Entitled to EU261 comp for this route?

[bfisk]

Hello all,

Normally actually in the sharp end of the proceedings but went on vacation about two weeks ago and was delayed. Wondering if I'm entitled to any compensation?

AA ticket (all the way), HEL-STI, routing HEL-LHR with Finnair, LHR-MIA with BA and then MIA-STI with AA. First flight was about 3 hours delay, causing a missed connection in LHR. Finnair who brought us late in then rerouted us via AA to JFK, hotel there, and then AA to STI next morning, total delay about 12 hours.

Anything to claim back for my delay?

[ExXB]

Under 261 it is the operating carrier who is responsible even though your contract is with another airline.

You didn't give a reason why the Finnair flight was delayed. If it was outside of their control - weather, ATC, etc. then you don't have a claim. If it was in their control then your delay may be considered a cancellation for the purposes of R261 (as the Regulation has been interpreted by the ECJ). Note that this ruling is recent and the airlines and the NEBs (National Enforcement Bodies) may have no idea how to implement it. You may want to contact the Finnish NEB:

Consumer Disputes Board P.O. Box 306
FI - 00531 HELSINKI
Tel. : +358 29 56 65200 Fax : +358 29 56 65249 [email protected] Kuluttajariitalautakunta (KRIL) (http://www.kuluttajariita.fi)

So you may have a claim against Finnair for their 3 hour delay in departure (Note R261 does not refer to delay in arrival). I don't see a claim against BA as it was you who didn't show up for their flight (albeit for reasons outside of your control).

Send AY a letter, outline any expenses you might have incurred and who knows ...

Let us know how you get on.

[Hotel Tango]

Even if you have a strong case, be prepared for the airline to reply to the effect that they were not at fault as an attempt to fob you off. If you have a case and, importantly, the evidence to back it up, then keep on at them. I speak from personal experience this year with a major European carrier. I was eventually fully compensated, but not without a fight. The key to my eventual success though was that I had sufficient and undeniable evidence that my (lengthy) delay was not outside of their control.

[Tableview]

In my experience every airline will systematically reply to a first request for compensation with a ´sorry but ......´ letter. A second request will elicit a feeble gesture, and a third request will usually result in an acceptable result.

We are currently taking on Vueling. In the past couple of years I have taken on, successfully, BA, BD, AZ, IB, LH, and LO.

Do not give up.

[bfisk]

The reason was a fuel diversion to AMS. (The reason for the fuel diversion was delays going into London, because of fog. As a pilot myself, also operating between Helsinki and London but on a different carrier, I wondered why the ... this came as a surprise to them.)


Edit: To clarify: the flight from HEL to LHR did infact have a minor technical delay on the ground in HEL (about 20 minutes or so), but the delay I'm talking about is in arrival - caused by the diversion to AMS for fuel.

Given the fact that I was on a single ticket HEL-STI, and arrived about 12 hours late in STI, that's what I'm searching compensation for.

[ExXB]

Sorry, but I don't think you qualify for a claim. The Regulation refers to delays in departure, not arrival. Assuming that you departed within 3hrs of schedule in R261-speak you didn't have a delay.

The Regulation was written by the EC and then edited by the parliament, neither of which have any idea of the realities of air travel.

As a pilot myself, also operating between Helsinki and London but on a different carrier, I wondered why the ... this came as a surprise to them.) Perhaps they did this on the advice of EuroControl, or on the hope that the fog would lift. Was it not better, for most of the passengers, for them to complete the flight than to have cancelled?

[bfisk]

I think you are right about the EC261.

What i was wondering about was why you would dispatch to London without at least an hour's holding fuel when there is fog. It's no surprise there will be delays. But I know, I know - shut the hell up when you're not up front.

[Hotel Tango]

Perhaps they did this on the advice of EuroControl,

Eurocontrol is not in the business of advising airlines how to run their operation. Maastricht would be informed of delays by London and this would be passed on to a/c inbound to the affected destinations. The rest would generally be decided by ops and the crew.

[ExXB]

"Advice" was a poor choice of words, Informed is what I meant.

[BKS Air Transport]

Ok, bit of thread drift here but here goes.

Supposing I bought a through ticket for a journey that involved a surface change of airport. For example, if I booked with BA Leeds-Mauritius, the ticket would be routed LBA-LHR/LGW-MRU. If I've made a through booking, then the system has presumably allowed me at least the minimum recommended transfer time Heathrow-Gatwick.

Problem: BA deliver me to Heathrow on time, and I catch the National Express coach ASAP, but a problem on the M25 gives a major hold-up and I miss the long haul flight.

Now, I know I wouldn't get compensation as the hold-up is not BA's fault. But would BA still be obliged to sort me out another flight, and provide food/accomodation as necessary?

[ExXB]

I would say that R261 would not apply in your scenario, as you did not present yourself at Gatwick in due time. The regulation would not require them to rebook or reroute you, nor would they be responsible for your hotac and meals.

[PhilW1981]

I filed initial complaint with Monarch 4 months ago and requested file be reopened the same day as the EJC ruling, sent all my documents in which were recieved 4 weeks ago and still no response.

[ExXB]

There is nothing in the Regulation on how quickly an airline has to respond. While all airlines are considering the ramifications of the ECJ ruling four months is getting long.

I would contact your NEB, with a copy to Monarch.