KLM to charge for Hold Baggage from April

[Rail Engineer]

Just had an email from KLM to say that as from 22nd April, they will be charging most Economy class passengers for the first hold bag on internal European flights.

Fully Flexible economy (Y or B) and Flying Blue members will be exempted.

Changed Check-in Baggage Policy - KLM.com (http://www.klm.com/travel/gb_en/campaigns/baggage/index.htm)

[Hotel Tango]

Seems that in their endeavour to promote 99 Euro fares to many European destinations they've now gone down the LCC path of making up the difference with ancillary charges to make up the deficit. All hogwash as far as I'm concerned, and not what I expect from a carrier of KLM's "legacy" status. Even though as an FF I won't be affected, I still think shame on them for descending to this crass level.

[Tableview]

Passengers transferring to/from long and medium haul services are also exempt.

I don't see the problem with this. Why should everybody pay for a service that only some use?

[ExXB]

Thin edge of the wedge. Don't want to give them any ideas, but will we soon see charges for baggage transfers, through checking, in flight entertainment, and other services that only some use.

Not surprised it is KLM taking the lead though.

[Hotel Tango]

I don't see the problem with this. Why should everybody pay for a service that only some use?

Isn't that too simplistic a response though? There's still a host of other services that only "some" of us use but that we still continue to subsidise in the fare we pay.

This modern idiology of deconstructing fares is getting on my t**s. But hey, I'm an old fart born in the glorious days of air travel. ;)

[Tableview]

But hey, I'm an old fart born in the glorious days of air travel.

So am I, but I think a modular concept is fairer than the conventional system. Let those who want to pay for ancillary services do so, and those who want to squeeze a week's luggage into a carry on to save the price of a few beers have the choice to do so. I prefer to travel in comfort and pay for that.

Baggage handling, transport, insurance, delivery and ancillary services cost the airline money. It seems reasonable to me to pass that cost on to those who use such services.

[finncapt]

If we take all this to the end:

Should I have to pay for the testing of beefburgers for horsemeat.

I quite like horse meat (makes a nice Sunday roast) and do not mind whether beefburgers contain horse or not - we eat a lot of reindeer and the occasional bit of bear as well.

Thinking about it - my wife makes our beefburgers herself with fresh ingredients.

Standing by for flak!!!!

[Hotel Tango]

and those who want to squeeze a week's luggage into a carry on to save the price of a few beers have the choice to do so

.....and see the size and bulkness of their carry on increase proportionately so that the overhead bins are so stuffed that I can't even get my overcoat in (a recent experience btw). Yes I know, there are rules about carry on size - and what a maze of variables they are - but most, aside from the LCCs, don't enforce adherence to these effectively. Nah, call me old fashioned, but for me this modular approach just doesn't belong in the real world of air travel. :)

[Planemike]

Nah, call me old fashioned, but for me this modular approach just doesn't belong in the real world of air travel.

Yeah, OK, you are old fashioned but totally sensible. The passenger cabin of an airliner, especially the smaller more compact ones, is for people to sit and travel in. Seems sensible to put cases and large bags in the hold of an aircraft. Reckon the designers got that bit right !!!

If you push that argument further you can say the provision of seating is an "ancillary service", therefore charge for a seat. Mind you a certain Irishman has already been there!!!

Let those who want to pay for ancillary services do so

To me the carriage of one's baggage is, in my view, hardly an "ancillary service". Can see that argument for an item such as the use of earphones or even the provision of a meal particularly on short haul flights.

The concept becomes ridiculous: what next, charge for walking through the passenger terminal??!!!

Planemike

[Hotel Tango]

The concept become ridiculous: what next, charge for walking through the passenger terminal??!!!

:) With many UK airports charging for dropping off and collecting passengers (airport customers), nothing would surprise me anymore!

[CelticRambler]

The concept becomes ridiculous: what next, charge for walking through the passenger terminal??!!!

As long as you call it a "development fee" such a charge will be stauchly defended by a determined group of regional airport supporters. :E

[750XL]

Am I correct in thinking that as long as you create a Flying Blue Account, regardless of whether you have 0 miles or 1000 miles, hold baggage is free?

[Tableview]

There are too many 'extreme points of view here.

Making people pay for checked baggage may tempt a minority to pack as much as possible into a carry on, but it's not the majority of people who will behave that way. Plenty of people travel on short haul flights for a day trip or a one night stop and don't need checked baggage, so again, I say, why should they pay for it?

The arguments about charging extra for a seat are, again, spurious and extreme. On the other hand, if you want a preferred seat, then pay for it or take what you are given.

As for the analogy "Should I have to pay for the testing of beefburgers for horsemeat" the fact is that we do. If I go to my butcher at the market who still uses a wooden block and charges £40/kilo for locally sourced fillet steak, I am paying more than if I buy Findus burgers, and rightly so.

If 10 strangers share a meal and I'm the one who has three courses and an expensive bottle of wine and liqueur coffee while the others have a sandwich and a salad, I don't expect others to subsidise my expensive tastes. The argument over ancillary services for flying is the same.

[Hotel Tango]

Arguments for ancillary charges may arguably be valid. But where do you stop? You could argue that it costs more in fuel to carry a 120kg passenger than a 70kg passenger. So why are fares then not calculated on the passenger's weight? Instead airlines calculate on an average weight, thus a number of passengers are effectively subsidising others in this area too.

Back to checked bags. Could you not argue that, on the other side of the coin, those charged for checked baggage could be subsidising the cheaper fares paid by others? For instance, let's say that 70 out of a load of 150 pax pay 15 Euro per bag on a given flight. This equates to a total of 1050 Euro. Is that 1050 Euro truly representative of the actual costs involved? Perhaps the true cost is only 250 Euros and thus the remaining 800 is effectively subsidising those travelling without checked baggage?

I still don't buy it :E

[vctenderness]

If 10 strangers share a meal and I'm the one who has three courses and an expensive bottle of wine and liqueur coffee while the others have a sandwich and a salad, I don't expect others to subsidise my expensive tastes. The argument over ancillary services for flying is the same.

You have obviously never gone out for a meal as a crew then!

[Jobear]

Charge a price for the ticket that allows the carrier to earn a small profit that includes all services. Or failing that charges 2Euros per checked bag, that seems a lot more fair than 10-15 for checking a bag in that won't fit in the overhead bin anyway.
I really detest the extra charge fairy, I will pay for the ticket but you have to provide an actual service and treat me like a customer not an animal to be herded, yelled at, and crammed into a cabin designed for 1/3 less passengers.

Whom do they expect to travel without clothes?

[The SSK]

I suspect that the main cost of baggage handling is in the sophisticated transfer systems that allow 45 minute (or whatever) transits at Schiphol - but passengers using these facilities are exempt, they are the ones benefitting from cross-subsidisation.

I wonder how the eventual lifting of the ban on LAGs in hand luggage will affect the operation of this particular cash cow.

[PAXboy]

Yes, Jobear, but consider that it is only our generation/s that have known the old and the new way of doing things that think like this. Those that are starting their travelling on FR aged 18 and just keen to get away from parents, will think this piecemeal way of ding things absolutely normal.

[750XL]

Anyone able to answer the following?

Am I correct in thinking that as long as you create a Flying Blue Account, regardless of whether you have 0 miles or 1000 miles, hold baggage is free?

[KBPsen]

You are correct, 750XL.

However, as this is another opportunity to play the jaded frequent flyer lamenting the state of things, a role that apparently brings status, it is of little interest and your question thus ignored.

[ExXB]

OY! Play the ball, not the player.

[lapp]

Anyone able to answer the following?

Quote:
Am I correct in thinking that as long as you create a Flying Blue Account, regardless of whether you have 0 miles or 1000 miles, hold baggage is free?

I've found this:
http://www.netflights.com/media/2867127/klm_europe_baggage_information.pdf

KLM Europe Baggage Information
As of 22 April 2013, travelers in the Economy cabin will have the option to travel
with just carry-on baggage or to check in baggage at a fee. All Flying Blue
members, corporate contract holders and Bluebiz members have free checked
baggage when travelling across Europe.
All passengers continue to take advantage of 1 piece of hand luggage up to
12kgs plus a laptop or handbag as wellas enjoying complimentary snacks and
drinks.
Exemptions on new paid option baggage:
- All Flying Blue members including ivory
- Corporate contract holders
- Bluebiz members
- SkyTeam Elite (plus) members
- Passengers holding a fully flexible ticket (Y/B classes)
- Infants (until 2 years old)
- Marine offshore/NGO traffic
Fees for the first checked baggage:
KLM website 15€
At the airport 30€
Baggage fees will apply for all KLM routes in Europe with the following
exceptions:
Italy
Russia
Ukraine
Turkey
Georgia
Belarus

[MathFox]

The way I interpret the information is that you need to be a Flying Blue member at the moment you present your luggage. (I guess adding your FB-number to the online checkin will be enough.)

[radeng]

SSK

'sophisticated transfer systems at Schipol'? Is that why they have such a reputation for lost bags?

Indeed, looking back over the years the complaints here about KLM are legion - probably more than about BA!

[er340790]

Yes, Schiphol are the undisputed masters of delayed baggage.

When I worked in NL, if ever we transitted Schiphol on a Sunday we would always take carry-on baggage only. Our checked bags NEVER made a :mad: 2+hr connection.

On one memorable trip to from Schiphol - Philadelphia - Memphis - Seattle - Tokyo - Seoul - Singapore - KL - Schiphol, my bags were up to 48 hours behind me the whole way. At one point, Seoul I think, the bags were physically in almost the right place - they arrived at the airport just as I was boarding to leave.

I still have an appalling collection of 'Welcome to Memphis' type Airport Giftshopwear from that one. :{

[Alsacienne]

Schiphol are the undisputed masters of delayed baggage.


I thought the capital of delayed baggage was CDG ... and of lost baggage LHR T5?

[Peter47]

They may be charging for luggage but I just did a round trip LHR - AMS in Y discounted and was able to reserve my seats in advance - for free. Is KLM offering this to differentiate its product?

[farci]

They may be charging for luggage but I just did a round trip LHR - AMS in Y discounted and was able to reserve my seats in advance - for free. Is KLM offering this to differentiate its product? Free seat reservations with KL are standard although they do try to charge for 'premium' seats with more leg room.

To us old codgers it's sad that we marvel at this. 'When I were a lad' all seat reservations were free and if I remember correctly the flight attendants used to carry you there on their backs from the aircraft door?

Matron, the screens please!:8