ATIS braodcast on VOR stations

[Dindon42]

From looking at either the enroute charts or the terminal charts, how can I know if a VOR broadcasts ATIS messages?

Ultimately, I would like to know for a given airport, which VORs broadcast its ATIS message.

I could not find any info about this in the forum or other sources.
Any lead is greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

[NightWolf]

Hey Capt.

Happy New Year to ya. I might not be 100% on this but I think if my memory serves me well, on the Canadian Charts in the Nav Aid box; if the frequency e.g 115.7 is not underlined it means that you can receive ATS communication on the frequency. Underline indicates no ATS Communications. Hope it helps.

[Dan Winterland]

The published ATIS frequency on your charts will be in the VOR range. There's a clue there if you can't tune it on the VHF because the frequency is too low!

[nitpicker330]

Yep funny Dan, now re-read his question mate. :D

He asks about reading "en-route" and "Terminal" charts in respect to knowing if the VOR has a ATIS broadcast on it...

Personally I don't know the answer, do you?:{

[one dot right]

Yep funny Dan, now re-read his question mate.

He asks about reading "en-route" and "Terminal" charts in respect to knowing if the VOR has a ATIS broadcast on it...

Personally I don't know the answer, do you?
:D:D
Agreed

Never fails to amaze me. Somebody asks a perfectly reasonable question (I don't know the answer either but i'd like to) and smartarses start taking a pop!:ugh::ugh:

[Sir Richard]

What Dan Winterland said is absolutely correct, feel free to research Jeppesen if you think he is wrong.

http://ww1.jeppesen.com/documents/aviation/business/ifr-paper-services/chart-examples.pdf

http://ww1.jeppesen.com/documents/aviation/business/ifr-paper-services/glossary-legends.pdf

Both documents are about 25Mb [each] and give no indication otherwise :8

[nitpicker330]

Oh god another one. :D:rolleyes:

Yes what he said is correct but it is a smart assed comment not answering the persons question at all.

I suggest you too need to re-read the original question.

1/ All VOR's are between about 112.0 and 117.9 MHz, the poster knows that they are NOT Comm freq you tune on the VHF radio tx/rx
Obviously he knows to listen to a VOR he needs to tune the VOR receiver!!

2/ "some" VOR's have a voice ATIS broadcast on their Freq. ( YPDN YMML etc )

3/ The poster was asking how you can know looking at an "enroute" and "terminal" chart that a particular VOR has an ATIS with it.

( Yes we IFR people are aware the ATIS freq are on the top of most if not all Approach charts.)

Simple question really, stupid smart assed comments regarding too low to tune in on a VHF Comm radio aren't helpful to the poster getting a correct answer.

DO YOU UNDERSTAND NOW MATE?:ok:

[Sir Richard]

Oh dear, another well balanced Australian, a chip on each shoulder. :sad:


By all accounts this is the ONLY answer the questioner is going to get, there is NO other way the requested information is displayed on the Terminal and En-Route charts. :8

Please take the time to read thoroughly the Jeppesen documents I linked to above. Might be good revision too !

[nitpicker330]

A simple apology would have sufficed old boy.....

[Sir Richard]

Apology accepted ! :ugh:

[Dan Winterland]

I wasn't trying to be a smartass - I thought my answer was relevant! The answer is that the information isn't on the ERCs, neither Jepps or Navtech. If it's your destination or alternate, then you will have the frequency on your approach charts.

What I hadn't considered is that the OP wanted to listen for en-route information - I have only flown ACARS equipped aircraft for the last twelve years, so the question didn't occur to me. The answer to that is that you will have to get the approach plates out and have a look. If you're considering it as an en-route alternate then I expect you will have them on board. Alternatively, get the Flight Supplement out and have a look at the list of ATISs available in the MET section. It lists them all for you region with the frequencies - and mentions the VOR ident from which they are being broadcast.

Small apology- but only a very small one!

[nitpicker330]

Fair enough, I thought his question pretty straightforward actually :ok:

I don't know an answer to his question on the maps.

As for you Sir Richard............the mind boggles.:sad:

[deefer dog]

Cur Richard, Dan W had the generosity to offer a small apology....he failed to RTFQ, just as you did too!

Dan's eyesight may not be as good as it once was, but this is probably related to to the experience he has gained as a result of age.

In respect of you though, I don't think that there is either a prognosis or excuse for pig ignorance!

[Sir Richard]

It is very unfortunate that certain posters choose to attack those who try to answer the question rather than providing useful information themselves.

nitpicker330 you appear to be familiar with Melbourne and Sydney so an examination of the en-route chart, AU(LO)6 for example, will show that the YMML ATIS is broadcast on 114.1 and 132.7, 114.1 being the ML VOR frequency. Conversely Essendon and Moorabbin use 119.8 and 120.9 VHF Com frequencies. Moving further North, Canberra has 116.7 and 127.45. Coffs Harbour 117.0 and 130.3. etc. etc.

ALL this information is gleaned from the face of the en-route Jeppesen chart mentioned above and is printed close to the airfield in question. (the charts I have may be out of date). Charts from other suppliers may have a different way of displaying the required information.

A few airfields in EuroLand and South America transmit ATIS on VOR frequencies but this method is becoming increasingy rare in USA, I can see Baltimore, KBWI still uses 115.1 and 127.8

In answer to Dindon42's question, there is no obvious highlighting of VOR located ATIS transmissions, I am afraid you have to examine the small print close to the airfield VOR in question. With the proliferation of Smart Phones, Pads and Tablets, there are several APPS available for retrieving ATIS and NOTAM information before or during flight.

p.s. My attempt at sarcasm/irony in post #10 was obviously too subtle.:E

deefer dog, I feel that you should look in a good mirror for a fine example of pig ignorance!:ugh:

[aterpster]

Anyone know of a location in the U.S. where ATIS is broadcast on VOR voice instead of a discrete VHF frequency?

