poison of the deadly frogs. One milligram of that poison can kill a monkey. Or a man. Prick yourself and you'd be dead within a day. Or longer. Different frogs, different times"!

http://www.comedy.co.uk/images/library/people/180x200/t/the_office_gareth.jpg

[NutLoose]

More


Brett Day Ian, I held the rank of Sgt Aircrew and my trade was Air Loadmaster but I did undertake the battlefield medic cadte and the SAR medic cadre, given that most people would not know what an ALM was I used the term sar medic. Does that clarify to your satisfaction?
2 · 31 July 2013 at 02:26


Brett Day Kim, if you are anywhere near Chelmsford Essex I'll be happy to dispell the idea I'm a yank. At the time I served in the RAF there was ASR: Air Sea Rescue, which was coastal to offshore, we shated this duty with the RN, SAR: Search and Rescue, coastal to inland and in wartime pilot retreival, and lastly volunteer mountain rescue. You'te right about my spelling between a dinky smartphone keyboard and mild dyslexia its bound to happen. PS Brett / Bret are both uk spellings deriving from an old english name Brit (Man of Britain).
1 · 1 August 2013 at 00:02


Brett Day Hiya I was with 202Sqn many moons ago!
1 · 1 August 2013 at 00:03


https://www.facebook.com/TheHunterGathererWayByFfyonaCampbell/posts/412389412212632

[Sun Who]

The Facebook link was priceless. That Ffyona Campbell gave him a proper mauling.:E

Sun.

[500N]

Didn't I read somewhere that he served 4 years in the RAF ?

If so, 4 years to make Sgt ???

[Lima Juliet]

Company Description: Wildcrafts was founded in 2000 by Les Davidson because of his love for Bushcraft and to teach specialist bushcraft and survival skills. Having spent 8 years in the British Army, Les brings his knowledge of military survival along with his extensive knowledge of bushcraft to those who wish to learn. It is his aim that every student who progresses from a Wildcrafts course will leave with an understanding of nature and caring attitude to the environment around them; will also recognize that skills must be passed down so that generations to come will benefit from the knowledge our forefathers possessed.

Wow! A whole 8 years; how very "extensive"!!!

[plans123]

And here he is on Facebook....

https://www.facebook.com/Brett.Hangman.Day

[ex_matelot]

I'm always entertained by Mr Grylls. He's never given the real reason for his leaving 21

Regardless of his craving for...

What was your reason for leaving 22, or even 21?

[TheWizard]

Didn't I read somewhere that he served 4 years in the RAF ?

If so, 4 years to make Sgt ???

He claims to have been Sgt Aircrew.
Acting Sgt is awarded upon completion of Non Commissioned Aircrew training.

[Lima Juliet]

Les’s interest in survival skills began whilst completing his bronze and silver D of E awards; he later served in the British Army for 8 years as a combat radioman. It was during this time he was taught fieldcraft, survival and basic escape and evasion techniques.

So he learned to hone his knife skills as a Siggie!!! :p

[ShyTorque]

but based on over 700 operational sar sorties and my experience as a survival instructor

Very impressive to fly 700 operational SAR sorties... but:

How long was SAR rear crew training in the 1980s?
How long did it take to train as a survival instructor?

All in four years, eh?

[Tiger_mate]

I am quite sure that there were no first tourist SAR in the eighties. This opportunity first occurred post DHFS which is 1997+.

He therefore would have done a tour on SH or on very rare occasions, the AT fleet.

Never heard of him :=

[Lima Juliet]

More info to track down and home into Mr Day...

