Thomson recruiting in November

[Matey]

Thomson are to hold 3 recruitment sessions in November. One is for Cadet entry pilots, one for experienced crew. Not sure about the third.

[southernjock]

This is good news if it pans out. How reliable is your source?

[contacttower118.2]

Would that be cadet entry as in no previous flying experience or fATPL with no previous airline experience?

[magicmick]

Hi Southernjock

Having read some of the posts that Matey has made in the past it seems that they are at a reasonably senior and well informed position so I would accept that their info is reasonable.

Obviously Thomson may change their minds between now and November which is beyond Mateys control but on the face of it this seems very positive news from a source that is about as reliable as it can be.

[magicmick]

See the question that contacttower has asked.

I believe that the definition of ‘cadet’ will be someone who has already got their MEIR.

In the past Thomson have run ab-initio schemes with the likes of OAA and they have also employed OAA graduates as non rated cadets.

Late last year there was talk on these forums about Thomson opening up future cadet schemes to people who already have their MEIR regardless what school they went to and whether they were modular or integrated.

However this will not stop the FTE/ CTC/ OAA recruitment machines from going into a frenzy and trying to force their product onto Thomson.

Hopefully Thomson will resist the pressure and give all candidates a fair chance and offer contracts to those that are the best fit for the job.

[magicmick]

Only time or Matey will tell us,

Without wishing to get into an English language debate, to my (very) simple mind people getting taken on with zero hours and needing all their training are ab-initio cadets, those that already have their MEIR and low hrs but need the type rating are cadets.

Ab-initios take over a year to train and no airline can be sure of their recruitment requirements in a years time so there is an element of risk there that needs to be shed onto the ab-initio by not guaranteeing them a job when they graduate.

One of the 3 recruitment campaigns might be for zero hours ab-initios but you can’t assume that. They might have one for low hrs cadets, another for experienced rated on their aircraft type and another for experienced but rated on other aircraft types.

Neither of us are in a position to know so we’ll have to sit tight and wait for all to become clear.

[southernjock]

Magicmic,

Thanks for the response. I will keep my ear to the ground for this one, along with every other newbie, hopefully some good news.

Is it just me or does it appear as if schemes and recruitment by airlines are on the up? Certainly seems like an increase on this time last year and quite a bit more from 2011.

[magicmick]

Yeah, fantastic to hear that a UK operator is looking to recruit and are considering low hrs cadets or maybe ab-initios as well. As mentioned before there’s plenty of time for Thomson to change their mind but heres hoping.

There certainly does seem to be more about now than in the period between 2008 and now, unfortunately in that ‘dry period’ thousands of people qualified and many are still looking so every recruitment opportunity will be heavily over subscribed but every opportunity is most definitely welcome.

[Matey]

Cadet entry is for candidates who already hold a licence. A type rating will be provided by our own instructors/examiners, usually at CTC in Southampton, but I guess could be at another location. I stress this is using CTC facilities as we have done for our own internal changes of type this winter, not necessarily their cadets. Recruitment is to to be a mixture of cadet/experienced pilots. Most recently experienced pilot recruitment has been for type rated pilots who are currently on fixed term contracts. This was driven by the heavy internal training programme for the 737 fleet, and the lack of capacity to provide type rating courses for non rated people. With a somewhat lower requirement for fleet changes next winter I guess that may open up opportunities for non type rated experienced pilots to be considered, but don't hold me to that. Current fixed term pilots recruited for this summer will have a training file review and interview with a view to changing to permanent contracts. As regards my credentials, suffice to say this is accurate information as of now.

[seymoreskye]

Thanks "MATEY"

This has confirmed what I have heard today also. Seems to of been in the pipeline for many months now.

[contacttower118.2]

Any ideas of numbers of cadets to be recruited?

[Matey]

I have no information as yet of numbers in any category I'm afraid.

[RedBullGaveMeWings]

So just to confirm, there will be no ab-intio cadets???
And if there won't be any, it's good. There are many CPL holders without a job and that deserve one.

[jimmyjetplane]

Amen to that!!

I served my time! 2000 hours including 1000 instructing.100 multi engine piston and over 100 hours Boeing 737 simulator.