[AviatorTB]

Kadw. It is not a comml airport, but I use it regularly on my way to kvkx.

[bubbers44]

Westchester Co, NY on 116.6 but also ATIS is on 133.8. I cheated and googled it. I have never been there.

[aterpster]

bubbers44:

Westchester Co, NY on 116.6 but also ATIS is on 133.8. I cheated and googled it. I have never been there.

That is interesting. 116.6 is not listed on any of the Jepp or FAA charts for the airport but the A/FD does show it. Not on the FAA en route LO chart either.

[sevenstrokeroll]

HI, I think you can only really know if you look at an aproach chart. / or on a sectional chart(vfr)...indeed on a sectional chart there is a freq chart for controlled airports on the side of the chart. And yes the fellow who said that the JEPP enroute charts (low at least) have controlled freqs including atis on the chart front is quite right.

an "A" on the side of the vor box, upper right corner, may mean AWOS is available...but that isn't atis.

UNDERLINE of a freq on a sectional chart means NO VOICE on this freq.

just for additional information. by the way...it is always a good idea to have sectional or wac charts with you while IFR just in case you lose everything having then to use pilotage.

San Francisco has ATIS on a couple of VOR's...as planes are coming in from over the ocean and are in range of the VORs before the com range ATIS.

We must remember ancient days when one didn't have the luxury of many radios and one could listen on the VOR while still listening to ATC on com...hourly wx broadcasts too...we used to call them Aviation Sequence Reports.

wow have things changed...Ihate even calling them METARS now.

[AviatorTB]

Well, to be annoyingly nitpicky, that is the Carmel CMK VOR and it is not co-located at HPN. Not that such was a requirement of the OP. The Andrews AFB VOR is co-located and is the only ATIS source available for that field.

My apologies.

[aterpster]

Unlike KHPN, KSFO Jepp charts all show the two VOR freqs.

[A Squared]

Anyone know of a location in the U.S. where ATIS is broadcast on VOR voice instead of a discrete VHF frequency?

McGuire AFB in New Jersey is another

[A Squared]

San Francisco has ATIS on a couple of VOR's...as planes are coming in from over the ocean and are in range of the VORs before the com range ATIS.

Not convinced that is the reason. VOR and VHF com are both VHF which is inherently line of sight for reception.

[westhawk]

Not convinced that is the reason. VOR and VHF com are both VHF which is inherently line of sight for reception.

That was my first thought too A2, but upon further reflection it occurs to me that VORs have a significantly higher radiated output than comm transmitters used to broadcast ATIS. Possibly a factor in reception range also? One could also listen to KSFO ATIS on the Point Reyes VOR (*H class VORTAC, elevation 1340') too if I recall.

*courtesy of wikimapia

[aterpster]

westhawk:

That was my first thought too A2, but upon further reflection it occurs to me that VORs have a significantly higher radiated output than comm transmitters used to broadcast ATIS. Possibly a factor in reception range also? One could also listen to KSFO ATIS on the Point Reyes VOR (*H class VORTAC, elevation 1340') too if I recall.


Attached is the header from one KSFO Jepp chart and the A/FD. These same four frequencies are also on the panel of the San Francisco Sectional and TAC charts.

No doubt one VHF is arrival and the other is departure. Presumably, 115.8, the SFO VOR being on the center of the airport, would be departure ATIS, and PYE VOR, being several miles north and on a hill, would be arrival ATIS.
http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa214/aterpster/SFOATIS_zps1fd2c1c2.jpg

[bubbers44]

None of this really is important because all that info is on the approach chart. Maybe we should not let simple common day situations not look complicated. ATIS is always on the approach plate. If you are VFR you should have that same info. It should be be simple. Why make it complicated?

[aterpster]

bubbers44:

None of this really is important because all that info is on the approach chart. Maybe we should not let simple common day situations not look complicated. ATIS is always on the approach plate. If you are VFR you should have that same info. It should be be simple. Why make it complicated?

It's an Internet forum, Tech Log at that.:E

[sevenstrokeroll]

A squared, regarding KSFO ATIS on VOR...

I realize that VHF is VHF...but if you already have a VOR station built, in use and capable of ATIS transmission, doesn't it make sense to use it rather than build a seperate transmitter at addtional cost?

the topography of San Francisco and its airport would preclude that extra long rrange transmission from an airport based site due to the hills surrounding the airport.

and yes of course, if the vor and a remote communication outlet were built, using the same power and antenna height I would expect similiar range.

it was a move to save MONEY and help the guys coming in from the ocean and points north.

now a days, one could take their cellphone and call the ATIS telephone number

[bubbers44]

I don't think it is legal yet to use a cellphone on most airliners. I have never had a problem getting ATIS just by using the approach chart.

[A Squared]

I realize that VHF is VHF...but if you already have a VOR station built, in use and capable of ATIS transmission, doesn't it make sense to use it rather than build a seperate transmitter at addtional cost?

Yeah, it would *seem* that way on the face of it, but then why is it relatively uncommon? From that perspective, you'd think every airport wih a VOR would broadcast ATIS on the VOR instead of having a separate transmitter .

[nitpicker330]

Ever tried hearing the ATIS voice on a VOR?? Pain in the ass. Even with "voice" selected on the receiver it's still way harder to hear than a dedicated VHF frequency especially at 150 nm....

The ATIS broadcast on an NDB is actually better than a VOR!! :D

The way to go is Digital ATIS for ACARS, much better :ok: