View Full Version : We've all been conned


VH-XXX
21st Apr 2013, 12:14
So there's no doubt you've probably all seen the latest advert for one of the big four banks featuring a flying instructor running his own flying school, outdoors using nothing but grass, fold up chairs and a Warrior.

Well..... It's fake. Said flying instructor isn't running a flying school business, didn't borrow money from the bank and is actually a pilot for a regional airline starting with R.

I feel ripped off because I believed them.

Does anyone know this chap and can the experts spot the two filming locations used for the advert?

(I also thought that Operation Repo was real until someone told me it was fake too, doh)



nitpicker330
21st Apr 2013, 12:21
Yep, Tooradin RWY 22 with the old Ship beached in the background.

VH-XXX
21st Apr 2013, 12:43
There's also another location inside a hangar...

John Eacott
21st Apr 2013, 13:11
Tooradin is the obvious one, but the Yak looks as if it was outdoors at Moorabbin. The hangar shot looks like one or two of the hangars north of the tower at Essendon, best guess would be Mike Falls' since he's been renting out to location companies since Pontius was a pilot.

And there was me thinking that some up and coming youngster was getting ahead in the flying game :hmm:

Stiff Under Carriage
21st Apr 2013, 20:40
I do know him. Don't know where it was filmed. He is an FO with said airline (ex cadet). Never held an instructor rating.

Jack Ranga
21st Apr 2013, 20:47
Would a bank loan money to this type of operation? This ad did create a bit of interest for me. If I was a banker it would be the last operation I'd be lending to. Tough game!

Horatio Leafblower
21st Apr 2013, 21:19
Bloke I know had a 3-year $7m charter contract and said bank would only lend him $650k under fairly extortionate conditions.

All the other banks refused flat out!

Mind you, given the number of shonks and cons in this industry who can blame them :hmm:

Metro man
21st Apr 2013, 22:41
It's much easier for a bank to get its money back when when it's gone into land or bricks and mortar rather than a business.

Old joke, how do you make a small fortune in aviation ? Start with a big one.;)

rioncentu
21st Apr 2013, 23:48
OK so yes I saw this add and thought "how good is this"

So yes I now have to agree, what a con. The NAB portraying to lend money to a business which doesn't even exist. What a crock.

OK not that I trusted the banks in the first place, but for a "reality" type add :ugh:

j3pipercub
22nd Apr 2013, 00:04
So was that the 'cadets' grandfather? Or was the story about a war veteran just cheap cashing in also? Does said 'cadet' also want an acting career?

j3

Andy_RR
22nd Apr 2013, 00:25
Employee goes to bank to buy a house. Bank says, "No problems! You've got a good employment history. Here's a 95% loan at 6.5%"

Employer of said employee goes to bank for business funds to buy some equipment. Bank says, "We need a mortgage over the equipment, a mortgage over your house and some cash in an account as security. Oh, and it's 13.5% interest."

Is it any wonder house prices are through the roof and there's declining business environment here in Australia.

:{

onetrack
22nd Apr 2013, 00:38
The NAB totally destroyed our family business and all our personal asset value, that was built up over 30 yrs, by demanding the full repayment of our debt to them ($1M) within 48hrs - despite the fact that that debt was secured by $1.6M in quality property, and there were no arrears whatsoever.

The reason given? A very senior NAB official turned up out of the blue, and in a 20 min meeting, told us he "had done some computer calculations, and considered that in 6 to 12mths time, our business would owe his bank monies he would not be able to recover". A computerised future projection is all they need for immediate foreclosure to take place.

All our assets had to be sold immediately at fire sale prices, thus depriving us of the equity we had built up over 30 yrs - some $5M. We were not alone, the NAB bank has done this to many hundreds of people, effectively foreclosing on them with no warning and no satisfactory reason other than one they can think up about the safety of their shareholders money. You believe anything that a bank tells you at your peril.

What made it worse for us (and many others), is that when we went to other banks to refinance, we had doors slammed in our faces. The attitude of all other banks was, "if the biggest bank in Australia doesn't want you as a customer, there must be something you're not telling us - so thanks, but no thanks."

I read about one businessman who was so bitter and so angry about how the NAB had totally destroyed him financially by unwarranted foreclosure, that he had planned for years about how he was going to fly a light plane laden with explosives into the head office of the NAB.
The only thing that stopped him and eventually made him give up his plan, was that he could never be sure he could get the right people who had destroyed him.

I can fully understand his incandescent fury at intransigent bankers who think nothing of destroying a persons lifetime of asset-building on a whim. You can try to sue them on the basis of unconscionable conduct - but good luck.

A lawyer told me straight out, "it will take you a minimum of $300K to commence the case - and the case will run for possibly more than a decade. If the bank decides it is losing the case, it will attempt every delaying and legal tactic available to them, until you run out of money. After all, they have $50B available to them to fight you at law. How much do you have?"

One action against banks here (the Bell Group lawsuit) has run for over 22 yrs, and is still not settled. The banks lost and still refuse to pay out the $2B awarded against them.

You trust any bank at your peril. Few people understand, that any bank can foreclose on you with virtually no warning, at a moments notice. You can be homeless within days if your bank suddenly decides on a whim, that there's a risk in the monies they have lent you - and that includes your family home.

The bumper sticker that says, "Which Bank? - they're all ba$tards", is the most accurate statement ever uttered. Bankers represent the lowest class of human existence and morals, and are responsible for more misery than all the wars ever engaged in. 90% of the worlds troubles today can be directly sheeted home to bankers and their greed-driven, unconscionable actions.

