Towing Aircraft [Archive]

Dark Helmet

9th Feb 2014, 16:35

Who'd have thought that this topic would produce so many replies!

So: TWCU at Honington in the winter. Lots of snow and ice and the forecast is that it will continue to snow. At about stupid o'clock in the morning we still towed twenty plus aircraft out to the flight line. It was not easy getting up the small incline. The wingtip men had chocks at the ready in case the shear pin went. Instead the tractor simply couldn't get enough traction and the whole tractor and aircraft rig starts to slide backwards towards another hangar that had closed doors. The brave wingtip guys slid and slipped their way to the mainwheels and popped in the chocks...to absolutely no effect! Everything just kept on sliding. I was either driving the tractor or I/C the tow, I can't remember but I just waited until we came to a stop or hit something solid. Luckily we came to a stop. I left the aircraft there and went to see if we would be able to stop this madness - I wasn't successful of course!

Eventually Operation Tow-Out was a complete success. Duty Auth arrives at about 08:00, looks at the weather and says 'No flying today'.
So an hour of downloading all the weapons in the snow and then Operation Tow-In could begin.

This time someone (not a liney) suggested that we should tow with a fuel bowser as they would have more traction on the snow and ice and would make it down the small incline and turn the corner into the hangar with no problem.

The trouble was that the bowser drivers were not trained to tow - they had no idea about how an aircraft behaves when it is so far behind you, nor did they appreciate how wide you had to make your turns to allow for the aircraft to always be in the centre of the taxiway.

It took just one, heartstopping, attempt for it all to be called off!

We left the aircraft on the line until we had all calmed down and later, with the aid of snow ploughs and gritters managed to get them all to bed again.

I would like to say that management learned from that experience but what do you, dear reader, think?

thing

9th Feb 2014, 16:48

I would like to say that management learned from that experience but what do you, dear reader, think? Being as the management were rarely out there freezing their nads off I think there is only one conclusion to be drawn. We often used to wonder what difference it would make if you took everyone out of the chain from Sengo upwards. Jets would still fly, the world would still turn.

Dark Helmet

9th Feb 2014, 16:59

Yep, thing you are probably correct. I often used to think that. We would be left with: people who loved (most of the time) to fix aircraft and people who loved (most of the time) to fly aircraft!

Cornish Jack

9th Feb 2014, 17:28

Sod's Law or Murphy's?? Whichever, Nicosia in the 50s, multi Hastings and Beverleys littered around the field and Bev on tow with nobody on the brakes. You KNOW what happened ... attempt to retrieve situation by throwing large chock under wheels just proved fragility of chocks!! Rampant Bev eventually found static version and demonstrated affection by burying nose deeply in tail of soulmate!! IIRC this was during the abortive Amman detachment so no harm done!!:rolleyes::E:E

NutLoose

9th Feb 2014, 17:31

RAF Bruggen new style tug arrived to replace the old wartime style items, these were the ones with the cab on them with seats in the back for handlers and a stowage outside behind that for chocks etc, worked a treat, but eventually needed maintainence, so MT lent us another new one, this had a larger full cab and could seat four behind the driver but no external stowage, off we go with Jag hooked on the back, go to turn a corner and bang, the pitot tube that on the shorter cab that would normally miss comes straight through the rear window..... Oops

RAF Bruggen TACEVAL winching a Jag into a HAS into the front location, doors shut and pilot doing verbal handover when the winch starts up dragging it into the wall, smashing the tip and dragging it along doing more damage, pilot and HAS chief hanging on steps trying to stop it as it hops the nose chocks, everyone runs to help, winch stopped and enquiry starts, winch stripped nothing found, Jag repaired, years later a guy who was in the HAS with me says, "it was me, I knocked the start button" when it happened everyone looked at Jag and rushed to it, then looked at winch buttons that were now unmanned so assumed a fault and he got away with it.

Brize, line office has just got the end of the financial year save fuel signal. looking out window boss says, there is an example, why is that Ten being towed with the APU running?. (me on brakes) Arrive back inside to be asked why I'm running the APU during towing, " so I can power the ovens to cook our Dulles burgers and hotdogs" I replied... Nothing else said :)

VX275

9th Feb 2014, 17:34

Back in the days when the VGS at Benson flew conventional gliders I was tasked to act as ballast in a Mk 3 Cadet being retrieved by Landrover and trailer.
For those who don't know the Air Cadets had a trailer on which a just landed glider could be mounted upon and returned to the launch point. As fixing it in place relied on a pin passed over the nose skid, ballast, ie a cadet, was required to sit in the front cockpit to offload the pin and not rip the skid off the fuselage.
On this occasion the retrieval had the combination driving down the length of the pan past all the hangars, at some speed it must be admitted.
Retrive over ops recommenced until the Boss came out wanting to know who had been involved with the retrieve as he'd just had a low flying complaint from the Deputy Captain of the Queens Flight, who had just looked out of his office window and whitnessed a glider chasing a Landrover at extreme low level.

NutLoose

9th Feb 2014, 17:40

Not towing as such, but just as funny,

Disaster relief in a quarry in Norfokk, it's winter and full of mud, we need the dumper truck we are using so some aircrew go to start it, 3 of them on the cranking handle trying to turn it over with no success, several of them take an interest and try to bump start the thing in about 3 inches of mud...
Much mirth from us, engine JT walks over, naunchantly leans on the engine and unseen by the aircrew pushes down the decompressor, then single handedly swings the thing over and off it goes... Walks off as stunned aircrew mouths wide open look on.

TOWTEAMBASE

9th Feb 2014, 17:45

Are fast jets susceptible to snaking when being towed then, sounds a tad strange. The nearest I've towed to one is an EMB145, but they never did it. I've towed jumbo's too.......now THAT would make an interesting snake

longer ron

9th Feb 2014, 17:49

I hope Newt is keeping an eye on this thread !

Canberras with full tip tanks used to snake a little :)

Halton Brat

9th Feb 2014, 17:54

Wiggins Aerodyne, RAF Little Snoring c.1922. Had to cast the anchor overboard from the underslung Observation Basket when the brakes on the Stutz Bearcat towing vehicle faded. Frightful calamity; CO's dog, which was chasing the Aerodyne & biting through the tail surfaces, was killed by well-aimed lob of anchor. No tea/coffee/biscuits interview with CO. Career limiting episode.

HB

longer ron

9th Feb 2014, 17:55

Actually the Snaking thing just reminded me how I got cleared to tow a/c...
For some random reason we had no qualified tow - ers in one day.
One of our canberras aborts take off and ends up at the wrong end of Cottysnore...we were right at t'other end :ok:
Flight Sgt says to me - If you can tow it back here without damaging it I will sign you up for towing - ok says I (thinking 'towers do not do station duties' ! LOL) - anyway I managed to get that one back ok...the 'Crunch' - 'Brakes' moment happened a few months later putting a cab in the hangar :)

NutLoose

9th Feb 2014, 17:58

RAF Upavon had a families day, the OCU was there with our aircraft that had to be hangared out of the way, during the show a casevac came in so a Puma was pulled out and down the taxiway, it was then cancelled so was towed back, just as we got to the hangar it was on again, so we turned round and set off again, over the radio it was announced it was cancelled so we turned around yet again and finally pulled it back into the Hangar. Closing the doors the RAFP who had been clearing the crowd came over and asked why we tow it back and forth across the aprons. "To wind up the starter motors" we replied... " Oh thanks" he said as he wandered off.... I do still wonder if anyone has finally told him the truth.

Danny42C

9th Feb 2014, 18:00

spekesoftly, (the link in your #4)

Wasn't there a character who shoehorned a war surplus Merlin into his Shelsey "special" (the "freikaiserwagen" ?). Went fine, by all accounts, so long as he could keep it on the road !

( a bit off-Thread, sorry).

Wander00

9th Feb 2014, 18:38

Watch what you say about Little Snoring - I used to live there, and my papers were delivered by Mrs Gotobed - honest!

smujsmith

9th Feb 2014, 19:06

Not strictly military !!!!

I was lucky to be allocated to a Joint services gliding course at Bicester, RAFGSA Centre, early 80s as I remember. As an Airframe SNCO, I was welcomed as they needed some servicing and polishing doing. Having spent the morning of a fairly damp day doing a bit of work, with the met beginning to improve, I asked the CFI if I could tow out the ASK18 and give it a bit of a go. Permission granted and the duty car is towing the glider out. About 100 yards out on to the newly mown airfield I noticed that the one and only main wheel had stopped rotating, and was merely skidding over the surface. When we stopped and looked the wheel was jammed by a compacted mass of grass clippings. It took over an hour to remove the grass, it would have been quicker to remove the wheel to clear it. But then, I was only an A Fitt A ! But, had that happened before ? At the time nobody said it had, but you have to wonder. I note a 2.5 hour soaring trip from the eventual launch in my log book, a bit of work always paid off eventually.

Smudge:ok:

Halton Brat

9th Feb 2014, 19:09

Aah, Mrs Gotobed; what a delightful popsie........

HB

Wensleydale

9th Feb 2014, 19:17

During the 1980s, drinking beer in the 8 Squadron crew room at Lossie on a Friday evening (30 seconds after QRA end at 1700 on Friday) when an enormous crash was heard in the Hangar to which the crew room was attached. A quick sprint into the hangar gave us the view of the towing tragedy that had just happened.

The ground crew were towing a Shackleton out of the hangar onto the flight line. A tractor was attached by the towing arm to the tail wheel and the aircraft was to be reversed out into position. Unfortunately on this occasion, the chap in the cockpit had forgotten to take off the parking break: the tractor had pulled on the tail wheel which had collapsed and the aircraft had fallen onto its rear fins and bomb doors.

A cheer for the ground crew was quickly cut short when OC 8 arrived very quickly on the scene from his office in the hangar - death was on his face and we quickly slipped back to the beer call while the Boss debriefed the ground crew. (Before he came into the crew room and debriefed us about standards of behaviour).

The aircraft was fixed by salvaging parts from gate guards and fire dumps around the country (from memory, the Shack at Manston was pillaged for its bomb doors but I stand to be corrected).

