Aircraft Hire/Training In Melbourne

[Con_G]

Hi all
I am a low hour PPL (CASA haven't sent my licence through yet). I will by holidaying in Melbourne over the Christmas break and I would like to hire an aircraft (and probably an instructor/safety pilot if my licence doesn't come through by then) for a scenic flight around Melbourne. I want to do the flight planning and flying from the left seat and be able to log the hours as dual.

So can anyone suggest a school that might be accommodating that have a late model C172/C182?

Can anyone recommend a decent sight seeing flight that is around an hour or 2 duration?

I have spoken to MFS but they seem to want to treat it as a charter job, and they only use a twin for charter jobs, which could get kinda expensive.

[Lucky Six]

Wow, that is low hours. Firstly, congratulations on your PPL and best wishes with your future flying.

Try Oxford Aviation at YMMB who have modern 172/182 with G1000, although they are not the cheapest.

Safe Flying:D

[major_tom]

oxford $254 dual + gst.

Good route to fly is from YMMB-Cowes VOR - torquay - YMAV Avalon - YMPC - Williams Town (request city orbit from YMEN Essendon Tower) - Brighton Jetty - YMMB

[metalman2]

Yarra valley flight training are a good school to deal with, Bob Boyds ph is 0457 391 416, or lilydale flying school on 0397391211, both are a nice spot in the Yarra valley to start a scenic from and they have a mix of pipers and cessnas,
Cheers Metalman

Just reread your question, a lap of the city is great, I've done a few flights south on the east side of the dandenongs, across to Phillip is and then north past moorabbin and the city, great view of the place I reckon!

[Old Akro]

I would expect your licence to come through in 2 - 3 weeks. If it hasn't maybe get a letter from your instructor or a Phonecall might help things along with a school you don't know. Even with a PPL, my guess is that a flying school that doesn't know you is going to want at least a couple of flights before they hire an aircraft, so doing a dual flight might be the pragmatic way to go.

There are many options in Melbourne and I'd be tempted to go near where you will be staying. So, Barwon Heads if you are on the west coast. MOORABBIN in the SE suburbs, Tyabb on the peninsula, Lilydale or Coldstream in the far east suburbs. You might like the novelty of operating out of Essendon too.

MFS are a pretty good bunch, I suspect you got the wrong person. Which makes me wonder if you should as to speak with the CFI about getting a lesson. When I was younger I used to do things like this when I was traveling. I've logged dual hours in many places around Australia as well as several overseas countries. It's fun. But regulation and insurance will conspire to make it difficult to get solo hours on a short term visit.

[just a dumb pilot]

Mojor Tom
$254.00 Dual plus GST is a fantastic rate for a newish C172 are you sure?
I understand that a 30 year old Warrior at MB is priced around $270.00 plus GST.
CAE Oxford are'nt famous for thier competitive hire rates.
Don't think they hire to Joe public either!

[Sunfish]

Try Royal Victorian Aero club as well.

Take Cessna LSP, just don't bend it! Do as Major Tom suggested, but personally I'd do it in reverse order, up to the city, request a city orbit, then Williamstown, etc. etc. That brings you back in via GMH. That means that your flight starts "busy" and gets less busy as you progress.

[VH-XXX]

I would advise against hiring a late model aircraft such as LSP at Royal Vic. They will make you do an engineering paper on it (because of the 15? fuel drains) and a full blown familiarisation before you go anywhere. You'll spend more on that than for your whole trip. I'd go with an average old 172 unless you're looking to blow a lot of cash as if you can't complete a quick check ride in one of those you'll be in trouble.

If you have a licence by then I'm more than happy to be your safety pilot and show you around the area, but if you haven't got one yet you're obviously going to need an instructor which isn't a bad thing as you won't need to pay for a check-ride.

Major Tom is on the money. Moorabbin, Tyabb / Tooradin, Cowes (Phillip Island), coastal Mornington, Sorrento/Portsea, Ocean Grove, Torquay and maybe a little further, back over Geelong and Avalon, City orbit and home again. With a few stops here and there you'll fill up the best part of a day if you want.

[nitpicker330]

Not $270 hr for a Warrior.
Check out MFS brand new Warriors for hire

Aircraft Hire Rates (http://www.mfs.com.au/index.php/aircraft/aircraft-hire-rates)

[just a dumb pilot]

Thanks Nitpicker RVAC Warriors are about $310.00 dual GST included.
:ok:

[nitpicker330]

Really?? Wow. The MFS ones are brand new, most with EFIS.

[Con_G]

Thank you all for the replies.

