Bombardier C Series first flight this morning

[Dak Man]

Bombardier C Series first flight this morning.

The flight is scheduled to depart Montréal–Mirabel International Airport Monday, September 16, 2013, around 10 a.m. It is possible to follow the event via a live, public webcast at www.cseriesfirstflight.bombardier.com. Please register using the following link Bombardier CSeries First Flight | Bombardier Aerospace Events (http://events.aero.bombardier.com/CSeries_first_flight) and clicking on the "Register" tab that appears in the menu. Photos of the first flight will be available at Bombardier - The only manufacturer of planes and trains (http://www.bombardier.com) and www.cseries.com.

[His dudeness]

Thomas Gerbet's post on Vine (http://vine.co/v/hnQXWp2bKWi)

[Broomstick Flier]

A better video was posted by Bombardier on Youtube

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=byMIlLKJjFI

Congrats to all involved!

:D

[deSitter]

Looks like a, say, B320 :)

[andrasz]

SSJ Clone... :E

[DaveReidUK]

Aircraft recognition just got that little bit more difficult ... :O

[flyingflea]

Embraer MRJ ?

[racedo]

Good luck to them :D

[clunckdriver]

The load music drowning out the engine noise was played by a band hired by Bob Deluce no doubt!For those not Canucks, its all about Toronto City Center Airport {or Billy Bishop field if you prefer} and Bob Deluce of Porter Airlines trying to get it into City Center over the protests of local Nimbys.

[Jet Jockey A4]

The C series test aircraft just took off from CYMX this morning (09:56 local) on its maiden flight... Congrats to Bombardier!

First takeoff...

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b79/mlab601/CSeries_zps90b86b3a.jpg


First landing...

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b79/mlab601/CSerieslanding_zps1d09bd7c.jpg

The test pilot reported after the flight that everything went very well with only one small technical issue that did not prevent them from carrying on for almost 2.5 hrs of flight testing.

[Cartman's Twin]

So long as each one has CS100 on the tailplane I reckon it'll be a piece of cake!

[The Dominican]

It was all fun and games with the name calling and the jokes "Barbie jets" "Rice Rockets" "Jungle Jets" but these new generation mid size jets are for the first time posing a real threat to AB's & Boeing's most profitable and popular size...!
That is a nice looking A/C:ok:

[FR8R H8R]

787 style nose/cockpit. Looks lovely.

[deSitter]

I think this is worse for Airbus than for Boeing. The A320 is their meat and potatoes and offsets the likely never-to-be-recouped cost of the A380. The 777 has it all over the A340 and A330 and the 787, once debugged, is sure to have a huge advantage over the A350. Boeing can afford competition in the 737 sector but Airbus cannot in the A320 sector. It's good to have a third player again!

-drl

[cattletruck]

Always loved the build quality of the Bombardiers. Well done folks on designing another fine machine.

Just like Embaerer there must be an emerging sweet spot in the market for these size jets.

How do they compare in price/maintenance/performance to a turboprop of similar size?

[deSitter]

Light weight + modern engines = big fuel efficiency.

-drl

[ruddman]

That's all great, but how fast does it go? :ok:

[DaveReidUK]

How do they compare in price/maintenance/performance to a turboprop of similar size?There aren't any.

[Volume]

787 style nose/cockpit.Dornier 728 style nose/cockpit. Designed at a time when Boeing still did the Sonic Cruiser and 787 was not even talked about...

[TurboTomato]

and the 787, once debugged, is sure to have a huge advantage over the A350.

Erm, have you got any facts to back this pretty big statement up?

[cattletruck]

There aren't any.I thought the Dash 8 came close, anyways Google is my friend:
CS100 vs Q400 (figures sourced from wikipedia.)
Length: 114ft/107ft
Seats: 110/80
Price US: $62m/$27m
Range: 5,500Km/2,500km
Cruise: 447kt/360kt
Payload: 14,500kg/8,600kg
And the best bit:
Take off run @ MTOW: 1,500m/1,400m

Looks like the writing is on the wall for big passenger turboprops as turbojets get even more powerful and even more efficient.

[StormyKnight]

Bombardier Q400 Speed:
Q400 Max Cruise Speed: 360 kts (knots), 414 mph, 667 km/h (Kilometers per Hour)
Q400 High Speed Cruise: 349 kts (knots), 402 mph, 646 km/h (Kilometers per Hour)
Q400 Long Range Cruise Speed: 287 kts (knots), 330 mph, 532 km/h (Kilometers per Hour)

Bombardier Q400 Specifications - Dimensions | Sun Airlines (http://www.flysunairlines.com/bombardier-q400/bombardier-q400-specifications-dimensions) :)

[DaveReidUK]

I thought the Dash 8 came close

At comparable seat pitch, say 32", the seating capacities of the Dash 8 Q400 and the CS100 are 72 and 110 passengers, respectively.

[Seloco]

787 style nose/cockpit.

Dornier 728 style nose/cockpit. Designed at a time when Boeing still did the Sonic Cruiser and 787 was not even talked about...

Come on chaps! The nose is undoubtedly a reflection of Bombardier's (albeit distant) De Havilland heritage :D

[FE Hoppy]

I note that Embraer already have about the same number of orders for their Ejet 2.0 as Bombardier have for the Cs.

It's a nice looking aeroplane and I'm looking forward to becoming intimate with it over the next few years but I wonder if it will make any money with such stiff competition from Brazil.

[flyboyike]

They'll make money with it somehow, no worries. I'm sure Bombardier is aware of EMBRAER.

[Dave Gittins]

Looks like those engines will be pretty easy to scrape with a bit of bank in a crosswind.

[Cows getting bigger]

Nice looking aircraft.

[deSitter]

Quote:
Originally Posted by deSitter
and the 787, once debugged, is sure to have a huge advantage over the A350.

Erm, have you got any facts to back this pretty big statement up?


Three year head-start, nearly 1000 orders, certain to have a popular cargo version (A350F est. 2020 minimum and probably not at all). UPS are likely to replace their 767s with 787s. Fed-Ex is committed to the 777F. Existing 747-400 freighters will certainly go 747-8F by and large. Airbus made a fundamental error by ignoring and/or botching the cargo market. My opinion.

[Mr-P]

deSitter,

I'm afraid I do not share your idea of the freight market. Times are going to get very tough it that arena I feel. Here is a report on it, a few months old granted but with plenty of widebody passenger jets still being delivered there must be a huge amount of spare belly capacity which is subsidized by the passengers themselves.

ANALYSIS: Where next for freighter markets? (http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/analysis-where-next-for-freighter-markets-386860/)

Anyhow good luck to Bombardier on this one, looks great. I only hope it lives up to expectation.

[Volume]

No doubt, the Comet was a real beauty of its time, and the nose even is for todays standards. But the overall window design is quite different.
Dornier 728 Nose (http://www.airliners.net/photo/Fairchild-Dornier/Fairchild-Dornier-728-100/0777125/L/)
Comet Nose (http://www.airliners.net/photo/De-Havilland-DH-106/2158162/L/)
However, it seems like designers have re-discovered the power of beauty... A beautiful aircraft saves a lot of money for PR campaigns. And the CSeries nose is beautiful.

[Max Angle]

the 787, once debugged, is sure to have a huge advantage over the A350 If one aircraft does have an advantage over the other I think it will turn out be fairly small rather than huge and will almost certainly boil down to the price that an airline can screw out of the manufacturer or leasing company.

[DozyWannabe]

Personally I'd be inclined to leave deSitter to his kvetch. It's a little sad that when a new short-hauler from a new (well, sort-of) manufacturer takes to the sky for the first time, all some people can do is try to turn it into an excuse to bash one of the others.

With the big two duking it out and occasionally over-reaching, I think it's a great thing that some new blood is coming into the market and giving them both something to think about.

[SMT Member]

She looks right, here's hoping she flies right and turns out to be the darling of frugality we haven been told she is. This has far wider implications than only BBD, as the GTF engine will power a long list of upcoming new aircraft - not least of which is the A320neo series.

I think this is worse for Airbus than for Boeing. The A320 is their meat and potatoes and offsets the likely never-to-be-recouped cost of the A380. The 777 has it all over the A340 and A330 and the 787, once debugged, is sure to have a huge advantage over the A350. Boeing can afford competition in the 737 sector but Airbus cannot in the A320 sector. It's good to have a third player again!

Coming from Murrica by any chance?

