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Pilot Pete
31st Jan 2002, 06:19
Here we go again then.

Where did I leave you all last time? I think I was extolling the virtues of flying the 757 on line. Nothing has changed in that department. She’s still the beauty she always was. She hasn’t changed her colours, moved the goalposts or dropped me right in the clag!

Life however, has a strange way of biting back, just when you least expect it.

With the line training behind me I really started to enjoy the life as a First Officer flying holiday charter. I’d spent my time giving my all to my employer, delirious at being able to carry these passengers to and from their holiday destinations. I sat in the cruise going over the ‘recall’ items whilst the captain read the Daily Telegraph. I knew my technical knowledge was my weak point so I’d committed to brushing that up on the ‘long’ sectors.

Suzie and the boys had really started to appreciate the hard slogg that we’d all been through to get where we were. The mortgage was a huge stretch on an F/O’s salary, despite our substantial down-payment, but I knew that cometh the ATPL cometh the £10k pay rise, so we’d gambled in the rising market and found our current house which would save us moving again for a few years at least. Poor Harry deserved a bit of stability for once in his life having moved house three times in as many years. He was becoming a bit of a serial ‘play grouper’, never staying long enough to be recognised anywhere!

September was a big month for more than one reason. Harry started school at what can only be described as the ‘ideal’ primary school (within the state system). It’s two miles out of town in a little village called Marton which boasts the oldest timber framed church in England, down a country lane, surrounded by farmland with Friesians leaning over the fence chewing the cud in the playing field. He was smaller than just about every other child due to his illness when aged one year (all covered in previous postings!) and this was the first time that we’d really noticed it. He was also very shy and his natural character is to be unwilling to try anything that he perceives to not like………………………..…99% of which he subsequently finds to be ‘excellent’! School was no different. A number of days crying his eyes out into mine or Suzie’s leg at ‘departure’ became the norm for a week or two. Being the cold hearted father that I am I found it a lot easier to walk away mumbling “he’ll be fine”. As it transpired I was proved right and he was. He was very advanced academically but very restrained socially and school has proved the best thing for him.

The second reason for September proving to be a big month was for the reason that does not need stating in aviation circles. Like Kennedy being assassinated I will always remember where I was on September 11th 2001. New life was due to be delivered yet again in our household, for the last time I hasten to add! Suzie was pregnant with our third, due in march 2002 and things had not gone to plan. I recall a ppruner who’d said how lucky I always was, being in the right place at the right time (with regards to employment I guess), but it didn’t feel like it on September 11th.

Two months earlier in the pregnancy Suzie had gone for a routine scan and they had found an ‘abnormality’. It was called a Neucal Translucency, which is a thickening of the back of the neck in the foetus. They don’t know what causes it but know that it can lead to a number of very unpleasant problems. We were sent to Manchester for a scan on a more powerful machine and to take a biopsy of the placenta to see what was happening and try to pinpoint any problem. The appointment was booked for September 11th at 10am.

We arrived at the hospital having dropped Harry at school and enlisting the mother-in-law to take care of Edward, parked the car and wandered into reception. Suzie was very worried, as was I, but it’s different for a mother-to-be and nothing I could say would have really helped. We were seen and then sent to another department to have a quite painful sample of the placenta removed for chromosomal testing. As we walked round into that department we checked to see what all the nurses were watching, hands on mouths, on the television.

Some time earlier the first aircraft had smashed into the WTC. CNN was live on the BBC. All we could see was the burning tower, oh my God what a terrible tragedy I thought. Little did I know what effect the unfolding events would have on the lives of so many people.

Suzie was incredibly brave during the very nasty procedure and we walked out surprised to see people still crowded around the TV. Another quick glance and they were saying that a another aircraft had crashed into the second WTC tower. It still didn’t really register with me the impact that this was going to have. We drove home frightened about the possible events that the test results could be laying before us. Down's Syndrome was the most likely if a chromosomal disorder was found. If clear, no guarantees could be given with still an increased risk of abortion, genetic abnormalities including heart disorders and a host of other increased risks.

By the time we reached home Suzie had to run through the debrief with mom and I felt a bit left out so put on the TV and thought I would follow the breaking news.

My God, I could not believe the tragedy that was unfolding in front of my eyes. The first tower dropped as I watched intently, followed by the second, I was lost in this horrendous screenplay, my mind diverted from my own mini-drama.

It didn’t take long for the UK airlines to latch on to this downturn that the market was ‘bound’ to experience and for those who’d messed up prior to that date the perfect excuse was there. By October we had a new MD who was brought in to ‘save’ the airline from this make or break situation that threatened the industry itself. He was full of good rhetoric and impressed with his maiden speech about how tough times were ahead but he would steer us and save us with his ruthlessness.

Within a week I found myself on a shortlist for redundancy. Costs needed to be cut and I was one of those costs. It was a kick in the teeth that I didn’t need right then.

Negotiations started through Balpa and the statutory 90 days began on 2nd November. Towards the end of October I was frantically trying to find someone who would provide me with payment protection insurance for the mortgage. At the time we decided we just couldn’t afford it, but now we just couldn’t afford not to have it. A broker tried but found that the companies were cherry picking and not touching anyone in the aviation industry. A colleague put me on to another broker who secured me a deal starting on Nov 1st with a 90 day ‘no cover’ period. Phew.

Christmas approached and we were determined to enjoy it, being the first in sunny Congleton, but the axe over my head left me always thinking about other things. My first revalidation in the sim came around very quickly and I took a good few days out to put in the required work to achieve a decent grade. I flew the profiles well and got the required ticks. My weakness was not being forceful enough with my captain when he deviated from the required STAR. Lesson learned.

New year came and went and my winter roster showed a sad lack of flying – 3 trips in December and 3 in January. Apart from the fact that I could do with the hours this type of roster creates added stresses at home. I always seem to be under her feet, I can’t afford to join a gym or anything else, I’ve painted everything that moves at home (and plenty that doesn’t) and spent far too many hours checking the latest negotiation position via the Balpa forum and Pprune.

As we stand today I have a one-on-one with my base captain this afternoon – another step in the legal process and I expect my redundancy notice in the post imminently. I still can’t see the justification for my redundancy, especially on a cost basis when you take into account relocation costs and type rating costs (all those to be laid off are 757 rated and those at the closing bases who are more senior are A320 rated), but hey, no one said life would be easy……………. don’t I just know it.

I just want to fly, professionally, with a determination to succeed and do the job as best I can. I don’t want to be involved in all the politics, but unfortunately it comes with the territory so the cv’s are out and I’m looking for a carrier who’ll just give me an easy time whilst I give them exactly what they want.

It doesn’t get any easier Wanabees. Good luck.

PP

[ 31 January 2002: Message edited by: Pilot Pete ]</p>

Megaton
31st Jan 2002, 06:30
PP,

We're with you. Good luck, mate.

redsnail
31st Jan 2002, 12:59
Pete, . .Hang in there mate. An old instructor told me something. "Luck always changes". Also, the "luckiest person he knew worked bloody hard to be that lucky".. .Keep going :)

Delta Wun-Wun
31st Jan 2002, 13:12
Pete,. . You think when you get to your stage that you have made it and all the worry is over.What a fragile Industry we all strive to be in.I wish you and yours well. <img src="smile.gif" border="0">

hasell
31st Jan 2002, 19:24
Pete,. .I'm so sorry to hear your news. I was in a upbeat mood when I first starting reading your post but as I read on -that soon changed.. .I hope that things take a swift change for the better.

Best Regards.

Hasell.

scroggs
31st Jan 2002, 20:16
Pete,. .I understand all too well the stress you must be feeling now. As you know, I was lucky - this time. I hope that things improve rapidly for your airline, and that the redundancy doesn't come to pass. If it does, good luck with your search for a new post - we're all with you in spirit.. .And all the best for your family as well; you obviously have a very patient and understanding wife.

londonlad
31st Jan 2002, 21:24
Yeah so weird how you (and all other wannabes) feel that once and airline takes you, that all your worries are over, and that it's only a matter of time and a good attitude that'll see you climb the ranks. Being a wannabe and a bit of a dreamer, I hope that belief doesn't fail me. But reading your story really puts it all in perspective. I really do hope that you find something. But remember-whatever happens, always happens for the best. Maybe the next flight with they may have been your last. (thank god thats not the case) but it could have been). Take the rough with the smooth, and god do I hope you (and others in your position) find something, and for those of us striving also join you guys some day.

Amen.

MAX
31st Jan 2002, 21:33
Hope all works out for you Pete. May pay to check aviationjobsearch.com as i believe theres an ad. for 757 F/O's. Lets hope it doesnt come to that.

MAX <img src="cool.gif" border="0">

icebox
31st Jan 2002, 22:03
Pete,

Here's hoping for the best for you and your family.

Icebox.

EGCC4284
31st Jan 2002, 22:20
His wife as far as Iam concerned . .is "THE WOMAN OF GOLD".

Pete, I wish you the best of luck.

Pilot Pete
1st Feb 2002, 01:43
Thanks for the replies, one and all.

Meeting was fairly straight forward just running through the options that were available to me (career break or out the door!). 3 months notice will be served on 25 of us on 7th Feb, that gives us a little time for the situation to change, so fingers crossed.

PP

avgas1
1st Feb 2002, 04:55
I wish you the best of luck mate.

Through reading your previous letters you certainly bloody deserve it!!

All the best.

Needmorecash
1st Feb 2002, 09:20
Pete . .Sorry to hear the bad news to the 25 of you - do you think it would have made a differance to the amount of redundancies if more pilots had taken the pay cut?. .nmc

tunneler
1st Feb 2002, 11:46
Hope it all turns out for the best Pete and please give Suzie and the boys my regards.

Catchya soon hopefully mate.

Tunny

spitfire747
1st Feb 2002, 12:36
Pete

My best wishes to your family during this time.

To you my friend, I wish you the best of luck. This is a difficult time but as my friend told me, the general public have short lived memories, Summer 2002 will soon come, people will forget about September 11th and start booking up their holidyas, Charters will be overflowing and begging redundant pilots back and tempting new ones to join, Low Cost Carriers will be short staffed due to their enormous exponential growth and good old BA, Virgin, BMi etc. etc. will be re-hiring those they laid off because they cannot handle the volume of passengers wishing, wanting,needing and liking to travel.

I think it is very uncommon in todays world, we reached a certain volume of air travel before Sept 11th because people NEEDED to travel for business and pleasure, it dropped due to the obvious incidents, BUT those same people and MORE will need to travel for the same business and pleasure AGAIN in the future, thereby causing a shortage of trained professionals such as yourdself and other wannabes who have fought through theis bad time.

Stick with it Pete, i know your worry over the mortgage, but I know things will get better, if not I am stuffed too.

All the best to every pilot, worldwide

[ 01 February 2002: Message edited by: spitfire747 ]</p>

Polar_stereographic
1st Feb 2002, 12:54
Good luck Pete. You'll be all right I'm sure.

Let me just add that myself, Mrs Polar and out two little Polars, have holliday'd in the Med for many many years now, benefiting from an investment that we made several years ago out there. As a consequence, we always just book flights, 3-4 times a year, usualy benefiting from cheap charter seats. I've become a bit of an expert searching this one out.

Well let me tell you, this year I have booked my summer flights earlier than ever before, and had to pay nearly twice as much in previous years. Yes, I know there are probably less flights (but not that many less), but take it from me, they are full to the gunnals. Every last one.

Pete, in life you make your own luck, but as the parent of two healthy kids, my thoughts are with you and your family, in an area you have no control over. Fingers crossed it'll work out OK for you, rest assured I know exactly what you are going through.

Best regards

PS

RVR800
1st Feb 2002, 13:15
I reckon It's going to bounce back soon as. .well.

This downsizing is an overcorrection.

Your wife is a gem.

Best of Luck

DoleBoy
1st Feb 2002, 14:10
Hope everything works out for you PP, You were very supportive of me after my I.R success.

My thoughts are with you and your family in these testing times.

Regards

DoleBoy

Pilot Pete
1st Feb 2002, 14:17
Thanks again

Some very encouraging words from all of you. Just to clear up a couple of issues;

Needmorecash

TCAG, our parent company put in our MD to slash costs to the bone in order to maintain our financial position prior to 9/11 (quoted figure was £140m throughout TCUK and jmc), not sure what proportion was to be saved by the airline specifically.

As part of this strategy we were kindly asked to take a voluntary paycut (after Balpa had pointed out that the forced 'voluntary' paycut was illegal). We have neither accepted or rejected that paycut and it stays on the table for negotiation, something which the boss is not prepared to do. All we asked was for the proof that accepting it would save jobs directly because from what we can see it would not. Ask yourself this; By implication, if jobs were directly related to paycuts then the more people who take the paycuts the more jobs are saved, so are you telling me that if everyone takes a paycut the employer will staff to a higher level than required? No, they have a 'minimum' number of people required to carry out the day to day business and during the hard times that is what they are going to staff to, pay cut or no pay cut. They are not running a charity.

Spit & Polar

You are indeed correct. Some of our sales figures during the 'Peaks' period are way more than expected, but this issue is nothing to do with crewing levels for S2002, believe it or not! TCUK Tour Ops are downsizing 20% and that it what is dictating crewing levels within the airline. It is going to be a very tiring summer for all who remain. Unless the tour operator increases capacity there will be no increase in crewing levels.

Various packages are on offer to stave off compulsory redundancies so it's just a question of how many pilots above me on the seniority list take an option which then drops the cut off line down closer towards me, or alternatively leave for pastures new..............

Chin still up and fairly confident that it won't actually happen,

PP

mark twain
2nd Feb 2002, 01:56
I don't know you and have never met you, so I can not claim to fully understand your position.

However when I started my PPL my wife was due her first child - with rose coloured specticles we set about the home making and plans for a career change.

At three weeks old our child was admitted to hospital and diagnosed with a rare genetic disorder. After a traumatic few hours they stabalised his condition, and then told us we had been with-in hours of losing him.

The hospital had no practical experience in treating the condition and we spent a nervous three months in and out of the place, each time treading a thin line with his care.

During this I worked for a large company that was a sub-division of a large bank. They decided that I was having too much time away from work whilst my son was in hospital and terminated my employment.

I decided to go on my own, and sod it I would earn enough to survive and become a Pilot. Over the next two years I had to put up with hospital visits, developing my own business and putting up with my old employers trying to make life difficult for me with business introducers.

We then had another child - and this one had the same genetic disorder (I should do the lottery the odds are better), and this set of another spate of hospital visits. More than anything we had a few years of wondering how on earth you manage to cope with fighting to get ahead whilst having what can only be described as heart wrenching episodes of watching your child hooked up to medical equipment.

We have now had a third child, thankfully clear of the condition -however I have been there with the Placenta testing and counselling - probably at the same hospital in Manchester (St Mary's).

Over the last few years we have lived with hospitals, financial uncertainty and disruption. In the last year this has settled down to a point in which we are comfortable, and I am now able to get cracking with my flight training.

Having been on my 'butt' a couple of times in the last few years I am now in a strong position. I can look at those who said I would not achieve my goal and know that despite their best efforts I have achieved the position I want to be in. I also know that I have the strength of character to overcome obstacles that no person normally sees in their life (thankfully).

You have had similar obstacles, and believe me losing your job now is bad news, you have the right to be upset - but you have achieved your target against odds in which most people would have drowned. Life is a marathon rather than a sprint - and my money is on guys like you to overcome these minor set-backs and long term you will look back and realise that in the overall picture of events the current issue is nothing.

Treasure your family and your children - having been close the losing them I can tell you that I would trade anything and everything for them - keep life is perspective, with your character you will prevail.

. .Mark Twain.

Not edited for spelling - too annoyed at a good guy being messed about.

Pilot Pete
2nd Feb 2002, 22:58
Mark

Thank you for taking the time to recount your experiences in this thread. It is strange to hear about someone else who has had such similar hurdles to get over. Not sure if you read my original story but the similarities are uncanny.

I am glad to hear you have overcome your pitfalls and your family are all well now. Children have a profound effect upon your outlook on life, you are very right. We will get over this and my job is after all just a job (a bloody good one that took a lot of blood sweat and tears to get mind you!).

I suppose I was just venting some anger, I thought we'd done the hard bit and were now going to get a few years of enjoying the rewards! Of course there will always be more hurdles, we know that, just wanted a bit of respite!

Good luck with the rest of your flying training (are you going commercial, you didn't actually mention it?)

PP

mark twain
4th Feb 2002, 01:45
Pilot Pete,

I have indeed read your initial thread and follow up. From a selfish point of view I take motivation from the fact that somebody else has achieved the same goal with similar problems - it is always easier knowing that somebody else has done the hard work ahead of you.

I hope you do not feel I was playing down your position or lacking sympathy - you derserve your job and the opportunity for a bit of peace and stability. You also derserve to be angry. On top of all you have gone through you do not derserve to have this added stress.

At times, normally late at night sat next to a hospital bed, you wonder where the next punch is going to come from and how you will cope - you crave for stability and peace. I personally believe that you develop a pool of inner strength. As an individual you may not always feel it, but it exists and it will carry you through.

I understand that this does not pay the mortgage or feed the kids, but it does mean that your down turn will be short lived, and you will bounce back with avengance.

In my last post I was trying, possibly unsuccessfully, to be motivational. Redundancy is a nightmare you do not derserve, however don't let it finish you or take away from the fact that have gone through alot - things will get better this is just another small bump on the road.

To answer your query I am going commercial, and presently doing my ATPL by correspondence, whilst pottering around airfields when possible. The last few years set me back in terms of progress - however the only thing I do know is that someday an airline will employ me - it is just that they do not know this yet!

Best of luck.

Mark

Oleo
6th Feb 2002, 00:26
Oh ******! Pilot Pete I am sorry! I really enjoyed reading your story, and everytime I see a JMC 757 I think that maybe you are in it grinning your face off and happy as Larry. I had no idea...

My guess is that the industry has over reacted and before too long there will be a scramble - I hope so!

Best wishes for your job and the up-turn being sooner rather than later, and for the new baby.

micheal
7th Feb 2002, 07:14
All the best for you and your family, hope your luck changes for the better soon.

G SXTY
7th Feb 2002, 18:49
This deserves to stay at the top.

The very best of luck to you Pete, and thanks again for sharing your story with the rest of us. It’s a sobering reminder of just how precarious the job can be, even when you’ve made it to the RHS of a 757.

The trouble is, it doesn’t put me off a bit – it just makes me even more determined to get there in the end.

All the best mate!

tailscrape
7th Feb 2002, 21:30
Pete,

You will be O.K.

When am i coming over to yours for more Singapore Noodles? We can drink a lot of wine and beer. Then Whisky and sit up till 4 a.m. listening to your CD's and p?ssing Suzie off!!

TFS Friday morning for me. Give me a call when you can and we will meet and drink and eat....and slag life off. Again!!

Pilot Pete
8th Feb 2002, 14:08
Well, the posty arrived both yesterday morning and this morning without the fateful letter so I'm still not redundant......yet. Lanzarote yesterday in 'big bird' the 757-300, it's really the best form of therapy.

Malaga on Saturday and then a quiet week to follow. Tailscrape, as long as you bring a bottle of Campo Viejo 1995/1996 you are more than welcome next week. I think I'll do Penne Arrabiata, that'll get the nose running and the eyes watering!

psychichotline
9th Feb 2002, 00:45
Pilot Pete,. .Hang in there. I think things can only get better for you. While I am no expert I think it is important that you remain strong for not only your own sake, but for your wife and Children most of all.Do your best and best of luck to you too.

EGCC4284
11th Feb 2002, 02:46
Pete, go and give suzie a hug from me.