Firstly regarding the licence, I rang CASA today and I was informed my application was on the processing officers desk and was getting done today, apparently the person who was handling it previously has had alot of time off with illness recently. I hope they get well soon. However I wont be holding my breath as I heard a similar story about 3 weeks ago when I called the first time.

Secondly, thanks major-tom for the suggested flight, I have had a look at it and it does look like a nice flight so I am using that for my initial planning but I will plan to YWBE instead of YMPC to avoid R330B which is an RA3 which is active on the days I have planned to fly, I do like Sunfish's idea of starting busy so I might reverse it. (on a side note you guys have a lot of ala's and military down there)

I will be staying in the city so I'm looking to fly out of Moorabbin as I don't have to travel too far. I have spoken to a few schools including what has been mentioned here, The CFI at Melbourne Flight Training has been really helpful in taking the time to answer all my questions and has agreed to let me log this as command time and also use it as a company check ride for any future hire. Judging by their website they seem to be a professional mob with mainly career instructors and their prices seem reasonable, so unless someone here tells me otherwise (feel free to PM me if you want to keep it private) I think I will be going with them.

[Old Akro]

The best instructor is the one you like & trust most. If you have a rapport with the guy at MFT - go with it.

It might be a newly minted PPL, but it is a PPL. You know how to fly (I hope). You already more experience that a bunch of WW2 pilots did when they went to war. The instructor is there to satisfy the insurers, calm your nerves in an unfamiliar place / be tourguide and maybe do a bit of coaching. The bay is nearly a continuous loop. Keep following the beach and you'll get back to your starting point! A calm late afternoon flight / early morning flight that avoids the thermal bumps on a clear day will be magic. You could call in at Tyabb / Tooradin or Bacchus Marsh which will give you a bit more experience with unfamiliar strips. If you plan 2 shorter trips (rather than a single 2 hour one) you've got a fighting chance of doing the second one solo.

Buy a VTC (or bring your iPad with Ozrunways) and study it a bit for familiarity. You can buy a VTC at Skylines if you don't get one at your home base.

If you have learned at Bankstown, then Moorabbin will be easier, but it might be worth familiarising yourself with the taxiways from ERSA.

You might like to think about an Essendon landing for the experience. It will almost guarantee you a nice over the city flight on either the way in or the way out too!

[poonpossum]

oxford $254 dual + gst.

This is wrong. Its $415 for a 172.

[AerodyManic]

I would chat to Vortex air. They have a warrior online. Reasonable prices too. Enjoy :-)

Aero

[just a dumb pilot]

Thaks poonpossum I thought Oxfrauds rate as advised by Major Tom was a bit light.

[Con_G]

I need help again. I am planning a city orbit as part of my flight but for the life of me I can't find any info. I have checked ERSA under YMML, YMEN and YMMB but found noting regarding a city orbit, googled but the most relevant info I found was this (http://www.airtalk.org/orbit-melbourne-cbd-vt4854.html) from back in 2006. Had a good look at the Melb VTC and found nothing really useful except for the ctaf just south of The Yarra. Had a look throught the Melbourne VFG and again, no info. I even rang ASA who put me through to MEL CEN but all they could tell me is if I stay below 1500' I'll be right (Isn't the city rC class from the ground up) So, am I missing something? I was sure a city orbit would need notification and set procedures similar to Sydney's Harbour scenic 1 and 2 which has plenty of info as does Victor 1.

Extract from the above link.
....Flight Plan or advance notice is not required. Essendon Tower control that southern end of the CTR zone around the CBD. (Not Melb Radar 135.7 or Melb Approach)

Approach Albert Park Lake from the South at 1500ft.

At APL southern end, with Transponder on 0100 Alt C, call Essendon Tower 125.1 and say; "Essendon Tower - G'day - Warrior, Kilo Echo November, Albert Park Lake, 1500ft, Request RH City Orbit at 1500 ft"

98% you will get it, sometimes kicked up to 2000ft due traffic. If not available
request left turn and holding over Port Phillip Bay until clerance available.
Readback assigned points and altitude.

You'll get a Clearance, usually with an end of orbit reporting point (either back
at APL or the MCG) As directed, track up towards Station Pier, Bolte Bridge (The
two tall vertical poles) in a gentleclockwise turn, and around the northern end
of the City, past Melb cemetary, and around to the MCG and APL. If you want to
go around again ask! Otherwise say Thanks and see ya later. Reset Tx to code
1200. Lookout for traffic, especially the nutter in the Cessna seaplane who
thinks he owns that part of the city....

[VH-XXX]

From my experience, the above description is exactly what you need to do to conduct a city orbit.

The Yarra CTAF is for helicopters (unless you have a super-dooper stoll aircraft) so no need to worry about them and yes, class C is from the ground-up, so 1,500 or 2,000 is essentially irrelevant to you, just do what you are told.

You might sometimes hear "clockwise orbit" rather than "Right-hand" - but both work.

Feel free to PM me with any queries about the local area and I can happily assist you.

Enjoy.

[Rogan82]

$415 for a 172! Holy moly, my first hire as a PPL was $120 for a Warrior. That wasn't that long ago either!

[nitpicker330]

1980's a PA 28 was $35 and a Bonanza only about $75

[VH-XXX]

Oh and you're not just limited to one orbit, feel free to ask for another.

[the_rookie]

1980's a PA 28 was $35 and a Bonanza only about $75

$80 in 1980 is equivalent to about $200 today. Reads good, but it really wasnt much of a difference

[Old Akro]

I've never done a city orbit. But its basically in MEL CTR, so I would expect you will require an airways clearance. How easily this is granted will depend on wind (ie which runways are in use & traffic). Over Christmas will probably be quiet, but I would probably still not be trying to do it at 8am or 5pm. You could call (ie telephone) to discuss beforehand. Controllers don't often bite and some are almost human. Seriously, call and tell them what you want to do and ask the best way. I'm sure you'll find them helpful. You might like to consider landing at Essendon for the experience.

Alternatively, you get a pretty good view from the light aircraft lane.

[VH-XXX]

But its basically in MEL CTR, so I would expect you will require an airways clearance

This procedure is facilitated by Essendon tower as stated in the earlier posts and has nothing to do with Melbourne Centre.

Wind direction and time of day is essentially irrelevant as airliners don't fly over the CBD at 1,500ft.

[JustJoinedToSearch]

The stuff written in that link is spot on. Orbits around the CBD are by far the easiest clearance to get anywhere near ML.

And as VH-XXX says, you aren't limited to one. I ask for 2 straight off the bat and always right hand so the pax gets the best view.

MB-2 orbits-MB is my stock standard half hour passenger flight.

[Mish A]

In thinking about city orbits you may also consider what the skydivers are doing at Pt Ormond. ES tower are usually good at offering assistance re a diversion upon request. Enjoy.

[VH-XXX]

Point Ormond is nowhere near the city (in terms of ciry orbits) and certainly nothing to do with Essendon tower.

[Old Akro]

Extra points if he gets some skydivers, but!

Con_G. Don't forget to tell us how it goes.

[nitpicker330]

Last time I did the city orbit from MB I called Mel Radar 135.7 and asked about the skydiving at Point Ormond. The controller was very helpful with information and congratulated me on making the effort to ask.

So, after you leave the MB CTZ call 135.7 and ask the status of the skydiving at Point Ormond. Especially during weekends and evening times.:ok:

[Con_G]

Thanks for all your help guys. Took the flight this morning which consisted of taking off from 35L with an upwind departure to Albert Park Lake, from there requested 2 city orbits but only got one, then Point Campbell via YMAV, from there followed the coast up to Port Phillip Bay then back to YMMB, 2.7 hours. I was able to do most of it without assistance, the instructor just pointing out some of the harder to find landmarks and local procedures and taking over for piccies. It was a great flight and I'll probably take another flight around the bay before I leave Melbourne.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h292/conspics/IMG_6702sml_zpsb9f0a262.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h292/conspics/IMG_6697sml_zps176c0bd7.jpg

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h292/conspics/IMG_6728sml_zps3df592c7.jpg

[VH-XXX]

Nice pic of the Apostles (or what is left of them :))

Glad you enjoyed your flight around the most liveable city in the world :cool:

[Lord Baldrick]

Great thread, I'm sure lots of new PPLs have used and appreciated this info so worth a bump I reckon.

I'm a new PPL ex-WA. My first flights after getting my PPL were the traditional YPJT - V65, city orbits, YRTI for lunch - YPJT.
First time with a safety pilot and mother, the second with girlfriend. Lots of happy passengers.

Now moved to Melbourne and this is exactly the tourist trail I will be doing first up so... is this info still current? What are the traps for young players?

[Avgas172]

And in 1976 I bought a new V8 Falcon GS for $4250 .... Wage for a 1st Year Tradesman was just on a $100 a week, $35 an hour would equate to at least $350 now ... Flying is cheap in comparison today.

[Jack Ranga]

Gees :ugh: what trade did you do? 1981, first year apprentice $86, that's about 35 extra middies per week you were getting :suspect:

[Jack Ranga]

Lord Baldrick, I'd still give MFT a call, you won't get ripped off there :ok: