Lightning Mate

[Skeleton]

Welcome back fella......

Now behave or i wont get in the boot again :D:D:D

[Tankertrashnav]

Welcome back L-M. What was the food like inside? ;)

[500N]

Welcome back.:ok:

[newt]

He's being very quiet! Lets hope someone starts a thread he can't ignore:ok:

What about "Who was the best Lightning pilot?" or " What's the fastest you have ever been in a Lightning?"

[Fox3WheresMyBanana]

I'm beginning to feel one isn't a proper ppruner till one's been banned!

(maybe this comment will get me banned:ok:, read it fast!)

[500N]

Fox3

That applies to most forums :O


A bit like you aren't trying hard enough until you have had a
"hats on, no tea" chat with the CO" :O

[Lima Juliet]

Banning is easy to deal with by coming back as someone else...:=

Tut, tut, tut...

[longer ron]

Dont hold your breath guys...he has joined the Key Forum :)

[Monsun]

He'll have to be careful on the Flypast forum as people readily get banned there as well. Two Spitfire luminaries (Andy Saunders and Peter Arnold) have just returned from the sin bin.

[phil9560]

I got banned for calling Richard Littlejohn a C word:O

[ex-fast-jets]

Newt

I'll try!!

[RedhillPhil]

I got banned for calling Richard Littlejohn a C word:O

But he is!:ok:

[phil9560]

Yes I did feel rather badly done by :)

[Lightning Mate]

You have my gratitude gentlemen. :)

[newt]

Good to see ya LM:ok:

[Lightning Mate]

Cheers mate.

Still fishin'?

[brakedwell]

From one old delinquent to another old delinquent - welcome back :E;)

[Halton Brat]

All's well - LM is back!

HB

[Lightning Mate]

http://i636.photobucket.com/albums/uu82/Lightning_29/forPrune_zpsd5b14aab.jpg

[brakedwell]

Ah, mad Ludvig's castle and Lightnings, the perfect match!

[Lordflasheart]

Ludvig .... ?? I thought his mummy called him David. :confused: Merry Christmas to you too LM - and to every one else. :) LFH

[cuefaye]

http://i1287.photobucket.com/albums/a628/harrymate/ooooo_zpsc7cb6b37.jpg

Merry Cringe Chaps

[Lightning Mate]

Wossa all the jagged edges mate?

[cuefaye]

Take yer specs orf - I'm not that proficient!

[Lightning Mate]

PM me an aeroplane pic and background that you want and I'll do a card from you as well. :ok:

(professionally this time :E)

[60024]

IIRC a couple to GR1s from Laarbruch actually got that view of the castle when they lost track of where the border was sometime around 1990.... and no it wasn't me!

[CoffmanStarter]

Picking up newt's "challenge" ...

What about "Who was the best Lightning pilot?" or " What's the fastest you have ever been in a Lightning?"

I can't comment on the "best" or "fastest" but I knew Pete Stone a long time ago ... where legend has it that he, in the late 70's early 80's, took a T Bird Lightning super sonic, at below mast height, past a Rusian Trawler "Earwigging" down in the Med ... which, after the event, he regarded as a legitimate enemy intercept. Must have been interesting for the Trawler crew !

Best regards ...

Coff.

[Lightning Mate]

All I can add to that is this:

The IAS limit for the Lightning was 650 kts.

At sea level ISA conditions the speed of sound is 661 kts.

[CoffmanStarter]

Interesting word that "limit" ... well even at 98% SoS it would have caused a stir on deck I'm sure :E

[Lightning Mate]

Yes.

You only need 0.97 to 0.98 with 6g to throw quite a nice bang.

Lots of us have done it.

On the receiving end it looks like this:

http://i636.photobucket.com/albums/uu82/Lightning_29/wetlightning_zpsb39ffb68.gif

[CoffmanStarter]

Thanks LM ... awesome bit of kit twas the Lightning :ok: If only I'd been more capable :(

[Lightning Mate]

You degrade yourself.

We were just a bunch of ordinary guys doing a professional job.

We were not called "Fast Jet Pilots" in those days - we were "Fighter Pilots".

[CoffmanStarter]

Have a Happy Christmas LM ... see you around PPRuNe :ok:

[thing]

I can't comment on the "best" or "fastest"

Dave Roome might be contender for highest. I believe he got up to 88,000' over Singapore one day.

[Lightning Mate]

No he didn't - another "Lightning Myth".

[sled dog]

Did someone (name forgotten) claim to have got to 85K+ over Saudi ? What is the known "official" height acheived ?

[thing]

No he didn't - another "Lightning Myth". Really? He did put it in print. (Not disputing what you are saying, just seems odd that he wrote about it.)

[BOAC]

Did someone (name forgotten) claim to have got to 85K+ over Saudi ? What is the known "official" height acheived ? - I believe Brian Carroll claimed that. there is a longish thread buried here somewhere about it.

[Monsun]

LM

Wrote a book on the Lightning a good few years ago and was helped greatly by Brian Carroll. He sent me his account of getting to 87,300ft (indicated) over Saudi in 1979. Also included the account of Dave Roome who claimed to have got to 87,800ft near Tengah in 1968. Are you saying the latter claim is incorrect?

[Scruffy Fanny]

If some one can tell me how to add an image from my desk top etc - ill add to the Ltg Xmas piccies!

[CoffmanStarter]

SF ... Here you go :ok:

Image Posting Guide (http://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/145070-how-post-photographs-videos-incl-photography-tips-gurus.html)

Best ...

Coff.

[PFR]

Have a Happy Christmas LM ... good to see you around on here again – looks like our petitioning worked :ok:


...and LM you might like to see this thread from UKAR.... :)
View topic - Ghosts of Binbrook Past (http://forums.airshows.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=48786)

[BOAC]

He was only given a week's peeling spuds.

[Tashengurt]

We were not called "Fast Jet Pilots" in those days - we were "Fighter Pilots".

Cool. Very cool.

[CoffmanStarter]

LM ... Ref my post at #27 ... Mrs Coff allowed a spot of mild surfing this afternoon ... where I came across what appears to be a bit of corroboration on the Pete Stone "Med Bang" :}

http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af162/CoffmanStarter/image_zps5477c700.jpg

Extracted from the Thunder and Lightnings Web Site (visitors comments)


Best ...

Coff.

[Lightning Mate]

Nice one mate.

[overstress]

Welcome back!

Surprised to hear the Lightning was limited to 650IAS, the Tornado F3 was quicker (750 I think?) until they discovered that the boys were enjoying this facility too often and the engines were falling out...

[Lightning Mate]

You're talking late 50s/early 60s technology.

[NutherA2]

The F4 was older technology than that, but we had a limit of 750KIAS & could legitimately squeeze that up to 810 in Alpha config, albeit in a very small corner of the flight envelope. http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/thumbs.gif

[BOAC]

Surprised to hear the Lightning was limited to 650IAS - stick the emergency ground egress kit on (aka a probe) and it was 625 from memory. Not that anyone..........................

[TyroPicard]

I have a feeling that Maggott was the best Lightning pilot in the world.. at least that's what he used to tell those lovely tartan-clad lassies...

[thing]

Think the F3 was 800kts. Willing to be told otherwise.

I was on Concorde once (never name drop, Elton told me that) and asked to visit the sharp end where I was surprised to see Vne was 530kts. I didn't expect it to be that high. Shows how advanced that bit of kit was. I remember the atmospheric conditions were such that we were cruising higher than normal and topped out at 60,000' and Mach 2.02 while sipping a beautiful Lanson Noble and eating strawberries and cream.What an aircraft.

[Dominator2]

I recall that the Tornado F3 was 810 kts KIAS when we started, but very quickly the engineers stopped that. The jet would jet up to that speed at 250 ft level.

In a previous life I flew the mighty F4. Despite all off it's limitations the Brit F4 was fast,very fast. As a JP on one of my first exercises I did a high speed stern on some USAF F4s who were doing 480kts at low level. In full AB doing a slack decending turn the speed got a little high. As I glanced inside I noticed we were a good bit over 800 kts, and that was with the Sgt Fletchers on. Yes, and before you ask, the tanks stayed on.

[thing]

If you went subsonic from supersonic did the F4M tuck? I remember at Coningsby, would have been around '76 an OCU stude pulled about 10G, blacked out and the USAF nav instructor in the back flew it until the pilot recovered. Luckily it was a twin sticker. The a/c was a bit bent...

Talking to the nav later he said that they had gone subsonic and tucked in, he was waiting for it whereas stude wasn't.

[Courtney Mil]

'Mach tuck' was one of the FGR2's handling characteristics.

[phantomstreaker]

View topic - More of Leconfields Lightning days (http://forums.airshows.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=40281)

Hope link works ok?

Regards

Phantomstreaker

[Dominator2]

The Phantom was very sensative in pitch. It took a while for any pilot to get used to. It became obvious during AAR and at low level. In the USAF we did a low level accel and slow down to demonstrate the effects of pitchup and pitch down. 200kts to 600kts in full Afterburner and then idle/idle A/B and slow down. If a stude started to PIO you would only get 2 reversals to take control of you would be another hole in the desert floor.

[thing]

I take it it was very interesting if you lost the pitch stab aug then....

[Lightning Mate]

Phantomstreaker

Luuuuuvvvverly!

Just getting some tissues for me eyes.....

200kts to 600kts in full Afterburner and then idle/idle A/B and slow down. If a
stude started to PIO you would only get 2 reversals to take control of you would
be another hole in the desert floor.

None of that nonsense with the Lightning.

[BOAC]

Absolutely - hurrah for British design expertise! Just a modest tuck, otherwise only the Machmeter to tell you (and the phone call from the Stn Cdr.................)

[Bevo]

The Phantom was very sensative in pitch. It took a while for any pilot to get used to. It became obvious during AAR and at low level. In the USAF we did a low level accel and slow down to demonstrate the effects of pitchup and pitch down. 200kts to 600kts in full Afterburner and then idle/idle A/B and slow down. If a stude started to PIO you would only get 2 reversals to take control of you would be another hole in the desert floor.
I have posted this before but the memory is still vivid. During the early1970s, while stationed at RAF Lakenheath flying Phantoms, I got the opportunity for one flight in the Lightning at RAF Coltshall. This was of course a two seat version and unfortunately I don’t remember the assigned squadron. The thing I remember most was the excellent handling qualities of the aircraft compared to the Phantom especially in pitch. A very shot legged aircraft, however, and it seemed like we were out of gas just after we got airborne. This led to the reputation that Coltshall had among our pilots as a great place to divert to when the weather was really nasty as the GCA lads there were outstanding in their craft. We assumed that was because the Lightings were always short on fuel and couldn’t make very many missed approaches.

Question for the Lightning pilots here – what was the aircraft handling qualities like when the over-wing tanks were installed??

[BOAC]

Quite g limited, especially when full - airliner type g I recall. Otherwise they killed the look-out! I don't remember any adverse yaw effects.

[RetiredF4]

thing
I take it it was very interesting if you lost the pitch stab aug (in the phantom) then....

It sure would have been, but never lost one. Switched them off intentionally to demonstrate how it flies though to students and to frighten some tailgunners.

To put the pitch sensitivity of the phantom in the correct ligth i like to add to the discussion. Different phantom types behaved differently, and the fuel loading and external loads had an distict effct on pitch sensibility. The F4-F had a tank 5/6 lockout switch, when used those tanks stayed dry and the pitch sensibility was history. In types where this feature was not available proper fuel management with the transfer switches could prevent any pitch problem.

The mach tuck had nothing to do with the basic aerodynamic layout and was not present in one g flight. It was a problem of the artificial feel system. In supersonic flight the feel system created a very heavy stick affording some force to change the pitch, a lot more than in the subsonic region. Therefore when decelerating from supersonic / transsonic while applying g´s the fore mentioned stick force lighting led to an increased g load for a given identical stick force applied.

Nothing an expierienced phantom driver couldn´t handle on an average day.

I´m not familiar with the spey phantoms though, only flew the F-4E / F4F, RF-4C, RF-4E types.


Keep the stories coming, you lightning mates!

franzl

[thing]

I seem to remember the F4M had a tank 7 lockout. As I recall this was used when they were ferried away for service totally clean, otherwise you had to have two concrete Sparrows on the front stations to keep CG in limits.

When the Lightning was on it's rundown in '88 we had little to do so my boss sent me across to North Coates (funnily enough I flew into there not long ago, just a grass strip now) where for some reason they had a massive video library. North Coates was a SAM site. I cobbled together all of the Lighning vids I could find, most of which weren't in the best condition and made a master vid but I don't think anyone ever saw it apart from me. I transferred it onto DVD last year for the Lightning preservation group at Bruntingthorpe along with an interesting USAF vid from around 1960 called 'Weapons effects' which has some glorious old jets on it.

[BOAC]

Keep the stories coming, you lightning mates! - indeed, and as an ex Lightning and Harrier driver I have the feeling WE definitely own this forum right now:ok:

[CoffmanStarter]

BOAC ... that's guaranteed to wind up the WIWOP community :ok:

[BOAC]

Yes, but you wouldn't want to admit to it in public, would you............:)

[BEagle]

....along with an interesting USAF vid from around 1960 called 'Weapons effects' which has some glorious old jets on it.

Was that the famous (and much appreciated) 'TAC Weapons Effect' film, which also features clips from the target itself - watching those Zuni rockets coming straight towards the camera was....interesting. The F-100 (?) which had to be abandoned after a premature detonation was also caught on camera.

Pah - enough of mud-moving! If you've got to move mud, do it with a bucket of sun and have done with it!

A very short legged aircraft, however and it seemed like we were out of gas just after we got airborne.

Indeed! I recall doing a Mixed Fighter Farce CAP in an F-4 with Porky P*** in a Lightning. Join CAP, a couple of turns around the CAP and Porky was off to find a tanker!

[Lightning Mate]

...after a premature detonation was also caught on camera.

That's the problem when you're making a porno film..... :E

[ORAC]

fLMhdUYUQQg

[CoffmanStarter]

Thanks ORAC ... :D

"Great Britain was slow in getting in to super sonic ..." How very dare that man" :=

I take it that was an old Meatbox that got splashed ?

[thing]

Was that the famous (and much appreciated) 'TAC Weapons Effect' film, which also features clips from the target itself - watching those Zuni rockets coming straight towards the camera was....interesting. The F-100 (?) which had to be abandoned after a premature detonation was also caught on camera.

It was indeed, along with suitably stirring martial music and a Hollywood style voiceover.

[BOAC]

Nice bit of film, ORAC - brings a lump to my err throat. Ah! The B-scope. Anyone know of a flt sim module?

PS Where did he pick up the missiles after refuelling?

PPS A bit late on the breakaway, Hoskins.

[newt]

Great stuff!! Bet the boys down the back had an exciting time during the rotation takeoffs at Farnborough!:ok::ok:

[A A Gruntpuddock]

At about 3.26 or so it appears to show a gun firing from the top of the nose?

[newt]

Top guns fitted to early marks. You could also fit a gun pack instead of the missile pack and get 4 Aden cannon on board!! Great fun to fire but the vibration could cause problems!!:ok:

[Lightning Mate]

Great fun to fire but the vibration could cause problems!!http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/thumbs.gif

...and the cordite fumes in a Hunter cockpit!

Had to tape down the RH console circuit breakers on a 4-gun shoot.

[BEagle]

Had to tape down the RH console circuit breakers on a 4-gun shoot.

Not surprised at that! Whoever designed that daft location for CBs, which required a shoulder-dislocating struggle and a deftness of touch like James Herriot halfway up a cow's arse should be taken outside and given a firm talking-to!

Never fired more than 1 Aden in the Hunter - but the old hands said that the noise, vibration and general fury when firing all 4 was somewhat spectacular; however, the resulting tripped CBs and double transfer failure were rather less welcome.

[BOAC]

a gun firing from the top of the nose - yes 'standard' fit, but the a/c missile stubs are empty and he manages to 'loose' a Firesqueak - 0/10 for the continuity girl.(lovely legs, though....)

4 cannon - I believe fillings used to loosen in the teeth too, and they tell me the 'pussy cat' used to go backwards.:)

[X767]

The "Full War Load" day at the end of the El Adem APC was always worthwhile.

Firing out 540 rounds of 30mm ( you had to start firing "a little out of range"), followed by 8 x SAP headed 3-inch drains in ripple made your hair stand on end.
Happy days indeed !

Notwithstanding the CB's and double transfer hiccups

[BOAC]

just"a little out of range":). What was the pull-out height and g...............................?:eek:

[newt]

To which "pussy cat" do you refer BOAC?

The Jaguar certainly did not!:E:E:E:E:E

[noprobs]

Top guns fitted to early marks. You could also fit a gun pack instead of the missile pack and get 4 Aden cannon on board!! Great fun to fire but the vibration could cause problems!

A similar fun shoot was multiple SNEB pods, using the 116s that were supposed to jettison automatically when fired out. I've done it with 4 pods, flying out of a field site in Germany. The take-off calculation was interesting with big trees at the end of the strip, and 1 of the 4 jets had an outboard hangup that he had to bring back for a VL.

I also saw the aftermath of perhaps the only Harrier 6-pod shoot (using twin-store carriers), which showed that there was a high probability of self damage with so much debris flying about, especially the frangible nose cones.

[Lightning Mate]

"use the fekkin' rudders and not the 'ailerons' "

ailerons Wholi.....ailerons...????

WTFO?

[BEagle]

When you have got bored with saying "use the fekkin' rudders and not the 'ailerons' " and so to make the point put in a largeish rudder input only to discover that (at the same time) said JP is whacking on a huge handful of left-hand-down-a-bit with the stick, the next 30 seconds or so are "quite interesting".

Surely the words "I have control" would have been more appropriate?

[BOAC]

Surely the words "I have control" would have been more appropriate - no, I too am a firm believer in a convincing demonstration where altitude permits:)

[BEagle]

The point I am making is that vague and ambiguous words of instruction"use the fekkin' rudders and not the 'ailerons'" leading to potentially dangerous simultaneous control inputs are pretty poor instructional technique.

The sort of thing which many of us had to endure in the 1970s.

Some 'instructors' might scoff at CFS standards of phraseology, but they were developed through bitter experience for all levels of flight instruction.

Oh - and the expression is 'control column', not 'stick'..... OO

[Lightning Mate]

You're getting sensitive in yer old age Beags.

For those of you who were not qualified on the Jaguar, and with reference to Wholis' comment, the Jaguar did not have ailerons.

edit: mind you Beags, I totally agree with you - one did not p*** about with the Jaguar. Just like its' animal namesake, its' bite was hard and too often fatal.

[BEagle]

Which is wholly different to your original comment, Wholi'! All now makes sense, sorry to have doubted you.

If the JP was indeed manipulating the controls during your demo, after your interesting 30 sec of recovery, I imagine that he was 'significantly rebriefed' about the IHC / YHC code?

Anyway, thanks for the clarification. Having some tw@t doing his best to kill you despite the brief can't have been much fun!

I can only recall one personal instance of 'who has control'? During my first ever formation ride in a Hawk during a refresher course, my QFI took control to demo something. A few seconds later, he exclaimed "WTF are you doing?" as we closed rather alarmingly on the leader. "Nothing", I said, "I'm not flying it!". An abject apology followed as the realisation dawned and we had a beer in the pub later.

During my training days, a 'who has control' incident a mate had in a Chipmunk on final had the runway caravan mate running off in fear of his life...:uhoh: But I won't elaborate further - let's get back to some good WIWOL tales!

[ORAC]

And on that point, which feckwit decided to design an aircraft with not very much lift in its wings and then destroy a bunch of that lift every time you want to roll the bugger?!?!?!? I was at Colt in 75 when they lost 2 in a week during their first major exercise over their targets evading. :sad:

[BlackIsle]

ORAC


I was at Colt in 75...

Me too - I remember one accident which saw the loss of a fellow singly but I can't recall the second despite the fact I ought to with two occurring? Maybe you could PM please we may well know each other!

[newt]

Hey guys! This thread has been fun. Please don't turn it into a QFI rant about the correct language to use when letting a JP make a horlics of things!!:=:=:=

[Lightning Mate]

I note that there are no "computer drivers of civvie crap" on here.

[Wholigan]

That's why I removed my posts newt.

Supposed to be a jolly banter thread, where you don't necessarily have to write the exact words used 30 odd years ago, but rather you write it so that people can enjoy the fun involved, instead of having to "virtually" wade through the equivalent of yet another straight and level fekkin' phase brief.

Can't be ar$ed to deal with that s**t or respond any more.

Anyway, Happy Christmas to one and all.

[Lightning Mate]

....and you mate. Cheers.

Why don't we start a new thread along the lines of - "what's the definition of a real aeroplane" to bait the civvie computer drivers.

First answer - it has a trigger.

[Wholigan]

And, preferably, only one seat. Some exceptions may be made to have 2 seats if people ask nicely. ;)

[BOAC]

Some exceptions may be made to have 2 seats if people ask nicely. - hang on there! Let's see the colour of their money first?

[ORAC]

......NATO exercise Teamwork 76 saw the loss of two more Jaguars and their pilots. On September 15th 1976 GR.1 XX735 from No 6 Squadron crashed near Eggebek, West Germany, killing Flt Lt G L Sheppard. Two days later GR.1 XX120 from No 54 Squadron crashed into the Kattegat off Samsoe Island, Denmark, killing Flt Lt P S West.

[Lightning Mate]

And, preferably, only one seat.

Agreed.......:ok:

[cuefaye]

I always thought the Jaguar had two seats from the outset? Silly me --

Merry Cringe

[thing]

I note that there are no "computer drivers of civvie crap" on here.

Oi! I drive civvie crap and there's not a computer to be seen, nor an autopilot thank you. Never been a mil pilot but it's funny how the mil pilots struggle trying to hand fly an NDB approach in something that's bouncing around like a ball in a spin dryer at 100kts with no, er ,'aids' to lighten the load on their overtaxed brains cells.....:).

[CoffmanStarter]

Seems that an ex Lightning instructor likes the Tangmere Sim :ok:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stAe4GLZZQQ

Cheers ...

Coff.

[BOAC]

I have posted about this before - a great day out. Get them to put you on 14 (as was?) at Valley and nip over the Menai and down the A5 - the visual is good enough. Beware the lack of motion etc - I clocked 8g going by the lake..........:D

The rest of the museum is good too!

[thing]

I remember the sim at Binbrook being non visual, in fact the hood was painted opaque white. Have they altered it a bit at Tangmere?

As an aside, can anyone remember the name of the Master Pilot who used to run the sim at Binners in the 80's?

[Scruffy Fanny]

Bob .... Don't recall surname

[thing]

Not a 'quiz' question by the way, I've been racking my brains trying to remember.

Incidentally, does anyone remember Master Pilot Egan from Coningsby, mid 70's?

[BOAC]

Have they altered it a bit at Tangmere? - I believe it is a modified flt sim visual, but quite adequate.

[CoffmanStarter]

Chaps ...

Sorry about my post last night on Tangmere ... I was on the iPAD which used a Mobile URL for YouTube. Now corrected.

SF ...

I tried to ID the chap's face against the WIWOL's 2012 reunion bash pics ... no joy ... :(

Anyway ... if a Sim is not your thing ... then try one of these ...

Shane Lightning - YouTube

A simply outstanding piece of engineering ... both at full scale and 1/6th ! Hats off to Mr Harding !

Happy Christmas all ... and please keep the WIWOL stories coming !

Best ...

Coff.

[PFR]

Truly outstanding Mr Harding :ok: But did it alight back to terra firma in one piece :sad: As I understand from you "pros" getting off was one thing getting back down was another :eek:

[Wholigan]

Absolutely brilliant Mr Harding. :D

[ORAC]

But did it alight back to terra firma in one piece 4 minutes in.

y7kGAAFBl6Q

[CoffmanStarter]

Yes he landed perfectly ... performance seems impressive with just one jet engine ... but piloting is another thing at that speed when you're not sitting up front in the direction of flight :eek:

[CoffmanStarter]

ORAC ...

I think you've got another Lightning model there ...

Here's Mr Harding's landing at another event ...

LARGE SCALE E E LIGHTNING , ALI'S EUROFIGHTER SPORT , COMET AIR RACER , NORTH WEALD - 2009 - YouTube

[ORAC]

I remember a little ex-techie Lightning pilot who might have fitted into the large scale model......

[GeeRam]

SF ...

I tried to ID the chap's face against the WIWOL's 2012 reunion bash pics ... no joy

If you mean the chap 'flying' the Tangmere sim, if it's who I think it is, he wasn't listed as attending the WIWOL '12 reunion.

It looks to me like it's Bob B, ex-22 loop Black Arrows pilot, and ex-boss of 19 Sqn......?????

[PFR]

Superb CoffmanStarter :ok: Looked "quick" on the round-out.....but then again it probably was in the "grown-up" model :}

[CoffmanStarter]

Well if someone can build a 1/6 Scale Model Lightning ... and some dudes can build a replica ME262 in the States ... it's not beyond the realms of possibility for someone to build say a 7/8 Scale Replica Lightning ! Probably not with AB's though !

Any pilot volunteers :uhoh: Sorry ... but funding such a project is a bit out of my reach :(

[CoffmanStarter]

Here you go Wholigan ... just for you :)

https://www.motorsandrotors.co/images/Ripmax_Hawker_Hunter.jpg

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQEpzsYH7RyyVkzg6MwG3iATMK09d5EkOOoz-NoLneqR7KFZMEtp76jygvFnQ

http://www.aviationtrivia.info/images/rc_jag_3.jpg

Just in case you ask ... yes someone has built a model Vectored Thrust jet engine :eek:

http://static.rcgroups.net/forums/attachments/1/1/0/2/0/6/a986926-210-Harrier%20engine%20model.jpg?d=1158243926

It works too ...

http://cpl.usc.edu/eschuste/TurboFanEwald2.mpg

A model seems to be coming along nicely too ... but this isn't yet true Vectored Thrust :ok:

http://static.rcgroups.net/forums/attachments/1/1/8/1/0/4/a1287414-15-IMGA0335.jpg?d=1177902774

Best regards ...

Coff.

PS. NO I'm not a Sim or Model nut ... I just appreciate good engineering and the shear inventiveness of some :D

[Wholigan]

Oh yes. Thank you CS. :ok:

[PFR]

Second you on that CS - some engineering going on there:ok: Just think we use to build-um "full" size like that - but that's a whole other thread:hmm:

[thegypsy]

Oh no please you will get BEAGLE going again:D

[BEagle]

You will indeed - those models are superlative pieces of model engineering!

Before micro jets became available, a colleague back in the 1970s was attempting to build a lightweight model Harrier complete with a ducted fan vectored thrust system. I don't know if he ever succeeded, but it was a brilliant effort nevertheless.

I wonder how well that F-104G model flies....?

I never progressed much beyond a Veron Robot powered by an OS Max II .15with 6-ch non-proportional 27Mhz radio - these models are from a whole different universe!

[ORAC]

A model seems to be coming along nicely too ... but this isn't yet true Vectored Thrust


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Ewald Schuster (http://cpl.usc.edu/eschuste/)

[CoffmanStarter]

Here you go BEagle ... Get that craft knife and dope out for a bit of nostalgic fun over Christmas :ok:

http://www.model-plans.co.uk/images/Veron%20Robot%20plan.gif

http://static.rcgroups.net/forums/attachments/1/3/6/7/1/7/a2719758-7-Fox%2015%20Robot.jpg?d=1251398162

Happy Christmas ...

Coff.

PS. WIWOL's please excuse the thread creep ... Keep the stories coming please :D

[CoffmanStarter]

ORAC ...

Yes this is an innovative approach ... note the electric props providing pusher lift under the wings and on the fuselage centre line :ok:

Best ...

Coff.

[BOAC]

Boac is quite happy with Harriers on the Lightning thread:cool:

How does that guy control the model? Gyroscope?

[CoffmanStarter]

Thanks BOAC :ok:

I'm making an educated guess here. The Electric Harrier ORAC posted probably works like a Quadcopter ... which has a miniature gyro and speed controller on board. The default airborne state is stable/hovering flight. The pilot then controls pitch and bank by differential prop speeds ... or for a hover climb equal power to all props.

I still think true jet thrust vectoring is going to require some very clever engineering :eek:

Best ...

Coff.

[CoffmanStarter]

BEagle ...

The F104 looks a bit of a handful given the high wing loading ... but Mr Hinton seems very deft at the controls.

Mind you if you cock-up the landing perhaps an appropriate epithet would be the "Poor Maker" given the expense of this type of kit :eek:

MARK HINTONS F104 STARFIGHTER AT ROUGHAM RC PLANES - 2010 - YouTube

A little extra for you and Courtney in your Christmas stocking ... sorry no RAF livery :(

Just in case you ask ... yes ... some have configured After Burners on these model jet engines :eek:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rmi3MD84nX0

For those that appreciate both the engineering and the piloting skills ... prepare to have your socks removed ! I'm sure Shawbury didn't teach some of these handling techniques :eek:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEs_iBXvEvY

Happy Christmas ...

Coff.

[60024]

are you sure he wasn't on his first solo just trying to hover?http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/icon25.gif

[wub]

Dead Cat turned into Remote Controlled Helicopter by Dutch Artist - Orvillecopter - YouTube

[Courtney Mil]

Thanks, Coff. What a great model. I wonder how he manages to fly it without Stab Augs and ARI. :ok:

Merry Christmas to you all!!!

[CoffmanStarter]

My final post before heading off for some Christmas Bubbles with Mrs C :ok:

This lot might give the RED's a run for their money one day :}

A Swarm of Nano Quadrotors - YouTube

Just love that horizontal "figure of eight" :D

Signing off ...

Coff.