The A320neo is to A what the 737 is to B. The neo has outsold the MAX 3 to 1 and has converted multiple carriers from A to B. The MAX has converted one airline.

The 777 has sold 1470 copies and has a backlog of around 339, split over the 77W, 77L and 77F - the vast majority being 77W. The 330 has sold 1256 copies with a backlog of 248, 2/3rds of which is for the -300. The 340 has sold 377 copies, with zero in backlog. 1256 + 377 is still, however, more than 1470.

The 787 is a class smaller than the 350, which explains why the 350 has more or less put the current 777 line to bed (77W sells like hotcakes cause the 350-1000 won't be out till 2017) and forced B to develop the 777X.

Apart from that, your arguments are quite sound.

[SMT Member]

This is fun!

Three year head-start, nearly 1000 orders, certain to have a popular cargo version (A350F est. 2020 minimum and probably not at all). UPS are likely to replace their 767s with 787s. Fed-Ex is committed to the 777F. Existing 747-400 freighters will certainly go 747-8F by and large. Airbus made a fundamental error by ignoring and/or botching the cargo market. My opinion.

4 years late, huge PR embarresment, 3 months grounding, PR disaster, continuing reliability issues, customers getting publicly upset, projected forward loss even at 870 orders. No plans made public amount the possibility of a freighter, serious question marks over the load carrying structure (remember the 777 had to have it's CFRP floor replaced in order to work as a freighter), and UPS have not made a single utterance about their future willingness to buy much of anything, least of all something that doesn't exist. FedEx just bought a bunch of 767s, and most 744Fs are likely to either not be replaced or replaced by 77Fs.

Where you are right, is when it comes to Airbus and their attitude to freighters. They never really 'got them', but for reasons I am rather certain are much distanced from what you may think.

[Willie Everlearn]

The Comet nose in wind tunnel testing was proven to be the optimum shape for aerodynamic efficiency and cockpit airflow noise reduction, therefore the C Series was designed with that in mind. There is no coincidence or theft in its shape. It is intentional.
If you take the Comet, the B787, and the C Series nose profiles you will see the striking similarities.
The C Series has no cockpit side windows that open, only a hatch like other Bombardier aircraft.

Re-engined A and B aeroplanes were the cheapest and quickest answer to Bombardier's all new narrow body. If Bombardier's C series sales gain momentum, some A and B buyers may be sorely disappointed they missed out round about 2018-2020 when most of these new (modified?) A and B narrow bodies get delivered.

Fuel savings discussions may be somewhat muted by the price of a barrel of oil around the same 2018-2020 entry into service date.

We'll see.
Congrats to Bombardier.

Willie :ok:

[DozyWannabe]

@SMT Member - with all due respect, cut it out. It's not big and it's not clever.

[underfire]

While the ac is a great milestone for them, it's the P1000G GTF that is really significant for aviation.

In reality, I was not all that impressed with the wing design of this ac. While the engines are really far forward, which will really help, the engines appear to be far too large for this ac, and I note quite a bit of ancient technology in the design of the wing and other areas.

The tail of this ac is really odd to me as well...

Edit: SMT. in regards to UPS, you should note that they have contracted with FedEx to sort and move their packages. I would expect to not see too much moving forward with the UPS air fleet, perhaps only in areas where FedEx does not fly...

[Volume]

The Comet nose in wind tunnel testing was proven to be the optimum shape for aerodynamic efficiency and cockpit airflow noise reduction, therefore the C Series was designed with that in mind.However, there are other considerations, mainly structural aspects to keep in mind as well. So a structral smooth design with a blunt, non load-carrying radome attached may be much wiser than a design smooth on the outside but with a significant angle between the windows / center post and the forward pressure bulkhead. There is a good reason behind the (ugly) noses we see on some A and B products...

[misd-agin]

The engines appear to be too large? Geared engines will have even bigger fans/N1's then the current generation.

The new engines will look larger, just like the fans looked larger than the pure jets, high bypass looked bigger than the fan jets, etc, etc.

[nitpicker330]

Underfire--------oh come on, really? You really think Bombardier don't know how to design a modern Aircraft!!!!!! I suppose you are an aerodynamic expert for Boeing or Airbus????:D

What ever you do for a living mate I'd strongly suggest you stick to it...:ok: