Honourable Company of Air Pilots

[John Eacott]

GAPAN (the Guild of Air Pilots and Air Navigators) is no more.
Royal Charter
Last Wednesday 19 February, our own Flying Lawyer presided over a splendid Banquet held at the City of London Guildhall to celebrate not only the grant of a Royal Charter to what used to be GAPAN but HM The Queen bestowing upon it the title 'Honourable Company'.
Several other livery companies have obtained Royal Charters over the centuries but only one other has ever received this rare honour, when King George V bestowed the title on the Master Mariners.


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/WelcomingtheDuke_zpsda3cf5a2.jpg
HRH The Duke of Edinburgh being welcomed by HH Judge Tudor Owen, Master of the Honourable Company of Air Pilots


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/G594GuestsofHonour_zps7950e0bf.jpg
The Master and the Duke with Alderman Sir David Howard Lord Mayor Locum Tenens & City Sheriff Adrian Waddingham


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G456copy_zpsadc9a6cc.jpg
Air Chief Marshal Sir Stuart Peach Vice Chief Defence Staff


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v140/Rotorheads/Honourable%20Company%20of%20Air%20Pilots/1673m109G458copy-1.jpg
Mrs Maria Evans & Air Vice Marshal Edward Stringer ACAS


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v140/Rotorheads/Honourable%20Company%20of%20Air%20Pilots/1673m109G471copy-1.jpg
Admiral of the Fleet, Sir Benjamin Bathurst


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v140/Rotorheads/Honourable%20Company%20of%20Air%20Pilots/1673m109G448copy-1.jpg
Lt Cdr Chris Barber OC 847 Naval Air Squadron


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Air Marshal Barry North


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G454copy_zps49b7b989.jpg
Air Chief Marshal Sir Peter Squire


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G561copy_zps8bbe21f6.jpg
Air Cdre & Mrs Malcolm White


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G525copy_zps38498570.jpg
Air Cdre Rick Peacock-Edwards (Past Master)


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v140/Rotorheads/Honourable%20Company%20of%20Air%20Pilots/1673m109G549copy-1.jpg
Gp Capt Tom Eeles

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v140/Rotorheads/Honourable%20Company%20of%20Air%20Pilots/1673m109G504copy-1.jpg
Rear Admiral and Mrs Colin Cooke-Priest (Past Master)


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v140/Rotorheads/Honourable%20Company%20of%20Air%20Pilots/1673m109G502copy-1.jpg
Gp Capt & Mrs Roger Gault (Past Master)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v140/Rotorheads/Honourable%20Company%20of%20Air%20Pilots/1673m109G499copy-1.jpg
Sqn Ldr Nick Goodwyn & fiancée




More to follow when the carrier pigeon refuels on the way from wet and damp UK to warm and fireswept Australia ;)

[John Eacott]

HRH The Duke of Edinburgh presents a sword to HH Judge Tudor Owen (Master)
commemorating the granting of a Royal Charter and Honourable status.


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G770copy_zps37c657eb.jpg


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/109G_771%20600_zpsu3zkpu46.jpg


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G773copy_zps9acbb166.jpg


http://www.eacott.com.au/gallery/d/6089-1/1673m109G798copy.jpg
"I know you'll find it very hard to believe that the Duke of Edinburgh would speak his mind."
Honourable Company of Air Pilots Judge Tudor Owen
Guildhall London

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G787copy_zps23a1c006.jpg

[The B Word]

Since when did 'Ted' become 'Edward'? :p

Plus what happened to the 'Honorable Company of Pilots incorporating Air Navigators' - espcially as Stu Peach is one!:p

[Roland Pulfrew]

Since when did Ted become Edward about when he got his 2nd star I believe;)

VMR being unable to attend the Dinner; I hope a good time was had by all!

[Could be the last?]

So what is the sketch with white bow-ties and waistcoats? I thought it may have been a VSO thing but SO2s as well?

[BEagle]

Could be the last, the order of dress for this Royal Banquet stipulated 'white tie', which is traditional for royal functions.

For RAF officers, the equivalent is Full Ceremonial Evening Dress (No. 5A SD), which includes a white waistcoat and white bow tie; for officers of the Royal Navy, I believe that it is No 2A Dress, which includes a white waistcoat but a black bow tie. There will be a plethora of equivalents for the Army, of course!