Hangarshuffle

9th Feb 2014, 19:22

was dragging a SHAR FA2 off the high power tie down at Yeovilton. The air brake had fully lowered and it caught the hold back chain T bar as it slowly moved forward, thus ripping both layers of skin on said AB. I wasn't driving but directing the move and the buck stopped fairly with me. Optically it looked safe to clear but wasn't and didn't.
Thankfully the Deputy AEO was a really decent guy and arranged a swop with a resident Hangar Queen, and nothing further was done or said.
Other than that one blot, in many years of both moving ashore, afloat and foreign and unusual I never ever pranged one. Insert smiley face here...

Flight_Idle

9th Feb 2014, 19:27

Not RAF, but some other air force...

A guy over confident on the tractor, fast moves with style, but it went wrong one day when he missed the brake, fast reversing in the hanger.

It bent the prop of a PC9, knocked it clean over the chocks & almost into the tail section of another aircraft.

I was a few yards away, but thankfully not part of the moving team. I can still remember as clear as day, my friend who was in charge at the time, turning to me with his hand on his forehead & saying to me "I think we have an incident"

I remember the 'Cracked eggshell" look of the front PC9 canopy after a student somehow managed to eject, then the instructor landing it safely, but that was not towing related.

Someone else ripped a landing gear off a Strikemaster, after towing it across a dug out hole temporarily covered with wood.

Be careful when towing.

Hangarshuffle

9th Feb 2014, 19:34

Some prangs are far too recent and I can imagine many people on here dying to put something up, but daren't. Theres nothing like hearing a thundering great shuddering bang of aircraft metal upon another solid object to get people running to a scene....! Generally there's always some pale faced bloke gone into semi shock....

Flight_Idle

9th Feb 2014, 20:33

Whilst not aircraft towing, someone I knew well towed a gliding club winch back the hanger, the trouble was, the cable was still fully out.

It took out various airfield equipment, but he was a civilian about to join the RAF.

He didn't join as a 'Techie' but the actual incident taught me an early lesson.

That lesson was that it's the people on the ground who have an important role in making things safe & administration from senior officers, just can't plug the gap.

Flying_Anorak

9th Feb 2014, 21:02

There is a story about a B2, a fuel load and a towbar that some of my fellow RIATeers are far better qualified to tell than me!

smujsmith

9th Feb 2014, 21:20

Flight_Idle (Steph), I never did it honest :ok:

My one and only visit to OC Eng, with my hat on.

A couple of years after leaving my job as a Ground Eng on Albert and I'm SNCO i/c a second line servicing team. There was never any way that my lads on the team were doing overtime unless I was there, so, having helped with the pre air test engine ground runs, after in my case a 14 hour day, I supervised the aircrafts move back into the hangar, before cease work. At the time we had the practice of leaving the main aircraft jacks in position in the hangar (big, heavy and awkward as long as you left them where they were they were no problem) and reversing the aircraft into position over them. As I had spent around 4 hours out with the ground running team, I was not aware that in our absence our new Flight Commander had ordered a "proper" clean up of the hangar by the rest of the team, including moving the main jacks to sweep underneath them. You all know what's coming. My wing safety man on the RH wingtip (left as we pushed the aircraft backwards into the hangar, and from my viewpoint) was a tired young chap who had spent most of the evening out in the cold as safety man for the ground runs. His state of alertness was indicated by the still affirmative "clear" (thumb up) signal as I convinced the tug driver to ram the out of position main Jack with the RH external tank. No excuses, I was in charge, my fault.

The team to a man insisted we could recover the situation, and with luck in having a spare tank, and a steady diet of coffee breaks we managed to change the tank before the day shift came in the next morning to prep the aircraft for the flight test. It was duly flown and returned to the line, serviceable. I had no answer for OC Eng when he expressed his surprise at an "experienced" SNCO making such a basic mistake. Of course, there were many excuses available for it, but only my failure to spot the main jack had been moved was the cause. I was grateful that OC Eng did have some understanding of the hours we had all put in to meet a target that day.

Smudge :ok:

Vendee

9th Feb 2014, 21:34

Laarparts again, early 80's, II ac Sqn Jags. Got dragged out of the crewroom to do brakes from hangar to HAS. Young and blasé, took my mug of coffee into the cockpit. Sheer-pin broke as we took the tight turn to the entrance to the pan. I hit the brakes....... nothing!! I hadn't checked the brake pressure before jumping in. The aircraft rolls gently onto the (thankfully firm) grass. I quickly throw the coffee mug into the bushes and give a quick burst of the Electro-Hydraulic Pump. "Yes Sarge.....got plently of pressure.... don't know what happened". Pushed the aircraft off the grass and into the HAS. No damage but not my proudest moment :uhoh:

Shack37

9th Feb 2014, 21:40

Another Shack towing snafu, Mk.3 this time at St. Mawgan early 60s.
Returning to pan from compass base and stopped right on the money.

The towmaster was unhitched before anybody thought to shove some chocks in. As the towmaster moves away the beast follows it and a quick look shows the air guage as low as it goes. A very loud scream from the cockpit alerts the guys below who stop the towmaster, grab the towing arm and re-attach with some difficulty and not a little risk to themselves.

No damage, no injuries, no witnesses and very little conversation on return to crew room.:\

thing

9th Feb 2014, 21:41

I've taxied an aircraft with only one brake working. That was interesting at the brake check as it did a quick change of direction to the right. Of course to stop and shut down you have to put more brake onto the one side that's working...thus lurching around like a drunkard hoping that no one of consequence is watching.

thing

9th Feb 2014, 21:46

Another Shack towing snafu, Mk.3 this time at St. Mawgan early 60s.

Crikey, my old next door neighbour Bill Hey used to fly Mk3 Shacks. Anybody remember him? Got one up to 27,000' once.

longer ron

9th Feb 2014, 21:46

And to get back to the raison d etre for this thread - hope you are keeping an eye on it Newt :)
After a bit of a pi55 up the night before (feeling like death cooled down) - towing a Hawk out at a Pembrokeshire airfield,me driving with a dodgy greenie (leccy) as nco i/c - as we trundled round the peri track - we remarked on how friendly 2 guys were standing outside the ground training school (they were waving to us :ok:).
Then realisation dawned - nobody was that friendly LOL and looking back we saw the Hawk about three quarters of a mile away with the brakeman waving at us (gee what a nice guy :))

The SHEAR PIN had ...well.... sheared... good job we had a mug on brakes eh :ok:

esa-aardvark

9th Feb 2014, 23:35

In the 50's sitting in a glider winch which was being towed back
for the day. Tractor driver decided it would pass under the wing
of a Valient. It didn't. Winch roof ended up a inch or two lower,
no problem. Valient wing - big problem

Airey Belvoir

10th Feb 2014, 00:06

Cracking collection!

Valient = Valiant
break = brake
whitnessed = witnessed
role = roll

Airey
SOP (Society Of Pedants) http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/evil.gif

newt

10th Feb 2014, 06:52

Well done guys! Nearly two pages of great stories in just a day! Keep it up!

And no sign of Krystal! Bet he does not have any interesting stories!

anotherthing

10th Feb 2014, 06:59

Definitely not a towing accident but a the soon to be ex of a colleague of mine managed to wangle a visit to the AFS with her daughter in deepest darkest Cornwall one weekend.

Whilst taking a fire fighting appliance for a spin down the runway, trying to impress the guests with the performance, they managed to tip it on its side while trying to negotiate a corner too quickly.

My e-mail to some squadron mates who were embarked at the time, comically describing the incident, brought them much mirth, but the view of the Station CO (and my colleague) was, understandably, less jovial.

diginagain

10th Feb 2014, 07:05

Pugh, Pugh, Barney McGrew, Cuthbert, Dibble and Grub, of Middle Wallop's fire station rolled a brand-new appliance in 1988.

They learned about 'free surface effect' from that.

Wander00

10th Feb 2014, 07:28

ISTR (a long time ago) an incident at MPA early 86 when a Land - Rover based appliance was rolled

dkh51250

10th Feb 2014, 07:43

Waddo 1967/8 One open to the elements David Brown tractor. Depart cylinder compound with lots of air and nitrogen trollies in tow, arrive D (line ground equipment) dispersal with lots of trollies, minus one in tow.

Apparently it decided it did not want to travel at a sedate pace to the other side of the airfield and left us somewhere near the flt sim.

Same period S****e C*****S delivering one bottle trolley hitched to the rear of a Bedford RL. Bedford halts at dispersal STOP line, trolley continues, passing the Bedford, continuing under Vulcan until meeting with a pair of steps complete with unwary rigger stood atop it.

oldpax

10th Feb 2014, 07:55

8sqdn Khormaksar c1963.forget the reason but a gang of us were bringing a Hunter up from ASF back to the squadron towing with a land rover when the towing arm shear pin went ,like stories before this it had no brake pressure,a shout went up "the towing arms broke".Driver brakes the land rover and the Hunter carries on into the back of it which was empty as we had all jumped over the sides!!!Worse than this ,same land rover two of us detailed to pick up a drum of AVPIN using a gun pack trolley,on the return with the AVPIN in the trolley we were waved down by another vehicle"sparks coming fom your gun trolley mate".We stopped and found that the gun trolley hydraulics had lost pressure and the AVPIN drum had been rotating on the road causing the sparks!!!There were slight flats on the drum!!Hate to think what would have happened if it had ignited!!Well,I probably wouldn't be telling this story!!

Basil

10th Feb 2014, 09:12

ISTR an Argosy incident at Cottesmore (or was it Benson?).
Aircraft towed from hangar, turned right up slight slope and stopped.
Towbar disconnected and hairyplane, neither chocked nor braked, rolled back, caught stbd. wing on hangar, swung to stbd., re-entered hangar and was stopped when stbd. tail boom contacted hangar wall.

Non aviation related incident: Bas asks Mrs Bas to tow him in car. Towline made fast at both ends and loosely flaked out between vehicles.
Bas: "OK, when I give you a toot, off you go." She did - drove off normally :{

longer ron

10th Feb 2014, 09:18

Bit of a lack of pre work brief there Bas :)

Basil

10th Feb 2014, 10:07

Bit of a lack of pre work brief there Bas
Yes, I learnt about briefing from that :(

HTB

10th Feb 2014, 10:17

I'm surprised we've got this far without mention of the perils of winter towing Vulcans at Goose Bay (are all the ex-V-Force guys still waiting for the nurse to give them their morning medication?).

It was along time ago, so I'll keep it vague. Taxiway/runway snow and ice clearing was a problematic topic during winter months at Goose, indeed most likely a futile gesture to attempt it. Likewise, no external parking for aircraft, everything would be frozen solid.

So the procedure was to start up the Vulcan in the Hangar (and they were big, warm hangars), attach the tug (Douglas Taskmaster, I think), and, generally, push the Vulcan out onto the apron. Either way - push or pull - there was 50/50 chance that once the tug was on the apron surface it's mighty efforts would be overcome by Olympus power. The results were unpredictable; staight back the way you came, a little bit sideways, wheels rotating but no movement. Throw into the mix the Vulcan's balletic properties on permafrost surface and you had a recipe for disaster (or certainly lots of fun...). Thankfully I experienced this only occasionally, and then passing through to sunnier climes; mind you Ellsworth AFB (Rapid City, South Dakota; tried it once, that was enough) could have equally savage conditions and nowhere to shelter the aircraft, or self (with winds of about 30-40kts and minus temperatures greater that of our combined IQ/shoe size).

Where was I; oh yes, come on V-Force crews and RAF Goose Bay support folks, contribute to the big picture about the fun to be had towing aircraft in adverse conditions:ok:

Mister B

nipva

10th Feb 2014, 10:27

TWU Brawdy 1980, Hunters already out in the fresh air ready for the first wave with the new Hawks still being assembled. A Hawk with brakeman was being towed out behind a row of Hunters when the shear pin broke. Unfortunately the brakes accumulator had not been charged so the presence of the brakeman served no purpose and he became merely a spectator in the ensuing contretemps. Due to the slope of the ASP the Hawk gathered momentum, altered course to port and crunched into the back of two T7s damaging the tailpipe of one and the aileron of the other. Serviceable T7s were like gold dust so there was much hand-wringing until our Hunter SEngO appeared on the scene and said 'no worries' I'll have them both back by lunchtime and he did. The aileron was easily removed and a new one installed and the damaged tailcone was simply unbolted and replaced with one from one of our many hangar queens. The Hawk? Out of action for several weeks because the damaged skin and honeycomb of the leading edge had to be rebuilt. Definitely one up to the old school.

There is also a serious moral: Brakemen are only as good as the brakes!

Thanks Newt for starting this thread so we can get back to celebrating the fact that a Lightning is flying again.

camlobe

10th Feb 2014, 11:16

Late '70's at a secret base in North Wales. Camlobe is enjoying a week on Station towing Team. This fine band of men was drawn from all sections of engineering from around the unit. One JNCO I/C, one tractor driver, one brakeman (camlobe) and two wingtip men. Half way through this wondrous week of fun, the message on the Storno states "Practice fire, practice fire, practice fire, Gaydon Hangar".

In accordance with our brief, we abandon the aircraft we are moving, chock it and off we go max chat with the tow bar bouncing along merrily.

Organised chaos ensues as all available personnel are removing aircraft as fast as possible from the "burning" hangar. Camlobe vaults into the front cockpit of one steed after checking seat pins, one wingman is pumping the Hydraulic hand pump furiously as we are well below operating pressure, the JNCO is using our tow bar as a sterling bar, and the aircraft is pulled into the middle of the hangar. Camlobe closes the canopy down to a one inch gap, again as briefed, and the aircraft is pushed rear wards out of the eastern end of the hangar...down the slope...towards the blast detuner. Harry hand pump is still beavering away like a demented banshee (fortunately) and the multitude of leading edge pushers ease off. The JNCO is now at a light gallop trying to keep up with the increasing pace of the aircraft. In the rear view mirrors, I can see the detuner getting closer (objects may be closer than they appear) and am starting to feel concerned. So are the guys following the leading edges as they back further away.

A standard point in any brief about moving aircraft is the use of brakes, and the use of the word "brakes". If heard, the brakeman applies them, but on no account should he operate them UDI. (Certain exceptions apply). Because the brakeman cannot see everything around the aircraft, he relies on the JNCO and the other members of the towing team to instruct when to apply the brakes. "Brakes" will be called in a clear voice accompanied by the visual signal of a fist clenched.

With the increasing rearward speed of the aircraft, anticipation of instruction was heightened. And through the small gap of the open canopy, camlobe heard someone say "brakes".

The brakes were positively applied...and the view from the cockpit changed quite dramatically. Firstly, the JNCO disappeared...then the hangar disappeared...then it all came back into a view with a thump. The JNCO was running away from the dropping tow bar towards the hangar...right into OC Eng Wg dressed in his Number 1's, who witnessed everything. After the third bounce, the JNCO, who had the thoughts of career cessation, ran back and started screaming unimaginable thoughts and questioning my parentage.

After a couple of seconds of his tirade, I merely mentioned that I had acted as briefed, and having heard someone say "brakes", I applied them. I acknowledged that it may have simply been one of the leading edge escorts saying "you think he would have put the brakes on by now" but I wasn't in a position to judge.

As OC Eng Wg invited the JNCO to his office, I surveyed the scene. The strakes weren't even scratched, the nose wheel and door weren't damaged and the rudder missed the detuner by about four feet.

Too close for comfort, but nobody hurt.

P.S. I think it is nice to see a Lightning flying again.

Camlobe

Tashengurt

10th Feb 2014, 11:30

Anyone know why the bowser knocked the tail off a Phantom at Leuchars not long before the fleet retired?
Istr it was due to the drivers feet being slippy with fuel but stand to br corrected.

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Doobry Firkin

10th Feb 2014, 11:32

The main one i remember was at Lyneham.
Moving a herc onto one of the bays where things that go bang can be loaded. It was early morning and decidedly dark. I was sat in the Eng seat running the APU so we had power for lights and brakes. We were quite merrily being towed at 'steady pace' by gold Dick (we could probably have a thread dedicated to him on here) when the guy on brakes in the pilots seat said "what wa".
Thats as far as he got into saying "what was that" when there was a decidedly loud bang and some noise from the back of the plane. We had to use the radio to get the tug to stop so we could see what the hell had happened.

Someone had left a portable lighting rig out in the middle of the airfield, extended.... and we had towed the plane straight through the extended arm of the rig. It was the fastest leading edge change i'd ever seen so the plane made the slot with no delay.

We never did find out who left the lighting unit extended in the middle of the airfield.

NutLoose

10th Feb 2014, 11:40

An ex colleague of mine on Lightnings was tasked to bring in the power sets post flying, hooking up a power set he thought, ohh i'll make a power set train and hook them all up to each other, so off he sets with his train in tow, coming to a Lightning he slows down and watching his first power sets glide effortlessly under the wing he put his foot down to be greeted with an almighty bang... the last power set on his train was sporting an extended exhaust system that didn't quiet fit under a lightning wing.. :E

.

izod tester

10th Feb 2014, 11:54

At Lyneham in the 60s Britannia Base 3 (Major) servicing was carried out in the North end of J1 Hangar. There was a purpose built multi story servicing dock built within the hangar which had 4 inches of clearance around the fuselage. The put the aircraft into the hangar required a 90 degree turn with the inner wingtip just 6 feet from the hangar. The Lyneham tug drivers rarely needed to reverse whilst putting an aircraft in. Respect.

coldbuffer

10th Feb 2014, 12:43

Friday afternoon, get the Bucc back to the Squadron post servicing in ASF.
Long haul back to the Squadron so a bit of speed required :} .
As the Taxi-way is not on the flat, on the down hill sections said Bucc is pushing the tractor and a bit of snaking occurs.
Get to the Squardon, who gave us grief for bringing it back on a Friday plus the message to ring Air tragic control for a B*****king

Towing a Hunter T-bird and the cable on the towing arm, which operates the jaws to disconnect the towing eye, gets trapped within the giant spring which compressed while going around a corner, shortened cable now works as advertised and opens the jaws and the tractor and towbar part company.
both stopped without any damage.

Icy day in the Falklands, tractor would not push the F4 into the HAS, whilst OC Eng not looking got a second tractor to push the first one and managed to get A/C safely to bed - with only minor paint scratches to both tractors. ;)

kintyred

10th Feb 2014, 13:41

Odiham, late 80s

An imminent squall is forecast with high winds and the decision to taken to tow the wokkas into the hangar.
By the time the towing team has hitched the beast to the Unimog the winds are upon us. The rotor blades have not been tied down but the towing starts. After a short change of direction one blade is now presented side-on to the wind. Result? Blade rises to the vertical, pauses and then descends with an almighty crash. "Ah," think I, "that'll be a lesson in bladesailing for the towing team then." Unfortunately the message didn't quite get through. After a brief delay the towing continues until the aircraft has turned through a further 60 degrees, presenting the next blade to the wind. Guess what? Now both front and aft gearboxes need inspections following the shock loading...and one needed changing ISTR!

thing

10th Feb 2014, 13:48

Icy day in the Falklands, tractor would not push the F4 into the HAS, whilst OC Eng not looking got a second tractor to push the first one and managed to get A/C safely to bed - with only minor paint scratches to both tractors.

You just reminded me we used to open the hangar doors at Coningsby by pushing them with a Land rover bumper. Lot easier than winding that bloody handle.

goudie

10th Feb 2014, 14:54

The first Vulcan for 617 Sqdn. arrives at Scampton. Everyone turns out to watch it taxying towards ASF. Sgt detailed by crewchief to marshall it the final 50yards or so. As it turns to park, in between the hangars, the starboard wheels cut across the grass and sink! Thankfully a quick blip on the throttles and it clears, no problem. Who was watching the starboard side...Wing Commander OC Eng, Wing!:O

Exrigger

10th Feb 2014, 17:03

camlobes story reminds of something similar that happened to me whilst on 203 Sqn Nimrod MR1s. Sat on brakes as we were towing the aircraft back onto the pan, all going well with me listening intently for the instructions from the I/C towing team as camlobe stated the brief the brakeman is always given is do as the I/C tow tells you. So there I was enjoying the Maltese sun when I thought that was odd we are moving backwards, still I heard nothing and assumed all was under control, had a look out the window and thought ' I hope the wingtip bloke and I/C has noticed how close the LH wing is to the hangar stanchions, when a rather frantic person (i/c tow) loomed into view screaming for brakes, which were duly applied before the aircraft hit said stanchion. At the wash up it appears the tug driver had lurched a bit while starting up a slight slope and broke the shear pin, this was my fault apparently for not realizing that and putting the brakes under my own initiative.

I actually have seen and been involved in a number of towing incidents with Tornado (including a 'I learnt about speeding on a wet & negative camber taxiway in the dark) and Chinook over my 30 years of being brake man, tower and I/C, Some involving Air logs trailers and runway RHAG engagement at St Athan, some involving ATC and Victor tanker landing while we were trying to recover a Tornado of the runway at Marham.

Saintsman

10th Feb 2014, 18:03

You just reminded me we used to open the hangar doors at Coningsby by pushing them with a Land rover bumper. Lot easier than winding that bloody handle

It does make the handle spin quite fast though!

NutLoose

10th Feb 2014, 18:06

Airline, sadly no longer with us, moving the staging around the aircraft, bod in charge cannot be heard over the noise of the wheels etc, so has a cunning idea and buys a whistle, briefs the team, one blow to stop. Off they go when suddenly lots of frantic whistle blows heard and team stop pushing thinking WTF, checking they find they have wheeled it over his foot breaking his toes.. :E

Fareastdriver

10th Feb 2014, 18:21

The Valiant's towbar was attached to the forward fuselage, not the nosewheel assembly. This meant that somebody had to be in the left hand seat to steer it behind a tug. If the tug didn't have 110 volts you had no electrical power to steer it. Then a Houchin power unit had to be plugged in and towed by another tractor alongside the aircraft.

A compass swing required a navigator and co-pilot to be in the cockpit. The co-pilot to steer and call out the landing compass headings and the navigator to adjust the compasses.

When, not if, a Valiant under tow got its nosewheel out of sequence with the tug there were black tyremarks all over the place.

goudie

10th Feb 2014, 19:01

At Bassingbourn in the early '60's a Canberra went wheels up into the overshoot.
After air bags had raised the a/c, trackjacks were located under each wing and hitched up to a tractor ready to tow a/c away. Just prior to this the F/Sgt in charge detailed an airman to sit in the cockpit. As the tractor driver was given the signal to move off the F/Sgt shouted at the airman in the cockpit, ''brakes off''!

Old habits......!

MPN11

10th Feb 2014, 19:34

ATC towing story, during a Part 1 Mineval at a major bomber base south of Lin***n.

Certain "things" had to be moved from "a certain location" to the various dispersals in order to "generate" certain other "things". Nothing must impede their stately transit, or people will be "exercise shot on sight". One small snag ... it was 10/10 fog of the densest quality that Lin***shire can provide. So ... the Local Controller, using a Storno on the Blue Channel spent the next hour or so directing 'ground traffic' by guesswork and "Have you passed the PAR yet?" to ensure the convoys proceeded uninterrupted from "there" to "somewhere else".

At some stage, Big John Stn Cdr called the Tower to ask why it was taking so long to get "things" to designated dispersals. SATCO was required to ask him to look out of a window and see the reality. He gulped, and accepted reality ... he was a great Boss :D

It was a slow, but safe, generation exercise and IAW SOP :cool:

thing

10th Feb 2014, 19:35

It does make the handle spin quite fast though!

Not if you take it out first...:)

peppermint_jam

10th Feb 2014, 21:34

Turns out that going across the grass isn't a short cut...

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f372/robstuff/IMG_17069772017069_zps2910ba40.jpg (http://s51.photobucket.com/user/robstuff/media/IMG_17069772017069_zps2910ba40.jpg.html)

camlobe

10th Feb 2014, 21:36

After a morning giving the pre-winter MRD training to Trades, Aircraft, Group 1, (engines-J/T and up, riggers and leckies-Sgt and up), camlobe is using a Land Rover Lightweight booked out from MT specifically for towing a Houchin to and from the Blister hangar where the MRD's were housed. However, this was the late '70's, and we still had a mix of RAF and NATO towing pins on the Land Rovers and towing eyes on ground equipment. Sure enough, the Lightweight was NATO and the Houchin was RAF. So, the jaws of the NATO hitch wouldn't fit in the ring of the Houchin. No problem, thinks our self-declared hero. This rope lying around will suffice. Five minutes later, the Houchin is 'secured' to the Lightweight by a method not recognisable by any Boy Scout or matelot. Training finished for the morning, time to return the Houchin camlobe scrounged Camlobe passes through the north gate, waving to the familiar face in the guard post and turns right onto the public road. Due to the incredible amount of shouting and whistling, camlobe decides to stop and investigate. Climbing out of the Landy! camlobe turns round to see...no Houchin. Camlobe's guard mate runs up and uses sign language while he catches his breath. For a couple of seconds, an episode of charades ensues. It turns out, when camlobe turned right onto the public road, the Houchin, now free of restraint, continued onwards in a forward fashion...straight towards one of the lakes popular with fishermen.

The guard deserted his post and assisted camlobe to try and recover the Houchin. Eventually, using the rope to pull the Houchin backwards, the Houchin is recovered to the public road. The guard returned to his post and let through the queue of cars that had built up. Camlobe makes sure of the rope securing and returns the Houchin slowly, after washing off the various bits of mud and undergrowth.

Camlobe is then stopped by the Padre. After a short chat, camlobe offers his services to carry the Padre's firewood collection to the bonfire sight before returning the Lightweight to MT. The bonfire sight is at the bottom of a slope. No problem, thinks our fool of a hero. After driving to the bottom of the slope, camlobe then unloads the firewood. Attempting to drive away back up the slope merely spins the rear wheels. Ahh, well, I'll try four-wheel-drive. Yellow knob depressed, and away we....slip. Ok, Red lever rear wards and that will sort it. Nope. The Lightweight is now covered in...yes, more mud and undergrowth. Walk forever to find a phone, call MT and wait for assistance. After recovery, camlobe washes the Lightweight and returns it to MT. OC MT doesn't get angry with me for my unauthorised trip to assist the Padre. Normally any and all unauthorised trips are automatically chargeable offences. My best guess is OC MT is a religious sort of chap, and possibly feared a bolt of lightning.

So, why did the Landy spin the rear wheels only? Because MT in their wisdom had removed all the front propshafts because the Linies kept breaking them...while towing trains of N2 bottles in four-wheel-drive!

Just another day in a blue suit.

Camlobe

RRNemesis

10th Feb 2014, 21:52

Apart from being the driver of a pirouetting tractor and Jag combination between one and two hangar at Lossiemouth; the other notable towing debacle was at a south clutch station in the early eighties in a group of HASs where the Jags were loaded with weapons I can neither confirm nor deny their presence on Federal German soil. The power failed in one HAS, choice of options: get a spare aircraft and up-load (not likely on a Sunday) or move the loaded aircraft to another HAS. After much discussion by the Stn Execs approved the move the aircraft ’as casually as possible’. Tractor attached Pilot as brakeman; as I pulled the aircraft out thirty plus RAF Plods shoulder to shoulder were providing a barrier to stop people seeing the weapon. As we moved the police cordon shuffled in a scene reminiscent of a Keystone Cops movie and note as casual as planned!

Alber Ratman

10th Feb 2014, 21:56

A few memories involving towing and the attempted towing of aircraft ..

Jaguars, as already mentioned, the tow bar had a shear pin that would fail if overloaded in a tight turn at too fast a towing speed. One early morning, 54 Sqn tow team pulling a GR out of 1 Hangar at Colt, way too fast and in a turn. Shear pin fails and the Jag goes off on a tangent, no braking apparent. Suddenly Electro Hydraulic pump powers up and aircraft bunts down on its nose oleo as the aircraft skids to a halt. Vendee has already explained what didn’t happen. That was in the late 90s.

Wittering in 1990. I’m up with RSS doing repairs to wings in the wing bay. Had to pop around to see another of our teams working up at the OCU. Around the corner I walk and find a GR3 stopped with a unimog very close to the cockpit, its windscreen smashed by the pitot probe. Around the corner comes Simon, a guy that I had just done TMT with and was on the OCU. “What happened mate?” “We towed the aircraft out, stopped, disconnected the tow bar and realised there was no brake accumulator pressure”. The OCU hangars were on a slope, so the aircraft had started to move. The tower realised the only thing to do was to use the tow bar on the unimog as a chock. It worked but the aircraft caught the windscreen. I believe OC MT wasn’t very pleased.

The last one was a farce. Lossiemouth in 1986. The Flight Sargent of the bays and VASS (surname sounded like D*** Head) asks the Chief who ran VASS to move the old Argosy that was on the grass near the lighthouse over to the burning. The Chief replies “bad idea, it’s been raining solidly for 4 days!” only to be ordered to send a team from VASS to do it. The VASS team goes to the other side with the big tug master, only to get halfway across the grass before the tug sinks 18 inches to its chassis. Radio calls gets the other VASS tractor across with a winch. That tractor even with a snow plough on it does a great impression of a plough trying to winch the tug out. Even EOD get involved with their AFV. It’s standing on the back of its tracks trying to pull the tug out with no effect. By this time the rest of the lads from MCSF had been called over with shovels and boards. We dug trenches for the wheels and laid down boards in between and ramps out the back. Then the tug was then driven out slowly with boards placed in front of its path back to the taxi way. We were covered in mud and the Flight Sargent wasn’t seen at the beer call that evening..

pbk

10th Feb 2014, 22:05

Funny how you remember a/c numbers, XV 307 brings back a terrifying moment as my pension was due in a couple of months; winter 89/90, towing 307 to bay 43 at Rompers, directly in front of ops, wet night. Little Annie on the brakes; as the chocks were put in, I shouted breaks off. The tug had been disconnected and 3 of us had hold of the towing arm. As Annie let go the brakes the bl##dy kite jumped up and pushed the nose wheel chocks out of the way and headed off towards the Bund Road Fence.... fortunately Annie was on the ball and leapt back into the seat and screamed down the back for more pressure of which there was not alot. fortunately the guy on the pump gave it all he had and Annie had the sense to wait before having another go at the pedals. She banged on the brakes and 307 fortunately shuddered to a halt mere inches from chain link and concrete posts. CHOCKS IN shouts I before almost collapsing in a heap of relief...... unfortunately the lads on the towing arm had seem me vainly tugging on the arm trying to stop Albert + 34k from rolling down the hill. Annie was a stroppy moo but I could have klissed her that night!
Had to laugh at the comments regarding bottle trolleys at Waddo. In the early 70's there were 22 nitrogen trolleys on the line and they were constantly having to be topped up at the weir (spelling?) the line tractor had a rev counter that basically said 19 mph per thousand revs; what nobody said was you cant make the tractor rev counter hit the stops at 2000 rpm with just the judicious use of a safety raiser handle jammed on the throttle cable. When you are towing perhaps a dozen trolleys and supper and the Raven club disco were about to start and it is peeing down or just Waddos brand of freezing fog surrounding you, 4 tons of tractor + trolleys could be a very interesting ride at around 40mph or so..........
Also remember back at Rompers when told to closr the hangar doors in J2 when just as the nose dock door was nearly closed, XV 177 jumped 4ft side ways to attack the door honest.......

Danny42C

10th Feb 2014, 22:21

If it's not too far off thread (and admittedly no aircraft are involved), the second part of my #4260 (p. 213) on the "Pilots Brevet in WW2" Thread, may amuse. It was about a tractor tow which bid fair to put a whole runway u/s !

D.

newt

10th Feb 2014, 22:37

Sorry guys, I just have to ask the question! Why do tow bars have shear pins?

Standing by for incomers:ok:

ShyTorque

10th Feb 2014, 23:18

Because some aircraft have limits on the left/right travel of the nose gear. Better to break the pin than break the oleo.

NutLoose

10th Feb 2014, 23:33

They are a failsafe, better the pin shears when you overload the arm than you tear the U/C leg out of the airframe. They are not just for side loadings either, but also for fore and aft.

camlobe

11th Feb 2014, 00:31

Newt,
As ShyTorque and NutLoose have referred, the sheer pin forms the weak link when towing, but only really effective when pulling. You can sheer the sheer pin when pushing, but you may not notice until the prime mover stops and the A/C continues. The sheer pins were manufactured from a fairly hard aluminium alloy and had a hole drilled through the centre. One end had a 'head' like a clevis pin, and the other end was cross-drilled for a split pin or similar to prevent the sheer pin from jumping out. They are manufactured in different ratings to reflect the weight of the aircraft being towed, and the ratings are identified by stamps on the head.

So, if the correct pin is fitted, can you damage the aircraft? Well, yes. In the incident Wensleydale referred to earlier, Shackleton AEW II WL 756 had its tail wheel assembly, including surrounding structure, ripped out. The correct rating sheer pin was installed in the tow bar at the time.

The aircraft were being put away into K17 hangar, a building that could accommodate three Shacks...if done correctly. 8 Sqn line had a Douglas Medium tractor (max tow weight 100,000 lbs) and the SOP was to tow the first one into the hangar, and at the last minute, swing the tractor to one side, just missing the far-end doors. This would ensure the tail of the aircraft would be as close as possible to the doors thereby leaving enough room to get another two Shacks into the hangar. If the first one wasn't in far enough, the third one would have its nose sticking out the other end.

On this particular occasion, the Douglas was U/S, so '56 was being towed in by the station Tug, a vehicle that due to its size was unable to do the 'Douglas swing'. The towing party stopped and opened the two centre doors to allow the Tug to drive straight through. Doors open and tug moves forward. Because the NCO I/C hadn't requested "brakes ON", he didn't request "brakes OFF" either. The awfully helpful chap in the cockpit had decided to play safe when the aircraft came to a halt and put the brakes on, just to be safe. Due to the noise of the Tug running in the hangar, none of the external towing team heard the air brakes operate (loud hissing like a lorry) and therefore were none the wiser. Because the Tug applied an even and smooth pull, and because the Shack towing arm had a very big spring, the forces wound up until the tail wheel structure overloaded. Fortunately, the bomb doors were fully open, and the aircraft settled onto the rear of the bomb doors. Because the bomb doors were hinged off the strongest longitudinal part of the aircraft, the longerons, the weight of the aircraft was supported by this strong path, thereby preventing major crush and ripple damage to the rear fuselage.

A sheer pin will fail quickly if subject to a 'snatch' load, and more slowly if the overload is gradual. I think most of the contributors in these pages have seen sheer pins in an almost 'S' shape when removed.

Camlobe

Richard Woods

11th Feb 2014, 10:49

Shackletons can still be difficult due to how fragile the tailwheel is.. it doesn't take much effort to break one, and they're not that solidly attached!

There are numerous photo's of MR2 aircraft sat on their tailfins without being towed, and looking through the paperwork both tailwheel oleo and the bearing blocks for the torque tube have an SI regarding stress cracking. Our WR963 split her tailwheel oleo leg from top to bottom last year, partly caused by getting stuck in a rabbit hole in the soft sand on the grass area at Coventry Airport.

As the tug moved the aircraft forward to go off the grass towards the ramp, the ground just caved in below the starboard mainwheel. Our tug is an old Fleet Air Arm deck tug, and as a result it isn't really equipped with tyres for the job, so we were very happy when Air Atlantique's old David Brown tractor took over and gently hauled her out of the hole.

The shear pin in the towbar didn't let go, but the tailwheel casting did. :ooh:

Exrigger

11th Feb 2014, 13:00

peppermint_jam's photo I thought was going to be of the German Tornado at St Athan post Air Show day in I think 93, but it was not allthough looks exactly the same state regard sinking as that one did. The background for the St Athan one was the towing teams are directed which aircraft and what order that the aircraft where moved from the static line to the active line for dispatch.

The Tornado's had to be moved first but there was not enough wing tip clearance between the RH wing tip and the nose of the other aircraft on the only route that could be used, when requesting advice it was basically sort it out, so as it had been a lovely sunny period the airfield grass was dry and earth solid provided you made sure the RH wheel was at least 3 foot onto the grass, 2 aircraft had been moved with success in this manner, but the third the RH mainwheel was moved the minimum amount off the taxi way and immediately sunk in one of the few soft spots around, it ended up like the one in picture above.

Several hours later when the wheel ended up bogged down even more by trying to pull it out with larger and larger vehicles (pushing and pulling) and the towing rescue sling, one full defuel once all the kit was assembled to empty the wing tanks, then somone listened to those that would have removed the aircraft hours earlier by digging a trench and laying a sheet of runway repair plate down, within 15/20 minutes after doing this the aircraft was successfully returned to the flight line and departed post refuel.

The debrief took a long time as well, as apparently it was my fault for succesfully doing it that way with the other aircraft.

camlobe

11th Feb 2014, 13:04

Late '80's, Lossiemouth.

"EMERGENCYSTATETWO, EMERGENCYSTATETWO, EMERGENCYSTATETWO, JAGUAR AIRCRAFT TWO POB, WITH NOSE UNDERCARRIAGE PROBLEMS"

All sections empty to watch the unfolding drama. Front seater elects to remain on board to assist rear seater (experience had apparently shown that the forward fuselage distorts, possibly affecting ejection of the front seat). Beautiful clear day. Over the hedge and the canopy is jettisoned, landing inside the airfield boundary. The most gentle contact of the mainwheels, and one of the most bizarrely beautiful sights entertain the onlookers - the graceful look of a Jaguar, mains on the floor with nose gear out of sight. It looked just so right.

Back to reality, speed slows and gravity takes over. The nose of the Jag is brought into contact with the Tarmac smoothly, and the aircraft slows and stops on the centreline. Two bods out safely on the grass and fire crews attend. Station personnel applaud, glad of the safe outcome, and impressed with the brilliant job done by these two fine aviators.

Then the recovery of the Jag.

226 send a team to recover the aircraft. MT crane lifts the nose and the tracks are positioned underneath. The tracks are connected to the tractor by a chain, and the SNCO I/C the move walks quickly beside the aircraft while SAC Bloggs is sat on the brakes. All's well until they are moving along the taxyway past the Great Eight...where the taxyway dips. The whole line shift in Eight including JENGO and SENGO are at the window to see how the 226 neighbours are going to "cope-with-the-slope". We are not disappointed.

The tractor (MF 40 IIRC) continues at it's fixed fast walking speed accompanied by its escorting SNCO. The Jag starts accelerating...

Bloggs the brakeman cannot steer away from the tractor because...the steerable nose wheel is in bed. The sound of the dragging chain alerts the SNCO that all may not be well. The wingtip guys, residing in the tractor, alert the tractor driver of the impending pitot tube coming his way.

At the same moment, the brakeman stands on his pedals while the tractor driver accelerates.

The tracks didn't get completely dragged out from under the Jag nose, but it was awfully close.

MT crane called again, nose re-lifted, tracks placed, and loads of 226 personnel escort the unfortunate Jag and it's recovery team home. And the whole station saw it.

We sat down again and had another coffee.

Just another day in a blue suit.

Camlobe

Dan Gerous

11th Feb 2014, 14:05

Cam was that in 1985? I remember seeing that, and watching the canopies come off and a very smooth landing all things considered. Was one of the pilots the incoming station CO?

mad_jock

11th Feb 2014, 19:27

You can sheer the sheer pin when pushing, but you may not notice until the prime mover stops and the A/C continues

Not taking the piss but has nobody thought of putting a dead rope steel cable between the front and aft connectors?

You could even be fancy and run a hydraulic sensor up the middle of it and when it pulls tight when the pin sheers it will ring a bell. If you put the cable over a pully it will sound the alarm when it breaks pushing and pulling.

Or would that just spoil the fun?

camlobe

11th Feb 2014, 20:14

Dan,
It would have been around '85, but can't be precise...I've slept since then. And, yes, I do believe the incoming Groupie was one of the participants...however, see clause one above.

Mad Jock,
Either or both of your ideas make perfect sense. I can't comment on the tow bars in use today, but I don't remember anything sensible like your ideas in use. Maybe there was but I was just in attentive.

Camlobe

ShyTorque

11th Feb 2014, 21:08

You just reminded me we used to open the hangar doors at Coningsby by pushing them with a Land rover bumper. Lot easier than winding that bloody handle

I recall the RAF banned this procedure after a civilian contractor managed to push a hangar door off its rails. The door fell on him, his tractor and one of his colleagues, who was working on a Chipmunk at the time. The hangar door flattened the lot of them.

camlobe

11th Feb 2014, 22:18

Shy's comment reminds me of the following.

Panic detachment to investigate and recover a Shack at Topcliffe. Linton (or was it Leeming) supplied and delivered a tractor and power set. We arrived after an eight hour trip in a four-speed Sherpa, no doubt the worst piece of MT ever.

At the time, Topcliffe was an army base with a small aviation contingent, JEFTS (Joint Elementary Flying Training Squadron), the starting point for RAF and RN pilots.

Linton had towed our Shack into JEFTS hangar, which was then filled up with their Bulldogs. Needless to say, our kite was at the end of the hangar with the hangar doors that hadn't been used for decades. Parked by the Shack was the tractor and power set.

Camlobe needs to get the Shack out and ground run the suspect engine to confirm his phone diagnosis. Problems are, the hangar doors are seized, the power set is huge and in the back of a Bedford 8-tonner, and the tractor is a Tug, and Linton Mt will take at least an hour to get to us.

The rules say, we can't use MT on hangar doors; I can't drive the 8-tonner as I don't have it specified on my RAF driving licence; and, although I am a towing instructor and examiner, I most definitely do not have Tug on my licence.

For the only time in my career, I issue a direct order...to my team to assist me and I state most clearly that it is my decision and my decision alone, and if it turns to a can of worms, I'll carry the can solo. To a man, they have no qualms about what was going to happen next, safe in the knowledge that their careers will be intact.

The Tug was used successfully to open and close the seized doors three times in total, and a considerable amount of paint was transferred from Tug to doors.

We had the aircraft back on line following an engine change, and everyone pleased with the result.

Except for OC MT at Linton.

Upon return to base, I went straight to SENGO's office and fully briefed him of events, warts and all. I emphasised the point that the team were merely following my direct orders, and no blame or fault should be attributed to them. When he asked why I made the decisions I did, I stated I was doing my best to ensure we could continue to meet our 'Q' commitment in the safest and quickest manner.

Over the next couple of weeks, SENGO would call and ask " so you had no licence for the tug?' 'No, sir'. 'And you used the tug for opening and closing the hangar doors?' 'Yes, sir'. 'And you knew that was wrong?' 'Yes, sir'. 'Hmmm'. In Cyprus a couple of weeks later. "Camlobe, SENGO on the phone". Questions once again same as above. Then silence. I never heard another thing again. I had expected a severe punishment for my serious transgressions, but nothing.

A year later, I was I/C Doomwatch. One of the lads found the Squadron Occurance folder that had been left on the debrief desk by mistake. "Hey, camlobe, you're in here". Who ME? Sure enough, the whole episode described above was in graphic detail. The Linton OC MT wanted my blood. Even Lossiemouth OC Eng Wing wanted my blood. And he gave SENGO a hard time.

SENGO backed me to the hilt without reservation. This was the first I knew. Mike Duguid, I still owe you many beers and fine malts for that one.

Camlobe

P.S. No one ever asked or fussed about me using the Tug to tow the Shack in and out of the hangar or driving the 8-tonner. Proof that paintwork is more important than rules???

smujsmith

11th Feb 2014, 22:29

Camlobe,

A classic if ever I read one. Sometimes the old "Rules are for the obedience of fools and the guidance of wise men." Really rings true. Your SENGO obviously backed the correct horse, and good to know there was no comeback.

Smudge:ok:

Geezers of Nazareth

11th Feb 2014, 23:59

I know that this is supposed to be 'military' stories and anecdotes, but all my aviation experiences are from the civil world. A few 'towing' and 'pushback' events that I either witnessed, or was involved in (in a minor fashion) ...

Towing team detailed to move an airliner from a stand/gate at the terminal to remote parking as it won't be required for the rest of the day. Towing team tow the wrong aircraft ... two identical aircraft on adjacent stands, and they picked the wrong one! Red faces.

Notified of an aircraft arriving shortly and has indications of a hydraulic failure. The plan is, they will stop on the runway and a towing-team will connect the bar and tow the aircraft to the stand. The towing team are waiting near where I am working, so I spend some time chatting with them while they explain how it will all happen. Aircraft lands, and one of them says (checking his bit of paper) "that's the one we're here for". At which point I advise them that they've bought the wrong tow-bar for the aircraft. Red faces.

Sitting in our crew-room when there is a very loud and sudden 'b-o-o-o-m!' and the whole place suddenly goes quiet. Everybody does their best meerkat impression and heads for the nearest door to see what's happened. No smoke or visible signs of damage, but there is an aircraft half-way through its push-back which is now stopped mid-taxiway.
During pushback, just as they're about to start the turn, a tyre burst on the tug. A big 70-tonne brute, with tyres nearly 6-feet across. Not sure what tyre-pressure it was, but it was loud. I suspect that the ground engineer needed a change of under-crackers.

Danny42C

12th Feb 2014, 00:41

camlobe,

In '56, as "Talkdown" on the old MPN-1 Radar, I regularly drove the 8-ton AEC "Matador" which carried the Lister generator set for the Radar truck, to which it was coupled and which it hauled round the airfield.

I had no instruction whatever in driving this vehicle, no HGV licence, so no endorsement on my RAF Driving Licence, (which would have been difficult in any case, as I didn't have one :sad:). I had a civvie one, though, so I suppose that was all right so long as I wasn't on a public road. And everybody in ATC drove our landrover with or without a RAF Licence. Life was simple in those times.

So they wouldn't let me take it on the road ? (Wouldn't be too sure about that either !)

Your SENGO sounds the "Right Stuff". Pity we didn't have more like him (bet he was an old Fitter 1 (E) or (A)).

Happy Days..Danny.

camlobe

12th Feb 2014, 01:30

The French trip
We land at a French Naval air station populated with Breguet Atlantique and Breguet Alize aircraft. Following ATC instructions, we taxy along a tree-lined taxyway watching our wingtips with great care as the trees don't look far enough away. Eventually, we are confronted by a marshaller. He brings us forward, stops us...and then gives the marshalling signal for...reverse. After a team laugh, the Crew Chief de-planes and has the most animated, hand-waving, same-words-with-raised-voice conversation with the marshaller. Crew Chief climbs back on board and advised the front end that the locals would like us to park in the very nice and pretty, tree-surrounded pan just to our right. The captain, the venerable and larger-than-life B###s H####n, decides he can manoeuvre us around and in. Most of us disagree, but as he outranks everyone else on board, round we go. The French welcoming committee is enlarging by the second, perhaps because none of them have ever seen a Shackleton before, or maybe waiting for les Anglaise to muck it up.

The Boss does an excellent job of getting us into the pan, but as we are now facing the wrong way, he does his best to swing us round the right way. Due to the closely bordering trees, we stop after loosing three static wicks, oh, and the wildly cross-arms waving of the Crew Chief. I hand down the undercarriage locks and climb down the ladder...to see the starboard mainwheel visably sinking into the Tarmac.

Without a moments pause, I climb on board and accost the boss. "Look Boss, the aircraft is sinking into the Tarmac. You speak fluent French! I need a tractor and towing arm RIGHT NOW". With all due credit, the Boss recovers from the shock of my rather forceful interruption, meets the head French fish head and requests tractor and towing arm and points to the disappearing mainwheel. The French are now embarrassed hosts, and with great rapidity organise both.

As most of us know, France wasn't part of NATO. When the combo turn up, the only available towing arm is for an Atlantique. Lightweight aluminium, short, and non-compatable with our home-grown NATO-compatable axle pin which slots through the middle of the tail wheels. The Crew Chief Al, the SGT rigger Del, and myself rapidly break down the towing arm, reverse a bit here, upside down a bit there, and voila, it will fit. Now for the tractor. And it is a tractor. An agricultural tractor. With twin rear wheels. I get the Boss to translate "I will tow". I don't think he translated the rest of my stressed message which went along the lines of "I'm not having some garlic-smelling foreigner ripping the tail wheel out of this aircraft in his enthusiasm to impress us with his Paris taxi driver antics". Well, I had seen him arrive with the Renault.

Del had placed a large chock in front of the mainwheel in an attempt to arrest the rate of sinkage. We all briefed what I was going to attempt. I would gently pull and ease back, then try and pull a bit more etc etc in order to try and rock the mainwheel out of its resting place. There was absolutely no room for any error on my part as there wasn't a sheer pin in the towing arm, and no tension spring, so all inputs from the tractor would be directed onto the tail wheel leg and surrounding structure.

In for a penny...feeling for the bite on the clutch and then take up load. Back off and try a bit more...then the tractor wheels spun. It just didn't have enough mass to pull the Shack. I explain the problem to the Boss who translates. Three minutes later, a small aircraft tug arrives. It was a similar size to the small American machines used to move F4's, about half the weight of our Shack. But it had to be better than the Renault. Problem was, this single-seater cab already had an occupant, and he wasn't going to get out. So I forced him into the corner, and we tried the rocking trick. This tug had an automatic gearbox which is fine for a smooth take-up, but lacked the precise feel needed in this situation. So, with the greatest trepidation, I started pulling, with my other foot resting on the brake to prevent any rollback. The tugs engine note increased, the tow bar creaked, the Shack groaned, and camlobe sweated. A bit more..."it's moved" from Del, who jams his chock in a bit further. A bit more rocking..."it's moved again". Al is concentrating on the tail wheel leg, and look, he's sweating too. I'm terrified I'm going to pull the leg out. Maybe I should ease off. Maybe there is another way. "It's moved again, it's going, it's going" and it's out. The feeling of relief was indescribable. I wasn't responsible for causing Cat 4 damage to one of her Majesty's aircraft. I straighten up the aircraft on the pan, give my towing 'partner' his tractor back, the French decide to leave the tow bar with us for the duration, and the Boss and crew leave to enjoy some French hospitality. Del does a most detailed inspection of the tail wheel leg and surrounding structure and proclaims everything in excellent health. Thank you Mr Chadwick, you built them well.

The reason why the mainwheel sank through the Tarmac was due to a culvert below that collapsed under the weight of half a Shack. The depression left by the mainwheel was around 6 inches deep.

That evening, we are gathered in the bar of the hotel drinking far more than is responsible. The bar closes, so the Boss insists we retire to his room and continue. After a few minutes of this, the porter knocks and quietly advises us the 90 year old lady next door is not amused. We move to another room and continue. The Boss and I are discussing the 'event' when he slurs " you know" he chuckles, " I did the same thing here 20 years ago in Mk III"

Happy daze.

Camlobe

longer ron

12th Feb 2014, 06:03

We arrived after an eight hour trip in a four-speed Sherpa, no doubt the worst piece of MT ever.

The 3 speed Bedford CF took some beating LOL on a drive from Brawdy to Colt to recover a hawk... I had to wear ear defs on the dual cabbageways :).
Of course prior to that - the Austin J4 - then JU250 were pretty crap.

Just remembered - on the 3 speed CF - reverse was where first gear is normally on the gate...outstanding safety feature ...well done vauxhall :ok:

OldAgeandTreachery

12th Feb 2014, 10:03

Ah - Mike Duguid: he of the Hundustani Granny song. Yes,one of the best: A very sensible head on broad shoulders.

NutLoose

12th Feb 2014, 11:22

The 3 speed Bedford CF took some beating LOL

Wasn't that the one that you could fry eggs on the engine cover between the seats after a long run?

Sherpas, we took one around the Banked track at Brooklands :) hanging on for dear life..

I remember going to Salisbury Plain in a Bedford RL, as we drove along at warp factor nought you could here this rattling chinking noise, we both looked at each other and shrugged, arriving and getting out my fearless driver found the noise was caused by all the coins in his combat trouser pockets falling out and dissapearing through a hole in the floor, he lost quite a bit of money lol.

Not a Crew Chief

12th Feb 2014, 21:58

The discussion on shear pins brings back memories.
Late 70's bombing comp at Lossie. Laarbruch's folding wing bombers operating out of the navy hangar where the exit is immediately up an incline. At the hangar door threshold is a drainage channel where the grating is not level with either the hangar floor or the sloping taxiway. The navy have given us a tractor. Not your usual RAF line type but a Massey Ferguson original, probably made even before M & F actually met each other. The trick was to get enough speed on the tractor/Bucc combo to get up the slope but not so much as you jumped the nosewheel on the threshold.
One morning when I thought I'd really got the hang of it, first two aircraft out and two shearpins worked exactly as advertised. Navy chief takes pity and says "you'll never do it with one of those (insert derogatory adjective here) RAF towbars, use one of ours".
The navy towbar was exactly the same as ours, at the nosewheel end. Tractor end was different. Bolted welded and very, very solid. Given what had just happened I said I couldn't use that as the weak link was now the nose leg. Chiefy reminds me Blackburn milled their aircraft out of solid and pilots have been landing them on pitching carriers for years " so you aren't going to break it". And do you know what, he was right. Mind you for the rest of the det it was the most controlled and considered movement of aircraft I've ever done.
Lightning tales later.

camlobe

13th Feb 2014, 10:49

Smudge and Danny,

Don't know if SENGO backed the correct horse, but he certainly had my back. What has made it the sweeter is, I never asked for his coverage, and I knew unquestionably that I had deliberately flaunted a long list of 'golden rules', especially the standard Engineering Wing Routine Order on every airfield in the RAF that thou shalt not use MT to move hangar doors. I didn't plan on setting myself up for the chop, but I did accept total responsibility for my decisions. I am guessing I must have convinced Mike Duguid that this was very much a one-off set of circumstances, and not my normal practice. Honest. Then again, we had known each other for some years, and he probably knew me better than I thought I did.

Danny,
In my day, MT would issue the licence (C if you didn't have a civil driving licence, B if you did) and after a test on each type, annotate them specifically on said licence. I had a 'B' with a 'C' attachment for our de-icing bowser before Her Majesty issued my HGV. Then everything was a 'B'. A 'C' licence was restricted to the station only i.e. not public roads.

But, it was Air Traffic that issued the airfield driving permits, and would charge anyone caught driving on "their turf" without it.

Poacher turned gamekeeper perhaps?

Old Age and Treachery,
"Will triumph over youth and spirit". Eight Squadron's best catchphrase. We probably know each other. I completely concur with your description of MD. He single-handedly steered the Great Eight's engineering forward during trying and difficult times, and had the natural gift of convincing everyone we were winning. And as for the Hindustani Granny, I have never before or since met anyone who could make up so many great lines on the go, even when rather tipsy.

Mike was a breath of fresh air to Eight, especially after the atrociously poor, spiteful and divisive J#hn Alt#n, who let the officer corp and the engineering branch down badly.

Camlobe

Belle and Sebastian

13th Feb 2014, 13:12

I arrived at a certain base in Rutland as a new liney and spent my first Friday afternoon towing some of the 28 ac from the line to the hangar. I get a brief from the Cpl i/c and get into the front cockpit. For reassurance, there is an experianced liney in the back to keep me company.

Just as we set off, I'm told that my passenger has just returned from the med centre after being on suicide watch due to girlfriend/wife/money issues. The canopy closes and the chap in the back starts moaning about life being poo and wanting to end it all. As we pass ATC, he passes me an ejection seat pin and tells me he's about to pull the handle to bang out.

Naturally, I tried getting out but, of course, the canopy wouldn't open! I was a jibbering wreck as we got to the hangar....but the towing team were pis#ing themselves laughing as it's revealed that my miserable pax did indeed have a spare ejection seat pin and the episode was part of my 'welcome'..........

Lightning5

13th Feb 2014, 17:55

Loosely associated with aircraft towing. Many years ago at a fighter base in Fife it was my turn for a week as a corporal I/c duty crew. The week went well until a 23 Sqn Jav went of the runway. Crash siren blasting around the base and panic in the duty crew room!! Now ,we were based in one of the ancient early wooden hangars that has numerous support pillars. In our panic, me driving the crash kit on the bomb trolley , taking a corner a little too soon, managed to jam said trolley between the pillars. Ten minutes now spent jacking the bomb trolley to free it from it,s prison ! Tower is now going berserk , where the hell is the crash crew? We dare not tell them! Finally freed, we went screaming through the partial open hangar doors ( wooden doors, but big ) when there was a rather loud bang, followed by a rather louder bang. What the hell was that was the cry?
No problem came back the reply just keep driving, we will try to put the hangar door back on later !! Not a good night, but we did get the Jav out of the mud.

NutLoose

13th Feb 2014, 18:34

Damaging buildings, now I was good at that, I was temporarily assigned to an engine bay between squadrons for a month or so, I was responsible for shuffling about engine modules and their cases... Having to move a module I drove over and under it with the forks and started to lift it, blimey it was heavy, heavier than I remembered, but I persevered, forks straining to lift it then all of a sudden bang and it was up.. Stopping I looked behind the packing case to find I'd also lifted the cast iron heating pipe that ran the length of the building fracturing it... Oops, but good old PSA had drained the system for the summer... Thinks to self, own up and take the grief for a genuine accident or leave it for them to find in the winter... I do wonder when they found it.. :p

ex-fast-jets

13th Feb 2014, 19:28

I have been away/busy/not interested.................................

And I come back to this!!

Have you no shame starting a thread such as this??

The Jaguar you so carelessly abandoned could have been easily towed to the threshold - with or without a shear pin - in no time at all!

I think you have been deliberately naughty!!:E

bill2b

13th Feb 2014, 19:38

Belle and Sebastian
Than had me in stitches, brilliant. I was at Cottesmore mid 80's and heard about someone during the Friday afternoon rush getting "briefed" by ATC for towing 2 Tornado's one on the front pushing and the one on the back following, I don't know if it was true but I thought it was a good idea.
Peppermint Jam
We had the same thing happen at Marham in the early 90s I was in ASF and we got called out to lift it out, we had to wait till a crane arrived from Norwich though.
ExRigger
My story is also about Marham in the early 90s I was the ASF tower and we were collecting a Tornado from one of the squadrons, it was when some review was on and we had to do our servicing's on the other side of the airfield. We had collected the aircraft and stopped at the side of the runway and my Chief radioed ATC for clearance, then said Chief said "Go", off we trundled and when we had just hit the piano keys I pointed out to chief that there was a fin showing on the other end of the runway, apparently my mate Lenny on brakes could see the whole of the Andover heading at great speed towards us but could do nothing to let us know, Yikes forget the rules about not reversing a tractor pushing an aircraft we did just that and then sat on the taxiway waving to the pilots as they went past. Chiefy was told to report to ATC and bring his driver. They gave him a good talking to and even wanted to take my license off me, I told them where to go, I was doing what I was told, in the end only Chiefy lost his. Fond memories.

clicker

13th Feb 2014, 19:41

clicker is sitting in a civvie herk at Grotwick, crew have the pushback clearance from ATC and so inform the pushback crew we are ready to go.

They come back with a "sorry can't do, the towbar has broken." A few more questions and we find that the only herk towbar at Grotwick is the one in front of us, spare is at Thiefrow. Umm problem, due to sked crew will be out of hours before that gets to us.

"Grotwick Ground, NxxxST, can we reverse off the stand please?
"Negative due night time noise restrictions"
"Cockpit to Tug, can you send your chief to speak to us please"

A little conversation and agreement reached and so pushback resumes. Well pushback was not quite the right word to use. We did a power run on four engines in reverse pitch.

Tug and broken towbar kindly escort us to the taxiway center line so we don't get lost. Grotwick Ground, NxxxST readly for taxi."

Always wondered if any noise complaints got recorded that night. :E

NutLoose

13th Feb 2014, 19:54

I think the world record for towing must be held by a Puma, from near Micheldelver back to Odiham. :E

camlobe

13th Feb 2014, 20:20

In the late '70's at the secret base in North Wales, i do a deal one evening and buy a hulk of a mini from a friend. Problem was, the mini was at the MR site on the North side of the field, and my garage was in the domestic site. The mini has no seats, battery, brakes or steering wheel. A quick chat, I make a (really foolish and stupid) suggestion, and we have a plan. Mate in front towing the mini with a very questionable rope, mate behind bringing up the rear. Camlobe in the mini, on his knees, mole grips on the end of the steering column, and handbrake to hand. Off we go. We leave the North gate and onto the public road, lead and trail with lights on, camlobe in the dark (something's don't change). Hey, it's Ll working. This is going well.

CLANG, SCCRRRAAAAPPPEEEE. The mole grips are 'wrenched' (sorry) from my hand as the right front wheel goes on a UDI navex, and we grind (sorry again) to a halt. We are stuck on the public road right between the traffic lights, in line with the runway centreline. Half a dozen guys stand around still creased up at camlobe's expense.

And then the lights start to flash. What the f###...

Someone produces a torch, someone else chases after the wheel, the rest grope around for the errant wheel nuts...and the F111 deafens us and blows us around. He does a touch and go, and we renew our efforts with a frantic zeal, not wanting to still be here when he comes around again.

He must have seen us. He will have told ATC. We are going to be for the high jump now. It can only be a matter of seconds before the plods come to investigate. This was a stupid, stupid idea.

"Got one". "So have I". "I've got the wheel". "How are we going to jack it?" Stuff jacking it, I shout. Just lift the front end and I will spin the nuts on. Two will do.

We just clear the lights when our American friend returns. We got the mini back to my garage, and all the beer I had to buy that night cost more than the mini.

Camlobe

Danny42C

13th Feb 2014, 22:04

camlobe,

Splendid ! (the things we did - and sometimes got away with - when we were young !)

=====

Sad Hangar Door Story:

Teeside Airport on a freezing winter morning. The pax are finishing their coffee before boarding the first (0630) "shuttle" to LHR. The crews are ready.The aircraft is fuelled and (S) in the hangar. Now to open the doors.

Frozen solid !!!.........

=====

"Airfield Driving Permits".......What were they ?

=====

Wheel digs in, but is hauled out (after herculean efforts).

Same happened late '45 at Cochin (Wilingdon Island). Liberator sinks to the axles through the tarmac (contractor hadn't put anything between it and sand below !).

Couldn't get it out; war over anyway so didn't want the thing; left it there as war memorial; probably there yet.

=====

Keep it coming ! :D Danny.

NutLoose

13th Feb 2014, 22:27

Danny you will find this interesting, most of the survivors today came from India

Bharat Rakshak ? View topic - Why were B-24 Liberators demolished after World War II? (http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewtopic.php?t=381)

dkh51250

13th Feb 2014, 22:32

Apparently, before we invented the IRA and barbed wire, it was possible to depart Waddington via the A17 gate that linked the airfield and "the site". It is said that if you were in the car park (it was larger in the 1960s) of the Green Dragon on Lindum Hill, around suppertime, you may just be able to spot brightly coloured RL Befords laden with air or nitrogen bottles with the added attraction of the odd Landrover or J2 RVT thrown in for good measure.

Of course none of us could have driven them there as we all held C class licences. Was it possible to escape from Scampton in the same manner? If so, what was their destination? The Turks Head maybe.

Danny42C

14th Feb 2014, 00:54

Nutloose,

Thanks for the link ! (there is an awful lot of good stuff on Bharat Rakshak about the IAF in the war years, and I served in the IAF (8 Sqn) from 12/43 to 12/44).

The B.R. flurry of interest dates back to 2002, so not much purpose in my poking my nose in there now.

But the simple reason for the destruction of the B-24s I know only too well. "Lend-Lease" meant exactly what it said. The US will have lent these a/c to the RAF to fight the war (I don't think any were supplied to the IAF then).

The war was over, the deal was off. Now: (a), anything we want (eg Daks), you have to hand back to us (no option to purchase). Or (b), if you want to keep any of the rest, you must buy them from us (in dollars). Or (c), if you're not willing to do that, you must destroy them completely, so that no component can come back on the market to compete with US sales.

This would have applied here (I was ordered to burn my aircraft where they stood !).

Danny.

Geezers of Nazareth

14th Feb 2014, 09:17

I seem to remember seeing an article (and maybe some photos) about the Royal Singapore AF aircraft that were moved to Cazaux AB in SW France (they set-up a new pilot training school there). The aircraft were delivered as deck-cargo by ship to the port at Bordeaux, and then towed by road all the way to Cazaux. Not sure how far that is, maybe 30 miles? And it wasn't just one aircraft, it was 12-15 aircraft.

In the 50s and 60s when Fairey Aviation were based in Hayes they were building Gannets. Once the aircraft was completed, it was towed (at night) to nearby RAF Northolt for flight-test and delivery to another airfield (Woodley?, White Waltham?). Once again, not just one aircraft, but dozens of 'em.

gopher01

15th Feb 2014, 10:27

Location; Akrotiri
Timeframe; 1969 - 1971
Tasking; Lightning Fire Mod programme

103 M.U. was tasked with carrying out a Fire Mod programme on 56 Sqns Lightnings to try to keep them from bursting into flames when they went flying, at least apart from the ones coming out the back where they were meant to! The Mod consisted of cleaning out the upper engine bay and resealing it with PRC, doing the same to the wing tanks and setting up all fuel connections with gauges and then X-raying them to prove they were aligned correctly. All this took place inside a wooden hut erected around the airframe to keep the temperature within the curing limits of the PRC. This was then proved by filling the engine bay with water to see if it leaked and doing the same to the fuel tanks but pressurising them to check for any leakage. If all ok then give it back to 56 for rebuild, engine runs etc., but there were leaks appearing after rebuild and runs so more in depth leak checks were needed before giving the frames back to 56.
Much thought resulted in the need to introduce stresses to the frame and PRC during the leak checks, particularly of the tanks so some bright spark said why don't we tow the aircraft around a bit. Further thought given and permission obtained from relevant authority, even futher thought applied and need to really stress the frame realised and permission sought to tow faster,imagine when permission granted with the rider that we could tow at such a speed we decided was required! Game on!
The taxiway sloped down from the M.U. to 56 dispersal so it was decided to start in that direction, pass through 56 dispersal and back to the M.U. It is amazing just how fast a David Brown tractor with a stripped out Lighting can go with a slope to help it.
The resulting phone call from the W.O. at 56 to the M.U. was I gather quite heated along the lines of "what do your lot of idiots think they are doing with my airframe!" Granted the speedo on the D.B. was showing about 25 mph when the wheels actually touched the ground so maybe he did have a point but the frame didn't leak and was rebuilt and flown succesfully so aqll s well that ends well.
So much so that the check was adopted so 56 had to get used to seeing there frames going through the dispersal rather quckly.

Danny42C

16th Feb 2014, 01:45

gopher01,

I once managed to screw the "Matador" Generator truck, with MPN-1 GCA Radar set in tow, up to 21 mph (again on a gradually sloping bit of taxiway) at Strubby in the mid '50s.

You still trump me with your 25 mph Lightning - but then your tow was designed to go fast ! :ok:

D.

AGS Man

16th Feb 2014, 11:58

Some years ago at a Saudi Air Base we were tasked with putting a Lightning airframe on display. After much restoration work and much polishing the big day arrived when we tow 219 to its display plinth. Unfortunately when we reached the tech site gate the guard would not let us out! A captain was called then a major then.a colonel but the one stripe guard was immovable! Finally the base commander persuaded the guard to let us proceed. We then had to make a 90 degree turn and with only 8 inches wing tip clearance on each side proceed through the gate which we managed quite well. Then the easy bit...slalom along a Palm tree lined road and park it for lifting onto its plinth the next day. Unfortunately a culvert with a thin layer of tarmac over sand intervened and the port main gear sank. After much cursing a crane lift and copious quantities of p s p we finally parked and checked it for the night. The next morning the same guard was guarding 219 but that's another story!

Lima Juliet

16th Feb 2014, 13:55

I can vouch for mole grips on Mini's steering columns not working. Picture: Dining In Night, JOs in No 5s, coming up with a bright idea to tow the Mini to the front of the Mess, on reaching ~30mph then massive PIO occurs, Mini hits lamp post, lamp post now in half, lots of giggling and then the "it" hits the fan!

Location? Coningsby ~1995

LJ:ok:

Davef68

16th Feb 2014, 14:21

. And as for the Hindustani Granny,

IIRC the scottish folk singer Aastair McDonald had a song about a Hindustani Granny - who made curried mince and tatties - same one?

Excellent tales chaps - haven't stopped laughing!

fltlt

17th Feb 2014, 21:57

Back in the mid 80's we heard rumors of a Lancaster up around the Edmonton area. Cut a long story short two brothers purchased two Lancasters surplus.
Over the years the brothers had moved twice.

The surviving brother broke out their photo album documenting the moves.
Each fuselage (minus wings, tail planes and bomb bay doors) had a wooden cradle under the bomb bay made of 12" x 12" timber.
Notches were cut on the underside each side external to the fuselage.
The main wheels/hubs were supporting this contraption.
He had a picture of one of them with the tail turret mount lashed on the end of a pickup truck 'parked in a gas station' getting fuel.
Parked would be a loose term, the last 40 feet or so of the fuselage has yet to leave the road.

These were the folks that Doug Arnold got his long/short nose sorted out.

The road to were the remaining brother lived and to get to where the last fuselage was defied the thought process of getting something that size to where it was.

microlightgary

20th Feb 2014, 19:18

One sunny afternoon at Norfolk’s much lamented Jaguar base sometime in the mid 90’s, a Charity event has been scheduled, to wit a race between two teams of willing volunteers, one RAF, t’other Army. Each will be hauling a Jaguar behind them and the Devil take the hindmost. It’s been done many times before and never a hint of a problem – but – SEngO wades in, raising concerns about the well-established practice of lashing tape (which will be used to haul the Jags) being tied around the main undercarriage legs.
T’will not do says he and insists that a better solution would be for the aircraft to be pulled whilst facing backwards, i.e. lashing tape secured to the shackles located at the rear of each leg, and the teams with their collective backs to the jet pipes.
An experienced Chief raises strenuous objection but this wisdom is ignored by our man who insists that he knows best…
So, picture the scene - two Jaguars parked side by side with perhaps an aircraft’s width between them, two teams of lusty troops braced and ready, with a firm hold on lashing tape and right at the back (or the front depending on your point of view), two lineys holding on to aircraft steering arms. – Waiting at the side of the flightline ready for the ensuing spectacle is the Stn Cdr, the Stn Execs and visiting Army VIP’s.
Well, I can tell you that a clean and lightly loaded Jag gets up to running speed surprisingly quickly, however, what our man had failed to anticipate was that with the aircraft moving backwards, the noseleg was effectively facing the wrong way. Now this isn’t a problem at a slow walking pace (i.e. winching back in a HAS) but to my knowledge, no-one had ever attempted it at the run.
All of a sudden (and without warning), the first aircraft noseleg decides it really, really needs to castor through 180 degrees; this literally spits the liney off the steering arm and causes the aircraft to veer rapidly towards the adjacent jet – which is now doing exactly the same thing!
"Brakes!", scream I (and others) – thankfully the brakemen were alert and we had lots of brake pressure so disaster was averted, but honestly, not by much.
The result? 2 lineys lightly injured (cuts, grazes, bruising), much egg on collective Stn face, 1 ego comprehensively shattered and the Charity aircraft pull abandoned.
I gather SEngO had a one way conversation with OC Eng and the Stn Cdr – wish I could have been a fly on that particular wall :E