CZ China Southern Oz bases

[dogsfatass]

Given the recent announcement of Airbus CCQ's and Boeing conversions offered by CZ there will no doubt be a bit of interest.

Is there a kind soul currently based in MEL on the 330 reverse schedule that could offer a bit of insight into scheduling, time at home, time away etc?


Please let's not start another China-bashing thread. Just after a few facts.


Cheers in advance for your input.

[Higs]

Apparently good to work for and offers a good lifestyle.. Oh and great money. Downside is that you are a "contract pilot" and as such, when they dont want you anymore.... your gone, just like Singapore Airlines just did..

[Vorsicht]

Could someone give a quick explanation of how the rostering actually works and how many effective days you get at your nominated home base port.

Cheers

[Servo]

Oooh I wonder if my current employer will give me 2 years lwop to have a go?

Interested in the 787..........

Would also like to hear about the conditions.

[Martin VanNostrum]

The Contract Summary between China Southern Airlines and Agency
1. Requirements for the Captain Position
1) A minimum of 6000 hours total flying time (only front seat time on turboprop and/or turbojet aircraft can be counted);
2) A minimum of 3000 hours command time on multi-crew, multi-engine commercial jet aircraft with an MTOW of 50 tons or more;
3) Note: We do not accept simulator time for flying hours calculation.
4) Must hold a valid ICAO ATPL with an unrestricted class one medical certificate;
5) English language fluency (written and verbal comprehension); must be at least equal
to ICAO English level 4;
6) Must have flown as an aircraft commander on a jet meeting the above mentioned
criteria, within 12 months of joining;
7) The age below 56 years old when first time send the application documents;
8) Category I instrument landing level.
9) No record of flight incident or accident.
10) No Criminal Record, which shall be issued by the governing body of his/her
nationality country, region or country or area of permanent residence (Residence Permit required) and the record must be legally notarized by the same country, or area. The No Criminal Record and the Notary Certificate shall be issued prior to 180 days of the background check.
11) Provide a Security Evaluation Comment (original) issued by the former airline company employer to confirm that the pilot is qualified to be an airline transportation pilot.
12) The given type rating from China Southern and the requirements:

[Lookleft]

2) A minimum of 3000 hours command time on multi-crew, multi-engine
commercial jet aircraft with an MTOW of 50 tons or more;


This will put a brake on the MOU pilots in Jetstar thinking that they will just pick up a Command gig when the three years are up.

[Servo]

Meet all of the above, no worries. Hmmmm.

[airdualbleedfault]

Do some searching on working for a Chinese airline, then ask yourself lf every one of those guys is just bitter and twisted or could they actually be plicks to work for.

[MASTEMA]

Higs has a valid point, it is a contract job, just like any other contract job or as secure as working for Ansett, Tiger, Qantas, Virgin... you just never know.

The main points are;

CSA can afford to purchase/ wipe out Qantas, Virgin and Tiger without even putting down a chopstick
CSA will NEVER go broke
You are based in Australia
You operate four crew everywhere (half the flight in a cosy bunk)
You operate to great destinations (LHR CDG AMS DME AKL + Oz)
You get an average 13 nights at home in Oz per month
You get paid double the average an A330 pilot earns anywhere else
The CSA folk are very warm and friendly
There are no numbnuts invited to work there
The incumbents reckon it is the best gig going
The current offer of CCQ will extend to A330/A380 MFF
Contract is 3 year renewable
CSA wants to be bigger and better than EK, Cathay, etc
Safeguard the 'contract' issue by sticking $8K net a month in rainy day account. You will still have $12K net left over to play with on all those days off. At the end of your three year contract you will $290K tax free to contemplate your navel with. :ok:

Simples!

[Karunch]

Mastema's view of the situation at the moment may well be correct.

If you'd like to know how the landscape can change take a look at the separate threads on how Air China's based pilots are seeing things five years down the track.

Fines, base closures, 8 days off/ month and rampant medical failures are all now features of a contract job that used to look exactly like the CZ description given above by Mastema. It just takes one change in management.

And Ccq's- a minimum 12 months as relief Capt on the new type after being cleared to line, by regulator decree (even 320/330).

So it depends on how far ahead you wish to look.

[MASTEMA]

Kraunch

It seems that you are not enjoying AC and didn't enjoy JQ?

Chinese airlines are not for everyone and neither are the ones here in the pit.

If given the choice, where would you choose work and why?

[Homesick-Angel]

Considering they can't train enough pilots, and they have cadet program's all over the place in AUS and elsewhere, and considering they've put orders in for nearly 200 new aircraft, and considering that China's growth is stabilising quite well, and really only has to do that to continue becoming if not already the worlds next superpower, then I'd say your average 3 year contract would have a fair chance of being extended..

[MASTEMA]

Heard today that BNE base opens next month, the contract has improved and the AUD has given them a payrise!

Sure beats sanddunes and camel farts. :sad:

[Rateofdescent]

'And Ccq's- a minimum 12 months as relief Capt on the new type after being cleared to line, by regulator decree (even 320/330).'


Can anyone confirm this?

Regards,

RoD

[Karunch]

'And Ccq's- a minimum 12 months as relief Capt on the new type after being cleared to line, by regulator decree (even 320/330). Can anyone confirm this?.

Ask any of the Air China A320/330 or 737/744 candidates, the latter now waiting 3 years for their upgrade. Aside from the regulatory requirement, what makes you think you could jump the already long queue of local candidates waiting for upgrade?. You will be considered an FO upon joining.

Factor what the brokers tell you with reality. That is, don't go unless already rated & experienced on type.

[MASTEMA]

Karunch

So where do you suggest they go? 42 degree dust and heat and not a tree in sight?

My understanding is that you dont pay for the rating, get paid while under training, go onto full pay once checked to line, based in Oz, wear four strips, take off and land in the left seat, log time on seat as command and spend half the flight in the bunk. Plus the AUD is giving a payrise.

What's not to like? :confused:

[Karunch]

Matstema, I'm not about to go offering up the few viable alternatives on a public forum.

Your understanding of the job is correct with the following caveats relating to non-type rated applicants.


You wear four bars but will be treated as if you have two- you have a social standing below the local first officers.
You may or may not be allowed to takeoff & land depending upon the PIC 1 and both first officers will jockey for sectors as their promotion depends on number of takeoffs/ landings conducted.
The aircraft captain must sign your logbook on completion of the flight (there is special column for this)- you cannot log this as command time on type and most other carriers know that this is relief captain time.
Your new type rating goes onto your non Icao licence. Good luck having it recognised by other authorities.


Its a different story if you already meet their type rated requirements.

Almost all jobs in Asia are benefiting from the downfall of the zombie currency, not just CZ. Those of us who've been offshore for a while have seen both sides,

Cheers

[MASTEMA]

I think we are on different pages here.

The requirement is for DEC (3000hrs command) to do conversion A320/B737 to widebody, not for FO upgrade to Captain.

Following a Skype call for some clarification of your comments;

Only Chinese FOs get their logbooks signed if flying with an instructor.
Take offs and landings based on who needs/ wants them (you normally only get 2-3 pm on heavy crew long haul anyway)
Foreign Captains treated with the utmost respect and usually called Sir by the FOs.
If you keep a copy of your training records and present them to CASA they will add the type rating to your Oz licence. Apparently the same for EASA/JAR.

Maybe CSA is taking a different path to AC? I heard some fellas at CE have been royally screwed.

Time for prayers which means a cold ale for me!