No 5A used to be worn at Officers Mess Summer Balls; however, the practice was discontinued many years ago and is now, I understand, only required at evening functions if royalty is present.

[Wander00]

I remember being issued with a white waistcoat, white stiff-fronted shirt and single ended bow tie (black) at the Towers in 196.........3. Single ended bow tie was a bu@@er to tie, ISTR

[Wensleydale]

Crossing over from the apocryphal stories thread....


There is the tale of a newly graduated RAF Regiment acting pilot officer who went to Buckingham Palace as part of QCS when they were given the honour of mounting guard for a couple of weeks. Being off duty one evening, the said officer was invited to dine with the "Family". Knowing nothing of horses and corgis, the conversation passed over his head as he sat there looking miserable. Prince Philip decided to break the ice:


"Tell me young man. The army regiments all seem to arrive with mess dress in several colours and styles and yet you RAF chaps always seem to wear the same thing."


"Well Sir", the Rock triumphantly replied as he at last knew something that he could contribute. " I am wearing No 5B Mess Dress which has a black bow tie, a soft white golf-ball shirt, and a blue waistcoat. We also have 5A dress which was a white waistcoat and a stiff wing collar, but we only wear that on special occasions".

[newt]

And there was me thinking this was all a secret squirrel affair with funny handshakes etc!:E

[BEagle]

Wensleydale, I believe that story was recounted by the Prince of Wales?

Wasn't the final comment from the Duke "Such as dining with the Queen?".

No newt, no rituals or brotherly grips are practised!

[teeteringhead]

What a splendid evening it was! And the "post party party" in the Cowdray Room was a good one too!

5A did indeed used to be worn "when ladies were present", and so was the rig at Summer Balls and LGNs, but IIRC (which I may not :8) was worn with black tie.

There were a few black tie wearers with Mess Kit last week (yes you are guilty Sir Stephen!!), and even the occasional cummerbund. := There seemed to be very few proper stiff shirts with separate starched collars, and rather too many soft fronted "wing collared" shirts for my liking, which one might associate with travelling salesmen ....... :=:=

One half expected them to be matched with white socks and suede shoes......

And as to the single-winged cohort, one did glimpse a VSO (pilot) pointedly obscuring the words "Incorporating Air Navigators" on the menu with his knife!

[Basil]

ISTR that, by the time I left in 1973, we'd ditched wing collars, stiff fronts & studs and gone for turn-down collars, a change of which I thoroughly approved.
Don't recollect seeing white tie with messkit; we just wore the white waistcoat instead of the blue - or perhaps I never attended anything sufficiently grand. :p

[Wander00]

I had forgotten the loose starched wing collar that went with the stiff shirt

[MPN11]

Still in possession of the white waistcoat, tie and stiff shirt and collars ... albeit a bit yellowed and probably now too small (they seem to shrink over time) :)

I have no regrets about the general withdrawal of 5A ... bloody painful if you sat down carelessly, an uncomfortable rig when standing, and one invariably got the shirt creased when installing the studs.

[Old Bricks]

Rumour at Cranners during flight cadet days was that the 5A mess kit (stiff-fronted shirt, detachable winged collar, white waistcoat, black bow tie) was required because females were only allowed over the threshold twice a year for grad balls, and once you had your 5A on it functioned better than the average chastity belt. (It was always useful the following day to keep your eyes peeled to locate and restock collar and shirt studs that had popped-off during the evening.)
ISTR that one of the main reasons for the demise of the outfit was the increasing difficulty in finding laundries that could actually wash and starch the shirt and collar.

[BEagle]

Old Bricks, I remember wearing 5A for your Grad Ball, to which those of us who'd escaped to University were invited. I was staying overnight in Grantham and can assure you that trying to drive a car with a wing collar trying to cut ones throat is emphatically not to be recommended! Her ladyship of the time thought it most amusing though....:*

Perhaps another reason for the demise was that increasing numbers of oikish individuals had taken to wearing elasticated bow ties :eek: , which could not be worn with a wing collar?