Brett Day SP
Message: For those who thought that it was over the top and condescending, you don't have to follow it, but unless you have the actual competence to counter it with better advice then please don't rubbish it. I'm not a fan of nannying people but a little knowledge and a little of the right preparedness pays dividends. The bit I posted came about as several of our students wanted some good practical advice, I tried my best to make something reasonably concise based on my knowledge and experience: over 700 operational sorties as a member of RAF Search and Rescue, my Police Class 1 driver training, I was formerly an aircrew survival instructor and am now a qualified Bushcraft and Survival Instructor and the experience gained from various incidents that I've come across over the years and of course things picked from student's experiences. For example the last lot of heavy snow I was flagged down by a gent in shirt sleeves, borderline hypothermic with his wife and two young kids in the car, they had got stuck in snow none had any cold weather clothing let alone kit in the car, they run down the battery and completely unprepared. Every year, every time we have severe weather we have those who get caught out, some due to lack of knowledge (as I said in my bit above - the main causes of AA's call outs - Battery failure, tyre failure and running out of fuel), to anyone with a bit of knowledge or vaguely prepared THIS SHOULD NOT HAPPEN, yet it does with frightening regularity. There are those who are aware of conditions but take the "Don't be a sissy" approach, I would argue that someone who knows what conditions are like yet fails to prepare is an even bigger fool than someone with no knowledge. Nature can be harsh - I've recovered the bodies to prove it! Based on information from the NHS, Mountain Rescue and UK SAR teams most fatal cases of outdoors hypothermia in the UK occur between temperatures of +10 degrees down to -6 degrees C to people who are within a 20 minute walk to a place of safety. Your decision. Pikeman, tbh most counties with far worse weather than ours deal better with it, they have longer to adapt most of the scandanavian countries it is a legal requirement to have winter tyres, and some areas tyre chains, and there is a cultural respect for the weather conditions that we in the UK just don't seem to have, we seem to bounce between ignorance and a macho contempt for it and just as most people get used to conditions they finish. Alex, if you like please use and adapt as you see fit and thank you.

From the website forum it appears his birthdate is 1 Jun - no idea of year yet...

[ex_matelot]

Regardless of the thread title..I wanna now hear Airborne artist's stories of derring-do. Anyone who takes the piss out of someone in the reserve SAS must have a few dits under his belt..surely??

[airborne_artist]

What was your reason for leaving 22, or even 21?

I left 21 after six years as my very new wife was diagnosed with multiple sclerosis.

[Lima Juliet]

I've been reading lots of his posts on Health and Safety for Beginners - There is no such thing as a "stupid" or "daft" health and safety question! (http://www.healthandsafetytips.co.uk)

It would seem that he left the RAF 13 years before 2009 (ie. 1996) - so why is he wearing his Sgt Airman Aircrew rank tabs some 18 years later in 2014!

Also, he talks about being a SAR medic in some threads and then asks where he can get qualified to teach a First Aid at Work course in another!

Still smells of poisson to me...

LJ

Same forum "During my time in the RAF SAR (I was an Air Loadmaster or as we were often called 'Dope on a Rope') we did trials with some of the types of aircraft the police use and most just are not suitable for this type of use, also many pilots do not recieve any rescue flight training, as a pilot rated on that type he should be aware of the airframes limitations and exclusions and if he had no rescue flight training or winch ops training he shouldn't have attempted what he did."

[Lima Juliet]

Another post on the same forum:

I used to be a reservist with the RAF Search & Rescue, in my other time I used to be a stage manager / stage crew. After my Sqn was disbanded I carried on crewing and was asked to stand in as the safety officer for one of the theatres I worked at after the SO had an accident and broke his leg.

Does that help? Didn't know we had Resrvists on SAR apart from some FTRS. I stand to be corrected...

[ex_matelot]

Fairdos AA..

Neck duly wound-in.
I apologise. Pm sent.

[NutLoose]

You could always email a member of 202 from that period

Page A-B - 202 Squadron Association (http://www.202-sqn-assoc.co.uk/page--a-b.html)

[Al-bert]

I was RAF SAR from 1978 to 1999 - 22 & 202 Sqns. Never heard of him and no, we didn't have first tour ALM's or reservists (not FTR even) back then. :hmm:

[Whenurhappy]

OK, there is prima facie evidence that this guy is telling a few porkies and perhaps 'bigging' himself up.

What do fellow PPruners think is the best remedy?


Serve multiple H&S infringement notices upon him, hoping the paper work with engulf him?
Insist that he spends a weekend with the West Country lot, where his survival skills might be, err, required?
Send him to the RAFA Annual conference and in doing so commit him to 2 days of mental torture?
Send him on a Unit Equality and Diversity Advisors' course?
Make him serve in 'today's' Air Force?

[lsh]

There are words & phrases we all use, and recognise.
I do not recognise any of the words or phrases from the "quotes", it is all very tortuous & oblique.

I do not recognise the name.

Do you know anyone who served 4 years?
(Incidents etc aside.)

lsh
:E

[St Johns Wort]

Tiger Mate, Al bert

Re the ‘no first tourists on SAR’. There was one. In 80/81(?) a crewman was selected during the Shawbury phase of training to go SAR however he couldn't go without being ‘badged’ aircrew so the system fudged it and he did a Puma course. After graduation he went straight to SAR where he had a long and successful career.

[cornish-stormrider]

So he did four years and over 700 shouts
Almost 200 a year, or four a week

Yeah ok, and I got a. 199 to run with more thrust than a J58

I call Walt - someone MSG the WaltenKommando

[Pontius Navigator]

Tiger Mate, NCO from our crew and a nav on our sqn, one JA who SAR mates should know.

[Al-bert]

ST JW - I stand corrected, but I can't guess who that might be, probably not our Walt though!

Pontius - certainly knew an ex Nimrod Nav by the initials JA - and a very fine nav was he! (I feel a song coming on) :ok:

Still, Walt did nearly as many 'shouts' as me (we never called them shouts btw) in my 21 years :ugh:

[barnstormer1968]

I've just popped back to this thread to see what's new.

Can I just add a few thoughts.
This chap may have been in the RAF, and maybe even in the Sqn he claims but perhaps in a totally different trade (or perhaps there is an ATC cadet Sqn with that number etc)

The fact he was looking for a course to enable him to teach first aid at work courses maybe just that. Being a medic at any level would not entitle you to be able to teach HSE first aid courses, you would still need to have the teaching cert.

He probably is a qualified bushcraft/survival instructor but that doesn't mean he has any military training or experience in this field. I myself am a qualified bushcraft instructor, and as far as I can see it literally means that someone who has no knowledge of bushcraft has printed something out for me and nothing more. From the qualifications I've seen the 'average' bushcraft qualification is just worthless and in no way has any connection to proper outdoor instructor Qualifications that have to be earned (mine certainly wasn't earned, and was dropped into file 13 pretty quickly)

Although his school seems a bit rubbish IMHO lets not confuse military survival priorities with general survival. When looking at the average student in his video I couldn't see many of them even being old enough to join the military, let alone be anywhere dangerous.

So, if anyone is really upset by this and wants to call Walt and is really on the outrage bus about this, just get the bus to collect a load of current SAR bods and get them on a block booking on one of his courses :)

[Basil]

the Tuareg state a “HANDFUL of sand” would make perfect sense
Well, it's a big desert but that dessicated do-do has been laid down over millenia :E

Re 'Concealment'; used to wonder about that :hmm:

[barnstormer1968]

Al-Bert.

Never mind how few times you got called out. You and our man are way behind the worlds greatest life guard.

If you have not heard of him, check out the series 'son of the beach' starring Notch Johnson the worlds greatest life guard..........with over a million people rescued!




Oh, it is a comedy by the way, and a superb parody of bay watch.

[Pontius Navigator]

Al-bert, that's the man. John M and Pete W also came across the same time. Both were outstanding wet men and badly missed but they wanted out.

[AR1]

Just reading Harry Redknapps book, and he was conned spectacularly by a 'Jockey' called 'Lee Topliss' (A real Jockey's who has nothing to do with con).. It's funny in one respect, but the reality is people who con the public should be outed.
I went to school with this chap, and it's not funny. ?Fake reverend? George Gordon in court over alleged fraud offences - Liverpool Echo (http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/fake-reverend-george-gordon-court-3342506)

[Dengue_Dude]

Why don't we email him and ask what his course number through SARTU was (presuming they still did it the same way then).

I was always told the Crewman's part of SARTU was the hardest course in the RAF, from the little bit I saw and folks I knew, I can believe it.

Al Clapp, Micky Crawford, Smokey Furness?

[Al R]

I was once approached by this man (link below) with a proposal for a publishing joint venture. He had done his research, we got chatting and he claimed to have done military service in order to qualify for a family inheritance. He told me his family had come over from France ".. after the war". "Really, I asked.. ".. First or Second"? "Neither, dear boy, he intoned without missing a beat.. "1066".

I had been a civvy for 2 years, had just left a FTSE100 company and was now starting up a new business. We had just been listed in Tesco (forget Dragons Den!), were growing very quickly and I was probably receptive to wanting to believe someone who could help our trajectory, although he was clearly BS'ing and he left followed by us cracking up.

I don't like gratuitous outing, but gullible people will be approaching a survival instructor, possibly swayed by a proclaimed specialist military background, to learn life saving skills. Not on.

Christopher Fulke-Greville, Chris Fulke Greville, Help4Heroes Fraud (http://chrisfulke-greville.wix.com/chrisfulke-greville)

[Al-bert]

or just ask which Flight and when, Dengue D.


Al, Smokey and Mick all grand chaps !

[gr4techie]

What do fellow PPruners think is the best remedy?

Make him serve in 'today's' Air Force?

Thats a bit of a harsh punishment, poor guy.

[Basil]

Lord Fulke Greville, a fake title purchased for £19.99
Reminds me of a 'Lord something or other' swanning around our Caribbean hotel years ago. Obvious prat who'd just purchased "Lord of the Manor - if that.

[Lima Juliet]

Anyone with some spare time should have a chat with a copper for suspiscion of fraud through false representation with respect to the Fraud Act 2006:

2Fraud by false representation

(1)A person is in breach of this section if he—
(a)dishonestly makes a false representation, and
(b)intends, by making the representation—
(i)to make a gain for himself or another, or
(ii)to cause loss to another or to expose another to a risk of loss.
(2)A representation is false if—
(a)it is untrue or misleading, and
(b)the person making it knows that it is, or might be, untrue or misleading.
(3)“Representation” means any representation as to fact or law, including a representation as to the state of mind of—
(a)the person making the representation, or
(b)any other person.
(4)A representation may be express or implied.
(5)For the purposes of this section a representation may be regarded as made if it (or anything implying it) is submitted in any form to any system or device designed to receive, convey or respond to communications (with or without human intervention).

LJ :ok:

[Wrathmonk]

I was always told the Crewman's part of SARTU was the hardest course in the RAF

Come on Dengue_Dude - you know the hardest course is actually the RAF Cooks Course. After all, no bu88er has ever passed it.:ok:

Hat. Check.

Coat. Check.

Taxi......

[Dengue_Dude]

Quote:
I was always told the Crewman's part of SARTU was the hardest course in the RAF
Come on Dengue_Dude - you know the hardest course is actually the RAF Cooks Course. After all, no bu88er has ever passed it.

Hat. Check.

Coat. Check.

Taxi......

Bye Wrathmonk :D:D:D

[Adam Nams]

... and the hardest part of the course was walking across the car park on day one. If the QHCI's didn't like the look of you then your rail warrant would be ready for you at lunchtime (allegedly!).

[Tiger_mate]

.... Been there - done that!

Happily the egos of yesteryear are history.

[Basil]

Happily the egos of yesteryear are history.
You might change your opinion if you met one or two at my reunion :E

[snaggletooth]

I emailed Mr Day at the Essex bushcraft school with a link to this thread and an invitation to comment. I received the following reply today;

Hi Jon,

I have no idea what, if anything Mr Day is going to say or do in regards to this. I am in no way going to defend his actions as to all appearances, he has misled not only me, but the also the man who highly recommended him to me, who was a man that I served with and therefore trusted.

Mr Day has been relieved of all duties and responsibilities and no longer has a role within Wildcrafts, all references to him will be removed as soon as is possible to do so.

I would like to take this opportunity to apologise for any offence that his actions may have caused, and would ask that you kindly pass on my apologies to the members of your forum, which not being SAR/ Aircrew member, I have no access to.