Jack Ranga
22nd Apr 2013, 00:54
Got to agree with you there.

John Eacott
22nd Apr 2013, 01:07
Looking at the video online and I'm sure the hangar is Shortstop Jet Charter (Mike Falls) at Essendon: his Trojan is parked in the corner!

PA-28 LXH is Aviation Management Services at Moorabbin.

All very disappointing if it is a beatup, NAB could at least have the honesty not to imply that it is a business they have financed. Statements like "my flight school" and "I wouldn't be flying if" are implicit in implying the voiceover is by an owner of a flight school.

My first helicopter the bank's finance arm wanted (along with ownership of the machine) deeds to two houses to guarantee the loan. Some years later when the loan was less than half the original amount, they refused to release at least one of the houses so they held $1.5m+ of assets against a loan of <$200k. The loan manager called later wondering why I had paid them out and moved elsewhere :hmm:

Even later the finance company that I was with were taken over by GEC Finance: run a mile if you ever have them near anything you are involved in! The dropkick account manager contacted me demanding the $2m helicopter be registered with CAS in their name, but couldn't understand when I tried to explain that made them legally liable for maintenance, etc. Nor could he see the fact that no other vehicles they finance were treated the same, so I moved again. Only to be hit with a substantial 6 figure penalty for closing the account early :rolleyes:

I quite like retirement ...... :cool:

peterc005
22nd Apr 2013, 01:13
@<hidden> - if it's any consolation, the only people banks hate more than their customers is their staff.

Since then the NAB manager who screwed you has probably been outsourced to India and retrenched. He is probably cleaning pools or mowing lawns now.

Jabawocky
22nd Apr 2013, 03:13
Sad to say, but this thread is remarkably accurate so far.

I can only say I am glad I did not know most of this when I owed money to the bank.

Now days they owe me money.......and I think that scares me more :uhoh:

Zero debt is a nice way to be. And if you can keep it that way life is less stressful.

aldee
22nd Apr 2013, 04:23
NAB aren't robinson crusoe, copped a right royal reaming, rough end multiple insertion no lube from the big W
similar deal,a lifetime of hard graft gone :mad:

Ovation
22nd Apr 2013, 06:10
For the last 8 years of my business (which I sold in 2002) our bank was the CBA, and I couldn't speak highly enough of them, mind you they had 2 industrial properties to support a pittance of an overdraft. I always found banks were only nice to you if you didn't need to borrow from them

I though it odd that the NAB would have any involvement with the aviation industry, in fact it would more likely be be a "NO-GO" to the major banks. I always though aircraft leasing was specialist field inhabited by finance brokers who had a good knowledge of the industry, plus GE Capital which has its own aircraft finance department.

My SIL worked as a valuer for GE Capital in those days, and related a horror story to me about one particular bank suddenly deciding that no longer did they want wineries as clients, so they told (most) of them they had 90 days to refinance or be foreclosed (there was another time when they did the same to trucking companies).

Great business for GE, who, if you didn't know, is generally known as a "lender of last resort" although in recent times bikie gangs have moved into this market niche (lots of spare cash, specialised default recovery methods etc). So they would go along to a winery and do a valuation, offer a low valuation with a high interest rate, and the lender really had little or no choice - do nothing and let the bank shut them down, or clutch at the GE lifeline and be burdened with a higher interest rate.

The SIL working at GE used to refer to me when he needed information on aircraft, and I recall he once needed to do a valuation on a rather old Cessna on floats. He was surprised when I told him the floats would have a better resale value than the aircraft to which they were bolted.

Homesick-Angel
22nd Apr 2013, 06:15
I can tell you that the word went around like wildfire that they were looking for a pilot.I know of at least three people who were in the running, myself included. of course we knew it was a beat up, but give me an ad that isnt..
I think sending in a photo was my undoing....ive got a great head for radio..
and tellling them my real age...

the project was worth a pretty penny-the only way you will ever make a dollar from a bank, and for a days work a lot more than you'd ever make as a driver.

So what if its a ruse.. The funny thing is that most people out there still think aviation is up there for the rich... I only know a few truly wealthy people involved in aviation, and they sure as hell didn't make their money in aviation..

gupta
22nd Apr 2013, 06:17
I always found banks were only nice to you if you didn't need to borrow from them


Two old sayings:


Banks will only lend you money if you can prove that you don't need it
Owe the bankl $500,000, the bank tells you what to do.
Owe the bank $50,000,000, you tell the bank what to do

caneworm
22nd Apr 2013, 07:32
Oh my giddy aunt!
Who'd have thought that a bank, in cahoots with an advertising agency, would try to sell us this bald-faced lie?
What's the world coming to?
:ugh:

anonymouspilot
22nd Apr 2013, 07:40
It seems the advertising execs have got wind of the economics of employing pilots...
"I'm telling you," says one ad exec to the other, "all we have to do is advertise for a pilot with a salary of x amount, before long we'll get pilots offering to do the job for less than we offer."
"Surely not," says the second exec, "pilots are an intelligent bunch, surely they'd be like every other professional and negotiate their salaries up not down!"
"No, no, I'm telling you," responds the first, "before long, pilots will even offer to pay us!"

There was an NBN ad not long ago where a certain flying school touted the benefits of the NBN and how wonderful it was for business. The kicker was, the NBN wasn't even available in that town!