[Heliport]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v140/Rotorheads/Honourable%20Company%20of%20Air%20Pilots/1673m109G514copy-1.jpg
Air Cdre Chris Luck Commandant RAF College Cranwell & Robert Pooley (Past Master)


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G564copy_zps3a4d6458.jpg
Sqn Ldr Chris Ford


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G114copy_zpsdcf863ee.jpg
AVM Ray Pentland, Chaplain in Chief RAF, ACM Sir Stephen Dalton, Mrs Christine Pentland


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v140/Rotorheads/Honourable%20Company%20of%20Air%20Pilots/1673m109G886copy.jpg
Capt John Robinson & AM Ian Macfadyen
Formerly Poacher 1 & Poacher 3


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/Howarth_zps0e2e8ad1.jpg
Sir Gerald & Lady Howarth


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G229copy_zpsb149ec82.jpg
AVM & Mrs Steve Nicholl


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G310copy_zps1359fdfe.jpg
Col Andrew Cash Regimental Colonel Army Air Corps
Fg Off Ben Chapman RAFVR(T)
?
Wg Cdr Naeem OC London Wing ATC


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G279copy_zps8cb63def.jpg
AVM David Stubbs


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G614copy_zps227e3ffb.jpg


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G630copy_zps907ec5c6.jpg

[Old Bricks]

BEagle
In those days, a chap could drive from Cranwell to Grantham in full mess kit at dawn without any busybody even suggesting that one was anything but stone-cold sober. It's all gone downhill since then.

[Union Jack]

Very impressed by the splendid record of the whole affair -and fascinated by the wingspan of the white tie Air Vice Marshal Nicholls is wearing.

He could easily have spared half of it for CAS, and indeed I'm surprised that no career-conscious junior officer offered to swap ties....:ok:

[Wrathmonk]

He could easily have spared half of it for CAS, and indeed I'm surprised that no career-conscious junior officer offered to swap ties....

If it is Dalton to whom you refer to as CAS then you're a bit behind the times as he hasn't been CAS (or in the RAF) since 31 July 2013. Of course this means he no longer has a (free) PSO / SO / ADC / House Steward etc to remind him which uniform is required when. Perhaps the dress regs don't apply to retired officers.....

Edited to add ....

Just had a look at his bio. He is retired but

Dalton was appointed as Honorary Air Commodore to the RAF Regiment on 21 September 2013, in succession to Air Chief Marshal Sir Richard Johns

[Wwyvern]

There was a thread some time ago concerning the wearing of miniatures at formal functions by those in civilian dress. The answer seems to be when military personnel are present in mess kit.

At Old Cranwellian Reunion dinners, the dress for all, serving and retired, is black tie, no medals or neck decorations. At Test Pilot Dinners at Boscombe, where serving and retired guests are present, dress is mess kit or black tie, miniatures to be worn.

[teeteringhead]

Dalton was appointed as Honorary Air Commodore to the RAF Regiment on 21 September 2013 You can't see it in the picture above, but he was wearing Regiment "Mudguards" on his Mess Kit too....

.... but still wrong weskit and tie!

[cuefaye]

ACM Dalton seems pleased to see someone:ooh:

[Union Jack]

If it is Dalton to whom you refer to as CAS then you're a bit behind the times as he hasn't been CAS (or in the RAF) since 31 July 2013.

I'm indebted to you, Wrathmonk, especially since on mature reflection I do indeed recall the interest in Air Chief Marshal Pulford's rotary wing background on the announcement of his elevation to CAS.

However (with apologies to FL for thread drift), I am now further intrigued by the fact that Air Chief Marshal Dalton is wearing an aiguillette despite no longer being either Air Aide-de-Camp to HM The Queen or a member of the Air Force Board. I am aware that a former Air Aide-de-Camp is permitted to continue to wear the Royal Cypher itself but, by comparison with the Chaplain-in-Chief's Royal aiguillette as a QHC, I suspect that it is the Type 4 aiguillette which is still being worn.

If only Ben Bathurst had worn uniform perhaps we could have had a straight comparison!

Jack

[Heliport]

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G435copy_zps8106540a.jpg
AVM Stringer & Ewan Lister Senior Student ULAS


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G599copy_zpsa7e51f93.jpg
ULAS Guard of Honour


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G436copy_zpsda45f7ea.jpg
AM Baz North & ULAS Cadet


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G733copy_zps29f089d0.jpg
'Post Horn Gallop'
Capt Peter Horton & Cdre Chris Palmer in foreground


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/G704AVMarshalStringer_zpsb7282759.jpg
Andrew Morgan Prime Warden Fishmongers’ Company
AVM Stringer ACAS
Christopher McLean-May Master Clothworkers’ Company


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v140/Rotorheads/Honourable%20Company%20of%20Air%20Pilots/1673m109G685copy.jpg
Mrs Maria Evans & Col Andrew Cash Regimental Colonel Army Air Corps


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G823copy_zps42bb1b05.jpg
Capt Peter Benn & Lt Cdr Graeme Spence OC 847 Naval Air Squadron


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G220copy_zps8036fb1f.jpg
Gp Capt & Mrs Simon Brailsford


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G903copy_zps0715e284.jpg
Gp Capt David Bentley Commandant CFS & Gp Capt Richard Allen

[Wrathmonk]

Union Jack

This is very sad I know but according to AP1358 chapter 9

.... an air aide-de-camp may, on relinquishing the appointment continue to wear the small size Royal Cypher of each Sovereign under whom he has served and been appointed. The Royal Cypher of the reigning Sovereign is to be worn above any other Royal Cypher. With the exception of personal and air aides-decamp, Royal Cyphers are not worn after the appointment is relinquished

I assume with the Royal Cypher go the Aiguillettes.

And as a strange co-incidence the officer modelling how to wear such Aiguillettes in the AP features in the second photo down in Heliports post below.

Good to see some fine medal racks as well! Even from the non-RW/ME fleets!

[teeteringhead]

Another idiosyncracy of ADCs' Royal Cyphers will - as I understand it - sadly need to be addressed in the next few decades.

My understanding is that technically for all Royal ADCs - including Nurse, Doctor and Padre equivalents - HM gives and only the same HM can take away.

So - on change of Monarch to put it delicately - those who had the "big" cyphers of the previous Monarch would retain "small" ones in perpetuity, as the "awarding" Monarch is no longer around to "remove". If subsequently made ADC or equivalent by the new Monarch, they would also wear the "big" version of the new Royal Cypher.

I believe that was what was done in 1952 - I must search for photographic evidence, as there should be some in the 1950s with small GVIR and big EIIR.

[Basil]

Old Bricks,
once you had your 5A on it functioned better than the average chastity belt
At the risk of lowering the tone of this august thread, ISTR that the stiff front, wing collar and bow tie (NEVER a ready tied) did make going for a summer ball musical interlude a bit of a kerfuffle but, nevertheless, worthwhile :E

[Union Jack]

I assume with the Royal Cypher go the Aiguillettes.

Thank you for your further comments, Wrathmonk. I was aware of the article you quote, but my reading of it was that the Royal Cypher alone continued to be worn. I also liked your last two comments.

That said, I will cease concerning myself who did or did not wear the correct rig, and my compliments to FL and all those concerned with what was clearly an excellent evening, all the more so for the "all inclusiveness" of the occasion.:ok:

Jack

[FODPlod]

Gp Capt David Bentley Commandant CFS & Gp Capt Richard AllenDid anyone else mistakenly read this as Dick Bentley and Dave Allen for a split second?

I suppose you have to be of a certain age. :O

[Wander00]

Nah, got all their fingers.............hat, coat.........!


More seriously, looks to have been a brilliant evening, aguillettes correct or not

[thing]

Crikey, Pete Squire is looking old now. Surprised to see a fishmonger there. Is he a pilot?

Looked like a great evening was had by all.

[500N]

Re the wings on the sleeve of "Lt Cdr Graeme Spence OC 847 Naval Air Squadron".

Interesting place to wear wings ?

Anyone know why on the sleeve and not above the medals ?

[Wander00]

Peter Squire 89 Entry, me 88 Entry - we are ALL beginning to look old (er)

[StopStart]

500N

Because that's where the FAA wear their wings. :hmm:

[Tankertrashnav]

Good to see some fine medal racks as well! Even from the non-RW/ME fleets!


Not least that worn by HRH Prince Philip. As well as the usual baubles picked up by all royals over the years, he has 5 campaign stars from WW2, all earned for genuine active service. Groups with 5 stars have always been fairly scarce, although I guess there will be a few more now since the introduction of the Arctic Star.

[kintyred]

I thought I was inadvertently leafing through "Hello" magazine when I opened this thread.

[N2erk]

Prompts 2 questions- is the Steve Nicholl in post 17, sometimes AKA "brains" or "AWACS" (ex F4s) and shouldn't it be Sir Ian McF??

[Fly3]

I can recall more than one gentleman being fined a round of port for being caught wearing pre-tied bow tie at a mess dinner.

[Wander00]

"Sir" Ian McF - surprisingly not

[Courtney Mil]

Indeed. If there was ever a man that should have been "Sir", it's certainly Fadge.

[Wensleydale]

"I am now further intrigued by the fact that Air Chief Marshal Dalton is wearing an aiguillette despite no longer being either Air Aide-de-Camp to HM The Queen or a member of the Air Force Board. I am aware that a former Air Aide-de-Camp is permitted to continue to wear the Royal Cypher itself but, by comparison with the Chaplain-in-Chief's Royal aiguillette as a QHC, I suspect that it is the Type 4 aiguillette which is still being worn."




Another bit of thread drift back to "Apocryphal Tales". I heard about a senior naval officer at Cranwell who was wearing an aiguillette at a beer call in the Officers' mess when he noticed that a newly graduated Acting Pilot Officer was staring intently at him.


"Can I help you, young man?" the VSO asked.


"I was wondering what the gold string was for," replied the APO.


"It is an aiguillette - it signifies that I used to be ADC to her Majesty" said the Naval Officer pompously.


The APO then came out with, "Oh - I thought that it was so your parrot got a better grip".

[BEagle]

Fly3 wrote: I can recall more than one gentleman being fined a round of port for being caught wearing pre-tied bow tie at a mess dinner.

I should think so too!

Fines for Dining-In Night misdeeds were quite rare though. But at pre-pongo Wattisham, one jovial Irish Fg Off navigator complained loudly about the lead-filled rubber chicken (it was actually very tough pheasant) we'd been served. So, after the loyal toast, a 'helpful' colleague obtained a catering-sized tin of baked beans from the kitchen and plonked it down in front of him, wherupon E**c set about it with gusto. The PMC, OC Eng Wg (and not a 56(F) Sqn favourite...), took a dim view of this, banged his gavel and announce that Fg Off H**p would buy brandy for the mess. 3 bottles were then produced and were passed around. But the whisper went round amongst the rest of us that no-one was to take any (apart from a couple of blunties to whom the whisper hadn't reached in time - they didn't drink it though, once they'd heard the instruction). Thus 3 almost full bottles ended up in front of E**c, who poured himself a glass and raised it in the direction of the PMC, thanking him for saving him the trouble of going to the bar!

[teeteringhead]

TTN

As well as the usual baubles picked up by all royals over the years, he has 5 campaign stars from WW2, And one of them has an M-i-D oakleaf too - from Battle of Cape Matapan IIRC.

Respect Sir.

[N2erk]

Thanks- it wasn't a suggestion, I thot Fadge had been knighted. How about AVM Steve Nicholl- is he the ex F4 driver?:confused:

[Flying Lawyer]

The B Word
what happened to the 'Honorable Company of Pilots incorporating Air Navigators' - espcially as Stu Peach is one!
Our full title is 'The Honourable Company of Air Pilots incorporating Air Navigators'.
It's quite long so will inevitably be shortened to 'Air Pilots'.


thing
Surprised to see a fishmonger there. Is he a pilot? No, not a pilot, nor even a fishmonger in the usual sense. He's a television director.
There were also (for example) a Draper, a Merchant Taylor, a Skinner, a Clothworker, a Pewterer, a Barber-Surgeon, a Tallow Chandler, a Butcher, a Cordwainer, a Bowyer and a Fletcher.
They are all City of London Livery Companies. Some, such as the Honourable Company of Air Pilots, are linked to a craft or trade; others no longer have such a link, sometimes because the craft/trade no longer exists. All livery companies are involved in charitable work; some are purely charitable foundations.


teeteringhead
What a splendid evening it was! And the "post party party" in the Cowdray Room was a good one too! A splendid evening indeed. :ok:
Our Patron, the Duke of Edinburgh, clearly thought so too - as can be seen in the photographs.
I'm sorry we didn't meet at either the party or the "post party party".
Or perhaps we did and you didn't reveal your PPRuNe ID?



Tudor Owen
(Master of The Honourable Company of Air Pilots incorporating Air Navigators.)

[26er]

Am I alone in thinking that judging from the photos The Honourable Company of Air Pilots must consist of VSOs of the Services. Perhaps the civil aviation contingent in their DJs don't make such interesting pictures.

[BEagle]

26er, the Company has a wide membership and is emphatically not made up of senior military officers.

Civilian dress for this event was 'white tie', evening tail coat not a dinner jacket.

[Tankertrashnav]

It's quite long so will inevitably be shortened to 'Air Pilots'.





T'was ever thus :(

By the way, can I join or do I have to be asked?

[gr4techie]

Am I alone in thinking that judging from the photos The Honourable Company of Air Pilots must consist of VSOs of the Services. Perhaps the civil aviation contingent in their DJs don't make such interesting pictures.

Maybe the civil aviation contingent don't need lots of gold braid and badges to make them feel special.

[BEagle]

Tankertrashnav, if you wish to apply for membership of the Company, please see http://www.airpilots.org/file/1484/air-pilots-membership-application-form-2013-14.pdf

[Wrathmonk]

Perhaps the civil aviation contingent in their DJs don't make such interesting pictures.

or perhaps they are posted on one of the many non-military boards within PPRuNe instead....

[Flying Lawyer]

26er Am I alone in thinking that judging from the photos The Honourable Company of Air Pilots must consist of VSOs of the Services. Perhaps the civil aviation contingent in their DJs don't make such interesting pictures. Since this is the Military Aircrew forum, it's not surprising that the photos are mainly of service personnel because they are more likely to be known.
Most of our members are/were professionals (commercial & service or both at different stages of their careers) but PPLs like me are made very welcome.

Some civvies:

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G524copy_zps5ebf4cc2.jpg
Capt & Mrs Peter Bugge (Past Master)


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G578copy_zps88569b92.jpg
Mr & Mrs Tony Edwards (PPL)


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G539copy_zps9831da68.jpg
Captains Colin Cox and Mike Davidson


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G572copy_zps9d78859b.jpg
Capt Hugh Dibley


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G291copy_zps112c602b.jpg
Dr Sam Waller (PPL) & her guest


http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G295copy_zps0582ec0d.jpg
Capt Jock Lowe (Past Master) & Ms Petra Boekle



Tankertrashnav
Yes, you can join. You don't have to wait to be asked.
You'll need a proposer and seconder. Having read many of your posts over the years, I'd be happy to do either if you need a second sponsor.


gr4techie
Maybe the civil aviation contingent don't need lots of gold braid and badges to make them feel special. I realise people are often very different in real life from their PPRuNe persona but, having read many of your posts over the years, I doubt if you'd enjoy being a member.


FL

[Courtney Mil]

How about AVM Steve Nicholl- is he the ex F4 driver?

Indeed, yes. Steve Nicholl CB CBE AFC of F4 fame and Station Commander at RAF Leuchars, early 90s. Another very fine officer, ACDS and BAeSystems Director of Military Requirements.

http://m.c.lnkd.licdn.com/mpr/pub/image-KGGMfteDtRwYYiEt6sgEKho8Nb187iCCKoGXKf-DNtvT7wxnKGGXLu3DNhm-sLn9bvyk/steve-nicholl.jpg

And he refuses to age!!!

[redsnail]

If I may post, Checkboard and myself were there. It was a cracking night :ok:

[Courtney Mil]

Ah, finally got it. ...on Monday. Harry, yeah?

[gr4techie]

Flying Lawer, I find the problem with text is people do not get the context it was written in. With face to face speech, you get the tone and body language. I did not mean anything bad by my comment. I was just pointing out all the bling, which (as you guessed) is a bit OTT for me.

[Tankertrashnav]

Flying lawyer - thanks for your kind offer.

If I'm honest Ive always been a bit in awe of the organisation (in its previous form at least). I was never more than a bog standard squadron nav, so thought I may have been a bit out of my depth in such august company. But maybe I'll give it a go!

[redsnail]

Tankertrashnav, I'm not services and never have been. No one really cares as every one is there for an enjoyable time. We've been to 2 events (plus the newbies afternoon) and we've been fortunate to be on tables with fascinating folks. All good company. :D

[Flying Lawyer]

TTN
I hope you do.

gr4techie
I must have misunderstood what you meant by "need lots of gold braid and badges to make them feel special."
They complied with the Dress Code for this very special celebration which was 'White Tie or equivalent Mess Dress with miniatures'. I'm certain the overwhelming majority of our members, probably all, are pleased when current and former service personnel wear mess kit to our formal dinners - and would be disappointed if they didn't.

I've noticed that you've commented, on a few occasions, that there's not much sign of public support for the armed services beyond the immediate vicinity of military establishments so I hope you are pleased to see that we demonstrate our support.
We have strong links with the armed services and have Affiliated Units in all three, including Reserve and Cadet units. Those affiliations are active, not notional.
One of my first tasks when I became Master was to visit HMS Illustrious (an affiliated unit) to present our Air Safety Trust Award to a member of the ship's company - Leading Airman (Aircraft Handler) Stephen Ashcroft. Seven members came with me. My term of office ends in a couple of weeks and one of my last tasks will be to attend a dinner at Middle Wallop (next Friday) to present a Master Air Pilot certificate to a member of the Army Air Corps - another affiliated unit.

My only personal link with the services was as a Cadet Pilot in the University of London Air Squadron, also an affiliated unit. Not much when compared with the regular contributors in this forum but, 40 years later, I'm still proud of it. I was delighted when the Squadron agreed to provide a Guard of Honour on two occasions during my Master's year - for the Duke of York last May and, on this occasion, for the Duke of Edinburgh.

In these challenging political/financial times, I think it's important as ever to show support for the armed services and we, the Air Pilots, do so in many different ways.


FL

[HugoFirst]

If I'm honest Ive always been a bit in awe of the organisation (in its previous form at least). I was never more than a bog standard squadron nav, so thought I may have been a bit out of my depth in such august company. But maybe I'll give it a go!


I was a mere SSgt in the Army Air Corps and they let me in! You won't feel out of your depth. I have found, without exception, that members are very welcoming of new entrants. We all have a shared interest in aviation, whether it be from a military, commercial or private flying background. If you share that interest you won't be out of place.

[N2erk]

Courtney- thanks for the info. I heartily agree with your assessment, especially the bit about Steve Nicholl not aging- that's what threw me. The oversize bow tie said 'yes' but the eyes and hair said 'no'. Glad that good things do sometimes happen to good people. Well deserved. :ok::)

[Piltdown Man]

Looked like a marvellous bash. His much does a seat at one if these cost?

PM

[newt]

Being a Yes Man and promotion to Air Cdr or above!:E

[BEagle]

Not so, newt!

You stirrer!!

[Snakecharmer]

Tankertrashnav - also happy to help with the formalities, bearing in mind the 'family' connection… just wish I was in UK more often to attend the various events...

[Tankertrashnav]

Thanks snakecharmer - getting measured up for my tails tomorrow ;) - better start saving!

[Bergerie1]

TTN


I am sure you would be very welcome....and they need some more navs!

[hunterboy]

There don't seem to be many attendees (as opposed to the hired help) under the age of 40 shown in the photos ?
Maybe they were all out working? ;)

[Flying Lawyer]

hunterboy

Most of those who attended were over 40 - perhaps not surprising given the nature of the event. However, we have a very active Young Air Pilots group (formerly the 'Guild Young Members') which is open to all members of the Company aged 35 and under. It has almost 300 members.

https://www.airpilots.org/image/604/150/young-air-pilots.jpg

They are involved in the work of the Company, particularly that relating to young people in or aspiring to be in aviation, and are made very welcome at all our events. They also have their own lively social calendar.

There are members of all ages from 19 to 92 (The Duke of Edinburgh) from all spheres of aviation and from all around the world.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k510/AirPilots/Royal%20Charter%20Banquet/1673m109G534copy_zps9be86776.jpg
Young Air Pilots from Hong Kong
Honourable Company of Air Pilots

I'm very pleased that the already substantial number of military/former military members of all ranks continues to grow and delighted that a recently retired VSO has just been elected to the Court of the Company. I have no doubt whatsoever that he'll be a very real asset - which is why I encouraged him to stand for election.


FL


(Edited)
Response to now deleted post removed.

[Heliport]

http://pooleysword.com/images/pooleysword/1/17/pooley-sword-honourable-company-of-air-pilots-hd-220.png

[hunterboy]

Flying Lawyer many thanks for your reply. It may have seemed that I was having a dig....The point that I was trying to make is that the (former) GAPAN appeared to have little or no relevance to the many thousands of professional pilots out there doing the job day in and day out. The photos that were posted appeared to show a bunch of old men back-slapping and congratulating themselves on their good fortune.
I'm sure that the Honourable Company does many good deeds in the background; maybe it just needs to raise its public profile and IMHO try to appear to be more relevant to the many thousands of professional pilots plying their trade ?

[Roland Pulfrew]

hunterboy

does many good deeds in the background

Maybe you should check out the GAPAN, oops, HCAP website - they do and not just in the background.

[Boudreaux Bob]

Hunter Boy seems to miss the fact that as in most Professions, those that have contributed to the growth and maturity of that Profession by natural circumstances are not the Youngsters.

The absolute thing they fail to understand is that in time, assuming they stay in the business and survive, they too shall become leathery old Geezers themselves and hopefully shall have contributed something to the Profession.

Perhaps joining this fine organization and finding a way to contribute to the on-going efforts by the members to further its goals would be something the Youngsters might consider. It is a wonderful group of people who all share a desire to make Aviation a better Profession.

[Heathrow Harry]

never saw the reason for the robes etc - very Harry Pooterish TBH

but its better than wasting your time in a golf club....... :ok::ok:

[hunterboy]

The above posters have crystallised the essence of what I was trying to put across. Very few young pilots are likely to join what would appear (according to the posted photos and general consensus ) to be an old boys club.
If the society does want to attract younger members/contributors, how does it do it? I would be interested to know the average age of the members .

[Roland Pulfrew]

appear to be an old boys club.

Well appearances can be deceptive. :rolleyes: There are lots of serving military, serving airline pilots and lots of private flyers amongst the Company's membership - of all ages. Obviously there is an element of needing to have experience to join the Company which will inevitably restrict some from joining, but that is where the above mentioned Young Air Pilots membership comes in.

Just out of interest and assuming that you are not a member, what difference does knowing the average age make to you? Surely the important bit is experience.

[BEagle]

hunterboy, rather than appear foolish, perhaps you might care to peruse the Young Air Pilots website at Young Air Pilots | Honourable Company of Air Pilots (http://youngairpilots.org/) ?

I hope all those who attended the CFS / Air Pilots Senior Instructor Forum at RAFC Cranwell yesterday found it a useful day - the presenters certainly did!

[hunterboy]

Many thanks to all that have replied. I'm glad to know that I got the wrong impression about the Guild, and that it does represent all UK pilots.

[redsnail]

There's a mix of ages but I wouldn't call any one "old". Perhaps they've seen the earth do a few laps around the sun a few more times than others but, none are "old".

HCOAP do provide scholarships for the lucky few. :ok:

[Heathrow Harry]

Some other professional associations make a big effort to have a "Young-uns" section - get them interested early in the whole thing

[madlandrover]

I hope all those who attended the CFS / Air Pilots Senior Instructor Forum at RAFC Cranwell yesterday found it a useful day

Indeed we did - both for the prepared presentations and the opportunity to engage in some unofficial diplomacy over coffee.

[I16]

In todays paper from the other side of the world.


Recognition of a life of flying | Stuff.co.nz (http://www.stuff.co.nz/southland-times/news/10339622/Recognition-of-a-life-of-flying)