Yours

Les Davidson
Senior Instructor
WILDCRAFTS BUSHCRAFT SCHOOL

[Whenurhappy]

Oops. Not funny, is it.

Perhaps this guy was a good instructor - rather than resting on his rather tenuous Service connections - he should have relied on his ability.

Although still serving, I have long learned that very few people outside the Services give a damn about one's service background - and to use it as a crutch after leaving the Services is, well, a sign of insecurity.

AVM the Hon Archie Bigglesworth VC DSO DFC* (Retd)

Available to lecture on every conceivable Service-related subject.

[Courtney Mil]

And,indeed, he has disappeared from their website. Goodness!

[Dengue_Dude]

'He might have been a very good instructor'. Yep he might have, but do it in his own name and not try to cream any hard-earned kudos from someone else's effort.


The guys I mentioned earlier were all characters, but the kudos they earned is theirs, not for some Walt to mug.


Good riddance (forgiving soul ain't I?)

[Thomas coupling]

Didn't Bear Grylls leave 21 because of a broken back?

[Lima Juliet]

Good

He should count himself lucky that he's not sitting on a fraud charge. People like him make me sick to the stomach.

I thank the head of the establishment for being honourable and for doing the right thing as a Service Veteran himself.

LJ

[NutLoose]

Though perhaps a tad hasty as he has not heard from the other side yet?

[Lima Juliet]

Lots of SAR Boys (or Girls) have commented on this newspaper (the Harwich & Manningtree Standard) website saying that they have never heard of him. Also, they ask the newspaper to run expose on him and others that find it neccesary to de-fraud the general public by stating they are something that they obviously aren't.

Survival expert speaks about ferry jumpers (From Harwich and Manningtree Standard) (http://www.harwichandmanningtreestandard.co.uk/news/11042404.Survival_expert_speaks_about_ferry_jumpers/)

LJ

[NutLoose]

Glad to see a responder has pointed out that the company involved has responded so well, after all he too has had the wool pulled over his eyes too.

[Skeleton]

Though perhaps a tad hasty as he has not heard from the other side yet?



I think we can assume that when he was relieved of his duties, he would have been given the reasons behind the decision and a chance to refute them.

[airborne_artist]

Thomas coupling wrote:


Didn't Bear Grylls leave 21 because of a broken back?

No, he left for another reason.

[snaggletooth]

Beware the law of unintended consequences...

Dear Jon,

thank you for posting my reply to your email on your forum.

In light of what has happened, and after reading the posts on this forum, I have taken the hard decision to close down after my last confirmed bookings at the end of April. Unfortunately in the small bushcraft community that I am a member of something like this is more than enough to finish off 14 odd Years of hard work.


Best regards


Les Davidson

[NutLoose]

No.... I read and had to register on that newspaper to refute some of the SAR communities posts, they were inferring he was an owner of the company. Well done to those who were posting on the local papers replies page that he was the owner, you probably have just destroyed a totally innocent persons livelyhood :(

re reading this thread I cannot believe some people even started having a pop at the owner who is totally innocent it this..


.

[Dengue_Dude]

I think I know where you're coming from Nutloose, but most of us have run into 'Walts' - especially in the flying game (God knows why . . .)


But watching that televised interview, I was smelling rats from not far in - especially when someone gets the four Survival priorities wrong or paraphrases them incorrectly.


It was drummed into us Protection, Location, Water and Food and changed slightly for combat situations which most certainly don't apply here. You didn't THINK about this, it just came out - or rather didn't in this guy's case.


My question of this organisation, and perhaps it's a little sharp, is:


'What value was this commercial training if the guy is not trotting out the answers in accordance with HIS training?' We may scoff about military training from time to time, but it was excellent in the main. Surely, paying customers require principles which have been 'honed' over decades.


We also don't know what state the business was in prior to this debacle - so blaming the folks on this site for a bit of righteous indignation (generated by all Walts) is in its turn a bit OTT.


Here endeth this afternoon's lesson (you can tell I've retired).

[NutLoose]

You are missing the point, the person in question WAS not the walt, BUT has or is in the process of seeing his business and livelihood destroyed because of this.. and some of the posts on here were to put it politely in my view offensive to the owner, whom has done nothing wrong but to employ someone recommended to him...

[minigundiplomat]

Agree with nutloose,


I can't help feeling sorry for the business owner; he seems to be completely blameless and employed an ex-military guy on the recommendation of someone he trusted.


Et voila - 14 years hard work down the dunny.


Walts deserve outing; but there needs to be robust ROE on the fire directed at them.


There is a great deal of effort, time and personal credibility put into extolling the advantages of employing former servicemen/women in what can be a challenging marketplace. People like this undermine that work, but equally, so does forcing an innocent man and his business out of operation.

[NutLoose]

I would also add please avoid visiting the newspaper page, as that is artificially keeping it at the top of the read pages, thus inflicting further damage on his company.

[gr4techie]

The business owner should do what corporations do when they get a bad name or legal issues... Just change the name and logo. cough Blackwater cough cough.

[Shack37]

Ah.....the old engage brain before opening gob, or keyboard.
To think, some of the aforementioned posters were once gung ho themselves, so THEY say.
Roll on the next WALT rant, eh chaps.

[gr4techie]

How come no walts want to be a fitter on Tornado?

The only survival course I've recieved in my career is how to avoid your blob from getting killed and moved back to base, in a game of Uckers. On one det, we checked into a hotel that was only 4 star, that was a hard survival situation. Never had to eat twigs and berries with a large machete though. Instead of making a fire with 2 sticks and a rabbits foot, I've a camping stove you can borrow.

[Courtney Mil]

If mixi-blobs are allowed, it's easy, Techie! Just don't get a syph on yer donk!

Seriously, I can't see why Les should decide to close down. The vast majority of folk booking onto his courses won't have heard of the issue and lots of those that have probably won't care. Unless Les has other strings to his bow that he wishes to turn to, I say crack on.

[barnstormer1968]

I do feel for Les here.
He was bigging up mr Day in the vid as having been there and done it, while being humble himself.

As per above he could simply change the schools name and carry on.

A large majority of outdoor customers couldn't care less if the instructor is ex military as it has virtually no bearing on what is taught/want they want to do.

The fact that Mr Day may not have been the genuine article and no one noticed only reinforces that.

[Lima Juliet]

Do I really believe that a few snipes by anonymous posters has sunk the business? Nope.

The majority of attendees for these types of courses will be Stag/Hen weekends, Office 'Team Building' events, Scouts/Schools/Cadets or airsoft-style Walts. They are the key contenders for his business. None of these give a rat's @rse about what is posted on a Military Aircew Forum.

We can all draw our own conclusions on why he has decided to wind up his company; mine is not in accord with some of the posts above. :=

LJ

[TheWizard]

Didn't Bear Grylls leave 21 because of a broken back?

You mean Lt Col Bear Grylls, Royal Marines? https://mydonate.bt.com/fundraisers/beargrylls

Raising money for charity still :ok:

[Al R]

Leon,

Call me cynical, but I'm a bit with you on that assessment. Anyway..

Reputation.com - Online Reputation Management | Reputation.com® (http://uk.reputation.com)

[Lima Juliet]

Al

Is that like Photoshop for online reputation? :ok:

LJ

[Al R]

:ok:

Try googling "Cameron" and "Cocaine" in the same search window these days.

[Lima Juliet]

Now if true, that would make the next round of cumpulsory drug testing interesting!

Now if it was BoJo, I wouldn't be that surprised - he must be on something! :eek:

LJ

PS. It would appear that the E-Goaters are less sympathetic to the survival business...

[Al R]

Now if true

:oh: ..........

[Dengue_Dude]

We also don't know what state the business was in prior to this debacle - so blaming the folks on this site for a bit of righteous indignation (generated by all Walts) is in its turn a bit OTT.

See my earlier comment. This may have been the last straw, this may be a convenient reason to cite. Who knows?

It wasn't the posters here that employed the Walt was it? Yes he did the right thing, but how one-sided was the parting of the ways. Who knows?

Yellow/black . . . pulled on this for me.