Advice for a future pilot

[Amit Wings]

Hello to all!

This is the first time I'm posting in here and I think it's a great forum. I would like some advice and I know this is the right place to get it.

I plan to study an aviation degree with a pilot stream next year at Griffith University. As for probably all pilots it has always been a dream of mine to become a pilot since I was 7 years old. I'm 32 now and this hasn't gone away. I couldn't afford the fees that's why I didn't do it. But now being an Australian Citizen I can get access to HECS and FEE-HELP from the government. I did study before at Griffith as an international student. I completed a Diploma, Bachelor and Master Degree mostly in Business.

Being a pilot has been a dream as I mentioned earlier but I don't want to be blinded by it. I've done a lot of research and I found that finding a job as a pilot is very hard. Pilots in the US and Europe are really struggling. This is the link of an American article written in May this year with many pilots commenting Pilot Career Is Losing Its Appeal, Shows Survey | Aviation International News (http://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/ain-news-live/regional-airline-association-convention/2013-05-14/pilot-career-losing-its-appeal-shows-survey) . It is quite scary. I also read that there is actually no such thing as a pilot shortage, at least not since the 1960s.

Griffith has a partnership with Cathay Pacific. Basically after 1 year at Griffith students can apply for a Cathay Cadetship which is very hard to get but it's still a hope.

I am really worried that after finishing the 4 years of study and having so much debt I won't find a job. What advice can you guys give me? I'm really really lost. Follow my dream or not. My elder brother who is nearly finishing his pilot course in England told me to go for it but I don't want to just jump in a black hole.

I really appreciate for any of your inputs. :)

Thanks,

Amit.

[redsnail]

There's a very similar thread running in Dunnunda & Godzone.

Why are you doing a 4 year degree?
You certainly don't need a degree to fly in Australia.
It can be done a lot quicker than that.

Do you know where you'll go to look for work? Are you aware of the "normal" pathways to jobs in Australia? Most folks get instructor ratings or head up north for bush flying.
Now I haven't been in Oz for over 10 years but you might want to research the current pathways to the (ultimate) job you want.

[greenslopes]

Don't do a degree.
Get a CPL, go North get a job!

[solowflyer]

Forget the degree you already have one and you will be paying a primium for any course with fee help. Maybe look at the various cadetships thats the way things seem to be going these days.

[Berealgetreal]

Amit at 32 you are already starting out up to 15 years later than many current pilots. During the boom 03-08 an awful lot of musical chairs took place and to be brutally honest most of the good seats on the seniority list were filled. At the moment I would say that all Majors have reached saturation point for pilots. There are people on my list that may not reach a command in their working life due to age and position on the list.

What you need to do is get your licence and get cracking. This means going into GA and building experience. Many try to avoid this step with numerous different methods but by the time they realise that very few manage to short cut the system they've just wasted yet another year or two. Getting caught up on the wave of 'this provider has a contract with CX' etc is NOT where you need to be. You might actually find that working for Cathay as a cadet or SO isn't quite what it used to be!

Be honest with yourself, get your licence and get going. Do the degree by distance if you want but start getting some runs on the board. Very few of us really looked forward to going bush but those that made it in the industry realised that we HAD to do it. Best of luck.

[tail wheel]

"I completed a Diploma, Bachelor and Master Degree mostly in Business."

Continue your professional development into a rewardng management career.

Gain a PPL and enjoy the freedom of weekend flying.

[Boomerang]

I second the cadetship suggestion. You seem to be good at research, so see what others you can apply for now, ie Virgin, Jetstar Australia/Singapore etc. Do you have dual citizenship that allows you to look further afield?

Doing the degree unfortunately is no garantee of a job, plus you'll be paying for the degree AND flying training. Ouch! But I wish you the best of luck!

[Wally Mk2]

'Taily' in some ways that's good advice but there would be a few managers out there who have PPL's & are very frustrated that they never pursued flying as a career but ended up behind a desk being disliked by pilots.

'Bere' that's a good honest post, & very real:ok:


Wmk2

[Jabawocky]

TW=POTY :D


sadly.....:sad:

[pull-up-terrain]

Another thing to factor in, The degree path normally costs an extra $40k compared to going to a flying club/school. But, there aren't many non university providers where you can get access to an interest free loan from the government for flying training.

I remember my son went to a unsw open day for there aviation degree, I would really take there bull**** spin about cathay pacific with a grain of salt. They told my son and I that a few of there students went straight to qantas on the completion of their degrees as direct entry a380 second officers (which of course is bull**** cause qantas hasn't employed a pilot since 2009, might be 2008)... :rolleyes:

[NNB]

what the hell .. airlines 'only' want cadets so they can train a monkey to monitor a computer...!!!
Better for that, now IF you are serious about following a passion that will enable you to live the dream as they say, go bush!
As others have already said - get a licence with the appropriate endorsements and go and learn to fly properly and earn respect of your peers and line managers as being a craftsman of your trade.
IF you want to go mainline later, that will be up to you but you will go there with the ability to make a decision and (hopefully) back it up with knowledge and skill.
Yes - I have a bent against the cadet system BUT my frustration is aimed at the bean counter management mentality that has managed to cut all aspects of the heavier end of RPT beyond the bone to the extent that it is bordering on criminal.
In spite of my rant, go flying and follow your dream.
The blue room is a fantastic yet very demanding mistress and a heap of fun..!!!
I'm feeling so much better now!
NNB

[solowflyer]

NNB I agree with you 100% about the cadets but like it or not the sad fact is they are here to stay and it is increasingly looking like DE is going to be a harder nut to crack as all the airlines line their pockets with ill gotten gains.

[poonpossum]

Very few of us really looked forward to going bush but those that made it in the industry realised that we HAD to do it. Best of luck.

I reckon its been probably the best time of my life i'll ever have have 'out bush.'

Don't dread having to do it, embrace it. Get excited. Its fantastic. I sometimes feel a bit sorry for my cadet friends. Straight from flying school to a big boring jet.


People are saying not to do the degree, but you have said the reason you want to is because you can offset your flight training with Fee Help.

There are a few flight schools now who are accredited tafe providers, with whom you can still use Fee Help and not have to worry about any pesky degree.

[Rogan82]

Join the ADF. Same pay these days as a low cost carrier, and no debt to pay back! After wings a guaranteed job for 10 years.

[MaximumPete]

I started flying in 1963 as an Air Scout on gliding courses and achieved my dream of sponsorship for my CPL/IR in 1966 starting my training at the tender age of 19 yrs. I had a few O-levels.

I got a Masters degree in 2001 aged 53 yrs, unrelated to aviation, by distant learning.

You don't need a degree to go flying just live the dream and have lots of fun.

MP

[Amit Wings]

Thank you so much everyone for taking time to reply to my post :) I appreciate all the advice!

[Amit Wings]

Hi redsnail!

I'm doing the degree because of the HECS and FEE-HELP. In QLD I think only Australia Wings provides VET FEE-HELP. Unfortunately, that's nearly 4 hours drive return from my house. But it is something worth considering.

Yes I can work as an instructor too to build up my hours.

[Amit Wings]

Hi Berealgetreal!

I don't mind going to the bush at all. I'll go anywhere that I can build up my hours and more importantly FLY!

You are right I just need to get cracking!

Thanks man!

[Amit Wings]

Hi Boomerang!

Yes I do have dual citizenship and I also speak 5 languages. That might help down the track as employers might think it as a plus.

Thanks!

[harrip]

I'm doing the degree because of the HECS and FEE-HELP.

You don't do a degree to get fee help. It's a bit like spending money to make a loss so you don't pay so much tax i.e. don't spend $1 to save 40 cents.

[Amit Wings]

Hi NNB!

Man, I would much prefer to go bush than go overseas and be a cadet in a major airline. I am happily married (ten years now) and the thought of leaving my wife and go overseas is very daunting. I prefer to go bush but still be in Australia. Then, after getting some experience I'll try to find a job closer to home.

However, I will take whatever comes. If I get a cadetship, although that is not my priority - flying is!, I will grab it. Even if I do it for a year the experience will be worth something. However, going bush doesn't scare me. I'm not trying to do any shortcuts. Hard work doesn't scare me. I've worked really hard all my life and still am. Most nights water was our dinner but we've achieved so much now and have a happy life.

Thanks for you advice.

[Amit Wings]

Hi harrip!

A very good thought there. Worth considering! Thanks for that.

[Amit Wings]

Hi Maximumpete!

It does seem like you had a really fun journey and probably still having fun.:ok:

Thanks!

[Smackbang]

If you are interested in the cadet path, have you considered training at Flight Training Adelaide? They have the VET-FEE courses which will allow you to offset the fees and you might get a chance to mix with cadets from Qlink, Virgin, CX, Dragonair or instructors that have trained some of these guys anyway. Just a thought.