No flying job.

Join the queue !!

[Matey]

Tennisten

I don't think ab-initio is part of the mix.

Cadets already holding a CPL/IR
Experienced and type rated
Experienced without a type rating

are the 3 most likely categories of applicant the Company are seeking.

[M1ghtyDuck]

Matey, would you expect those to be cadets from CTC or similar, or just newly qualified CPL/IRs from any source?

[Superpilot]

Will recruitment be across all fleets? From what I understand the A320s of FCA went when the merger happened. Is that correct?

[Matey]

I don't think the source of your licence is an issue. As to the fleet, you would join the B737. We no longer operate any Airbus types, the B757/B767 fleet is shrinking and fully crewed, and the B787 fleet is also fully crewed.

[flyhiguy28]

Great news, let's have more of this!! :D

[acepilotmurdock]

Jimmyjetplane, believe me there are a lot more ppl with a lot of hours and experience that will go for this, just look at the amount of rhs operators wanting to jump ship from Flybe, not to mention other TP operators such as eastern or Logan air. These are experienced guys with upto 3000 hours commercial with countless LPC's and OPC's under there belt. Competition will be fierce :}

[Prophead]

But that in itself will leave spaces open for jobs with these operators, this is how it should be with people moving up the ladder so to speak.

Where it goes wrong is when airlines bypass this and take people through ab-initio with the likes of CTC OAA etc. whilst there are many fAPTL candidates out there.

This is not a dig at the above training companies, I know they turn out good pilots but whilst those people are still out of work (including ex students from these places) these should be at the head of the queue.

Hats off to the airlines that are starting to look at the low houred and TP/instructors out there, although I feel it is probably more down to time constraints than anything else.

[Vipersrt10]

Good news! They will probably take the inexperienced nonrated guys from CTC / OAA though.

[Matey]

The whole point of the Thomson cadet scheme is to avoid taking candidates supplied specifically by the likes of CTC who then charge Thomson for their services. Under the Thomson scheme cadets can have obtained their licence from any provider (including CTC), but apply as an individual rather than as a "package deal" from a training provider. The money which would otherwise have gone in fees to the training provider is then channeled to the cadet with the result that the pilot should be up to £800 a month better off, and have access to loss of licence, flexible ( days off) working payments and pension benefits amongst other things. This was all negotiated by our BALPA Company Council as part of our recent Flight Ops Modernisation Programme negotiations. At the risk of being repetitive, this is not for ab-initio training but for those who already have a CPL/IR from whatever source. Type Rating is provided by Thomson, the cost of which is recouped by salary sacrifice. The contract in the past has been for 8 months including type rating training. Historically all bar a tiny number have moved on to permanent contracts at the end of the initial period. No guarantees about that though. Rumour has it that the Company will initially seek suitably qualified internal candidates before advertising externally. I have no idea how many such people exist within the Company. They will also, I believe, be looking for experienced pilots as well. Oh and rumour has it the total numbers sought from all sources is 30-40. I will not be held responsible for the accuracy of that needless to say.

[WX Man]

Matey... thank you for that information. Very good news for the experienced but non-rated guys and gals who have been leapfrogged over the past 4 years by the ZTH crowd.

[Matey]

Pilot Management have announced that they are looking to recruit a small number of current TUI UK & Ireland employees on a Non Type Rated Entry Scheme, starting in January 2014. The position is fixed term until October 31st 2014. Candidates must hold an EASA CPL/ IR ME with ATPL Ground School Exams passed (Frozen ATPL) and a current EASA Class 1 medical. Applicants will be initially screened to ensure they meet the required criteria and then will be invited to an Assessment Day in October. The position will be initially advertised internally, however, should there not be sufficient interest the positions will be advertised externally.

I have no idea as to how many suitably qualified internal candidates exist, or how many cadetships in total will be available in the mix of cadets and type rated recruitment. The current estimate for total recruitment including a type rated entry to be advertised soon ( permanent part year contracts) is 20-25. This is the Company view..."We estimate that we will need around 20 to 25 recruits in total for next summer, although this does depend on any future programme changes and the number of pilots that leave us between now and next summer."

I have received numerous PMs since posting here originally, and completely understand the desire for further information and advice. However, in order not to compromise the recruitment process with which I may be involved please understand if I ask you to refrain from sending PMs to which I will be unable to reply.

Previous fixed term pilots have all, bar a tiny number, moved on to permanent (PPY50) contracts at the end of the fixed term following a training file review and interview. No guarantees that will continue to be the case though of course. PPY50 means full time working May to end of October then part time of one week off two weeks on for the winter. Pay is spread equally over the year and amounts to 81.3% of full time salary.

As to where the posts may be advertised a good starting place would be Welcome to TUI Travel PLC - a leading international leisure travel group (http://www.tuitraveljobs.co.uk/). Where else they plan to advertise I don't know.

[contacttower118.2]

How many people work for Thomson do you think with fATPLs?

I asked this question about easy a while ago and was told c.50. Even if Thomson is only half that (considering they are a smaller airline) it sounds like the likelihood of this ever getting to external applicants is quite low.

[Watt001]

Hi guys. Do you think, that also people from the rest of Europe will have any chances or is this recrutiment process focused just to UK / Ireland people? Thanks..

[Matey]

This is the first time the Company have advertised internally before seeking applications from outside. Thus it would be true to say that if you work in any capacity within TUI UK and Ireland and meet the requirements then you are eligible to apply. As to whether the posts are available to candidates from anywhere within the TUI group the communication specifically refers to the UK business. I repeat I have no idea how many eligible people there are in the business.

[sm85]

Hi All,,,
Any details as to where an application can be made for the cadet scheme?

[Matey]

Try this for a start:

A World of Opportunities. Careers portal of TUI Travel PLC, a leading international leisure travel group. (http://www.tuitraveljobs.co.uk/content/22/airline.aspx)

Follow the instructions for email alerting as and when positions are advertised.

[benish]

Hi All,,,
Any details as to where an application can be made for the cadet scheme?



Unless your a Thomson employee, no where :rolleyes:

[seymoreskye]

Thanks Matey,

Just as I heard also, Think its a great idea to Recruit Internally first, I think they have sufficient numbers to Interview but then again I don't know how many are still current.

[Matey]

After a period of silence the Company have now announced that they are holding an assessment day for cadet entry pilots in mid October. This is for internal employees, so presumably they can meet their current cadet entry requirement from the pool of suitably qualified internal candidates.

In addition, they are also opening recruitment for Type Rated Second / First Officers on Monday 23rd September at 0900hrs. The qualification criteria are:

Type rated on B737NG (600, 700, 800, 900,)
Have a minimum of 300 hours on B737NG (600, 700, 800, 900,)
Have a minimum of 100 hours B737 300-900 in 12 months prior to application.

I believe this is for permanent part year contracts. (PPY50) as previously described, but the advert will presumably elaborate. The advert will be on the TUI Travel Jobs web site – the link is:

Welcome to the careers portal of TUI Travel UK & Ireland, a leading international leisure travel group. (http://gs12.globalsuccessor.com/fe/tpl_tui02.asp?newms=jj&id=73421&aid=11697)


The ad will close at 0059 on Sunday 29th September. If you click on this link now it will tell you that the position is no longer available. Please see above...the job advert will become active at 0900 Monday next.

[magicmick]

Many thanks for the update Matey, shame about the possible lack of external cadets, still it's their trainset and I'm sure that the internal candidates have 'paid their dues' with the company while waiting for their chance.

Good luck to those qualified to apply for the F/O positions and those that are in a position to get the cadet places.

[yeoman]

There is a very strong likelihood that external applicants will get a look in.

Don't bother asking because I'm not in a position to do the telling. Just offering encouragement to those who fear the requirement will be filled wholly internally.

Good luck to all.

[airmiles]

Guessing the application for this has now closed? Cabin crew for Thomson told me I should apply as the company is looking for pilots, but on their website it says that the applications for this closed in September, is that right?

[Matey]

The Company has sourced their cadet recruitment requirements from internal candidates this time and the selection process has already taken place. I will post here if/when they reopen cadet recruitment in the future.

[adelta]

Good on Thomson. This sounds like a sensible way of recruiting - especially for those already holding a license - and I say that as someone with no license who would jump at the chance to get on a cadet program with an airline.

But this thread has made me wonder...if you joined a company such as Thomson as cabin crew with a view to eventually being able to apply for a pilot position, how does this go down with the airline?

I presume airlines are aware that people become cabin crew (as an example) as a way to get their foot in the door?

And assuming they are, does this go against you in your application? I mean you'd obviously need to want to do the job you apply for first and foremost and to do it well (and not to turn up saying "I'm only doing this so I can apply to fly later"), but if it is to get your foot in the door and prove yourself to that company...do they care / mind?

[micro_burst]

A very valid question - I'd be interested to hear an answer to this.

[magicmick]

Some operators will recruit from within while others won’t, obviously Thomson are recruiting from within this time, will they recruit from within in the future? We don’t know.

I have read on other threads that Jet2 and Flybe have taken internal recruits in the past but we don’t know about the future though probably Flybe won’t see much low hours recruitment for a while other than cadets.

I also understand that a lot of smaller biz jet/ air taxi operators like to recruit internally once they’ve had a chance to look at an individual working in another department before investing heavily in getting them qualified on type.

As mentioned operators will invest time, money and effort training up cabin crew, ops assistants etc and good cabin crew and ops assistants are no doubt hard to find. So if you start in another department and prove yourself to be exceptionally good at that job you may well find your boss is reluctant to let you go off and train as a First Officer, equally if you prove yourself next to useless then the company won’t want to invest in your First Officer training.

Having said all of that if you’re not working and you’ve got loans/ bills to pay off then at least you will be earning a wage and getting your face known. You will also have the opportunity to network with other operators in the area and get your face known with them. You may also be put on a shift system where you can still network further afield on your rostered off days.

If you think that it might work for you and decide to apply then it’s best policy to be honest about the CPL MEIR and state that you would be interested in any internal First Officer recruitment campaigns in the future while dedicating yourself fully to the job in hand in the meantime.

[average-punter]

I am current CC. At my airline there are a fair few fATPL holders flying as CC and no so long ago we were having this exact discussion.

It was easier for me at my CC interview as I had no licenses. Others were all qualified and the vast majority were honest about it, but at the same time had good examples of customer service, culture awarness etc...

Best of luck.

[adelta]

Thank you very much to magickmick and average-punter.

I would prefer the open and honest route also.

Can I just ask one more question - that is if you joined as cabin crew with no license - do they ever train internal candidates from the ground up, or would you be expected to have a license already? Just wondering whether they have some kind of sponsorship scheme.

Average-punter - what airline are you with (pm if you prefer) and have you seen CC successfully become flight crew?

[Matey]

To answer the point about selecting unqualified internal candidates for ab initio training, that is not on the radar at Thomson nor anywhere else I would hazard a guess as there are more than enough frozen ATPL holders out there already.

With regard to compromising your chances of gaining a position in another part of the company by being honest about your ultimate ambition, then I would suggest that Thomson would see it as a very positive "apprenticeship." Experience of the other side of the flight deck door, or other parts of the business would be very useful, and we are actively encouraged to, for example, spend time in Thomson retail outlets to gain an insight into the process of tempting a customer to commit to a Thomson holiday. The job is not just about an isolated existence locked in the flight deck, the days of just flying the front 20 feet of the aircraft from A to B with no regard to what is happening behind us are thankfully long gone. From a personal viewpoint, training and working with someone with life experience outside of obtaining a licence and starting in an airline flying job brings a greater flexibility and far better understanding of our customers. We have, for years, used a Pilots Skills List as a debriefing aid for recurrent training and checking tasks. In more recent times that has been supplemented by a Customer Skills List which you can expect to be used as well.

[yeoman]

^ Seconded!

[seymoreskye]

I can vouch for Matey,

I worked overseas for TOM and regularly met staff from the UK who had been sent over to experience different parts of the company.
Many graduates get sent and I have met Recruitment, HR, Flight crew and even the odd Engineer

Knowing how the company operates through different departments helps understand your job better and everyone elses.