A friend <img src="wink.gif" border="0">

Pilot Pete
12th Feb 2002, 21:33
Got the letter over the weekend, so the clock is ticking. I have three months for them to see sense and rescind. Still confident, it's not going to happen............

PP

[ 14 February 2002: Message edited by: Pilot Pete ]</p>

ATCbabe
12th Feb 2002, 21:52
Hey Pete,

. . Just read your posts mate and really sorry. I just hope that your company sees sense and change their mind.. . I know just how hard you have worked to get this far and how much Suz has put up with. <img src="frown.gif" border="0"> . . Need to let me know how things pan out and keep in touch.. . Love and best wishes, Babe http://www.stopstart.fsnet.co.uk/smilie/heart.gif

P.S. When you, suz and the boys coming back up to visit??????? :)

[ 12 February 2002: Message edited by: ATCbabe ]</p>

flite idol
12th Feb 2002, 23:46
Try not to sweat it too much. I`m sure they are just covering the bases and issuing the notices as a contingency in case things dont pick up. Best I can tell things are looking a bit more optimistic already so hopefully you and the other folks will be ok, assuming the company dont use you as a bargaining chip or example to quell the ranks. No contract negotiations on the horizon I hope.! Best of luck to all. BTW forgot to ask, under your present contract do folks who are made redundant have any kind of formal recall provisions when things pick up.?

[ 12 February 2002: Message edited by: flite idol ]</p>

Kempus
13th Feb 2002, 04:59
Hi Pete!

I am very moved by this thread and the way people come together to other support and experiencies.

I work for the same parent company as you but in TC Direct Businesses. I was made redundant early Oct. I have always had a dream to fly and well for me, my first foot in the door of the aviation world was as a travel agent for TC. Well close enough, they have their own airline!

Everyday i would book families, couples, pals and business men on to those green and white planes and, every day i would look at the TIB for any vacancies that would move me into the airline brand whether as ground staff, cabin crew, engineering (got a degree in aeronautical eng.(, you name it. Then of course things happened, they asked me to leave. I wondered what happened to the business that i made 160% target for every month go? I was gutted! I was making them money so i could get that little closer to my dream.

Anyway, it is now feb, they called me at the start of jan. I started work 5 days later. Yesterday saw the final day of a recruitment drive for 160 new staff. End of Jan saw myself hit 170% target with a healthy bonus.

I dont mean to sound nieve or arrogant by posting this but i just want to give a little hope. Like you said, until the T/Op starts to employ, make bookings, the airline cant do the same. Our TC pax mix for Jan was over 70%(ish), try getting a flight with JMC from Glasgow, good luck! Things are slowly on the up. I still go into work everyday and read the TIB, i still sit with the brochures of the different FTO's at my desk thinking which would be best.

Good luck mate, maybe see you when your on the LHS and me on the right on day!

Kempus

P.S. I did a booking for a company pilot once, fed up with his 48hr £75 concession. He was one of the most down to earth, family orientated, funny and dedicated persons i have ever spoke to. When i think of that day, maybe it was you. That's what kind of pilot i wanna be!

<img src="smile.gif" border="0">

Pilot Pete
14th Feb 2002, 22:44
Thanks again guys,

the official number threatened with redundancy has been coming down since they were first announced. It was something like 60 initially and gradually came down to 25 who were handed 3 months notice last week. Since then the official number threatened has dropped again to 17 as further arguments are won to prove the numbers don't add up. Still a few to go for me to be safe and hopefully everyone else shortly after. It's still looking positive but it remains very stressful. Oh, and we had a phantom labour on Monday, spending most of the day in hospital only to be sent home to continue the wait........5 weeks to go!

PP

tailscrape
14th Feb 2002, 23:16
PP,

Campo Viejo it is.

Penne sounds fine mate.

Just been called out to ferry a 752 from Manch to Gatwick. 2015 report. Off duty at 0315. 45 minutes in the log book!

I understand that one Pilot Pete went sick for this gem....I am on his tail let me tell you....only joking!

Will call you Monday to arrange the said festivities and drinks....hopefully my mobile won't ring this time when I call you!

M