F16 Drone Thread (merged twice)

[Toadstool]

BBC News - Empty F-16 jet tested by Boeing and US Air Force (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-24231077)

F16 empty cockpit.

[Rhino power]

Boeing suggested that the innovation could ultimately be used to help train pilots, providing an adversary they could practise firing on.

Really?! What do BOING think the USAF have been doing with retired jets converted into FSATs for the past 50+(?) odd years!

-RP

P.S. Glad they've finally found a suitable role for the Lawn Dart! ;)

[Courtney Mil]

Indeed. When I was based at Tyndall AFB, it was great sport to join Falcon Eddie (RIP), ex-F-16 pilot, then remote F-4 drone pilot, talk about his missions against live armed front-line jets trying to shoot his aircraft down. A better end for a fine aircraft than being smashed up by metal traders.

Haven't heard the term Lawn Dart for ages! :ok:

Who is Boing? :E

[500N]

Courtney

Genuine question.

Did he win often ?

[Courtney Mil]

Probably for a lot of reasons, but I think I see what you're getting at.

[unclenelli]

After 15 yrs of basking in the desert at AMARC, the US have commissioned 6 F-16s as QF-16s. BBC News - Empty F-16 jet tested by Boeing and US Air Force (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-24231077)

But one of the chief complainants is non other than "spokesman for the Campaign to Stop Killer Robots" Professor Noel Sharkey (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noel_Sharkey) - The same bloke who brought us ROBOT WARS!!! Teams of kids who were encourage to build Robots who could KILL other Robots!!!!

What a hypocrite - he brought us 7 Series & 2 "Extreme" Series of Robot Wars which were filmed inside a hangar at former RAF Newton, West Bridgford, Notts.
The House-Robots sported names like:
Sgt Bash
Sir Killalot
Dead Metal
The Sentinel
Mr Psycho
and the arena had features such as:
The Pit Of Oblivion
The Disk Of Doom
The Flame Pit
The Drop Zone


It was shown in the UK from 1998 to 2003 and repeated on digital channels ever since.

Prof Sharkey is a victim of his own success - the root and cause of people who are now of an age to further develop and deploy these remotely piloted air systems in a theatre of conflict.

Surely someone of his renowned qualifications and intellect should realise that RPAS are NOT Drones. "Drone" implies an element of automatry and artificial intelligence. They are "Remotely Piloted Air Systems"


-----------------------

However, it did amuse me that Lincolnshire County Council, East Midlands Ambulance Service and Lincs Fire & Rescue chose to conduct a civil emergency exercise earlier this year involving a train crash nr Newark & the launching of a Thermal Imaging UAV over the Lincs F&R Trg ground on the eastern side of the A15 (formerly part of RAF Waddington)
"What? You're launching a "Drone" over Helen John (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helen_John)'s peace caravan?"

DOH!!!!!

[gr4techie]

and the arena had features such as:
The Pit Of Oblivion

Sounds like it was Marham.

[BEagle]

The QF-16 andQF-4 are just as much drones as were the UK's Firefly U9, Meteor U16, Sea Vixen D3.....and Jindivik.

Not new. Nothing to see here, move on.

[Lima Juliet]

BEags

There is something here that is new - the media are actually using the word 'drone' correctly in this instance. It should only be used to describe aircraft used for target practice like this QF-16, the DH Queen Bee (which is the origin of the name 'drone'), the QF-4 and the Jindavik (or others).

LJ

[just another jocky]

[pedant on]Robot Wars was also filmed in London as I took my son to one of the filmings for his birthday. :ok:[pedant off]

[The Helpful Stacker]

Just another small point.

.... which were filmed inside a hangar at former RAF Newton, West Bridgford, Notts....

RAF Newton isn't very close to West Bridgford at all. Both Bingham and East Bridgford are closer and Radcliffe-on-Trent is actually in between Newton and West Bridgford.

(THS, current resident of the Lace City).

[Wander00]

THS - how strange - from your list, met Mrs W in Nottingham, she was living in W Bridgeford, her brother was serving (literally) at Newton (he was a Chef in OM and Sgts Messes). She had previously lived in Radcliffe on Trent. Brother in Law now lives in Bingham. And our youngest son and gf moved to Nottingham on Monday. Apologies for thread drift - just amused me

[ExRAFRadar]

BBC News - Empty F-16 jet tested by Boeing and US Air Force (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-24231077)

[ExRAFRadar]

"However, a spokesman for the Campaign to Stop Killer Robots warned of the temptation to use them in warfare."

I would have thought the only place to use Killer Robots was in warfare

And I want to join the Campaign to Stop Killer Robots. What a great name

[Dash8driver1312]

Slow news day.

Anyone ever noticed how many QF-4s/QF-106s/Jindiviks have flown?

[GeeRam]

Slow news day.

Anyone ever noticed how many QF-4s/QF-106s/Jindiviks have flown?

And QF-100, QF-86's before that (not to mentioned the shedloads of old Meatboxes we converted as drone targets)

[Roland Pulfrew]

And, of course, the other 2 topics on QF-16s already on PPRuNe :rolleyes:

First (http://www.pprune.org/military-aircrew/524243-new-training-tool.html)

Second (http://www.pprune.org/military-aircrew/524249-1-1-scale-rpas.html)

[Courtney Mil]

Oh, Sorry, 500N. I completely failed to answer your quesion there. I was responding to something else - not there now. Mist be the pills.

Not often, but I do remember one excellent night in the O Club when Falcon had landed his QF4 back at Tyndall (the runway well out to the East) having denied the two F-16s their AIM-7 shots by hitting the beam. In his own words later, more by luck and a lot of poor coordination by the fighters, but at the time he was buying drinks all night.

[big v]

Now that's what I call a drone

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e7/Apollo_4_liftoff_-_GPN-2006-000038.jpg/260px-Apollo_4_liftoff_-_GPN-2006-000038.jpg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Apollo_4_liftoff_-_GPN-2006-000038.jpg)


Nov 9 1967. Apollo 4 was the unmanned dress rehearsal for the first manned Apollo mission. ;)

What's a "drone?"

Killer Death Robot gets my vote.

Regards,

Vernon

[melmothtw]

There is something here that is new - the media are actually using the word 'drone' correctly in this instance. It should only be used to describe aircraft used for target practice like this QF-16, the DH Queen Bee (which is the origin of the name 'drone'), the QF-4 and the Jindavik (or others).


Why do you say that Leon? I'm not disagreeing with you, but I'm curious as to how and why people draw a distinction between ISR/combat unmanned vehicles and unmanned targets when it comes to defining one as an UAV/RPAS etc and the other a 'drone' - they are both remotely piloted after all.

[500N]

Thanks Courtney

Reason I asked is I came across a video a while ago and it looked
like the Drone (F4) was missed. I can't find it to check.

[Toadstool]

And, of course, the other 2 topics on QF-16s already on PPRuNe

I'll have to make sure that the next time I start a thread, I check the future to make sure two others don't start similar threads:O

[WhiteOvies]

I wonder if the dear Prof and his friends are worried about the Skynet British military satellites currently orbiting earth. Plenty of links to killer robots with that name....

[OK465]

Can't vouch for the accuracy of this:

From the November issue of the semi-quarterly “Third Line of Offense Journal”:

A PR spokesperson for the WEG at Tyndall today announced radical changes to the WSEP profiles flown during Combat Archer:

“In an effort to add realism to Combat Archer scenarios and more closely align the pilot’s mindset with potential real world combat events and concerns, the Weapons Evaluation Group has been given the go ahead to arm QF-16 drones with a single defensive air-to-air weapon, either an AIM-9 or an AIM-120 depending on the QF block.”

Weapon employment will be controlled remotely by the drone pilot and may be initiated anytime after both the verbal “clear to maneuver” and “clear to fire” authorizations.

The WEG spokesperson stated: “With this option in place we will truly get a clearer picture of not only weapon effectiveness, but also pilot capability and aggressiveness and countermeasures usage. Put in doubt will be the on going issue of who really is the “smoker” and who then becomes the “smokee”.

Feedback from fighter pilots and particularly the Eagle community has been mixed.

A spokesperson for the first F-15 unit scheduled to deploy to Tyndall for this program stated: “This is like giving the rifles to the deer during hunting season. We’re still evaluating our planned level of participation in this type of leading edge training.”

An F-15 pilot stated: “Under these circumstances, it’s possible we’ll see more “blow thru” tactics utilized.

Another F-15 pilot stated: “With the high potential for unfavorable results, I would assume we will always engage the drone with numerical superiority.”

Guard F-15 pilot comments have run the gamut from “I’m transferring to C-130’s” to “They don’t pay me enough for this”.

An A-10 pilot was quoted as saying: “Bring it on.”

The bidding pool on the first Pork Falcon kill has now dropped below the $100 level.

The WEG spokesperson further added: “Painting an aircraft silhouette on a drone that recovers successfully will be discouraged however.”

Article by the former F-15 pilot and former WEG assistant acting Deputy Vice-Commander, Col. “Bugs” Outte, callsign “Viperbait”.

[Courtney Mil]

Apart from the obvious doubts about firing live missiles at manned aircraft in a training exercise, the article was a good read untill the line:

Guard F-15 pilot comments have run the gamut from “I’m transferring to C-130’s” to “They don’t pay me enough for this”.

Yeah. Right.

[Courtney Mil]

If you have any dollars to spare, I'd be happy to come and fly for some of them. :ok:

[NutLoose]

We've been doing it for years, RAFG Phantom V Jag training ;)

[Courtney Mil]

I shall pass your best wishes onto the victors when I see them in a few weeks. :ok:

[SpazSinbad]

One [2nd?] video here more or less same as earlier BBC video with an extra one.

Boeing’s QF-16 Goes Unmanned 26 Sep 2013 Steven Hoarn

Boeing's QF-16 Goes Unmanned | Defense Media Network (http://www.defensemedianetwork.com/videos/boeings-qf-16-goes-unmanned/)

Boeing's QF-16 makes its first unmanned flight - YouTube

GoPro: Boeing's QF-16 goes unmanned - YouTube