CHC Probs With UK SAR 92's Leaving For Irish SAR?

[EAGLESDARE]

Why are the CHC UK SAR S92's still in the UK and not in Ireland yet? Mind you the Bristow SAR cabs look great.

[EAGLESDARE]

The fact that crews were sent to fly them back to Ireland would show that someone thought all the boxes had been ticked, just as well they don't work for Sir Alan Sugar coz most lightly you would be F****. Basic mistake for such such a contract, lack of planning. When was it won by CHC?

[Pink Panther]

Any idea on the timeline for the remainder of the Irish bases transitioning to the S-92 ?

[EAGLESDARE]

If the US paperwork was indeed the oversight by CHC Ireland, the only people to answer that question are the AMERICAN's. Not the first time they have helped out in this part of the world. Mind you not sure if that is the prob considering Ireland is still part of the British Isles and the S92's are transfering from one EU country to another.

[helihub]

For the sake of accuracy, the Sumburgh base was handed over to Bristows on 1st June, and the Stornoway base will follow on 1st July.

[EAGLESDARE]

Sounds like a lot of probs in SAR Ireland for CHC, at least on the surface Bristow's seem to be a lot more successful at implementing their SAR contract, mind you no doubt CHC Ireland will start to loose people to Bristow's. No aircraft, unhappy staff and on the back heel, not a good sign for things to come. Who rescue's the Irish MCA from this ?

[EAGLESDARE]

My mate in Bristow's filled me in on the US paperwork that is holding up the UK SAR S92's going to CHC Ireland SAR Contract. This is a big issue if the paperwork was not filed by the Company. Bristow's have a department in house for dealing with this issue, would be surprised if CHC don't considering , correct me if I'm wrong but they bring aircraft from many locations around the world. This is basic stuff in the world of large helicopter operators you would think:\

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=itar&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&ved=0CCwQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fpmddtc.state.gov%2Fregulations_laws%2Fitar_ official.html&ei=byqyUaT4J8nb7AaEmoEg&usg=AFQjCNHjnsCBWvxBLB10LodDARqDpX4XkA&bvm=bv.47534661,d.ZGU

[sonas]

Looks like both CHC 92s have lifted from Sumburgh, noticed on AIS heading in a SW direction

[Pink Panther]

Any idea what their final destination this evening is ?

[Pink Panther]

With a start for one of these aircraft being July 1st as you have said, they certainly know how to cut things fine.:eek: Sleepless nights for some people I would have thought.:} Not far from Enniskillen now by the looks of things, according to AIS.

[StAn gelo]

Both aircraft hangared at Enniskillen :ok:

[EAGLESDARE]

Still in the UK but closer to their final homes:D Are they staying in MCA colours or do the Irish MCA have their own colour scheme? Is there a spray facility in Enniskillen or Northern Ireland?

[helihub]

Very little paint will be required. Here are the existing Irish S92 and one of the pair hangared at Enniskillen below

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8393/8704650967_9d6fede653_z.jpg

http://shetlandcoastguard.info/gallery/albums/userpics/10001/GCGOC.jpg

[EAGLESDARE]

All I know is there's more space in Sumburgh now and those 92's are closer to there final destination. Mind you they could have been sprayed in the UK, plenty of good paint shops over here. Roll on the other Bristow Cabs going to Stornoway :D

[206Fan]

Few images of them arriving in Enniskillen!

Private / Corporate - HELICOPTERS-NI's Photos (http://helicopters-ni.smugmug.com/Helicopters/Private-Corporate/17522615_BLd5WR#!i=2564230216&k=sPKKw85)

[Hiduly Damper]

Non Event, Yawn:zzz:

[Hiduly Damper]

Aircraft only released on 1st June. Crews all trained, operational and moving back to an area that most have operated in for over 5 years. Service delivery by 1st July. Like I said Non event.

[206Fan]

Both AC on route according to ICG. ETA into Shannon, 18:00!

[Pink Panther]

Any idea when the new paint jobs will be done ?

[Hiduly Damper]

Ah now MTB,
Just because somebody challenged your axe grinding mountain out of a molehill attitude theres no need to spit the dummy. What I find really interesting with you is that you wish good luck to the crews who's livelihood depend on this contract yet obviously hope it falls on its ass to spite the management. Had a little run in with them have we?

How about waiting until the 1st July and if it's 'Meanttobe' then it's 'Meanttobe' rather then asserting that the entire contract is in disarray over what is a fairly small delay.

[Pink Panther]

I have to say, as an outsider looking in. To get three bases operational in the remaining time line ( 1st June-31st Dec 2013, not including the current slippage), does indeed look like a very big ask.:}

[Hiduly Damper]

MTB,
Do you know the actual reason for the delay? Tell me this, if a UK ITAR licenced aircraft cannot be used in the ROI do you suppose an ROI ITAR licenced aircraft could be used in the UK? And considering the aircraft had to be in the UK until the end of May when do you think the ROI licence application could be lodged? And tell me this how long do you think it takes to get an ITAR licence? Just because you, without any facts decides something is embarrassing doesn't make it so.

Also, as you don't have the facts, the only 2 contractual dates where 1st July 2012 for Shannon and 31st Dec 2013 for the last base, Dublin. What happens in between doesn't attract any penalties.

Any other half truths you would like cleared up.

PP,
With Sligo running in July that only leaves 2 bases to transition over 6 months with an increasing fleet available for training. Bearing in mind that most of the Waterford crew are already trained and Dublin about to start its conversion its very do-able, tight but do-able.

[Pink Panther]

Reading this thread was it not the case 2 sets of flight crew, inc engineers were sent up north to pickup the helo's, only to find they couldn't because paperwork was not in order ?

[Hiduly Damper]

Correct and right but that was lack of communication between three different sections of the company the paperwork was what the paperwork was. A balls up yes but hardly the contract killer that MTB pontificated about.

[mechanicalapple]

Getting ready for paint!

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/p480x480/5566_602339199790426_202093935_n.jpg

[sonas]

I've seen on another site that the page from the Shannon base has been silenced by someone. Same pic as the one above so some poor burger will be getting slapped knuckles for breaching company policy. Defo management kicking about here!

[Pink Panther]

This thread is getting interesting. :eek: Obviously somebody is not enjoying the social media thingy at the mo.:E Looks like the only IRCG SAR helo Facebook page left standing now is........... R-117.

[500 Fan]

Even if the S-92 is late entering service here, the Irish government (I use the term loosely!) will do nothing about it. The clowns in Dail Eireann are too busy slinging mud at each other. Given the state of the country at the moment, the late arrival of these helicopters is the least of our problems.

Besides, they can hang onto the S-61N for as long as they like, it is much quieter!:ok:

500 Fan.

[comforteater]

HD, there is little point in you coming on here and trying to play down the ITAR delay as a non event. This delay has only served to make already tight deadlines tighter. For whatever reason, paperwork not being submitted on time or manpower issues at a US State Dept., the moment the customer had to lobby the US Ambassador in Ireland to help speed things up, the situation was outside of the management teams' control.
PP is correct, getting 3 bases online before December 31st is hugely ambitious and with plenty more hurdles to clear before then maybe you should put your showboating on hold until the 1st of Jan 2014.

[Hiduly Damper]

Good man MTB, wrong again:D
No Im not in management or a legal eagle just one of the other 100+ poor soles dependent on this contract succeeding. Plus it wasn't my paranoia antenna going off, it was my BS detector :}
As for being upset at the use of a single word in a thread I have a little more cop on then that. However, what does 'upset' me is an individual who cannot see the difference between his animosity at a couple of individuals in management and an entire company that puts food on the table for a lot of people.

Now as for this thing of 3 bases in 7 months its not. Sligo is pretty much 100% complete so a more accurate figure is 2 bases in 6 months. The fact that there arent aircraft sitting on bases also doesnt reflect the true situation. Facilities are already in place from the 61, Engineer training is almost 100% complete, Rear crew training is almost 100% complete and pilot training is 100% complete in Shannon and Sligo about 70-80% complete in Waterford and about to commence in Dublin. Considering that all pilot training to date has been completed on one base and with one aircraft and now there are 3, soon to be 5 aircraft the conversion rate will accelerate.
So is 6 months tight for 2 bases that already have most of the long lead items in place, not really. Is it a risk if their is a SIGNIFICANT delay, yes of course it is but this little episode certainly isnt a game changer in any respect and hence not significant bar to those who want to ham it up.

PS Sonas, as your so quick to post about the 115 Facebook page I presume you'll be happy to recheck their Facebook page and clarify for everybody, right?

[sonas]

HD I stand corrected

Rescue 115 Official (https://www.facebook.com/pages/Rescue-115-Official/202427363114947?ref=stream&hc_location=stream)


Sorry for the confusion, but no ban has been put on us, we are currently reviewing our administrators. Posts will continue.

Sonas

[EAGLESDARE]

Great shot with the Coke bottle, brings me back to the old Coke add "I'd like to teach the world to sing in peace and harmonyeeeee", hopefully it's all ahead of you in CHC Ireland. Over here the MCA audit the bases and operations the same occurs on start up bases to ensure contract compliance. I hope the Irish MCA does the same and puts the brakes on a little if required, it tends to take the commerciality ( MTB earlier post 20% return, nice contract return) out of the situation as its in everybody's interest that people come home to their families.

[Hiduly Damper]

Rest easy EAGLESDARE, the Irish Coastguard also conduct audits prior to all base starts and I believe its also the same company that do the MCA audits.

Ahh, thanks MBT, your concern for all the crews and their kids is gratefully appreciated.:}

[Rescue1]

Hiduly Damper Considering that all pilot training to date has been completed on one base and with one aircraft

So there were NO Irish Pilots trained on the 92's in Stornoway and Sumburgh then :=

R1

[comforteater]

Hiduly Damper

You've certainly posted a few half truth's here!!:=

Also, as you don't have the facts, the only 2 contractual dates where 1st July 2012 for Shannon and 31st Dec 2013 for the last base, Dublin. What happens in between doesn't attract any penalties.

Any other half truths you would like cleared up.

I stand to be corrected here, but I thought that all four bases were to be online with S92's by the 1st July 2013, originally. I find it inconceivable that the Irish Coast Guard would not penalise CHC for failing to reach such an obvious contractual milestone.
I wouldn't be surprised if the ICG were hitting CHC with a substantial penalty on every base that's not up and running with a 92 after the 1st of July. Would this explain the scramble to get the Sligo base up and running by then?

[Rotorbike]

comforteater, you are wrong.

:ok:

[comforteater]

Thanks for clearing that up!!;)

[Hiduly Damper]

Rescue 1,
Apologies you are correct. A number of pilots and crew trained on the Scottish bases and some have since spent a number of months there on shifts. That said I think you would agree that the vast majority of the training burden has fallen to a single airframe, a situation that additional airframes can only improve.

Comforteater,
Thanks for showing that you don't really know the situation on the ground.

[comforteater]

Hiduly Damper
Why don't you enlighten me about the "situation on the ground"?

[Hiduly Damper]

I already did, you called it a half truth and Rotorbike corrected you.

[IrishSarBoy]

when are we opening a book on the total collaspe/completion of the transisition (delete as applicable):}

I'll put a fiver each way:p

[edwardspannerhands]

Looking at AIS, it would appear the S-92 from Shannon is on a LongSAR shout way down in the Celtic Sea. Is R193 off-line? or is this within the Irish CG's AOR? Must be right on the edge of it's Op radius, it looks a long way (150NMish South of Irish coast) hope they've got the CASA for company:)

[206Fan]

Ed,

Just noticed that myself on the AIS. She's well out to sea. There is an Oil Rig to the South West they use to refuel the aircraft on long SAR missions South!

[edwardspannerhands]

More details from the Irish Coast Guards FB page:

https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net/hprofile-ak-ash4/203506_365726190137889_120791926_q.jpg (http://www.facebook.com/IrishCoastGuard?ref=stream&hc_location=timeline)
Irish Coast Guard (http://www.facebook.com/IrishCoastGuard?ref=stream&hc_location=timeline)

39 minutes ago (https://www.facebook.com/IrishCoastGuard/posts/562801410430365) near Clane, Kildare (http://www.facebook.com/pages/Clane/103095156397690?ref=stream)

On going mission off the west coast. Single handed yachtsman in urgent need of Medevac after being injured in heavy swell. So far unable to locate the yacht but have an approx area. Tasking given to rescue 115 at 0630UTC as she was completing transfer of a pilot onboard a ship trying to enter the Shannon (weather too rough to transfer pilot by boat). Rescue 115 accepts tasking and routes to Cork for fuel. Currently Rescue 115 en route to the area 200 kilometers south of Mizen. ETA 1030 UTC for winch ops. Best of luck to the crew.

[comforteater]

Lovely HD, very insightful!

To even the most casual observer it seems that CHC are cutting things extremely tight. The ITAR mess has delayed the introduction of the Sligo 92 by about 2 weeks but the start date appears to have stayed the same. Net result is 2 weeks less build up training for the Sligo crews. Are corners being cut?
Also, I see the work on the Dublin hangar has started. They'll be working around the clock to get that finished by December, never mind for when their 92 arrives.
I refuse to believe that the Irish Coast Guard are not penalising CHC for not having Waterford and Dublin operational. It should be easy enough to find out though. An FOI request or a Dàil question should get the required info.

[Hiduly Damper]

So tell me comforteater:

1. What was the original plan prior to ITAR? Oh wait that was a 2 week run up starting on the 18th. And post ITAR please share with everybody what is happening?

2. Ref Dublin Hanger, you seem very interested in this, which TBH Im not very surprised at, but are you suggesting that the operation cannot be conducted from the current facilities?? God forbid your wouldn't have an aircraft wash area!!!!!!!

3. Refuse to believe all you want. Your wrong and your persistence just proves your lack of knowledge .

[Hiduly Damper]

Irishsarboy,
Ill give you evens unless your based with MTB and CE in which case ill give you 50/1 that they wont make end 12/13 (replaced by Irish Air Corps) and/or 100/1 that their base is taken over by aliens prior to 12/13. (Payment only viable if aliens wash aircraft).

[comforteater]

Wow, Hiduly Damper!!!:D

You slag off what you perceive are other people's "lack of knowledge", and then talk about CHC not being penalised, the IAC providing a SAR service and aliens washing aircraft!! Sure what else would you be doing in the wee hours of Saturday morning?

[Manchester]

mtb - you come across as logical but opinionated and optimistic - traits of the inexperinced; Comforteater comes across as logical but realistic. I’ll bet he is your older wiser self, Luke

[Pink Panther]

Instead of playing the players play the ball.:= Are there any takers who can counter what MB has posted.... He seems to have done his homework with concrete info. HD, The helo wash area has gone over my head, what's that about.:confused:

Is the quote from the IRCG director supplied my MB correct or not ?:E

[EAGLESDARE]

As a outsiders point of view MTB seems to know what he/she is talking about. There have been a few false starts with UK SAR the biggest one obviously was SAR H. That is the past and Bristow's seem to being doing it right from the starter blocks with spend on infrastructure, people and aircraft. I would suggest the least of your worries in Ireland are having aircraft washers and wash bays. Pink P is correct, play the ball not the person on the forum. The later looses you the argument:= What is FOI?

[meanttobe]

Irish Coast Guard search and rescue fleet renewal extended - Irish News, World News & More | The Irish Times - Mon, Jun 17, 2013 (http://www.irishtimes.com/news/irish-coast-guard-search-and-rescue-fleet-renewal-extended-1.1430873)

[Hiduly Damper]

MTB,
I'm sorry you have wasted your time posting such a great post but a few counters.

1. The tender wasn't in compliance with the Irish Coastguard tender as it was a non compliant tender which was available to all tenderers To provide alternate solutions provided it was accompanied by a compliant tender (which wasn't selected). For example a fully compliant tender required 5 new aircraft.

2. What was in the public tender, the tender by CHC and the CONTRACT post CHC selection are all different so basing your thoughts on the public tender is flawed. Sorry but there are no penalties in the contract until Jan 1st 2014.

3. The transition plan prior to the ITAR issue, which you said was a last minute issue, also bears to resemblance to the transition plan you alluded to which was about 2 years old, primarily because of the release of the aircraft as you pointed out. However, has the up to date transition plan changed due to the short delay caused by the ITAR issue, which is what this is all about? No. As I said before, only a significant event to those who want to ham it up.

[meanttobe]

Bristow restarts SAR service from Stornoway with S92 | Helihub - the Helicopter Industry Data Source (http://helihub.com/2013/07/01/bristow-restarts-sar-service-from-stornoway-with-s92/)